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Author Topic: Help me DESTROY Bitcoin!  (Read 483 times)
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legendster
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September 11, 2018, 03:17:05 AM
 #1

Okay, that was a clickbait!  Grin

I am not looking to destroy Bitcoin but rather a way to effectively send a deposit to a wallet and then destroy the wallet along with the Bitcoins.
I'd want to be able to do this with any cryptocoin. And I want to be able to track it and verifiably prove it.

Essentially setting up an off-chain burning tool / service.

I need technical guidance, help, suggestions and basically anything and everything I'll need to pull this off. Please DM or start up a convo and I'll DM you.


PS: I am on the road will be back home in a couple days or sooner, expect slow replies. Thanks in advance.


The ideology is :

There is a non-stop increase in digital assets especially cryptos. That's equivalent to an uncontrollable rate of inflation.
As FIAT will keep getting produced by the governments and someone or the other with a large bucket of FIAT currency will invest in some altcoin out there. Resulting in more money being created out of no where.
There is no system in place in the crypto-verse where this steady inflow of money is countered with a steady reduction in the amount of available money and digital assets in the crypto-world.

When you are burning your original asset in the system, you are rewarded with Phoenix based on factors derived from the existing value of your destroyed asset from the open market.

The economic idea :

That's the idea. There is no inherent value of Phoenix at the point of generation, but rather the value of the destroyed asset that would be destroyed to generate Phoenix. Which - would be decided by the open market.

To explain better, here's an example :
Say there are no Phoenix at the moment. So the value of Phoenix is 0 and ∞ depending on who wants to generate the first Phoenix.

To note, there will be XXX number of Phoenix that can be generated. No more.

Now someone burns 1 BTC in the system then they will be rewarded with and instant reward : Phoenix and some locked Phoenix rewards : Ash which will slowly unlock more Phoenixes for a period and then the Ash will itself be depleted. The generation/conversion power of Phonenix from Ash will decrease logarithmically over a set period of time.

Now, theoretically, for the first generation of Phoenix blocks :
1 Phoenix = Total Potential Phoenix Generated = Instant generation of Phoenix + Ash (Locked Phoenix) = 1 Btc's USD value at that point of burning - in the open market.

There will be no direct inflow of FIAT > Phoenix


So if you destroy $1m worth of Bitcoins for Phoenixes, then you will get $1m worth of Phoenixes.

Now, there will be bonuses for early generators - which is what I hope will be the enticement for investors. Then technically their 1 mil could be multiplied by the bonus they will get.



I am not looking to destroy Bitcoin but rather a way to effectively send a deposit to a wallet (or address) and then destroy the wallet along with the Bitcoins.
I'd want to be able to do this with any cryptocoin. And I want to be able to track it and verifiably prove it.

Why exactly do you want to send to a wallet? Do you by any chance mean an address? Because otherwise I could be holding a wallet with some addresses in them having a huge balance and then they all get destroyed because you deposit some satoshi's in an address from that wallet?

Essentially setting up an off-chain burning tool / service.
What's the off-chain aspect of this? How will coins get deposited into this wallet if it's not on-chain?


What I am trying to get at is not particular to Bitcoin. And hence does not need to be a single / universal solution.
Think of it this way, we have a 'system' let's call it 'Phoenix Generators" - it simply churns out 'Phoenixes' whenever a token or crypto is burned 'in the system'.

This serves two purposes;

One - The original value of the token or crypto is transferred into the new Phoenix that is generated, creating value for the generated Phoenix in equivalence to the token / bitcoin burnt. The value can be described as the usd market equivalence of the crypto at that time.

Two - Since the burnt cryptos cannot be recovered, the burnt crypto asset as a whole would also appreciate in value as there is less of that original crypto in the market.


Now, of course, this is a lot of work, if a system is built it cannot be universally compatible with every asset and blockchain out there but at the least, I want to target a few chunks of Bitcoin or any other altcoin out there. When the time arises a new asset would be plugged-in to the system (much like how an exchange like Binance keeps adding new coins to it's system).

