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Author Topic: Please show Trust in Project Development  (Read 393 times)
Vod
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August 23, 2018, 10:03:25 PM
Merited by Foxpup (2), TMAN (2), mprep (1), SFR10 (1)
 #1

People are starting to use that area to post scams, since you cannot see their trust ratings.

"Project Development" often involves coin changing hands, so people should be able to see who is not trustworthy.

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August 23, 2018, 10:21:37 PM
Merited by Vod (1)
 #2

I'm guessing this is in response to the guy hoping to run a bitcoin mixer from his email account and a bitcoin address (as if that doesn't look suspicious).

Although, more generally, it would probably be helpful as there is an exchange of something if not money (sometimes code or other stuff get exchanged at the same time between people) and if that code is designed to fool someone into thinking it does something it actually doesn't then it is helpful to know their trust rating.

If this does happen, project development should also be moved to economy/market place...

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August 23, 2018, 10:22:44 PM
 #3

Theymos hear my prayer...
and enable viewing trust everywhere including default trust for visitors in some sections...



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August 23, 2018, 10:59:54 PM
 #4

Snip

Agree, I don't know exactly why it is necessary to hide trust rating few specific board. Although everyone can see trust rating if click in profile but its better to show all board. If some click on my profile they able to see my trust rating that means its publicly visible. I would like to suggest enable trust rating for all boards. Perhaps it will help people to know the poster is how worthy.    

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August 23, 2018, 11:11:18 PM
Merited by Vod (5)
 #5

Enlightened, even a Vod prays to a higher power.

Agreed anywhere that deals, partnerships or a currency can change hands should reap the benefit of the trust system

I would like to suggest enable trust rating for all boards. Perhaps it will help people to know the poster is how worthy.    

This has come up before and I liked the reasoning why it isnt everywhere.

Most boards are conversational or serve as an area for troubleshooting/advice. Untrustworthy people can still be intelligent and contribute in those areas. You yourself are posting a fallacy that an untrustworthy member is not a worthy poster.

With trust being as subjective as it is it's best left to it's true purpose; representing past trade or practices of a member.

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August 23, 2018, 11:15:23 PM
 #6

If I understand the purpose of that section correctly, it is to develop the projects and not to invest in it.

If you want to hire someone or are interested in working with him, you must do a broad search. "Showing trust will not represent anything."
Also, people are scammed even with trust system, "especially guests."

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August 23, 2018, 11:24:27 PM
 #7

The trust score should be visible in all sections of the forum. It can be useful in sections others than the ones currently displaying it.
You can easily guess who you're talking to.

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August 24, 2018, 02:41:41 AM
 #8

Although everyone can see trust rating if click in profile but its better to show all board. If some click on my profile they able to see my trust rating that means its publicly visible. I would like to suggest enable trust rating for all boards.
Why people need to click profile to look their trust rating? How about implement a system that showing trust score when mouse hover over the user name, instead of clicking it. I want to know can we implement this feature in new forum software.

I would like to suggest enable trust rating for all boards. Perhaps it will help people to know the poster is how worthy.    

This has come up before and I liked the reasoning why it isnt everywhere.

Most boards are conversational or serve as an area for troubleshooting/advice. Untrustworthy people can still be intelligent and contribute in those areas. You yourself are posting a fallacy that an untrustworthy member is not a worthy poster.
While I'm agreeing with your statement, I am seeing  another view regarding that issue. Because I'm not taking any consideration of the trust score when I reading posts, member suggestions, answers for questions(but not in trading discussions). So isn't that mean we are pre assuming, if we allowed to show trust rating in every boards people will judge their decisions by blindly looking only at the trust rating? No I'm not that catagory and I don't care that members trust rating when I'm reading, if he/she adding value to the ongoing discussion.

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August 24, 2018, 03:11:32 AM
 #9

No I'm not that catagory and I don't care that members trust rating when I'm reading, if he/she adding value to the ongoing discussion.



Yes, but what about ranking? For instance, try to imagine that someone got's an underserved redtrust as a payback from a personal issue with someone, for instance. If the trust is showed by default, probably this person will be unable to rank-up, or it can be more difficult for the hypothetic liable. Hey, you said that this wouldn't influence you, and that's awesome, but, being honest, I would think twice before meriting someone with red trust. I guess that is why this isn't shown in all boards because it can subconsciously influence the people about the one writing.
Of course, I do think that the trust system may be shown in all the boards in which transactions are having a place like the very one pointed up by the OP, or any other with money or work or any kind of transaction implicit. Yet, in those ones dedicated to the public opinion, I just don' t see that the trust system have anything to do with that. Please, correct me if I'm wrong, for I'm just a newbie, but, as far as I have been able to understand, the Trust System is a decentralized tool designed as a way of advice others regarding any kind of transaction, so this is a dedicated tool and not one meant for general purposes.
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August 24, 2018, 03:29:57 AM
Merited by vphasitha01 (1)
 #10

Yes, but what about ranking? For instance, try to imagine that someone got's an underserved redtrust as a payback from a personal issue with someone,
-snip-
Don't you worry, the trust system works like a "voting" system on who to trust, aka Default Trust
Depth 2 is the default for registered accounts (unless you tweaked it).
Users in the Default Trust 2 are responsible enough to be trusted.

