Why you shouldn't buy Hashfasts new "up to 800GH/s" "product"

[Bicknellski]

Secret shopper good idea.

Guild / Collective good idea.

Sitting on our collective ass and letting others get screwed bad idea.

There is plenty that can be done.

Ideally it be best to have a positive format / forum where those vendors and customers can come to report legitimate and well respected companies. The idea that consumers and producers can't work together seems pretty silly given the number of people in this community that are both customers and now sellers and who have been scammed in the past and want to change that. Nothing better than having people wronged looking to right the problems.

This community can gain more if they are pushing for self-governance vs. expecting regulations or courts to resolve issues with unethical companies and people who are leeching off us. Most of these problems would go away if there was a concerted effort to promote what most of us want in Minerland. Product that we pay for is shipped quickly, no pre-sales bs and clear ethical guideline for refunds. Those who subscribe to this will win the market and the rest will die off. BFL or HF can't compete with say Antminer at this stage and that is good.

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[gmaxwell]

An update:  Someone else mentioning this thread seems to have penetrated the reality distortion field which has prevented HF from acknowledging my existence— at least indirectly, and HF_CL commented on it.

I've responded inviting them to make good on their contract and refund me in a publicly verifiable manner:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=262052.msg5536343#msg5536343

[Easy2Mine]

Most of the early miners are intelligent people.
The only mistake they have made is putting trust in the wrong companies.
I don´t think they will burn their hands for a second time.

From all the ASIC companies out there, Hashlast has the less professional customers service.
Lies, lies, lies and nothing but lies is hashlast telling us.

They can´t stand negative criticism and sarcasm.
My messages at their self-moderated has been deleted over and over.
they can´t stand if someone make a bad joke about them.

I totally agree that gmaxwell is not abusing his moderating powers to force hashlast to a solution, despite that hashlast think the opposite.
I totally agree with him that you shouldn´t buy hashlast new "up to 800GH/s" "product".

If you decide to buy despite all the warnings, I can assure you, that you will have a lot of stress and grey hair.

[gmaxwell]

FWIW, Hashfast-cl has posted claiming that the only reason people are giving them negative trust is their scammy-looking self moderation.  I responded, pointing out that while their self-moderation is concerning, my negative trust is because they've ripped me off.  Sadly, they decided they didn't want people seeing that post either.

A reply of yours, quoted below, was deleted by the starter of a self-moderated topic. There are no rules of self-moderation, so this deletion cannot be appealed. Do not continue posting in this topic if the topic-starter has requested that you leave.

You can create a new topic if you are unsatisfied with this one. If the topic-starter is scamming, post about it in Scam Accusations.

Using negative feedback to express dissatisfaction with a self-moderated thread is silly.  If you don't like self-moderated threads, simply don't read or post in them.

My dissatisfaction is not due to the self-moderation, and I believe I am not alone in that.

However, sometimes certain behavior with self-moderation may be a reason to distrust a party. If self-moderation is used to remove substantiated criticism that may be a severe red-flag.

In my case my negative feed back is that HashFast accepted almost 98 BTC from me for mining hardware to be delivered at the end of October under contractual terms— and assurances in direct communication with staff as well as public comments— guaranteeing a full refund if Hashfast failed to deliver by December 31st, a very generous timeframe considering delays that long would almost certainly guarantee that the equipment would be at a loss at that point.

HashFast, as is well known now, failed their initial delivery targets in October, and later they failed their drop dead date on Dec 31st. As of today, March 5, there are many people still expecting and waiting for hardware with no idea when it will be delivered. HashFast tried unilaterally changing contract terms— demanding customers agree to additional delays and an additional NDA and an agreement to not disparage the company if they wanted to receive any hardware or a refund— even though the customers had an existing established contract in which Hashfast was in default.

I paid HashFast and have received nothing in return. No response to my communications asking them to comply with their agreement or otherwise settle the matter. Beyond a single email that they relieved my first certified letter I have no evidence that they've actually read a single word I've sent them.  Other customers are already in the process of litigating against HashFast...  Personally, I just want them to make good on the agreement as they expressed it and I understood it.  I do not want to enter into an expensive and costly litigation which may ultimately leave hashfast out of business and unable to deliver the products to whatever few people are still purchasing with these substantial red flags at play.