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TryNinja
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September 11, 2018, 03:21:38 AM
 #2

Can’t you just send them to a burn address? For example, Bitcoin has 1BitcoinEaterAddressDontSendf59kuE.

Edit: fixed the address.

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September 11, 2018, 03:40:39 AM
 #3

Can’t you just send them to a burn address? For example, Bitcoin has 1bitcoinEaterAddressDontSend32425663.

Wasn't aware and that's not what I am aiming for. I have other plans. Want to develop something that is essentially the same as that burn address but with some differences. If you (or anyone) can help me code this, PM me.

This would be a fun project with a huge pay off in the end.

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legendster
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September 11, 2018, 05:00:59 AM
 #4

If anyone is interested, you may respond to my hiring call here :

NEED EXPERIENCED COIN DEVs

What I need done (Job Details) : EXPERIENCED COIN DEVs

Amount I am willing to spend : TOKENS ONLY (% from premine) rate negotiable

I need this done within (time): Reasonable

Portfolio / Experience Required : Preferable

How and when I will pay : No one is funding the idea. So it will be a pay off in tokens when this hits market.

Will I use escrow for payment : Yes - Whenever applicable



The idea is somewhat based on this : Help me DESTROY Bitcoin!



The idea can be something novel and real. Anyone interested. Please reach out.

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September 11, 2018, 06:46:50 AM
 #5

Let's connect and have a chat about it ? I think i might be able to cide it per your requirements.
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September 11, 2018, 07:17:12 AM
 #6

Let's connect and have a chat about it ? I think i might be able to cide it per your requirements.

pm'd

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September 11, 2018, 07:31:29 AM
 #7

Can’t you just send them to a burn address? For example, Bitcoin has 1bitcoinEaterAddressDontSend32425663.

This address isn't valid. I suppose you could send bitcoins there if you compose a transaction manually, but wallets wouldn't allow you to send there.

This one seem to be valid: 1BitcoinEaterAddressDontSendf59kuE
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September 11, 2018, 07:46:27 AM
Merited by suchmoon (4)
 #8

I am not looking to destroy Bitcoin but rather a way to effectively send a deposit to a wallet and then destroy the wallet along with the Bitcoins.
I'd want to be able to do this with any cryptocoin. And I want to be able to track it and verifiably prove it.
Why exactly do you want to send to a wallet? Do you by any chance mean an address? Because otherwise I could be holding a wallet with some addresses in them having a huge balance and then they all get destroyed because you deposit some satoshi's in an address from that wallet?

Essentially setting up an off-chain burning tool / service.
What's the off-chain aspect of this? How will coins get deposited into this wallet if it's not on-chain?

In general the preferred way in Bitcoin to burn coins is to include an OP_RETURN in a transaction with a value > 0.00. That way it is verifiable because it's registered in the blockchain but it cannot be spent afterwards. This is a better way than using fake addresses like the Bitcoineater one since the will be unspendable but it will also be included in the utxo-database.
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September 11, 2018, 10:04:25 AM
 #9

https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Proof_of_burn

Any address that nobody has a private key of is a burn address.

Some addresses are specifically created because it is unlikely that anyone has a key to them.

You cannot destroy bitcoins "offline". They only exist online.

Bitcoin exists because it is a balance show on the blockchain available to a certain address.


Proof of burn addresses:
http://bitcoinwhoswho.com/blog/2017/12/30/8-97-bitcoins-burned-in-2017/


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September 11, 2018, 12:08:50 PM
 #10

https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Proof_of_burn
Any address that nobody has a private key of is a burn address.
Some addresses are specifically created because it is unlikely that anyone has a key to them.
You cannot destroy bitcoins "offline". They only exist online.
Bitcoin exists because it is a balance show on the blockchain available to a certain address.
Proof of burn addresses:
http://bitcoinwhoswho.com/blog/2017/12/30/8-97-bitcoins-burned-in-2017/

Burning Bitcoin offline is easy. Transfer to a Drive and destroy the drive. Same with paper wallet, there you will actually get the satisfaction of burning it.