If the user who gave a negative trust wasn't included in the DT2 trust list, it wont be displayed, most users will just ignore the ones (hidden) in the profile.
So, you will not get a red-tag or a negative reputation from a retaliative negative trust rating from a regular member.

(っ◕‿◕)っ Newbies and Newbies at heart! Remember to Lock your Thread(s) after receiving enough replies/sufficient answers. 
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August 24, 2018, 03:44:25 AM
 #11


Don't you worry, the trust system works like a "voting" system on who to trust, aka Default Trust


Thanks for that but now I feel just more confused: I've seen that some of the enlisted names you've provided me are stricken out. That means that they once were trusted but not anymore? And, if so, why?
Aren' t they so trusted them? If they were trusted and they lost their credibility -just if that' s the case- then, what happens with the trust they give to others?? Sorry, my brain is just exploding here.  Huh Huh
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August 24, 2018, 04:52:58 AM
Merited by The Pharmacist (1)
 #12

Maybe it's because I'm so cynical when it comes to the subject of due diligence (and why so many people don't do it anymore!), but I feel like if a dialogue is opened up between a (potentially) shady developer and a project owner, or vice versa, that at least a click-through to the user's profile would be the minimal due diligence someone would research... am I wrong??

However, this is a secondary step (that newbies, especially, may not know to do) that could easily be eliminated with allowing trust ratings to show by default, so it seems like a valid request.

My personal opinion about the Project Development board is that it's no longer the same thing as it was when Bitcoin wasn't so widely adopted, so I'm down with supporting a move of the board to be a sub of the Marketplace, especially given that fees will undoubtedly be changing hands with most new projects.

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August 24, 2018, 05:02:09 AM
 #13

No I'm not that catagory and I don't care that members trust rating when I'm reading, if he/she adding value to the ongoing discussion.


Yes, but what about ranking? For instance, try to imagine that someone got's an underserved redtrust as a payback from a personal issue with someone, for instance.
That's not the way trust system works here and I am hoping that "nc50lc" would clear your doubts. Now you can ask me "DT members are also humans and cant they emotionally biased when giving away red trust for a member?" The answer is, it can happen sometimes and we can be giving away evidences for other DT members by explaining that DT member put me red trust without any solid proof or valid reason. If those reasons are valid and if that DT member found guilty about putting red trust on a member, I think that DT member will be removed from that network.
  
If they were trusted and they lost their credibility -just if that' s the case- then, what happens with the trust they give to others?? Sorry, my brain is just exploding here.  Huh Huh
Actually, you're making a good point here and I'm thinking red trust given by particular DT member, should be removed (Not other members given) if that DT member lost their credibility.


  but, being honest, I would think twice before meriting someone with red trust. I guess that is why this isn't shown in all boards because it can subconsciously influence the people about the one writing.
I only give you an example user (mdayonliner is an exceptional user for this forum) for that matter and the decision is yours.

This is what theymos said about giving away your Merits (theymos didn't say anything about trust Tongue)

While we will not be directly moderating this, I encourage people to give merit to posts that are objectively high-quality, not just posts that you agree with.

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August 24, 2018, 05:31:38 AM
 #14

Thanks for that but now I feel just more confused: I've seen that some of the enlisted names you've provided me are stricken out. That means that they once were trusted but not anymore? And, if so, why?
Most likely, yes.
Based on this old post: Re: How to get into the Default Trust list?, those with strikethrough are the users who've lost their Green Trust Rating and/or their reputation, and...
The official announcement from theymos includes:
If your trust list is totally empty, you trust "DefaultTrust", which includes some trustworthy people that I'll select.
He personally picked them, unless there was a change in the system that I missed.

Quote from: Helana
If they were trusted and they lost their credibility -just if that' s the case- then, what happens with the trust they give to others?
It will stay on the user's profile but it will not be displayed (in the profile or forum) by default, anyone can see the "Untrusted feedback" by clicking "show ratings" button if they want though.

For example, user: Patriciaparakeet has [Trust: 0: -0 / +0]
But when you look at his trust page and clicked the "show ratings" button below "Untrusted feedback", there were two negative feebacks that was written by untrusted users which doesn't have much weight on the user's reputation. (now, read my first reply again)

-edit and response to the next post-
After a user was removed from DT list, his previous trust rating will be counted the same as other "untrusted" users. Unless you've included his name on your trusted users list.

