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Author Topic: The situation with IRAN  (Read 570 times)
aliashraf
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November 22, 2018, 06:19:19 PM
Last edit: November 22, 2018, 06:39:48 PM by aliashraf
Merited by dbshck (4)
 #1

Disclaimer:
As a resident of Iran, I'm obviously biased toward my nation, the people who I personally know and well, mostly love. A great country it is, Iran. Thousand years of history, a very fantastic, sophisticated and sweet language FARSI (persian) which has absorbed a lot of words and concepts from Arabic pertaining its own unique and well formed grammar and rich treasury of vocabulary which has given birth to one of the most beautiful and important parts of humanity literature heritage. I love this country and its nation and I'm honored to be biased defending its right to survive and to develop.


Obviously Trump administration in the US is a global disaster (Ironic isn't it? US citizens vote on behalf of us and determine our fate!) but its worst political behavior is withdrawing from Iran nuclear deal and reinitiating the most brutal sanctions against Iran, with no excuse and no international support. Sanctions that are described as "the strongest ever in history" by US officials. In the heart of them a row of harsh restrictions  against Iran banking system, including its central bank, Bank Markazi.

Now it would be the challenge: How could bitcoin help people of Iran to resist against this dirty invasion? Isn't it the right time for bitcoiners to prove themselves as true libertarians?

I mean we have Faketoshi Wright who represents everything against bitcoin on one side but who is representing bitcoin, true bitcoin on the other side?
And what the hell other bitcoiners are doing?
Most of the prominent figures have disclosed their identities and are vulnerable to SEC/NSA prosecution and have no choice other than playing coward, I suppose.

I didn't start it to discuss about how idiot Trump is or is not, or to argue in favor of a fuckedup regime like what we've in Iran.

I'm just asking about how faithful and honest we are and how could we help people of Iran to be able to do a fair "non-nuclear" trade like buying food, drugs, weed, civil air plane parts, ... ?

Believe it or not  International Court of Justice recently ordered US to lift Iran sanctions, which Trump says he would not follow at all. Apparently it is because America has recently become great againGrin and does not care about what the remaining 96% of human beings think or want!

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November 22, 2018, 07:13:02 PM
 #2

Iran have suffered with far too much Western meddling over the years, mostly from the US and Britain.  As far as I'm concerned, they're well within their rights to circumvent these ridiculous sanctions.  If Iran ends up using Bitcoin, or some other form of cryptocurrency, to achieve that, it would prove beyond doubt that the traditional banking system is becoming weaker and that there is a viable alternative.  If America want to maintain dominance through the dollar, this could easily backfire on them.  America won't be able to use money as a weapon if people don't solely rely on using that particular type of money.  Sanctions would effectively hurt America more than the nations they try to sanction if the result is that other nations adopt crypto instead. 

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November 22, 2018, 09:00:34 PM
 #3

Doomad, for a dedicated anti-fud warrior, you are full of surprise  Cheesy

Seriously, appreciate the support. You are so correct about the sanctions historical impact as it proves how vulnerable to censorship and bullism is the status of fiat currencies generally and USD especially.
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November 22, 2018, 09:23:20 PM
Last edit: November 22, 2018, 09:37:12 PM by franky1
 #4

Disclaimer:
As a resident of Iran, I'm obviously biased toward my nation, the people who I personally know and well, mostly love. A great country it is, Iran. Thousand years of history, a very fantastic, sophisticated and sweet language FARSI (persian) which has absorbed a lot of words and concepts from Arabic pertaining its own unique and well formed grammar and rich treasury of vocabulary which has given birth to one of the most beautiful and important parts of humanity literature heritage. I love this country and its nation and I'm honored to be biased defending its right to survive and to develop.


Obviously Trump administration in the US is a global disaster
 ...
Sanctions that are described as "the strongest ever in history" by US officials. In the heart of them a row of harsh restrictions  against Iran banking system, including its central bank, Bank Markazi.

first thing first. mentioning the media tripe of trump, sanctions is meaningless
thats like saying 2008 western world banks didnt make profit

what you need to do is get to the crux of the issue. how does "sanctions" personally affect average joe.
EG western world. not making profit=a smack to sub prime and causing people to get forclosed/ lose homes, banks shut down, people cant just get cash out the ATM from a couple banks.

secondly
once you know how it affcts average joe you can then start finding the issues to then find solutions

Now it would be the challenge: How could bitcoin help people of Iran to resist against this dirty invasion? Isn't it the right time for bitcoiners to prove themselves as true libertarians?

bitcoin is code. it has no arms, no legs, no voice. no political preference.
the real question is how can people of iran help themselves by using bitcoin. isnt it the right time for iranians to show they are libertarians and use bitcoin

I mean we have Faketoshi Wright who represents everything against bitcoin on one side but who is representing bitcoin, true bitcoin on the other side?
And what the hell other bitcoiners are doing?
Most of the prominent figures have disclosed their identities and are vulnerable to SEC/NSA prosecution and have no choice other than playing coward, I suppose.

I didn't start it to discuss about how idiot Trump is or is not, or to argue in favor of a fuckedup regime like what we've in Iran.
bitcoin has nothing to do with craig and craig has nothing to do with bitcoin..
think of craig and ver as kloe and kylie kardashians, not trump and hillary.. then you will understand the social drama of it
well.. craig is more like kanye west.. says he is a politician.. but.. yea nothing


I'm just asking about how faithful and honest we are and how could we help people of Iran to be able to do a fair "non-nuclear" trade like buying food, drugs, weed, civil air plane parts, ... ?

again bitcoin is code not AI
people of iran need to do the leg work. ask their merchants to use bitcoin so iranians can buy brad from those merchants.
you will not see bitcoin get a passport and makea phone call.. its just code

Iranians that use bitcoin are the iranian "bitcoiners".


Believe it or not  International Court of Justice recently ordered US to lift Iran sanctions, which Trump says he would not follow at all. Apparently it is because America has recently become great againGrin and does not care about what the remaining 96% of human beings think or want!

asking code to grow legs or pointing fingers at a yellow wigged orange that lives thousands of miles away from you. solves nothing.
try instead to sort out a local meetup in your town for iranians to discuss bitcoin. learn about it, use it..
then find out popular grocery stores iranian bitcoiners would use and organise convincing that local merchant to accept bitcoin solves the problem in your town

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November 22, 2018, 09:47:51 PM
 #5

@franky1,

Ofcourse I'm aware of the requirement for bitcoin adoption to be boosted in Iran.  Actually it is being a while since bitcoin has become popular here. But it is not about adoption:

1- Bitcoin is not resistant enough against surveillance pseudonymity is not doing fine in this regard.

2- Centralized exchanges are increasingly impose KYC/AML measure and besides discriminations against Iranians, are potentially ready to follow US regulatory authorities orders to disclose private informations about their clients and they would be more comfortable to do this against Iranians as there would be no legal consequences. In 2017, Bittrex stole hundreds of thousands worth of crypto from us, no consequences.

3- Bitcoin developers have disclosed their identity, hence they are vulnerable to US local federal authorities prosecutions.

4- Craig Wright fights for a fully regulated bitcoin but nobody is fighting for a permissionless, fully resistant bitcoin, resistant against censorship.

And no, you are not correct about bitcoin being a piece of code or a device. Originally bitcoin is the most important part of a resistance agenda. Actually we have Axiom of Resistance.



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November 22, 2018, 11:04:38 PM
Last edit: November 22, 2018, 11:40:28 PM by franky1
 #6

2- Centralized exchanges are increasingly impose KYC/AML measure and besides discriminations against Iranians, are potentially ready to follow US regulatory authorities orders to disclose private informations about their clients and they would be more comfortable to do this against Iranians as there would be no legal consequences. In 2017, Bittrex stole hundreds of thousands worth of crypto from us, no consequences.

3- Bitcoin developers have disclosed their identity, hence they are vulnerable to US local federal authorities prosecutions.

4- Craig Wright fights for a fully regulated bitcoin but nobody is fighting for a permissionless, fully resistant bitcoin, resistant against censorship.