To avoid any further confusion I've requested HashFast refund me in a publicly verifiable way: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=262052.msg5536343#msg5536343  so everyone has an easy check on much progress hashfast has made on making good on their agreements before placing further orders.

Until then, I'd continue to caution anyone against purchasing any products hashfast is offering.

[midnightmagic]

Hashfast has also ripped me off, to the tune of about 120฿ minus a trivial amount of fiat which is missing a good 20% or so of the total amount I paid even in fiat at the time of my preorder, contrary to their promise to denominate refunds in bitcoins according to the amount paid in bitcoins.

They deleted my question as to whether they were ever going to honour their promise to refund in bitcoins.

I would be interested to know how much longer it will be before they honour their MPP commitments.

I will add to the below, which they deleted from their self-moderated thread, the following: When will you at least complete my fiat-denominated full refund?

A reply of yours, quoted below, was deleted by the starter of a self-moderated topic. There are no rules of self-moderation, so this deletion cannot be appealed. Do not continue posting in this topic if the topic-starter has requested that you leave.

You can create a new topic if you are unsatisfied with this one. If the topic-starter is scamming, post about it in Scam Accusations.

Yes, it's both true and awesome!  Proof is at the top of the thread, in the form of cgminer/eligius screenshots and a video of the live output.

We're setting up webcams so everyone can enjoy live streams of a 2TH Sierra EVO, the World's Fastest Bitcoin Miner.

Are you at some point ever going to honour your obligations after promising that returns would be in full and denominated in the same form of payment that they were paid in, as per initial contractual terms, statements and promises here and elsewhere, and original invoice amounts which were also denominated in bitcoins?

[gmaxwell]

Just an update: HashFast has still not refunded the 97.95849881 they owe me after taking my funds and failing to deliver by the refund or die they which they chose, nor do I believe they've refunded or sent products to many other customers.

They have also still not responded to a single one of my certified letters. They have no confirmed with me if they will or won't make good on their explicit commitment to refund the full amount I paid— even though its now more than three months since they violated their agreement.

They also continue to aggressively delete all critical comments or concerned views from their self-moderated thread promoting their latest pre-order product. These deletions include deleting messages where they claim to have sent me a refund— which they have not— and where I respond pointing out that they have not done so.

[jjiimm_64]

Just an update: HashFast has still not refunded the 97.95849881 they owe me after taking my funds and failing to deliver by the refund or die they which they chose, nor do I believe they've refunded or sent products to many other customers.

They have also still not responded to a single one of my certified letters. They have no confirmed with me if they will or won't make good on their explicit commitment to refund the full amount I paid— even though its now more than three months since they violated their agreement.

They also continue to aggressively delete all critical comments or concerned views from their self-moderated thread promoting their latest pre-order product. These deletions include deleting messages where they claim to have sent me a refund— which they have not— and where I respond pointing out that they have not done so.

Same here.. no communication whatsoever....  arbitration continuing.  210 btc here....

[gmaxwell]

Also keep in mind that when you post in the HF self-moderated thread it bumps it to the top again at least until they delete your post. Doing that keeps their distorted reality more visible than these other threads that are showing people whats missing.  If you're posting something critical in the HF thread: it _will_ be deleted, you might as well at least post it in parallel in the relevant other threads.

(Because of the high rate of deletions in that thread I recommend you post nothing in there at all— but if you feel you must, I don't see a reason to hold the duplication against you: most posts in that thread are deleted.. so just go ahead and simulpost when you post there.)

Also if you ignore hashfast-cl it will make their posts show up small and greyed out for you on the list, so it'll be less distracting. You can still click show to look at their posts at it if you want though... I recommend it if you find them irritating.

[Micky25]

I'd still like to see user HashFast_CL banned. No usefull contributions, just spamming bs.

