moonman787
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Activity: 84
Merit: 10
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March 22, 2014, 04:42:04 PM |
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Surely they'd want valuation, nothing wrong with being rich internationally, but its not at all necessary for the success of the coin as a currency for Lakotas. Their only risk is having the inflation and supply dominated externally - whales abroad would have the power to manipulate supply and the price of goods within the reserve. They don't need investors. "Investor", unless they're local, means coins being owned outside the reserve. Its counter-intuitive. Its actually better for the coin if we all lose interest - the only people left to pick up the torches would be those with an actual reason to own the coin beyond speculation (Lakotas). . . If Maza reaches a high price its unlikely that would happen because of Lakota investors. High price means the coin is dominated outside the reserve; high price could very well doom MZC to failure.
And the problem with USD isn't the inflation itself but the fact that tyrants control the flow and distribution. There is NO free market, the currency is controlled completely. This is not true in cryptos (the good ones) - they have predictable inflation that is randomly distributed. Its a fair system where no one gets to run things. Decentralized vs Centralized > that's the advantage.
I said it earlier and I'll repost what I said in reference to how the importance of outside valuation is (i.e., from the investors): I think you're dead wrong with the assumption that the tribe will set the "real price" of the coin, and here's why: Say they have a grocery store and someone wants to buy 1 weeks worth of food with 80 maza lets say, the whole supply chain would have to agree on such a price for it to work. So what this means is the grocery store pays for their supply of goods from outside vendors and distributors, who would have to agree to the maza standard and accept it's worth. Then, they would have to pay the individual food brands who supply the store in maza who would have to pay their workers in maza, etc... The whole system breaks down immediately because if I want to buy a loaf of bread with 1 maza lets say, the store who is selling that loaf to me actually paid USD for it from their vendors, and so on and so on. The entire chain of supply would have to acknowledge to a universally standard of what 1 maza is really worth. Otherwise, the store clerk would say, "wait a sec, we just paid $1.50 for this bread in real money and now we're selling it for something worth less than a penny?" Correct me if I'm wrong here, but I think adopting a different standard for the worth of maza outside of what the market says is completely pointless, because the supply chain simply won't allow it. Now if you have two people who independently create something and sell/trade with each other, then yes, they can price 1 maza for whatever they want. Once you add in outside factors of the supply chain, then you would have to convince each and every factor to adopt the "real price" according to the tribe. The supply chain extends to everything you could think of...buildings, streets, schools, food, gas...whatever. Each industry has multiple supply chains and countless companies who agree to the USD value of goods and services. I highly doubt anyone of those checkpoints in the supply chain are going to spend millions of USD on supplies or services and get paid on the backend with the "real value" of maza. Sure, they can get paid with maza, so don't get me wrong there. But the price of each maza will solely depend on USD market value. So, it truly is the investors who set the price of the coin and not the tribe saying, "No, Maza is worth $1 each on the reservation." It doesn't work that way because 99.9% of the supply chain works outside of the reservation to produce the goods and services to bring into the reservation and as such, it spends USD in doing so. Again, please correct me if I'm wrong. |
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marhaben
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Activity: 66
Merit: 10
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March 22, 2014, 06:04:48 PM |
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Surely they'd want valuation, nothing wrong with being rich internationally, but its not at all necessary for the success of the coin as a currency for Lakotas. Their only risk is having the inflation and supply dominated externally - whales abroad would have the power to manipulate supply and the price of goods within the reserve. They don't need investors. "Investor", unless they're local, means coins being owned outside the reserve. Its counter-intuitive. Its actually better for the coin if we all lose interest - the only people left to pick up the torches would be those with an actual reason to own the coin beyond speculation (Lakotas). . . If Maza reaches a high price its unlikely that would happen because of Lakota investors. High price means the coin is dominated outside the reserve; high price could very well doom MZC to failure.
And the problem with USD isn't the inflation itself but the fact that tyrants control the flow and distribution. There is NO free market, the currency is controlled completely. This is not true in cryptos (the good ones) - they have predictable inflation that is randomly distributed. Its a fair system where no one gets to run things. Decentralized vs Centralized > that's the advantage.