And no, you are not correct about bitcoin being a piece of code or a device. Originally bitcoin is the most important part of a resistance agenda. Actually we have Axiom of Resistance.

2. then dont use centralised exchanges.
EG organise a meetup of local people. ask the people that turn up to raise the left hand if they are a buyer and a right hand if they are wanting to sell.. and let them work out whos who and trade at the meetup

3. bitcoin developers again are thousands of miles away. when you decide to get a group of people to meet up at a coffee shop or some rent-for the-day office conference space. has no tie to devs/us government. you will not find on the blockchain that transactions were done at the coffee shop.

4- stop talking about kanyewest kardashian drama. it has nothing to do with bitcoin. he is just dancing around to "im a little teapot"

4-as for permissionless bitcoin. thats something world wide.. i thought you were looking for iranian solution tobuy bread, choose the battles you wish to solve and build a community to then join the war on permissioned transactions, and single "REFERNCE client" source of code issues

5-bitcoin is code. the axiom of resistance is human. again you cant ask code to change a human. but you can ask a human to change code. its then for the human to change their life by using the code or not. the code is not AI. it has no arms or legs. humans do. so organise the human to solve the situations using the tools available or to ask humans to make the tools.
bitcoin is NOT self programming. again its not AI

easy way to view it. replace the word bitcoin. with the word dollar
dollar is just dollar. its the humans that make the rules for dollar. (senators(bitcoin devs)) its the humans that decide to use the dollar(btc) its humans who "should" tell the other humans what rules should be allowed for the dollar rather than just let just one side decide how it should be for everyone.

I DO NOT TRADE OR ACT AS ESCROW ON THIS FORUM EVER.
Please do your own research & respect what is written here as both opinion & information gleaned from experience. many people replying with insults but no on-topic content substance, automatically are 'facepalmed' and yawned at
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November 23, 2018, 04:02:29 AM
 #7

there are a lot of problems with using bitcoin.
first and foremost, the laws regarding bitcoin are not clear yet. they said "a team" is investigating and the talks were mostly positive but there has not been any actual law legalizing bitcoin or not.

then there is the fact that there aren't any decent exchanges where you can trade bitcoin! your option is P2P trading with high risks. and as you already know sanctions mean you can't use your bank account to deposit on exchanges such as kraken, coinbase, bitstamp,...

and as always we have the high volatility of bitcoin which turns everyone around. even when the local fiat is tanking, despite bitcoin drop the value of it stayed nearly the same in IRR!

my guess is that we will soon see an Iranian version of cryptocurrency similar to Petro since there has also been talks about it and they mentioned the project is on its way. i doubt it can solve anything or be remotely successful but i think that is the rout that is going to be taken.

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November 23, 2018, 05:52:21 AM
 #8

As long as you guys are not trying to circumvent those ridiculous sanctions, to buy nuclear weapons, then the rest of the world would support you. The worst thing for your country would be to use Bitcoin or Crypto currencies to do that and for the rest of the world to suffer, because of that. <Actions like that will just give regulators more ammunition to ban Crypto currencies>  Roll Eyes

If ordinary citizens wants to use bitcoins to buy food and medicine to survive, then I would be the first person to support that. Governments should not initiate any actions that would cause ordinary people to suffer from hunger and paid and if they do, then people should use technology like Bitcoin to stop that.  Angry

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November 23, 2018, 06:02:57 AM
 #9

I am very curious. I know that the Iranian government has always implemented the external website filtering policy for the domestic Internet, and this year the Iranian government has blocked VPN access, so how did you come here?
If you think your government is right, why are you using VPN?

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November 23, 2018, 07:16:43 AM
 #10

Hi man, I read that the United Stated banned Iran from the SWIFT system is that true? That you guys can’t access now payments from international banks or financial institutions.  

Can you still use Paypal, Payoneer, Payeer, Neteller or uphold or Zelle or any other wallets or payment services? I guess that many Iranians will start to use Bitcoin or any other cryptocurrencies now. I hope that everything works fine to you guys… good luck!  

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November 23, 2018, 07:18:07 AM
Last edit: November 23, 2018, 07:50:26 AM by aliashraf
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there are a lot of problems with using bitcoin.
first and foremost, the laws regarding bitcoin are not clear yet. they said "a team" is investigating and the talks were mostly positive but there has not been any actual law legalizing bitcoin or not.
I guess, it is no more possible for bitcoiners to live in the gray zone, it is just fading out, the gray zone:

Trump needs even more centralization of power for running his version of Fascism, Putin has already centralized everything in Russia (again) and Chinese have no clue about what a non-centralized form of power could ever be.

In monetary systems, AML/KYC discourse is getting more aggressive on a daily basis, It is about Orwell 1984 rather than Satoshi Nakamoto 2009. The true force behind bitcoin falling down is this trend and the fact that bitcoiners are doing almost nothing about it other than sticking with their few coins and waiting for dick heads in regulatory agencies to show merci and absorb them in the so-called 'legal system'.

As a smart con artist, Craig Faketoshi Wrong has understood the situation and made a decision: "Don't be shy Craig, you've never been, choose the wrong side as usual and figure out a way to keep talking in public."

The rest of bitcoiners? They are just shy!
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November 23, 2018, 07:48:19 AM
 #12

Hi man, I read that the United Stated banned Iran from the SWIFT system is that true? That you guys can’t access now payments from international banks or financial institutions.  

Can you still use Paypal, Payoneer, Payeer, Neteller or uphold or Zelle or any other wallets or payment services? I guess that many Iranians will start to use Bitcoin or any other cryptocurrencies now. I hope that everything works fine to you guys… good luck!  

That's true, as of now, Iranian banks access to SWIFT is cut and as an Iranian you need to go through a shameful forgery and denying/faking your identity to use Paypal and similar services to buy a graphics card from e-bay or pay for a newsletter subscription.

Thanks for the support, by the way.
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November 23, 2018, 07:51:04 AM
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I thought iran was going to create their own currency like venezuela. If not then iranians should start stocking up on bitcoin, it is a good way to bypass sanctions. Monero is another good one to use

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November 23, 2018, 09:37:42 AM
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I thought iran was going to create their own currency like venezuela. If not then iranians should start stocking up on bitcoin, it is a good way to bypass sanctions. Monero is another good one to use
First of all, the idea of state cryptocurrency, is so absurd, it is not crypto, it is just another form of fiat.

Secondly, Iran government is really corrupted from the head to the tail. They look at every project in the country as an opportunity to steal some money from us. A bunch of stupid thefts they are who don't bother caring about anything other than winning the corruption competition in Iran. Apparently they feel being smart or something this way.

So, I seriously pray to god they might not start playing crypto games as they are good at ruining everything, I mean they've ruined the word revolution like forever, already.  Wink
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November 23, 2018, 05:48:51 PM
 #15

Well, Iran has petrol. Quite a lot of it, I believe. So you may buy a generator and powerful computers to mine BTC. You will not be making a lot of money to begin with, but BTC shall allow you to buy things you couldn't get with your local Iranian currency.

Sorry if what I'm proposing is not very original, but that's the best BTC can do for you.

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November 23, 2018, 09:53:29 PM
 #16

there are a lot of problems with using bitcoin.
first and foremost, the laws regarding bitcoin are not clear yet. they said "a team" is investigating and the talks were mostly positive but there has not been any actual law legalizing bitcoin or not.
I guess, it is no more possible for bitcoiners to live in the gray zone, it is just fading out, the gray zone:

Trump needs even more centralization of power for running his version of Fascism, Putin has already centralized everything in Russia (again) and Chinese have no clue about what a non-centralized form of power could ever be.

In monetary systems, AML/KYC discourse is getting more aggressive on a daily basis, It is about Orwell 1984 rather than Satoshi Nakamoto 2009. The true force behind bitcoin falling down is this trend and the fact that bitcoiners are doing almost nothing about it other than sticking with their few coins and waiting for dick heads in regulatory agencies to show merci and absorb them in the so-called 'legal system'.

As a smart con artist, Craig Faketoshi Wrong has understood the situation and made a decision: "Don't be shy Craig, you've never been, choose the wrong side as usual and figure out a way to keep talking in public."