[RoadStress]

Also keep in mind that when you post in the HF self-moderated thread it bumps it to the top again at least until they delete your post. Doing that keeps their distorted reality more visible than these other threads that are showing people whats missing.  If you're posting something critical in the HF thread: it _will_ be deleted, you might as well at least post it in parallel in the relevant other threads.

(Because of the high rate of deletions in that thread I recommend you post nothing in there at all— but if you feel you must, I don't see a reason to hold the duplication against you: most posts in that thread are deleted.. so just go ahead and simulpost when you post there.)

Also if you ignore hashfast-cl it will make their posts show up small and greyed out for you on the list, so it'll be less distracting. You can still click show to look at their posts at it if you want though... I recommend it if you find them irritating.

You can freely post in the main HashFail thread. You won't get deleted there so you just need to be inspired!

I'd still like to see user HashFast_CL banned. No usefull contributions, just spamming bs.

There are many others before HashFast_CL that should be banner, but they won't because thermos is a lazy ass.

[TooDumbForBitcoin]

There are many others before HashFast_CL that should be banner, but they won't because thermos is a lazy ass.

Theymos is an ancap.  Ancaps don't condone coercion. Banning is a form of coercion.

[TooDumbForBitcoin]

98 BTC here, 120 BTC there, 210 BTC from the other guy.

That's almost $500,000 stolen by Hashfast from just three people!

Let's see LTC and Doge match that!!

[Easy2Mine]

A reply of yours, quoted below, was deleted by the starter of a self-moderated topic. There are no rules of self-moderation, so this deletion cannot be appealed. Do not continue posting in this topic if the topic-starter has requested that you leave.

You can create a new topic if you are unsatisfied with this one. If the topic-starter is scamming, post about it in Scam Accusations.

Batch One EVOs sold out almost instantly, so exhibiting your grudge in public hasn't had any noticeable effect.  Better get a Batch Two before they're gone!

If Batch One sold out almost instantly, why are you still stuck at Batch Two?
I suspect you skip Batch One to make it look how succesfull you are scamming people.
Once a thief, always a thief !!!

Asshole keep deleting my posts, no worries, I will reposting the truth.

He asshole, when are you sending out the MPP?
And why so many people don't have their BJ yet?

Keep this thread alive, so that people who are not aware that Hashlast are just a bunch of thieves will know about the truth.

[culexevilman]

I heard this and is sad, sorry guys for your losses.

[Luke-Jr]

So I'm just wondering, is gmaxwell going to start calling out all of the overpromising/underdelivering, cough BFL cough, hardware companies or just the one's he has money invested in and ignore the one's who have invested money in advertising here. Because there are/have been a lot of them out there and I haven't seen this kind of response until now.

Regardless, this isn't all that surprising after my initial meetings with their team before they went public. Something was just off and then I found out they claimed that someone who is actually financially backing another company financed their operations. The dog and pony show was awesome, but when it came down to it, Lil Sebastian was/is late to the party still.

+1 Here here.

We need association or guild of reputable miner fabricators and developers. Here was my post for a guild.


https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=282030.0

You should find someone to spearhead this who isn't biased against other reputable people...

[SolarSilver]

You should find someone to spearhead this who isn't biased against other reputable people...

Says the guy who got free hardware from both BFL and Hashfast

[TheRealSteve]

* TheRealSteve passes the popcorn around

[Luke-Jr]

You should find someone to spearhead this who isn't biased against other reputable people...

Says the guy who got free hardware from both BFL and Hashfast

You need to check your dictionary for the definition of "free".

[dropt]

You should find someone to spearhead this who isn't biased against other reputable people...

Says the guy who got free hardware from both BFL and Hashfast

You need to check your dictionary for the definition of "free".

Are you saying you wouldn't have incorporated the new ASIC hardware on your own, for nothing? 

[Luke-Jr]

You should find someone to spearhead this who isn't biased against other reputable people...

Says the guy who got free hardware from both BFL and Hashfast

You need to check your dictionary for the definition of "free".

Are you saying you wouldn't have incorporated the new ASIC hardware on your own, for nothing?  

That's irrelevant.
You're also assuming I didn't pay for it...