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Author Topic: What should we focus on more? Demand or Supply?  (Read 1481 times)
pitiflin
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August 30, 2018, 10:39:09 PM
 #41

I see a lot of people that are hoarding 100% of their bitcoins, because they believe cutting off the supply, would be enough to increase the price. <mostly speculators>

Would it not be better, if we increased the demand by increasing Bitcoin awareness and convincing more merchants to offer Bitcoin payments?

A 100% hoarding strategy is more harmful, because it cancels all the good work that was done to get merchants to accept Bitcoin as a payment option. A merchant will stop accepting Bitcoin, if their is no demand or transactions being generated for their business from the Bitcoin payment side.

We should actively encourage local merchants to start accepting bitcoins and then we should start supporting them. <No matter how low the price is>

Just buy back the bitcoins that you spend and you will be fine or use money that you would not have hoarded and buy the goods or service with bitcoins. <So when the price increase, you will not have regrets that you spend those coins>

Adopt a 80% hoarding and 20% spending strategy and we will see a massive increase in Bitcoin adoption <Merchants & Bitcoin users >  Cool  
That's not how things work. You can't just focus more on one thing. We don't live in a world that has perfectly elastic supply or a world of perfectly inelastic demand. This won't make sense to you,if you haven't learnt Economics.

If you focus on demand more, then we will be forced in a situation where demand drops and supply increases until they crossover at a point called equilibrium which would decide the equilibrium price and equilibrium quantity. Same applies to supply.

Crypto-economics is different than normal economics, so things can be more complicated than what I said.


Things are easier said than done. Just saying things won't do shit. People have mixed feelings on bitcoin. You have to understand the laws of demand and supply, you can't just go ahead and tell merchants to adopt bitcoin or tell "hodlers" not to "hodl".


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August 30, 2018, 10:43:44 PM
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 #42

Without a constant demand hoarding won't make anyone rich, on the contrary, they'll be getting poorer every day, even faster than they would holding inflationary fiat money.
Most holders know about it and they're holding because they believe in BTC.

The problem here is that most holders treat Bitcoin only as a long-term investment or store of value. I am not denying that they are right but they forget that Bitcoin can be used as a currency. Many merchants stopped accepting Bitcoin because of high transaction fees. The transactions fees are now low (1 sat/vbyte) and they might become even lower in the future (Bitcoin Core 0.18 -> 0.2 sat/vbyte) so there is no reason why holders would not spend at least some of their coins. The more people spend their coins, the more merchants decide to accept Bitcoin.

I can explain to you why I'm not treating it as a currency and why most people aren't and aren't planning to change it.
First of all there aren't many merchants that accept it in my area. I can't go to a shopping mall and pay for everything, like they do in Korea or Japan. I'm forced to use fiat, so that's what I'm doing, even though I'd prefer to use BTC. I'm not going to drive for 20 min just to get to a store that will take my BTC and probably charge me more for the merchandise than a fiat-based local store.
The second reason is even more obvious. My BTC is limited, I'm not getting a lot of it every month, but I'm getting fiat and I still have some fiat lying around. If I have to choose between spending my depreciating fiat or my BTC with a huge growth potential I will always spend fiat. It's that simple.
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August 30, 2018, 10:44:59 PM
 #43

In the case or world of cryptocurrency, demand is the thing that should be given by attention. This is because when we talk about supply, it is about the coins currently in the market. There's a lot of coins that can be seen. But the problem is that there's a little demand over those coin. Thus, this would further prove that what we should focus now is with the demand of everyone to the coin s rather than the supply of the coins itself that can be found in the market.
I agree on you as we see, we have lack of. Demand to the coin why it also have only lower price. Yes sometimes we have lot of supply of coin in our wallet but because. There are no demands on it, it became useless. Or maybe it has only have lower price when you sell. I believe we really need to focus more on the demand of every coin in the market.
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August 30, 2018, 11:02:53 PM
 #44

I see a lot of people that are hoarding 100% of their bitcoins, because they believe cutting off the supply, would be enough to increase the price. <mostly speculators>

Would it not be better, if we increased the demand by increasing Bitcoin awareness and convincing more merchants to offer Bitcoin payments?