The rest of bitcoiners? They are just shy!


wow that's deep bro Lips sealed

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November 24, 2018, 06:39:08 AM
Last edit: November 24, 2018, 06:49:57 AM by aliashraf
 #17

there are a lot of problems with using bitcoin.
first and foremost, the laws regarding bitcoin are not clear yet. they said "a team" is investigating and the talks were mostly positive but there has not been any actual law legalizing bitcoin or not.
I guess, it is no more possible for bitcoiners to live in the gray zone, it is just fading out, the gray zone:

Trump needs even more centralization of power for running his version of Fascism, Putin has already centralized everything in Russia (again) and Chinese have no clue about what a non-centralized form of power could ever be.

In monetary systems, AML/KYC discourse is getting more aggressive on a daily basis, It is about Orwell 1984 rather than Satoshi Nakamoto 2009. The true force behind bitcoin falling down is this trend and the fact that bitcoiners are doing almost nothing about it other than sticking with their few coins and waiting for dick heads in regulatory agencies to show merci and absorb them in the so-called 'legal system'.

As a smart con artist, Craig Faketoshi Wrong has understood the situation and made a decision: "Don't be shy Craig, you've never been, choose the wrong side as usual and figure out a way to keep talking in public."

The rest of bitcoiners? They are just shy!



wow that's deep bro Lips sealed

Indeed. I wonder who wrote this? Me? NO! I'm not that insightful, it is not me  Shocked

By the way, once you find a post "deep" best practice would be sending the poster some merits  Wink
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November 26, 2018, 02:02:41 PM
 #18

I think one reason for btc drop below $4K may be this suforum. Every minute one or two pointless topics pop up ... anyway, BUMP!
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November 26, 2018, 02:51:37 PM
 #19

Well i quietly not aware on this situation but i'm reading this blog or a link the link is down below feel free to check it out and how about post some comments or even reply so i can know something about it , also to expand my knowledge about what is happening. Link : https://news.bitcoin.com/bitcoin-hits-24000-in-iran-after-government-okays-mining/

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November 26, 2018, 03:12:21 PM
 #20

The sanction of President Trump been hammered on IRAN has a lot of momentum. This will have to do with the President of Iran's decision and actions. The people ought not to suffer for the mistake of a few government officials. Iran has to consider incorporating the bitcoin for now to ameliorate the economic sanctions and hardship.

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November 26, 2018, 07:58:05 PM
 #21

It is the Rothschild family behind all of the shenanigans.   Tongue


http://www.theeventchronicle.com/finanace/three-countries-left-without-rothschild-central-bank/

Quote
The Rothschild family is slowly but surely having their Central banks established in every country of this world, giving them incredible amount of wealth and power.

In the year of 2000 there were seven countries without a Rothschild owned or controlled Central Bank:

    Afghanistan
    Iraq
    Sudan
    Libya
    Cuba
    North Korea
    Iran

It is not a coincidence that these country, which are listed above were and are still being under attack by the western media, since one of the main reasons these countries have been under attack in the first place is because they do not have a Rothschild owned Central Bank yet.

The first step in having a Central Bank establish in a country is to get them to accept an outrageous loans, which puts the country in debt of the Central Bank and under the control of the Rothschilds.

If the country does not accept the loan, the leader of this particular country will be assassinated and a Rothschild aligned leader will be put into the position, and if the assassination does not work, the country will be invaded and have a Central Bank established with force all under the name of terrorism.

Quote
Rothschild-owned or controlled Central Banks

Central banks are illegally created private banks that are owned by the Rothschild banking family.

The family has been around for more than 230 years and has slithered its way into each country on this planet, threatened every world leader and their governments and cabinets with physical and economic death and destruction, and then emplaced their own people in these central banks to control and manage each country’s pocketbook.

Worse, the Rothschilds also control the machinations of each government at the macro level, not concerning themselves with the daily vicissitudes of our individual personal lives. Except when we get too far out of line.

The only countries left in 2003 without a Central Bank owned or controlled by the Rothschild Family were:

    Sudan
    Libya
    Cuba
    North Korea
    Iran


Now in 2018
https://roserambles.org/2018/03/01/only-three-countries-left-without-a-rothschild-central-bank-thursday-march1-2018/
Quote
The only countries left in 2011 without a Central Bank owned or controlled by the Rothschild Family are:
    Cuba
    North Korea
    Iran

*North Korea next to fall to the Rothschilds:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90xD71ANvEA

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November 26, 2018, 08:17:31 PM
 #22

Iran have suffered with far too much Western meddling over the years, mostly from the US and Britain.  As far as I'm concerned, they're well within their rights to circumvent these ridiculous sanctions.

It has also brought a lot of suffering down on itself by allowing islamists to rule the country and force their laws upon the people. I guess that was what the Western world was afraid of. Nuclear power in the hands of Islamic extremists who want to destroy the West and make sharia law great again.

Why is Iran in such a bad situation? Because they've been in hyperinflation for many years and tried to hide it by adding new fiat currencies on top of the existing ones. At the same time The USA did its best to destabilize the rial with the help of the CIA and various sanctions. Not to mention that some people are still using tomans there which adds to the chaos.

Ignoring the government and using Bitcoin would be the right path.

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November 26, 2018, 08:39:03 PM
 #23

I guess, it is no more possible for bitcoiners to live in the gray zone, it is just fading out, the gray zone:

Trump needs even more centralization of power for running his version of Fascism, Putin has already centralized everything in Russia (again) and Chinese have no clue about what a non-centralized form of power could ever be.

In monetary systems, AML/KYC discourse is getting more aggressive on a daily basis, It is about Orwell 1984 rather than Satoshi Nakamoto 2009. The true force behind bitcoin falling down is this trend and the fact that bitcoiners are doing almost nothing about it other than sticking with their few coins and waiting for dick heads in regulatory agencies to show merci and absorb them in the so-called 'legal system'.

As a smart con artist, Craig Faketoshi Wrong has understood the situation and made a decision: "Don't be shy Craig, you've never been, choose the wrong side as usual and figure out a way to keep talking in public."

The rest of bitcoiners? They are just shy!


in all your post above you have laid out pointing the finger at people and businesses that exist thousands of miles away from iran.

again. if iran want to trade in bitcoin. find a bitcoiner within 50 miles and trade... its that simple.
organise something in your town.

dont set yourself up to fail by saying "cant 'coz coinbase KYC's".. say "can 'coz adbul down the street has bitcoin he wants to sell"

dont blame the rest of the world. first of all make the first step. organise something local and build on it.

bitcoin is not coinbase. its not bitpay, its not coinify.. bitcoin is just code.
coinbase, bitpay, coinfy are just american businesses.. if you dont like what they have to offer. dont use them. instead stay away from american businesses. and then in your town organise something in your community.

you cant start a protest/strike/revolution by saying "but america want some paperwork if we ask a american union to strike for us". start your own strike. ask locals where you live to get together

no point saying american businesses dont like iran so iran will stand still and do nnothing waiting for american businesses to stop being american.
instead say, lets start iranian businesses and not wait around

 

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November 26, 2018, 09:31:16 PM
Last edit: November 26, 2018, 10:09:53 PM by aliashraf
 #24

I guess, it is no more possible for bitcoiners to live in the gray zone, it is just fading out, the gray zone:

Trump needs even more centralization of power for running his version of Fascism, Putin has already centralized everything in Russia (again) and Chinese have no clue about what a non-centralized form of power could ever be.

In monetary systems, AML/KYC discourse is getting more aggressive on a daily basis, It is about Orwell 1984 rather than Satoshi Nakamoto 2009. The true force behind bitcoin falling down is this trend and the fact that bitcoiners are doing almost nothing about it other than sticking with their few coins and waiting for dick heads in regulatory agencies to show merci and absorb them in the so-called 'legal system'.

As a smart con artist, Craig Faketoshi Wrong has understood the situation and made a decision: "Don't be shy Craig, you've never been, choose the wrong side as usual and figure out a way to keep talking in public."