Also, if I do not have the private key to the wallet but still if I could log into the wallet with a passphrase -like older wallets where passphrases were not wallet keys. Then that wallet would still be pretty unsecured as someone would still have access to it.

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September 11, 2018, 12:17:00 PM
 #11

Burning Bitcoin offline is easy. Transfer to a Drive and destroy the drive. Same with paper wallet, there you will actually get the satisfaction of burning it.
OP asked for a way to to track it and verifiable prove it.

Also: Burning a paper wallet or destroying a drive is not burning a coin, it's still registered in the utxo.
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September 11, 2018, 12:24:34 PM
 #12

Burning Bitcoin offline is easy. Transfer to a Drive and destroy the drive. Same with paper wallet, there you will actually get the satisfaction of burning it.
OP asked for a way to to track it and verifiable prove it.

Also: Burning a paper wallet or destroying a drive is not burning a coin, it's still registered in the utxo.

Which is why I am not leaning towards those ideas. I want to be able to do this 'digitally'... if that makes sense..



I am not looking to destroy Bitcoin but rather a way to effectively send a deposit to a wallet and then destroy the wallet along with the Bitcoins.
I'd want to be able to do this with any cryptocoin. And I want to be able to track it and verifiably prove it.
Why exactly do you want to send to a wallet? Do you by any chance mean an address? Because otherwise I could be holding a wallet with some addresses in them having a huge balance and then they all get destroyed because you deposit some satoshi's in an address from that wallet?

Essentially setting up an off-chain burning tool / service.
What's the off-chain aspect of this? How will coins get deposited into this wallet if it's not on-chain?


What I am trying to get at is not particular to Bitcoin. And hence does not need to be a single / universal solution.
Think of it this way, we have a 'system' let's call it 'Phoenix Generators" - it simply churns out 'Phoenixes' whenever a token or crypto is burned 'in the system'.

This serves two purposes;

One - The original value of the token or crypto is transferred into the new Phoenix that is generated, creating value for the generated Phoenix in equivalence to the token / bitcoin burnt. The value can be described as the usd market equivalence of the crypto at that time.

Two - Since the burnt cryptos cannot be recovered, the burnt crypto asset as a whole would also appreciate in value as there is less of that original crypto in the market.


Now, of course, this is a lot of work, if a system is built it cannot be universally compatible with every asset and blockchain out there but at the least, I want to target a few chunks of Bitcoin or any other altcoin out there. When the time arises a new asset would be plugged-in to the system (much like how an exchange like Binance keeps adding new coins to it's system).


If anyone is able to understand and comprehend this idea, please get in touch.

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September 11, 2018, 01:02:54 PM
 #13

What you are describing has been done before. You might want to lookup the story of Counterparty who was responsible for trading a new currency "XCP" for people who were willing to burn bitcoin in exchange. Over 2,100 BTC's were burned this way.But some smaller startups have done it as well in the past.

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September 11, 2018, 01:05:13 PM
 #14

What you are describing has been done before. You might want to lookup the story of Counterparty who was responsible for trading a new currency "XCP" for people who were willing to burn bitcoin in exchange. Over 2,100 BTC's were burned this way.But some smaller startups have done it as well in the past.

Well, I'm not them. And if something has been done before does not mean it can't be done again in a much better way. I haven't even described 10% of the full functionality of what I am intending to build.

PS: I've heard of XCP before but wasn't aware of their 'burning bitcoins' ideology. Thanks for digging it up. Now I'll know what I need to do differently.