I said it earlier and I'll repost what I said in reference to how the importance of outside valuation is (i.e., from the investors): I think you're dead wrong with the assumption that the tribe will set the "real price" of the coin, and here's why: Say they have a grocery store and someone wants to buy 1 weeks worth of food with 80 maza lets say, the whole supply chain would have to agree on such a price for it to work. So what this means is the grocery store pays for their supply of goods from outside vendors and distributors, who would have to agree to the maza standard and accept it's worth. Then, they would have to pay the individual food brands who supply the store in maza who would have to pay their workers in maza, etc... The whole system breaks down immediately because if I want to buy a loaf of bread with 1 maza lets say, the store who is selling that loaf to me actually paid USD for it from their vendors, and so on and so on. The entire chain of supply would have to acknowledge to a universally standard of what 1 maza is really worth. Otherwise, the store clerk would say, "wait a sec, we just paid $1.50 for this bread in real money and now we're selling it for something worth less than a penny?" Correct me if I'm wrong here, but I think adopting a different standard for the worth of maza outside of what the market says is completely pointless, because the supply chain simply won't allow it. Now if you have two people who independently create something and sell/trade with each other, then yes, they can price 1 maza for whatever they want. Once you add in outside factors of the supply chain, then you would have to convince each and every factor to adopt the "real price" according to the tribe. The supply chain extends to everything you could think of...buildings, streets, schools, food, gas...whatever. Each industry has multiple supply chains and countless companies who agree to the USD value of goods and services. I highly doubt anyone of those checkpoints in the supply chain are going to spend millions of USD on supplies or services and get paid on the backend with the "real value" of maza. Sure, they can get paid with maza, so don't get me wrong there. But the price of each maza will solely depend on USD market value. So, it truly is the investors who set the price of the coin and not the tribe saying, "No, Maza is worth $1 each on the reservation." It doesn't work that way because 99.9% of the supply chain works outside of the reservation to produce the goods and services to bring into the reservation and as such, it spends USD in doing so. Again, please correct me if I'm wrong. Well of course you're right, but I assumed that it would be treated like other natural currencies. You could make the same argument about the USD/Euro. Yes, it will have to stablize in price before it gets adopted in a fashion that third party non-traditional users would consider dealing in it, but for local transactions within the Lakota Nation that do not rely on external logistics (such as agricultural, carpentry, etc...) I could see it working. You'd have to deal in USD for things imported for the time being, but internally created items and services could work, provided the service providers were able to procure some USD for imported items. |
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mazatalk
Newbie
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Activity: 7
Merit: 0
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March 22, 2014, 07:48:01 PM
Last edit: March 22, 2014, 08:27:10 PM by mazatalk |
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Enough about the mafia wankers, what's going on with this coin? Haven't heard any news in awhile.
Not sure, but the new website looks pretty decent. http://mazatalk.com/The website is a good idea, it's good to keep people informed and explain what the coin is about. The only problem is that it's filled with bullshit. Lakota nation this, and lakota nation that....the new currency of the lakota nation. The lakota nation has made it clear that they had no intention of making mazacoin their official currency. The website just has a bunch of links that point to mazacoin being the "official currency of the lakota nation" which straight up isn't true. The website is misinformative, especially to newcomers of maza. I'm not trying to cause FUD, I'm still holding on to a significant amount of maza tht I invested in, and that's why I'm pissed. Payu made bogus claims about maza, which is what made most people invest in maza, and he refuses to listen to the investors, miners, and supporters of maza about concerns and improvements, because he doesn't give a shit about them; and he obviously doesn't give a shit about the lakota nation if he refuses to make changes, because at this rate, the 1000 maza that he is giving out to them is only going to amount to 2 or 3 dollars per person. So as of now, fuck the website, and fuck Payu To be absolutely clear http://mazatalk.com is a community project for MazaCoin advocacy and not created directly by MazaCoin devs. Our independent goal is to provide communication, transparency and local awareness for the coin. While we do claim MazaCoin to be "for" the Lakota Nation we make no claim that it is the "official currency", however we do believe MazaCoin is the best tool to create an economic foundation upon which the Traditional Lakota Nation can build lasting wealth and prosperity for their people. Acceptance by tribal government and grassroots growth will take time. But, the cause is noble and people are in need. I have family in Pine Ridge. Our ambitious goal in support of MazaCoin is to eliminate the extreme poverty in Pine Ridge and further establish tribal sovereignty; and we seek the collaboration of others who share our vision. |
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bitranger
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March 22, 2014, 08:37:18 PM |
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Welcome Mazatalk!..Pay no attention to the FUD spreaders.Most of them are on ignore and it shows what kind of a person it is when they have to resort to vulgar language to get their point across!..