The rest of bitcoiners? They are just shy!


in all your post above you have laid out pointing the finger at people and businesses that exist thousands of miles away from iran.

again. if iran want to trade in bitcoin. find a bitcoiner within 50 miles and trade... its that simple.
organise something in your town.

dont set yourself up to fail by saying "cant 'coz coinbase KYC's".. say "can 'coz adbul down the street has bitcoin he wants to sell"

dont blame the rest of the world. first of all make the first step. organise something local and build on it.

bitcoin is not coinbase. its not bitpay, its not coinify.. bitcoin is just code.
coinbase, bitpay, coinfy are just american businesses.. if you dont like what they have to offer. dont use them. instead stay away from american businesses. and then in your town organise something in your community.

you cant start a protest/strike/revolution by saying "but america want some paperwork if we ask a american union to strike for us". start your own strike. ask locals where you live to get together

no point saying american businesses dont like iran so iran will stand still and do nnothing waiting for american businesses to stop being american.
instead say, lets start iranian businesses and not wait around
It is not about what american businesses want or don't want, it is about what a crazy billionaire wants who is a friend of Netanyahu and Bin Salman and is violating every single international law and treaty to ruin the planet once forever, Donald Trump. He is not America and it is not about American businesses.

To resist this bullyism, bitcoin needs more privacy and more decentralization and censorship resistance and it should migrate from centralized exchanges to decentralized ones, otherwise with AML/KYC getting tenser every day how is it possible for Iranians to use bitcoin for international trade? And without international trade who cares about bitcoin right now in Iran?

See? you live in gray zone. You want bitcoin and want regulatory compliance at the same time, kinda hypocrisy it is. Isn't it? Then tell me how is not it just insane to expect such a ridiculous self-contradictory thing: a cryptocurrency with high prices and regulatory compliance at the same time?

I have been around enough to be familiar with the agenda of most of non-anonymous bitcoiners who are willingly ready to do anything and retreating from any agenda bitcoin has to keep the price high. Anti-censorship, anonymity, privacy, decentralization, state resistance, ... are the last things they are interested in and do not hesitate to give up with and such fools are the ones who want bitcoin to skyrocket!

Here I'm talking about what I've been promised about bitcoin:
A new monetary system that is supposed to put an end to bullyism.  
What are you talking about? Promoting bitcoin in Iran for local trade? What is it? A joke?

80 million human beings health and welfare are put in risk by a stupid bully.
They can't normally finance their international trade because of US sanctions.
They can't buy medicine, food, ... because they just can't transfer the money.

It is not a joke.
 
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November 26, 2018, 10:48:35 PM
 #25

I do not agree with the trump, he has a purpose to weaken the military, political and economic power of Iran.

when aspects of growth in the economic, military and political fields are limited by USA, the crypto world can be a solution to improve the conditions of Iran.

I think, Iran is a country that will follow Venezuela, but today, I don't know how the crypto development in Iran.

so, if Iran doesn't get a good agreement with China and Russia, then Iran must make crypto as a solution.
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November 26, 2018, 10:49:22 PM
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 #26

See? you live in gray zone. You want bitcoin and want regulatory compliance at the same time, kinda hypocrisy it is. Isn't it?

People who want regulation are simply greedy. They want it because they associate higher prices with it. They don't care about BTC. They care about their lambos and cashing out back to fiat. Most bitcoin investors are traders who want more fiat to set themselves for life and regulated BTC means rich snobs being less scared to invest and pump prices.
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November 26, 2018, 11:11:50 PM
Last edit: November 26, 2018, 11:24:49 PM by aliashraf
 #27

See? you live in gray zone. You want bitcoin and want regulatory compliance at the same time, kinda hypocrisy it is. Isn't it?

People who want regulation are simply greedy. They want it because they associate higher prices with it. They don't care about BTC. They care about their lambos and cashing out back to fiat. Most bitcoin investors are traders who want more fiat to set themselves for life and regulated BTC means rich snobs being less scared to invest and pump prices.
Indeed!

And paradoxically, it is why btc is falling sharp, regulations are getting harsher and people are asking (correctly):
When everything is under surveillance and they are aware of every single transaction or at least are so close to do it by sitting at the gates, how it would be considered radically different from fiat after all? Except for limited liquidity and price fluctuations and the row of hacks and scams?

For me price deeping even more is a blessing, it helps getting rid of bugs in the community. Be them dumping all their coins and get the hell out of this ecosystem and find their fortune in stocks or gambling business.
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November 26, 2018, 11:20:02 PM
 #28

yes, the USA has made Iran condition become worse, in my opinion, USA has given severe sanctions to Iran, of course, it affects the condition of Iran, especially in the military and economic aspect

I think, Iran must make a new revolution by making crypto regulation, even creating a national digital currency, which can have a positive impact on Iran's conditions.
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November 27, 2018, 02:19:58 PM
 #29

yes, the USA has made Iran condition become worse, in my opinion, USA has given severe sanctions to Iran, of course, it affects the condition of Iran, especially in the military and economic aspect

I think, Iran must make a new revolution by making crypto regulation, even creating a national digital currency, which can have a positive impact on Iran's conditions.
it has almost nothing to do with military to be more specific. And I don't think "national digital currency" does make any sense. I'm trying to make it clear how bitcoin should evolve and be ready for the upcoming waves of aggression by states. I think it is very important for bitcoiners to become more aware of the true forces behind the clunge of btc price and choose the right side of the lee.
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November 27, 2018, 02:41:03 PM
 #30

The influence of US is so great that no country can remain the same should she be magnanimous with sanctions. Even advance countries with sophisticated economy and sizeable influence would have to put serious palliatives measures in place in other to survive with little scar.

The current political landscape in the US is subject to interpretation which from your end you are seeing as something wrong but to some other people, its surely the right thing to do which you have rightly expose your biasness at the beginning. On the use of bitcoin to solve the situation, I think its an overreaching assumption because to use a model that has not been tested would means something of proper planning and in a situation of peace not this moment that because of pressure would be implemented in a shaby way.
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November 27, 2018, 02:47:01 PM
 #31

Iran have suffered with far too much Western meddling over the years, mostly from the US and Britain.  As far as I'm concerned, they're well within their rights to circumvent these ridiculous sanctions.  If Iran ends up using Bitcoin, or some other form of cryptocurrency, to achieve that, it would prove beyond doubt that the traditional banking system is becoming weaker and that there is a viable alternative.  If America want to maintain dominance through the dollar, this could easily backfire on them.  America won't be able to use money as a weapon if people don't solely rely on using that particular type of money.  Sanctions would effectively hurt America more than the nations they try to sanction if the result is that other nations adopt crypto instead. 


I don't know much about politics that is related to bitcoin, but what you say is right. Western countries too interfere with the problems of the Middle East country, especially Asia.
I think crypto can be an option that offers freedom in financial terms and bitcoin is very appropriate to be adopted.

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November 27, 2018, 04:08:31 PM
 #32

To resist this bullyism, bitcoin needs more privacy and more decentralization and censorship resistance and it should migrate from centralized exchanges to decentralized ones, otherwise with AML/KYC getting tenser every day how is it possible for Iranians to use bitcoin for international trade? And without international trade who cares about bitcoin right now in Iran?

bitcoin is just code
it has not coded itself to coinbase and coinbases KYC

bitcoin does not ask for people addresses.
if you in iran want to avoid COINBASES KYC.. just dont use coinbase
if you in iran want to have freedom just find someone in your area to trade with

bitcoin is not regulated
american businesses are.
so simple solution dont use american businesses

find someone local to you

i do not want regulatory compliance.
but it seems you need to understand you cant sit and cry that american businesses(not bitcoin) have regulatory compliance. without actually realising that you can simply avoid regulatory compliance by avoiding using american businesses

find and create something local to you. and you will have your solution

bitcoin cannot create a business because its just code. its the PEOPLE and businesses that use bitcoin that need to use their arms legs, mouths.

so you as a person should not ask code to detach itself from businesses because bitcoin is not attached to it. its just code
again
its just code that does not know fiat laws. has no lines of code or commands that comply with fiat laws and does not ask for fiat law KYC stuff

its for PEOPLE to detach from BUSINESSES that kyc.
again
you as a person should find someone local and trade with. its that simple
you will then find out that bitcoin code and bitcoins blockchain has not revealed that you and someone else traded in a coffee shop because bitcoin does not ask or demand KYC or demand you comply with fiat regulation

lets make it simpler
say your allergic to peanuts. you simply avoid going to a peanut factory

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November 27, 2018, 04:11:36 PM
 #33

The influence of US is so great that no country can remain the same should she be magnanimous with sanctions. Even advance countries with sophisticated economy and sizeable influence would have to put serious palliatives measures in place in other to survive with little scar.