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September 11, 2018, 08:32:52 PM
 #15

Do the project requirements mean that it’s a necessity that the coins be destroyed or could they simply be locked away in an encrypted wallet where the password/2FA is unknown to the creator?
I’m probably missing the point of this but then again it depends if you want the function to be available to the masses or as a single wallet in which case that could be a simple solution?
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September 12, 2018, 05:26:56 AM
 #16

Do the project requirements mean that it’s a necessity that the coins be destroyed or could they simply be locked away in an encrypted wallet where the password/2FA is unknown to the creator?
I’m probably missing the point of this but then again it depends if you want the function to be available to the masses or as a single wallet in which case that could be a simple solution?

The aim is to destroy the consumed coins and be never accessible by anyone. Essentially taking them away from the market and in turn they would be replaced by these newly generated 'Phoenix' tokens/coins.
If you are interested in getting onboard as a coder, DM me, we can have further discussions about this.

And its not going to be a wallet ergo a single wallet solution.
The idea is to design a system that will consume inputs - tokens / other cryptos, irrevocably removing them from circulation and the free market.
AND in turn generating some new coins - Phoenixes.

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September 12, 2018, 06:41:01 AM
 #17

Ok, if I understand this correctly, you want someone to deposit bitcoins into a digital wallet and the moment he/she "burns" that wallet, the software must award the person with another "token" from another Alt coin that you created.

So in a sense, you still want to destroy bitcoins by burning them, but you want to reward people with another token for doing that.  Huh Undecided

Should this software also be "compatible" with other Alt coins, for a broader use case? <Something like the Lightning Network that can be implemented as a second layer on several Blockchain compatible coins or a standalone software solution?>

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September 12, 2018, 11:58:37 AM
 #18

Ok, if I understand this correctly,

You are almost correct!

you want someone to deposit bitcoins into a digital wallet and the moment he/she "burns" that wallet, the software must award the person with another "token" from another Alt coin that you created.

Let's call it a "system" - something like a wallet but its entirely hosted on the 'internal network' of the "system".

At the beginning the internal network may only be compatible with a few coins or tokens and additional tokens / coins can be plugged into the system -so that when those inputs are enabled the same 'Phoenix' would also be available for those burning events.

So in a sense, you still want to destroy bitcoins by burning them, but you want to reward people with another token for doing that.  Huh Undecided

Yes, and there will obviously be a cap to how much phoenix can be generated overall so there is - in theory - a limited supply. In that way the early burners will get larger rewards. But the rewards will be locked in a way that not all of it is given away at once. That locked reward is something I'd like to call "Ash".
The ash system in the early days of the product would mature into Phoenixes at a much slower rate than -say 4 years into the project.
This way the early adopters are still rewarded well but not enough to make them whales.

Should this software also be "compatible" with other Altcoins, for a broader use case? <Something like the Lightning Network that can be implemented as a second layer on several Blockchain compatible coins or a standalone software solution?>

Let me put it this way :
In long term the purpose of this coin/token is to burn away excess digital assets. In a way I want it to not only be able to accept crypto inputs but anything and everything that has a "value" digitally.

Remember, value is something that will be determined by the usd price of an asset in the free market - which is another aspect of this project in the future - setting up a free market where ANY digital asset can be traded and "burned" to get Phoenix coins as rewards.



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September 12, 2018, 05:04:20 PM
 #19

Burning Bitcoin offline is easy. Transfer to a Drive and destroy the drive. Same with paper wallet, there you will actually get the satisfaction of burning it.
How will you prove your didn't make another copy? The only way to prove nobody can access coins ever again is by sending them to a burn address.

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September 12, 2018, 07:07:47 PM
 #20

Changing the topic a bit here But this isn't true 'burning' IMO. What happens when we master the art of quantum computing in the next 5-10 decades? A quantum computer will be able to crack these 'Burn' addresses and retrieve the bitcoins. What you are doing here is basically donating your bitcoins to person/entity who will avail these bitcoins in the future. Consider it a sort of smart contract  Cheesy

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