You have a nice site!..Mazacoin is the first to attempt what it is doing..Your site and others like it will help spread the word!.
I had no idea how bad it was for the lakota before i discovered Mazacoin a few weeks ago!
I am still buying the coin and in it for the long haul and very proud to say it!
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serejandmyself
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March 22, 2014, 08:39:42 PM |
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Enough about the mafia wankers, what's going on with this coin? Haven't heard any news in awhile.
Not sure, but the new website looks pretty decent. http://mazatalk.com/The website is a good idea, it's good to keep people informed and explain what the coin is about. The only problem is that it's filled with bullshit. Lakota nation this, and lakota nation that....the new currency of the lakota nation. The lakota nation has made it clear that they had no intention of making mazacoin their official currency. The website just has a bunch of links that point to mazacoin being the "official currency of the lakota nation" which straight up isn't true. The website is misinformative, especially to newcomers of maza. I'm not trying to cause FUD, I'm still holding on to a significant amount of maza tht I invested in, and that's why I'm pissed. Payu made bogus claims about maza, which is what made most people invest in maza, and he refuses to listen to the investors, miners, and supporters of maza about concerns and improvements, because he doesn't give a shit about them; and he obviously doesn't give a shit about the lakota nation if he refuses to make changes, because at this rate, the 1000 maza that he is giving out to them is only going to amount to 2 or 3 dollars per person. So as of now, fuck the website, and fuck Payu To be absolutely clear http://mazatalk.com is a community project for MazaCoin advocacy and not created directly by MazaCoin devs. Our independent goal is to provide communication, transparency and local awareness for the coin. While we do claim MazaCoin to be "for" the Lakota Nation we make no claim that it is the "official currency", however we do believe MazaCoin is the best tool to create an economic foundation upon which the Traditional Lakota Nation can build lasting wealth and prosperity for their people. Acceptance by tribal government and grassroots growth will take time. But, the cause is noble and people are in need. I have family in Pine Ridge. Our ambitious goal in support of MazaCoin is to eliminate the extreme poverty in Pine Ridge and further establish tribal sovereignty; and we seek the collaboration of others who share our vision. ill be happy to help spread the word. |
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flipstyle (OP)
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March 22, 2014, 09:03:00 PM |
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Payu probably ignores the gamblers and kids on this and other forums because a high price was never necessary for MZC to succeed. The distribution is only intended to spread Maza among Lakotas in the hopes that if enough people own it, it will gain traction as a currency among holders. Putting Maza into terms of USD and suggesting that the intention here was for Lakotas to cash in their 'airdrop' as a one time donation is asinine. People suggesting that a one time USD donation was the purpose of this coin are either tricksters or very confused.
Long term. No one needs to profit a single USD for Maza to succeed. It functions as an accurate unit of measure whatever its USD conversion is. If anything, a low price and other national options will hopefully scare off gamblers and profiteers abroad, leaving Lakotas much more opportunity to dominate the ownership and mining of their own coin.