The current political landscape in the US is subject to interpretation which from your end you are seeing as something wrong but to some other people, its surely the right thing to do which you have rightly expose your biasness at the beginning. On the use of bitcoin to solve the situation, I think its an overreaching assumption because to use a model that has not been tested would means something of proper planning and in a situation of peace not this moment that because of pressure would be implemented in a shaby way.
Too much relativism. As far as divergence in political agendas and viewpoints are of concern, relativism does not hurt, actually it helps resolving conflicts and initiating dialogues but when it comes to committing illegal and brutal actions against a nation it turns to be totally inappropriate.

Once US imposes sanctions against Iran banking system including Iran central bank, it implies blocking their access to their deposits in global banking system, it is censorship and censorship is what bitcoin is supposed to resist against.


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November 27, 2018, 04:35:39 PM
 #34

Once US imposes sanctions against Iran banking system including Iran central bank, it implies blocking their access to their deposits in global banking system, it is censorship and censorship is what bitcoin is supposed to resist against.

bitcoin is resisting because bitcoin has no fiat regulatory complience code.

its PEOPLE that need to resist
EG
if your FIAT bank tells you that you cant deposit into a certain FIAT bank of an exchange. only YOU have access to YOUR fiat funds of the bank YOU bank with.
so YOU as a person can:
take your fiat out and find someone local to trade fiat to btc.

only YOU have the power to take YOUR fiat out of YOUR bank and go to YOUR local bitcoin meetup. its YOUR bank account aftr all
i as another PERSON cannot get to YOUR bank account and withdraw YOUR fiat and attend YOUR towns meetup to convert YOUR fiat to BTC.

so help your fellow iranians. start something local so your not affected by american decisions. because code cant do what humans can do.

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November 27, 2018, 04:41:11 PM
 #35

To resist this bullyism, bitcoin needs more privacy and more decentralization and censorship resistance and it should migrate from centralized exchanges to decentralized ones, otherwise with AML/KYC getting tenser every day how is it possible for Iranians to use bitcoin for international trade? And without international trade who cares about bitcoin right now in Iran?

bitcoin is just code
it has not coded itself to coinbase and coinbases KYC

but it seems you need to understand you cant sit and cry that american businesses(not bitcoin) have regulatory complience. without actually realising that you can simply avoid regulatory complience by avoiding using american businesses

you as a person should find someone local and trade with. its that simple
it is not helpful to teach us about bitcoin being a code , what's wrong with you franky? I know it is code already. everybody knows!

And please don't repeat your "american businesses" spell, it is not helpful too. We are not discussing about how american businesses willingly offer their customers information to feds and impose discrimination against a nation, it is irrelevant, no business not even an american one is happy with this mess.

Bitcoin is seized and we have to choose sides:
either being happy with the seizure and to push for full regulatory compliance (like what Faketoshi Wrong is fighting for) or we need to enhance privacy and decentralization and stick with the resistance. My observation suggests we are getting short of chairs in the middle.

Obviously as an Iranian and a freelance developer, I'm biased in favor of the resistance and I joined bitcoin in the first place because of it but I can't
 resist mocking at the fools like Craig Wright who don't pick the right side and are dreaming of a fully regulated cryptocurrency under the watch of US feds, it is truly one of the funniest things this ecosystem and I have rights to enjoy myself by laughing at it.

Again we are not talking about how Iranians should trade locally, it is about international trade for the Christ sake, focus!


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November 27, 2018, 04:45:12 PM
 #36

now iran certainly does not approve of the existence of bitcoin because it is very disturbing the real currency in the real world which is very global at all and the price of 1 btc is now very high so many people invest in it.
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November 27, 2018, 04:57:45 PM
 #37

Bitcoin is seized and we have to choose sides:
either being happy with the seizure and to push for full regulatory compliance (like what Faketoshi Wrong is fighting for) or we need to enhance privacy and decentralization and stick with the resistance. My observation suggests we are getting short of chairs in the middle.
Again we are not talking about how Iranians should trade locally, it is about international trade for the Christ sake, focus!

if PEOPLE stop using regulated businesses. then people wont see bitcoin as regulated.
because it isnt.

also the topic is about IRANS situation
so people of iran should stop using businesses that are regulated
again if your bank imposes rules. stop using your bank

people are the resistance because bitcoin is already not complying because bitcoin has no fiat complience code

take the alcohol prohibition era.
alcohol is alcohol. it cannot decide where it gets deliverd and who gets to drink it. PEOPLE DO
when governments prohibited businesses from selling it or asked businesses to set up sting operations to offer it just to report people who asked for it.. the solution was simple. people stopped going to those businesses.

people started their own local brewing groups and clubs. and they had parties drinking all the alcohol they could wanted.

you cannot ask a bottle of beer to not comply to regulations. its for the people who want a bottle of beer to find a way to get it locally so that they can then drink with international friends and family.

the reason i say locally is because how are you going to get the fiat in your pocket into bitcoin as the first step to internationally trading using bitcoin.

its baby steps
convert your fiat locally. then trade your btc internationally. then the international recipient can convert their btc thy get locally into thir local fiat in their pocket.

so if you stop worrying about american exchanges by avoid thinking, using, doing business with them. then american fiat regulations dont apply to you..
so if you stop worrying about iran banks by avoid thinking, using, doing business with them. then iran banks regulations dont apply to you..

bitcoin is the solution and doesnt need change because bitcoin does not have regulation. people just need to stop using BUSINESSES that are regulated

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November 27, 2018, 05:09:31 PM
 #38

franky,

I have  a point: AML/KYC discourse is weakening bitcoin and my nation at the same time and there are potentials for the two to become allies. For this to work, both sides have obligations? Yes! Iranians should adopt bitcoin and bitcoin should improve in terms of privacy and decentralization.

Any objections franky?
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November 27, 2018, 05:15:56 PM
 #39

franky,

I have  a point: AML/KYC discourse is weakening bitcoin and my nation at the same time and there are potentials for the two to become allies. For this to work, both sides have obligations? Yes! Iranians should adopt bitcoin and bitcoin should improve in terms of privacy and decentralization.

Any objections franky?

bitcoin has privacy
  show me a command/line of code that asks for your name and house location
  show me on the blockchain anyones name/house address

bitcoin the currency is decentralised.
  show me a command that says do not relay/confirm transactions intended for iran/china/korea or anywhere.
  show me a command that says only transact with americans

iwill say this though. the fee war has priced some countries out of wanting to use bitcoin for daily use because the fee's are higher than a hours minimum wage for some country. (this needs changing)
but thats about stop using the business that developed the code for removing the fee formulae
you cant ask bitcoin code to self edit. its not AI
you need to stop using a certain dev team(business/people)  and instead get other PEOPLE/teams to develop code and have people decide to activate a fee formulae code that makes it cheap to use for all countries

bitcoin doesnt kill people.. people do

its the people/businesses around bitcoin(but are not bitcoin themselves) that need privacy and decentralisation.

the solution. dont use businesses that require regulatory complience.
code cannot do this. people can

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November 27, 2018, 06:37:16 PM
 #40

franky,

I have  a point: AML/KYC discourse is weakening bitcoin and my nation at the same time and there are potentials for the two to become allies. For this to work, both sides have obligations? Yes! Iranians should adopt bitcoin and bitcoin should improve in terms of privacy and decentralization.