A 100% hoarding strategy is more harmful, because it cancels all the good work that was done to get merchants to accept Bitcoin as a payment option. A merchant will stop accepting Bitcoin, if their is no demand or transactions being generated for their business from the Bitcoin payment side.

We should actively encourage local merchants to start accepting bitcoins and then we should start supporting them. <No matter how low the price is>

Just buy back the bitcoins that you spend and you will be fine or use money that you would not have hoarded and buy the goods or service with bitcoins. <So when the price increase, you will not have regrets that you spend those coins>

Adopt a 80% hoarding and 20% spending strategy and we will see a massive increase in Bitcoin adoption <Merchants & Bitcoin users >  Cool  
I will asked for demand rather than supply but many of the people has demand for the supply but since bitcoin was down fall on its price. How can you able to demand for supply even you got  more of tgat but is price was too low it will be a no price because its low. You need the demand. The demand to its price and quality because all of that are equivalent to high price even it is small.

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August 30, 2018, 11:18:01 PM
 #45

Of course demand!

Even there are scarce or huge amount of supply if the demand is low, price won't keep hike. If I am looking for a coin, I usually look upon the volume of it and if the price is congruent to the total supply. Most of the time, I am buying coins which has lower supply because it will have the tendency to rise up when the demand gets higher. Lower supply will easily up while higher supply won't.

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August 30, 2018, 11:24:51 PM
 #46

Of course demand!

Even there are scarce or huge amount of supply if the demand is low, price won't keep hike. If I am looking for a coin, I usually look upon the volume of it and if the price is congruent to the total supply. Most of the time, I am buying coins which has lower supply because it will have the tendency to rise up when the demand gets higher. Lower supply will easily up while higher supply won't.
Yes.I also think it will be good to focus more on demand rather than its supply.If majority of the people and even big establishments will come to patronize bitcoin not just as an investment but as a currency,i'm sure the market price will continue to grow even more and even reach new heights in the future.

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August 30, 2018, 11:26:40 PM
 #47

I see a lot of people that are hoarding 100% of their bitcoins, because they believe cutting off the supply, would be enough to increase the price. <mostly speculators>

Would it not be better, if we increased the demand by increasing Bitcoin awareness and convincing more merchants to offer Bitcoin payments?

A 100% hoarding strategy is more harmful, because it cancels all the good work that was done to get merchants to accept Bitcoin as a payment option. A merchant will stop accepting Bitcoin, if their is no demand or transactions being generated for their business from the Bitcoin payment side.

We should actively encourage local merchants to start accepting bitcoins and then we should start supporting them. <No matter how low the price is>

Just buy back the bitcoins that you spend and you will be fine or use money that you would not have hoarded and buy the goods or service with bitcoins. <So when the price increase, you will not have regrets that you spend those coins>

Adopt a 80% hoarding and 20% spending strategy and we will see a massive increase in Bitcoin adoption <Merchants & Bitcoin users >  Cool  
Well its definitely a different perspective that bitcoin holders were doing it for decreasing the supply.Even if they do it,unless they were in majority they could not get the desired results since still there are day traders and newbies who would contribute for bitcoin circulation.



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August 31, 2018, 05:35:03 AM
 #48

I see a lot of people that are hoarding 100% of their bitcoins, because they believe cutting off the supply, would be enough to increase the price. <mostly speculators>

Would it not be better, if we increased the demand by increasing Bitcoin awareness and convincing more merchants to offer Bitcoin payments?

A 100% hoarding strategy is more harmful, because it cancels all the good work that was done to get merchants to accept Bitcoin as a payment option. A merchant will stop accepting Bitcoin, if their is no demand or transactions being generated for their business from the Bitcoin payment side.

We should actively encourage local merchants to start accepting bitcoins and then we should start supporting them. <No matter how low the price is>

Just buy back the bitcoins that you spend and you will be fine or use money that you would not have hoarded and buy the goods or service with bitcoins. <So when the price increase, you will not have regrets that you spend those coins>

Adopt a 80% hoarding and 20% spending strategy and we will see a massive increase in Bitcoin adoption <Merchants & Bitcoin users >  Cool 


There is no incentive for most people to use bitcoin to make payments that could have been made perfectly fine with fiat, without losing your bitcoin position.