While that is true, in order for it to gain status as a sole currency replacement, it will have to garner a greater sense of market stability. I think that's what payu is struggling on convincing the tribal counsil of...the current and future market stability and purchasing power of this crypto currency. Or else what's the point of there even being a hard cap on coins? Might as well just have it print to infinity like the u.s. dollar. Obviously the devs do care about the secondary market value of this coin or they would not have set their goals and coin specs accordingly. Both the people of the lakota nation, as well as the businesses accepting this currency will want the greatest valuation possible. Now long term, they might get that. Who knows. But as it stands now, there are just way too many coins in circulation and more being minted daily. Hell, the makers of spaincoin are about to fork the coin and convert it to n-algo to simply stop the bleeding that's been caused by multipools and dumpers. I'm not saying that's the solution here...but there are many things that can be considered if they want to start to take steps to regain investor confidence. Or perhaps they don't... Surely they'd want valuation, nothing wrong with being rich internationally, but its not at all necessary for the success of the coin as a currency for Lakotas. Their only risk is having the inflation and supply dominated externally - whales abroad would have the power to manipulate supply and the price of goods within the reserve. They don't need investors. "Investor", unless they're local, means coins being owned outside the reserve. Its counter-intuitive. Its actually better for the coin if we all lose interest - the only people left to pick up the torches would be those with an actual reason to own the coin beyond speculation (Lakotas). . . If Maza reaches a high price its unlikely that would happen because of Lakota investors. High price means the coin is dominated outside the reserve; high price could very well doom MZC to failure. And the problem with USD isn't the inflation itself but the fact that tyrants control the flow and distribution. There is NO free market, the currency is controlled completely. This is not true in cryptos (the good ones) - they have predictable inflation that is randomly distributed. Its a fair system where no one gets to run things. Decentralized vs Centralized > that's the advantage. You're forgetting about the chain of supply. Unless the lakota people start themselves manufacturing and producing everything they own and consume, then they eventually have to purchase items outside the reserve with good ol', hard cash. So yes, the market value is the primary driving force behind the success of this coin. The merchants will still have to convert the maza to btc and 'cash out' when they need to deal with their suppliers to restock their inventory. They can't just say 'ok here's the deal guys...I have all this maza from my customers...and I'm sure you'll love it.' Yes, in a perfect world the price wouldn't matter...and everyone would be able to live self-contained away from the constraints of fiat currencies and thrive on decentralization. Unfortunately, it's not as simple as 'black and white.' |
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49er.miner
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Activity: 42
Merit: 0
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March 22, 2014, 11:07:58 PM |
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if mazacoins value versus dollar or btc didnt matter then remove from exchanges whats the need....
use chucky cheese coins and just state its worth a so called amount....
keep it simple no need for making excuses when the value drops....
what we have right now is inflation...
the purchasing power of mazacoin is decreased...but in a broad sense most coins including btc is going down ....
we are in a slow cycle unfortunately....
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ldr77
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March 23, 2014, 11:49:56 AM |
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Regarding flipstyles valid argument of maza's adoption within the reservation's economy...
They could get around that if for example the local store (assume it's the centre of their economy) was owned/funded/operated locally via membership in a co-operative or collective.
The local store would make available the option for shoppers to purchase goods with maza.
That would then spread the financial burden of adopting maza to the community, instead of a sole owner/operator of a store or a wholesaler/supplier of goods to the store, who would never adopt maza due to the obvious financial risk.
So the task would be for payu to convince locals to back a business venture (say store or credit union) that accepted maza within the reservation.
As I see it all comes down to whether the coin's economy should've been built-up from the ground within just the reservation and once it was ready then publicise it to the outside world for investors.
OR the way it was actually done, by trying to get investors to boost the price through speculation to encourage the reservation to adopt maza because of its high value. Except that hasn't worked out as we can see due to oversupply of the coin that undervalued it.
Unfortunately it looks like the horse has already bolted, unless there's a hardfork to lower the reward eventually.