Any objections franky?
bitcoin has privacy
  show me a command/line of code that asks for your name and house location
  show me on the blockchain anyones name/house address
Bitcoin is pseudonymous, you are not exposed but you are traceable. US surveillance agencies have to spend their ridiculously high budgets somehow and tracking bitcoin transactions mixed with imposing kyc on centralized exchanges gives them everything they want plus a stupid selfie of the victim who is holding his id and smiles like fools  Grin

To guarantee their seizure, SEC recently pressed charges against Zachary Coburn because he is the developer of Etherdelta, a decentralized exchange!  and here I come to another issue that should be fixed: bitcoin devs are too exposed, they are not eligible for developing useful stuff
related to privacy and decentralization because of this, not being anonymous and being vulnerable to prosecution.

Quote
bitcoin the currency is decentralised.
  show me a command that says do not relay/confirm transactions intended for iran/china/korea or anywhere.
  show me a command that says only transact with americans
I have been discussing pooling pressure flaw in bitcoin and the situation with pools for a while, we need serious commitment by devs to fix it, what we are not observing any signal from them about.

With pools, speaking of decentralization is void, Trump is crazy enough to make a deal with Chinese for blacklisting specific addresses/nodes/... and dictating it to pool operators within a week.

Bottom line:
We need to get rid of pools and centralized exchanges and to implement stronger privacy feature in bitcoin.
Such an agenda needs a lot of commitment from devs (true anonymous ones) and the community (true insightful members). Shut the F**up and join franky  Tongue

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November 27, 2018, 06:43:29 PM
 #41

Disclaimer:
As a resident of Iran, I'm obviously biased toward my nation, the people who I personally know and well, mostly love.

Is it true that the price of BTC is much higher in Iran than elsewhere?

Online cryptocurrency exchange
https://linkkoin.com Buy BTC, ETH, XRP, BCH, EOS, LTC, XMR, REP, ETC, ZEC with payment card/Apple Pay
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November 27, 2018, 06:47:52 PM
Last edit: November 27, 2018, 07:21:50 PM by aliashraf
 #42

Disclaimer:
As a resident of Iran, I'm obviously biased toward my nation, the people who I personally know and well, mostly love.

Is it true that the price of BTC is much higher in Iran than elsewhere?
Nop. Rial has suffered but we trade bitcoin by its usd price as it is reported by Binance and others, then it translates to Rial using free market Rial/USD fee.
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November 27, 2018, 06:53:13 PM
 #43

Personally I don't like mixing politics with Crypto especially Bitcoin,  but I think Iranians people too need to look at the mirror and ask themselves some fundamental questions, this issue is not peculiar with Iran alone becaause there are some people behind the scene benefiting greatly from this, I am talking about Zimbabwe, Nigeria, Argentina and some of these countries in dire financial mess. For me you can only help yourselves thanks God for internet that has made information this readily available prepare for your future and that of your children because some people I talked to about BTC still believe it to be a scam

          
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November 27, 2018, 06:58:59 PM
 #44

what id love to see as a code solution to de-tag bitcoin from the PEOPLES vision of $america control

imagine exchanges(local decentralised) all agreed to stop measuring bitcoin in $ and instead measure it as
minimum wage hours

imagine right now all exchanges measure bitcoin as being 533 hours
just that 533 hours
and exchange move up or down in minute or seconds (not cents)

now people using the Rial can convert that to what their minimum wage per hour is to get a rial value

.. heres the international revolution part.
in america it would cost americans $4000
in iran it would cost iranians r882

meaning where-ever you ar in the world it only costs you 533 of your local hard labour employment to get 1btc
instead of having to work 2415 hours due to converting dollar to rial to get 1btc

benfits: labour equality world wide
detags peoples perception that $$ rule
people can then arbitrage the forex markets and flood forex with dollars as they buy rial to get cheap coins so that $/r imbalance occurs and brings the rial inline with $.. lifting iran out of 'poverty'

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November 27, 2018, 08:31:01 PM
 #45

I have read about the situation with IRAN for several times and there are still some things. I hope that everything will be fine! I am not an expert but to my mind the situation will stabilize

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November 27, 2018, 11:23:44 PM
 #46

franky,

I have  a point: AML/KYC discourse is weakening bitcoin and my nation at the same time and there are potentials for the two to become allies. For this to work, both sides have obligations? Yes! Iranians should adopt bitcoin and bitcoin should improve in terms of privacy and decentralization.

Any objections franky?
bitcoin has privacy
  show me a command/line of code that asks for your name and house location
  show me on the blockchain anyones name/house address
Bitcoin is pseudonymous, you are not exposed but you are traceable. US surveillance agencies have to spend their ridiculously high budgets somehow and tracking bitcoin transactions mixed with imposing kyc on centralized exchanges gives them everything they want plus a stupid selfie of the victim who is holding his id and smiles like fools  Grin

To guarantee their seizure, SEC recently pressed charges against Zachary Coburn because he is the developer of Etherdelta, a decentralized exchange!  and here I come to another issue that should be fixed: bitcoin devs are too exposed, they are not eligible for developing useful stuff
related to privacy and decentralization because of this, not being anonymous and being vulnerable to prosecution.

Quote
bitcoin the currency is decentralised.
  show me a command that says do not relay/confirm transactions intended for iran/china/korea or anywhere.
  show me a command that says only transact with americans
I have been discussing pooling pressure flaw in bitcoin and the situation with pools for a while, we need serious commitment by devs to fix it, what we are not observing any signal from them about.

With pools, speaking of decentralization is void, Trump is crazy enough to make a deal with Chinese for blacklisting specific addresses/nodes/... and dictating it to pool operators within a week.

Bottom line:
We need to get rid of pools and centralized exchanges and to implement stronger privacy features in bitcoin.
Such an agenda needs a lot of commitment from devs (true anonymous ones) and the community (true insightful members).
Shut the F**up and join franky  Tongue
God forbid me, but I feel so bad when important posts happen to fall at the bottom of the page (with default settings) and get little chance to be on the latest page because of scrolling. So, I did it, I quoted my own post and I'm sorry, not a common practice for me, I promise.
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November 28, 2018, 01:31:02 AM
 #47

I am very curious. I know that the Iranian government has always implemented the external website filtering policy for the domestic Internet, and this year the Iranian government has blocked VPN access, so how did you come here?
If you think your government is right, why are you using VPN?
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November 28, 2018, 01:46:53 AM
 #48

Bitcoin is pseudonymous, you are not exposed but you are traceable. US surveillance agencies have to spend their ridiculously high budgets somehow and tracking bitcoin transactions mixed with imposing kyc on centralized exchanges gives them everything they want plus a stupid selfie of the victim who is holding his id and smiles like fools  Grin

To guarantee their seizure, SEC recently pressed charges against Zachary Coburn because he is the developer of Etherdelta, a decentralized exchange!  and here I come to another issue that should be fixed: bitcoin devs are too exposed, they are not eligible for developing useful stuff
related to privacy and decentralization because of this, not being anonymous and being vulnerable to prosecution.

again you are addressing businesses "imposing KYC on centralised exchanges"
if you dont use it. dont make a stupid selfie.. they wont find your details on a businesses website

again you are addressing businesses
you also argue about needing decentralised exchanges. then quote a media story about decentralised exchange getting hit
again if you dont put coins into etherdelta. you wont get anything seized

bitcoin code cannot stop businesses. cannot stop government from reading kyc details held by businesses. so th solution si to just stop using businesses that do it.

if everyone found a local meetup and traded coins in a coffee shop. the blockchain wont show any details of the coffee shop
you can buy btc with rial with someone else while you sip on a coffee..

then you just trade bitcoin internationally without your identity being revealed.. oh and no stupid selfies will be found.
the recipient then just finds someone in his area and trades bitcoin he gets back to his fiat. without trace shown on the blockchain.

its simple. stop using regulated businesses.
if you really need code to prevent your details from being listed in a KYC's business.. simple
{
ShowMessage("dont use that business.");
}

its the beer bottle argument
if you want to drink beer during prohibition. make your own moonshine beer and drink it wherever you like. just dont go to a bar/pub and ask for a beer

the point you keep missing hense me repeating
code cannot stop you making a selfie and stop you typing your name into a KYC'd srvice.. only you can stop yourself.
if a service has a selfie of you and your details. its because you provided that information to that service.

if you cannot stop yourself from using a KYC service. you might want to take a step back from the keyboard and stop typing your name and address into services

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November 28, 2018, 02:09:02 AM
 #49

the funny thing about laws is. laws are paper

the law itself is meaningless. its about people
officers looking and arresting.
customers giving out information to a business for an officer to find.

lets take the U.S gun law.
the law says no fully automatic gun with a certain grip should be permitted.
people didn sit on their hands for years crying that laws should change.

the simply changed the grip on the gun.. now the law doesnt apply to people using fully automatic weapons

if you dont like a law.. as a person.. AVOID IT. work around the problem
bank related activity:
dont use banks. form your own credit union.
set up a bartab get people to trade bitcoin using banknotes for btc
work for cash in hand
i can think of hundreds of solutions.

but sitting at a computer mentioning the problem is just about highlighting the problem
if you want a solution then solutions have been presented to you

if you want a revolution. start one.
code cant start a revolution. its just code

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November 28, 2018, 08:44:16 AM
 #50

if you want a revolution. start one.
code cant start a revolution. its just code
So wrong!