Why would people want to use bitcoin, something scarce and limited in amount, to buy stuff, stuff which could be perfectly bought with fiat, so you lose the easy money (fiat) while saving up the hard money (bitcoin)?

I don't see bitcoin being integrated within economic activity anytime soon. There would need to be a catalyst for that, like the governments banning physical cash so people are forced to look for alternatives, and bitcoin would be the best one, so there we would see a rise in goods and services being sold for bitcoin under the radar.

But until then most people are simply going to keep using bitcoin as a better gold, not as a fiat replacement. You don't see people paying with gold in shops, yet gold is worth 7+ trillion. So that's a potential 7 trillion dollar market there without necessarily being used as a common way to make payments. Will the day of common BTC payments come? only the future will tell.

Merchants should create the incentive, by offering "discounts" to people who pays with bitcoins. Why? ..because the merchant does not have to deal with large amounts of cash or expensive credit card transaction fees. The savings can be used to fund these discounts.  Grin

The user will obviously opt to use Bitcoin, because these discounts does not apply when you pay with any other payment method.

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August 31, 2018, 07:35:46 AM
 #49

Of course demand!

Even there are scarce or huge amount of supply if the demand is low, price won't keep hike. If I am looking for a coin, I usually look upon the volume of it and if the price is congruent to the total supply. Most of the time, I am buying coins which has lower supply because it will have the tendency to rise up when the demand gets higher. Lower supply will easily up while higher supply won't.

The price increase is depending on the volume and that is the reason why you should always invest and sell your coins at the right time in order to earn more profit.
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August 31, 2018, 07:43:01 AM
 #50

Hold too much bitcoin or crypto will not be good for the market because there is a scarcity of products and prices may increase or conversely traders and buyers will leave the product so there is no market activity which causes crypto to stall and die. Market dynamics must run and when the market is filled with large sales volumes, crypto will easily develop
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August 31, 2018, 10:32:23 AM
 #51

In my opinion, it should be equal so that market would not be paralyzed. It has a good cycle for the economic  development of the country or even to the whole world.
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August 31, 2018, 11:14:09 AM
 #52

In my opinion, it is a logical move that they have made, but the demand increases so slowly by this way. I mean, if the main goal is to increase the demand, the way you say is much better. But, governments are against it and the fear of people prevent it. Cryptocurrency just needs big forces that can be supported.
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August 31, 2018, 11:42:20 AM
 #53

Merchants should create the incentive, by offering "discounts" to people who pays with bitcoins. Why? ..because the merchant does not have to deal with large amounts of cash or expensive credit card transaction fees. The savings can be used to fund these discounts.  Grin

The user will obviously opt to use Bitcoin, because these discounts does not apply when you pay with any other payment method.

While I agree that attracting people with discounts is a good thing in the short term, it's however not sustainable in the long term.

If Visa & Co see their market share shrink due to Bitcoin being the preferred option to conduct day to day transactions, they can just as easily lower their fees to a point at which Bitcoin can no longer compete based on merchant fees with how nearly every merchant uses a centralized payment gateway.

The only way for Bitcoin to win this 'fee war' is to have merchants cut out centralized payment gateways entirely, and this is something that will take plenty of years and also requires more price stability.

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August 31, 2018, 11:47:58 AM
 #54

I think we need to focus on increasing the demand as we need mass adoption to increase the flowing of transactions. The more the flow this can attract more people to use Bitcoin as for digital payments.
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August 31, 2018, 01:33:23 PM
 #55

I think we need to focus on increasing the demand as we need mass adoption to increase the flowing of transactions. The more the flow this can attract more people to use Bitcoin as for digital payments.

Yes you are right, the price will only increase if the demand in the market increase so people should invest even more in order for the volume in the market to drop.
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August 31, 2018, 02:03:16 PM
 #56

We should  be able to demand more in other for bitcoin to supply more and when more of it is in the market so many people will want to come in to demand for more of bitcoin
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August 31, 2018, 02:05:00 PM
 #57

I think we need to focus on increasing the demand as we need mass adoption to increase the flowing of transactions. The more the flow this can attract more people to use Bitcoin as for digital payments.
Right.There should be an increase in demand rather than its supply because once there will be more investors and even holders of crypto,i'm sure the market price will definitely increase making a huge number of people will show interest on digital currencies.