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August 24, 2018, 06:48:06 AM
 #15


Quote from: Helana
If they were trusted and they lost their credibility -just if that' s the case- then, what happens with the trust they give to others?
It will stay on the user's profile but it will not be displayed (in the profile or forum) by default, anyone can see the "Untrusted feedback" by clicking "show ratings" button if they want though.

For example, user: Patriciaparakeet has [Trust: 0: -0 / +0]
But when you look at his trust page and clicked the "show ratings" button below "Untrusted feedback", there were two negative feebacks that was written by untrusted users which doesn't have much weight on the user's reputation. (now, read my first reply again)

I think that's not what Helena asked. She asked about what would be happened for a member previously red tagged by a DT member(Members who handpicked by theymos) who lost their credibility even after that member red tagged. Not about the trust rating put by untrusted users which we don't consider normally.
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August 24, 2018, 08:31:58 AM
 #16

The trust score should be visible in all sections of the forum. It can be useful in sections others than the ones currently displaying it.
You can easily guess who you're talking to.


Actually here, people judge by the trust rating only.But negative user also can contribute in the community.So, we should not judge people by only trust system.I think that's why thymos hide the trust rating in some section.              
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August 24, 2018, 09:17:13 AM
 #17

- Trust should be shown everywhere
- Sig Campaigns need to die

This would be a huge advantage for all of us.

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August 24, 2018, 09:25:18 AM
 #18


I think that's not what Helena asked. She asked about what would be happened for a member previously red tagged by a DT member(Members who handpicked by theymos) who lost their credibility even after that member red tagged. Not about the trust rating put by untrusted users which we don't consider normally.

If a current DT Member lost  credibility then it will become an untrusted feedback to scammer and the red tag will get erased from that scammer profile.(If scammer is tagged by that single DT member only.)

I am not 100% sure, but I think Pharmacist lost the DT status for few days.



If they were trusted and they lost their credibility -just if that' s the case- then, what happens with the trust they give to others?? Sorry, my brain is just exploding here.  Huh Huh
Actually, you're making a good point here and I'm thinking red trust given by particular DT member should be removed (Not other members given) if that DT member lost their credibility.
a) Why it should be removed? Might be due to scam accusation DT member lost its position and afterward it find out everything was fine and user regain its DT status.

b) Even DT member lost it credibility and accusation is proved but it does not mean that user lied earlier in every occasion. User feedback should remain there.

Untrusted -ve feedback are also important while making a deal. Might be DT did not find enough evidence to tag or the scam accusation did not get attention of DT.


(theymos didn't say anything about trust Tongue)

Read the whole post "https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=211858.msg2221664#msg2221664" here.




Welsh
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August 24, 2018, 09:59:50 AM
 #19

- Trust should be shown everywhere

Not really. It would have a negative influence on how users perceive others. In a perfect world users would judge a user on what they have written, but that really isn't the case. We aren't all rational, and users jump to conclusions, and immediately discredit anyone with negative trust. Regarding the signature campaigns, then maybe. Maybe it would be best if we just disallowed them. It would be a pity though.

vphasitha01
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August 24, 2018, 12:56:41 PM
 #20

If they were trusted and they lost their credibility -just if that' s the case- then, what happens with the trust they give to others?? Sorry, my brain is just exploding here.  Huh Huh
Actually, you're making a good point here and I'm thinking red trust given by particular DT member, should be removed (Not other members given) if that DT member lost their credibility.
a) Why it should be removed? Might be due to scam accusation DT member lost its position and afterward it find out everything was fine and user regain its DT status.

b) Even DT member lost it credibility and accusation is proved but it does not mean that user lied earlier in every occasion. User feedback should remain there.
I think you misunderstood what I'm explaining and I missed a comma when separating a long sentence. Now it is corrected and I'm not talking about the removal of DT member, but the red trust gave by that DT member for the particular user who not found guilty after an investigation.

Quote
Untrusted -ve feedback are also important while making a deal. Might be DT did not find enough evidence to tag or the scam accusation did not get attention of DT.
I think you didn't read my first post and read the bolded part Tongue

While I'm agreeing with your statement, I am seeing  another view regarding that issue. Because I'm not taking any consideration of the trust score when I reading posts, member suggestions, answers for questions(but not in trading discussions). So isn't that mean we are pre assuming, if we allowed to show trust rating in every boards people will judge their decisions by blindly looking only at the trust rating? No I'm not that catagory and I don't care that members trust rating when I'm reading, if he/she adding value to the ongoing discussion.

I think you choose the decontextualized way of debating. We all know what "theymos" said about the trust system. I am talking about when giving away your merits, we don't need to consider the red trust of that user.



This is what theymos said about giving away your Merits (theymos didn't say anything about trust Tongue)

While we will not be directly moderating this, I encourage people to give merit to posts that are objectively high-quality, not just posts that you agree with.

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