It is classic:
Quote
  link=https://satoshi.nakamotoinstitute.org/emails/cryptography/4/#selection-29.0-47.6
>Lengthy exposition of vulnerability of a systm to use-of-force
>monopolies ellided.
>
>You will not find a solution to political problems in cryptography.

Yes, but we can win a major battle in the arms race and gain a new territory of freedom for several years.

Governments are good at cutting off the heads of a centrally controlled networks like Napster, but pure P2P networks like Gnutella and Tor seem to be holding their own.

Satoshi



It is known as the Axiom of Resistance:
Quote
link= https://github.com/libbitcoin/libbitcoin/wiki/Axiom-of-Resistance
In other words there is an assumption that it is possible for a system to resist state control. This is not accepted as a fact but deemed to be a reasonable assumption, due to the behavior of similar systems, on which to base the system.

One who does not accept the axiom of resistance is contemplating an entirely different system than Bitcoin. If one assumes it is not possible for a system to resist state controls, conclusions do not make sense in the context of Bitcoin; just as conclusions in spherical geometry contradict Euclidean.

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November 28, 2018, 12:39:11 PM
 #51

what you are quoting is not code doing the work
its people

code cannot hand deliver weapons through the postal system. people do. businesses do
if DHL suddenly stops delivering guns to peoples homes. code cannot mandate that people stop using DHL people choose to stop using DHL
people would then choose to use the amazon logistics similar to uber(for parcels) again. people

so if you want to circumvent weapons policies people need to act.

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November 28, 2018, 12:47:59 PM
 #52

what you are quoting is not code doing the work
its people

code cannot hand deliver weapons through the postal system. people do. businesses do
if DHL suddenly stops delivering guns to peoples homes. code cannot mandate that people stop using DHL people choose to stop using DHL
people would then choose to use the amazon logistics similar to uber(for parcels) again. people

so if you want to circumvent weapons policies people need to act.
Code is supposed to be supportive, isn't it?

Bitcoin should improve even more to cope with the new centralization threats led by crazy right wing populists who want the whole power in their dirty hands.

I have clearly defined what I mean by improvements:

To guarantee their seizure, SEC recently pressed charges against Zachary Coburn because he is the developer of Etherdelta, a decentralized exchange!  and here I come to another issue that should be fixed: bitcoin devs are too exposed, they are not eligible for developing useful stuff
related to privacy and decentralization because of this, not being anonymous and being vulnerable to prosecution.
...

We need to get rid of pools and centralized exchanges and to implement stronger privacy features in bitcoin.
Such an agenda needs a lot of commitment from devs (true anonymous ones) and the community (true insightful members).

You got any problems with this franky?
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November 28, 2018, 01:05:26 PM
 #53

what you are quoting is not code doing the work
its people

code cannot hand deliver weapons through the postal system. people do. businesses do
if DHL suddenly stops delivering guns to peoples homes. code cannot mandate that people stop using DHL people choose to stop using DHL
people would then choose to use the amazon logistics similar to uber(for parcels) again. people

so if you want to circumvent weapons policies people need to act.
Code is supposed to be supportive, isn't it?

Bitcoin should improve even more to cope with the new centralization threats led by crazy right wing populists who want the whole power in their dirty hands.

I have clearly defined what I mean by improvements:

To guarantee their seizure, SEC recently pressed charges against Zachary Coburn because he is the developer of Etherdelta, a decentralized exchange!  and here I come to another issue that should be fixed: bitcoin devs are too exposed, they are not eligible for developing useful stuff
related to privacy and decentralization because of this, not being anonymous and being vulnerable to prosecution.
...

We need to get rid of pools and centralized exchanges and to implement stronger privacy features in bitcoin.
Such an agenda needs a lot of commitment from devs (true anonymous ones) and the community (true insightful members).

You got any problems with this franky?

bitcoins privacy has not changed from 2009-2018
satoshi a person rmained anonymous even while writing hundreds of posts and emails. not due to changing code. but by him as a person not doing something(giving out his real name)

bitcoin does not ask for real names.
its peoples decision to go public. the problem is not bitcoin code its peoples choice to reveal their name
so if you want code (which people will ignore at times)
{
ShowMessage("dont give out real name");
}
but as you can see the code cant enforce people. its people that need to act.
again code cant shut down pools because people will find a work around.
even with PoS instead of PoW people are already syndicating their funds('stake') into pools
agaiin the problems you raise cannot be sorted by getting writing on paper(laws) changed. or keys on keyboard(code)
people need to be the change.

to kill a pool/exchange people just need to stop using such services. and it can only happen if people do things and people change their normal habits

so if you dont like american regulations holding iranians hostage against international trade. stop using businesses linked to american rgulations. then do something local to get your btc and be able to buy things in your local town with btc without the need of american tied services

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November 28, 2018, 01:30:04 PM
 #54


bitcoins privacy has not changed from 2009-2018
But threats have been escalated! So we need change, desperately.

again code cant shut down pools because people will find a work around.
even with PoS instead of PoW people are already syndicating their funds('stake') into pools
agaiin the problems you raise cannot be sorted by getting writing on paper(laws) changed. or keys on keyboard(code)
people need to be the change.
to kill a pool/exchange people just need to stop using such services. and it can only happen if people do things and people change their normal habits
I'm realising that you franky, play dumb once you find it adequate for your arguments. It is really dumb, to think about pools as of people's choice! They are not! Pools are totally inevitable because of bitcoin pooling pressure flaw which I have been discussing it in this forum for a long time and I have proposed a definite solution for it. Briefly speaking, people join pools because they just can't afford the high stake gambling that bitcoin mining is. It is called mining variance and i have dedicated a topic to analyse it.

Quote
so if you dont like american regulations holding iranians hostage against international trade. stop using businesses linked to american regulations. then do something local to get your btc and be able to buy things in your local town with btc without the need of american tied services
Now you are back to "american businesses" and "using bitcoin locally in Iran" stuff that I've refuted more than once. So, please stop this nonsense.
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November 28, 2018, 02:49:51 PM
 #55


bitcoins privacy has not changed from 2009-2018
But threats have been escalated! So we need change, desperately.

what threat.
if you fear your bank freezing your account. take your fiat out
they cant freeze what they dont have.

then with fiat in hand organise a meetup and buy bitcoin hand to hand
there, done, no threat.
now your free from the worry of banks

I'm realising that you franky, play dumb once you find it adequate for your arguments. It is really dumb, to think about pools as of people's choice!
i dont play dumb. what i do is take something that someone over complicates using buzzwords and finger pointing. and i simplify it into simple terms and solutions. not just for your benefit. but all readers,

i dont bother finding simple solutions and then twist them into sounding complicated by giving them buzzwords. though many people in other topics hate it when i use simple terms. so now and again i use other peoples buzzwords just to shut people up arguing offtopic about lack of buzzwords, so that the topic can revert back to simple explanations for ALL readers to understand.