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audaciousbeing
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August 31, 2018, 02:58:07 PM
 #58

I see a lot of people that are hoarding 100% of their bitcoins, because they believe cutting off the supply, would be enough to increase the price. <mostly speculators>

Would it not be better, if we increased the demand by increasing Bitcoin awareness and convincing more merchants to offer Bitcoin payments?

A 100% hoarding strategy is more harmful, because it cancels all the good work that was done to get merchants to accept Bitcoin as a payment option. A merchant will stop accepting Bitcoin, if their is no demand or transactions being generated for their business from the Bitcoin payment side.

We should actively encourage local merchants to start accepting bitcoins and then we should start supporting them. <No matter how low the price is>

Just buy back the bitcoins that you spend and you will be fine or use money that you would not have hoarded and buy the goods or service with bitcoins. <So when the price increase, you will not have regrets that you spend those coins>

Adopt a 80% hoarding and 20% spending strategy and we will see a massive increase in Bitcoin adoption <Merchants & Bitcoin users >  Cool  

I would stick to the position that the focus should be on both but more should be on demand. On the issue of demand there is need for increased publicity there is still a lot of untapped grounds that have not even heard about bitcoin and there are people who have heard but have not joined the market until they are pushed. These are the avenues to be tapped by every means and by our individual efforts in bring them into the fold active participants.

However, one sided effort cannot guarantee the outcome that we all are waiting for. In the case of a little increase in price occasioned by the result of activities listed above, people tend to see it as an opportunity to let go of the hoarding they have been doing thereby forcing the price downwards since the demand is not strong enough to maintain resistance at that level. This is evident in various push and further down in price that we have seen in the past couple of months. So as we are focusing on demand we should not be ignorant of the activities of supply.
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August 31, 2018, 03:20:18 PM
 #59

Very true.

It should not just be over by hodling it.
Invite others although there is much negativity about crypto currencies. Just making them aware might give them that spark to look at it deeply.
With that, they may see the positive feature of crypto currencies specially bitcoin.

It would be lovely if it happens. But some are discouraged because they are rejected or worse they are being mocked by those traditional fial believers.

You cannot create a demand artificially, at least us a community. Maybe TPTB can create artificial demands, but there's nothing we regular people can do about other regular people not wanting to use bitcoin to buy their groceries or whatnot.

There has to be a perfect storm for that to happen. People need a genuine incentive to do so. And right now this incentive is simple not there in most cases within the 1st world. Perhaps in other countries they find bitcoin as the only way to do any commerce, but here in the developed world, people aren't looking for an alternative, it doesn't even cross their mind, they just get paid in fiat and buy in fiat, and having to buy some other currency to buy something (and paying trading fees + transaction fees) is simply nonsense for them.

So only when this perfect storm happens (say, devaluation of fiat currencies becomes so obvious even to the average joe, end of physical cash.. etc) it will be used for daily purchases.

Until then it is a store of value that anyone smart enough to read the fundamentals will see as a crucial hold on their portfolios.
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August 31, 2018, 05:06:00 PM
 #60

I see a lot of people that are hoarding 100% of their bitcoins, because they believe cutting off the supply, would be enough to increase the price. <mostly speculators>

Would it not be better, if we increased the demand by increasing Bitcoin awareness and convincing more merchants to offer Bitcoin payments?

A 100% hoarding strategy is more harmful, because it cancels all the good work that was done to get merchants to accept Bitcoin as a payment option. A merchant will stop accepting Bitcoin, if their is no demand or transactions being generated for their business from the Bitcoin payment side.

We should actively encourage local merchants to start accepting bitcoins and then we should start supporting them. <No matter how low the price is>

Just buy back the bitcoins that you spend and you will be fine or use money that you would not have hoarded and buy the goods or service with bitcoins. <So when the price increase, you will not have regrets that you spend those coins>

Adopt a 80% hoarding and 20% spending strategy and we will see a massive increase in Bitcoin adoption <Merchants & Bitcoin users >  Cool  
People focus a lot on the supply because that is something that they can control partially, if they hold their coins then even if by a little they can manipulate the price, this is even more true for those that are whales and are holding a huge amount of coins, but when it comes to the demand there is nothing to do, the demand will come to this market by itself once people realize how fake the current economic system really is, until that happens the demand for bitcoin is going to be low.

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