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bitranger
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March 23, 2014, 02:16:21 PM
Last edit: March 23, 2014, 02:33:29 PM by bitranger |
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http://www.reddit.com/r/mazacoin/comments/214zd5/mazacoin_giveaway/I hit a block last night. And I want to distribute those coins. Redditors can claim the coins by posting an address. Giving away coins by following No. of coins to a user = 100 x (No. of years of account's age) Edit : For every Mazacoin given away through this thread csjenks has generously decided to match it and donate the purse to RE-MEMBER.org. Please make that a success. Very Nice! http://rememberrez.blogspot.com/
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mazatalk
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Activity: 7
Merit: 0
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March 23, 2014, 06:00:45 PM |
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Welcome Mazatalk!..Pay no attention to the FUD spreaders.Most of them are on ignore and it shows what kind of a person it is when they have to resort to vulgar language to get their point across!..
You have a nice site!..Mazacoin is the first to attempt what it is doing..Your site and others like it will help spread the word!.
I had no idea how bad it was for the lakota before i discovered Mazacoin a few weeks ago!
I am still buying the coin and in it for the long haul and very proud to say it!
Thank you! Your support is noticed! In my opinion, lack of transparency leads to FUD and negatively impacts what should be the true goals of Maza, to create an economic foundation upon which the people of an impoverished sovereign nation can rebuild. Thank you for spreading the word and sharing the vision! |
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Trafficlearn
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March 23, 2014, 06:55:56 PM |
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Welcome Mazatalk!..Pay no attention to the FUD spreaders.Most of them are on ignore and it shows what kind of a person it is when they have to resort to vulgar language to get their point across!..
You have a nice site!..Mazacoin is the first to attempt what it is doing..Your site and others like it will help spread the word!.
I had no idea how bad it was for the lakota before i discovered Mazacoin a few weeks ago!
I am still buying the coin and in it for the long haul and very proud to say it!
Thank you! Your support is noticed! In my opinion, lack of transparency leads to FUD and negatively impacts what should be the true goals of Maza, to create an economic foundation upon which the people of an impoverished sovereign nation can rebuild. Thank you for spreading the word and sharing the vision! Going to have a look at mazatalk!....this is the type of community feature you need to make a coin take hold and grow...it has to be ORGANIC...cant stress that enough...people place TOO much attention on pumps and horseshit.... I will keep mining at MZC.MINEBIG.COM and will also visit mazatalk just becase its an attempt to think outside the crypto pump game for a change... |
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battbot
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March 23, 2014, 10:44:58 PM |
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whats up with the price.. 250 satoshi.. new low. hhaa
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Trafficlearn
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March 23, 2014, 10:58:53 PM |
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whats up with the price.. 250 satoshi.. new low. hhaa
Who cares?? if you are in crypto for overnight riches go sit in the exchanges and trade...... What this coin needs is to get the multipools off of it....we were just KILLING blocks at mzc.minebig.com then it slows to a crawl when the multipools move in.... |
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49er.miner
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Activity: 42
Merit: 0
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March 23, 2014, 11:10:11 PM |
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sure multipools are a problem but the algo must be adjusted for them....
devs dont want to change any technicals of the coin...
multipools not going anywhere...
algo of maza not being adjusted...
so learn to live with it .....
double digits here we come yay!!!!!!
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poppys
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March 24, 2014, 12:54:38 AM |
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sure multipools are a problem but the algo must be adjusted for them....
devs dont want to change any technicals of the coin...
multipools not going anywhere...
algo of maza not being adjusted...
so learn to live with it .....
double digits here we come yay!!!!!!
They already cashed out and moved on. That fucker better lawyer up soon. I'm going after this entire team. |
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49er.miner
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March 24, 2014, 12:57:19 AM
Last edit: March 24, 2014, 01:09:23 AM by 49er.miner |
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cashed out? the premine is dumped?
anyone know anything about the premine?
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49er.miner
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Activity: 42
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March 24, 2014, 01:42:30 AM |
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look at the buy order side and scroll down...
shitload of 1 mzc orders to make it look like the coin is still alive....
what a joke.....
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battbot
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March 24, 2014, 02:24:44 AM |
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so, is mzc doomed?
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Raek
Member
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Activity: 79
Merit: 10
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March 24, 2014, 04:31:57 AM |
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dspair
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March 24, 2014, 04:32:48 AM |
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