EG your buzzword "axiom" ill call it what it is to common people.... "common sense"

so i am sorry if i dont use your buzz word. but 99% of readers would prefer to read a topic that gets straight from problem to solution. rather than have to deep dive search engines for definitions

if they would rather just talk about the complexities of the problem, so be it i just tell them to go research and deep dive the search engines in their own time

same goes for solutions
instead of over complicating solutions requiring trying to lobby governments to change or lobbying devs to change. i just give out a simple idea for a simple solution any average common person can do. and just leave them to do it.

thats where people think that i should be pushing things. nope. i just untwist complicated FUD, mis understandings and correct it into simple terms. people think i should push for change because i am mentioning the problem.. others think i am trying to force change because i mention a problem/solution. again no.
i just show the simple real understanding all common people can understand and then, if people want to wake up one day and do something that will change something. they can

but its up to them to do it.
code cant change itself and as this topic has shown no matter how much you tell a person to do something they wont. because THEY/YOU need to do it. not rely on others to do it

people/businesses are the problem. if you cant change them. avoid them and find another way.
hense. find the simple solution that solves the issue without you having to bang your head against the wall

so your problem with KYX banking regs and seizing funds. easy dont use a bank. do things locally
so your problem with not being able to buy brad locally with btc. easy locally organise a meet up and plan to help grocer store use bitcoin

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November 29, 2018, 08:57:40 AM
 #56

Today, the US federal agency in charge of Iran sanctions, Office of Foreign Assets Control (OFAC), for the first time in bitcoin history, announced two bitcoin addresses associated to two Iranian individuals subject to secondary sanctions!
Quote

link= https://home.treasury.gov/news/press-releases/sm556

WASHINGTON – The U.S. Department of the Treasury’s Office of Foreign Assets Control (OFAC) took action today against two Iran-based individuals, Ali Khorashadizadeh and Mohammad Ghorbaniyan, who helped exchange digital currency (bitcoin) ransom payments into Iranian rial on behalf of Iranian malicious cyber actors involved with the SamSam ransomware scheme that targeted over 200 known victims.  Also today, OFAC identified two digital currency addresses associated with these two financial facilitators.  Over 7,000 transactions in bitcoin, worth millions of U.S. dollars, have processed through these two addresses - some of which involved SamSam ransomware derived bitcoin. In a related action, the U.S. Department of Justice today indicted two Iranian criminal actors for infecting numerous data networks with SamSam ransomware in the United States, United Kingdom, and Canada since 2015.  

“Treasury is targeting digital currency exchangers who have enabled Iranian cyber actors to profit from extorting digital ransom payments from their victims.  As Iran becomes increasingly isolated and desperate for access to U.S. dollars, it is vital that virtual currency exchanges, peer-to-peer exchangers, and other providers of digital currency services harden their networks against these illicit schemes,” said Treasury Under Secretary for Terrorism and Financial Intelligence Sigal Mandelker.  “We are publishing digital currency addresses to identify illicit actors operating in the digital currency space. Treasury will aggressively pursue Iran and other rogue regimes attempting to exploit digital currencies and weaknesses in cyber and AML/CFT safeguards to further their nefarious objectives.

Obviously, the two addresses belong to Iranian local bitcoin traders/exchanges that has been transacting bitcoin for years and the accusation of being "involved" in processing ransomware related addresses is just an excuse for weakening bitcoin in Iran by threatening people all around the world.

It is a declaration of war against bitcoin too. The dick heads in Trump administration has no clue about what they are talking about! How in the hell bitcoiners should avoid this two addresses to transact with?

And it is a proof of what I'm saying about the shady zone getting narrower:
I guess, it is no more possible for bitcoiners to live in the gray zone, it is just fading out, the gray zone:

Trump needs even more centralization of power for running his version of Fascism, Putin has already centralized everything in Russia (again) and Chinese have no clue about what a non-centralized form of power could ever be.

In monetary systems, AML/KYC discourse is getting more aggressive on a daily basis, It is about Orwell 1984 rather than Satoshi Nakamoto 2009. The true force behind bitcoin falling down is this trend and the fact that bitcoiners are doing almost nothing about it other than sticking with their few coins and waiting for dick heads in regulatory agencies to show merci and absorb them in the so-called 'legal system'.

As a smart con artist, Craig Faketoshi Wrong has understood the situation and made a decision: "Don't be shy Craig, you've never been, choose the wrong side as usual and figure out a way to keep talking in public."

The rest of bitcoiners? They are just shy!



Just a few days after the above post and they are blacklisting bitcoin addresses and threatening bitcoiners all around the world by their brutal secondary sanctions!

What?! You think they may be following my posts?

But seriously, isn't it the moment of truth for bitcoin?  
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November 29, 2018, 09:17:16 AM
 #57

if THEY are blacklisting 2 addresses. then dont use services/exchanges tied to "they"

continue trading bitcoin locally. you will still see that you can swap your fiat for btc by not using exchanges that blacklist
again simple solution.

instead of sitting in a chair worrying yourself and thinking for years you cant swap bitcoin because you fear x,y,z.. find a work around

EG i see flaws of segwit and flaws of LN. my solution. i just dont use segwit or LN

if you want decentralised exchanges. organise a meetup and change hand to hand. code cant organise decentralised exchanges of people

its like your trying to ask a screwdriver to make a wooden box. yes a screw driver is the tool. but it requires a human to put things together and lay out the space to build it.
if you find out that a government is asking a popular retailer to report all screwdriver sales. find another retailer

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November 29, 2018, 09:55:33 AM
 #58

[...]

I will not delve into the issue of the fight between Iran is the US, let's talk about bitcoin and Iran, here are the headlines that were published months ago on the news channels:

MAR 18, 2014

Iranian Officials Look Into Bitcoin

That was 4 years ago and it was supposed that today Iran legalized bitcoin or will it be that this article was just rumor? who knows, but let's continue to see other headlines about Iran

NOV 04, 2017

Iranian Government Plans New Infrastructure for Bitcoin Users

Quote
Amir Hossein Davaee, Iran’s Deputy Minister of Information and Communication Technology. shares:

The ministry of communications and information technology has already conducted a number of research studies as part of efforts to prepare the infrastructure to use Bitcoin inside the country.

FEB 22, 2018

Iran Central Bank Wants To ‘Control And Prevent’ Cryptocurrency, Local Press Reports

Iran’s central bank has split from previous pro-Bitcoin government announcements and is now looking to “prevent” cryptocurrency, according to a report published by the Iran Front Page news site Wednesday, Feb. 21.

An article in local newspaper Iran quoted online by Iran Front Page cites the Central Bank of Iran describing cryptocurrencies as “highly unreliable and risky” this week.

The bank, the press sources claim, is now “cooperating with other institutions to develop a new mechanism to control and prevent digital currencies in Iran.”

APR 04, 2018

Iranian Cyberspace Authority Says Telegram’s Upcoming Crypto Threatens National Currency

Quote
The secretary of Iran’s High Council of Cyberspace (HCC) has publicly supported the potential ban of Telegram within the country, citing the chat app’s recent Initial Coin Offering (ICO) as potentially “undermin[ing] the national currency of Iran,” local news outlet Al-Monitor reported yesterday, April 3.

Why the government of Iran has not yet legalized bitcoin? Power corrupts people, and government is consists of a small group of people who only defend their own personal interests.

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November 29, 2018, 10:02:30 AM
 #59

bitcoin does not ask/force you to use a centralised exchange.
bitcoin does not ask/force you for personal information
bitcoin does not ask/force you to use a certain bank

bitcoin does not ask/force you to avoid local swaps
bitcoin does not ask/force you to avoid OTC trades
bitcoin does not ask/force you to avoid paper money swaps

bitcoin did not code exchanges
bitcoin did not create regulations
bitcoin does not contain code that follow american regulations
bitcoin does not contain code that blacklist addresses

its businesses and people.
thus the problem is not bitcoin its businesses and people

if you want privacy dont give out personal information
if you dont want a business linked to regulation, regulating/prohibiting you. dont use that business

create your people group and circumvent/work around the problem

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