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Bitcoinwaist (OP)
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December 27, 2018, 10:59:12 AM
 #1

I always wondered how much fiat is in the system backing bitcoin. I can't imagine it being dollar for dollar. Anyone have any ideas? I remember bear whale years ago selling 18000 btc for like $26 million on his sale on bitstamp and that was when bitcoin was $350. If a whale wanted to sell say 25000 coins now on say coinbase instead of otc would they have enough fiat to cover the sale of $100 million?
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December 27, 2018, 11:26:55 AM
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 #2

exchanges are not buying coins and dont need fiat. Investors are buing from each other. There is nothing like fiat backing bitcoin. 0 $ are backing bitcoin. Today I have 100 $ and i wont to buy bitcoin and you have bitcoins that you want to sell. Tommorow you have mine 100$ and i have yours bitcoin. Those 100$ was never in system. Firtly they were in my hand now thay are in yours.

If you mean how deep is this market - how much bitcoins cam be dumped on it without pushich price significantly - well im sure that 25 000 btc would be sucked in less than hour and price will remain to previous price (if that big order wont cause panic selling). Only Bitmex has 1,3 mld dayli volume what is more than 300 000 btc.

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December 27, 2018, 11:50:51 AM
 #3

There is no fiat currency in the Bitcoin system. The whole point of Bitcoin is to get away from central banks and their worthless fiat currencies.

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December 27, 2018, 01:27:38 PM
 #4

I always wondered how much fiat is in the system backing bitcoin. I can't imagine it being dollar for dollar. Anyone have any ideas? I remember bear whale years ago selling 18000 btc for like $26 million on his sale on bitstamp and that was when bitcoin was $350. If a whale wanted to sell say 25000 coins now on say coinbase instead of otc would they have enough fiat to cover the sale of $100 million?
Bitcoin market cap values are calculated in the terms of dollar or other fiat currencies but it doesn't means that fiat money is involved in the crypto fieldthe prices were just based on satoshi and one bitcoin will be always equal to one bitcoin.

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December 27, 2018, 02:51:52 PM
 #5

I always wondered how much fiat is in the system backing bitcoin. I can't imagine it being dollar for dollar. Anyone have any ideas? I remember bear whale years ago selling 18000 btc for like $26 million on his sale on bitstamp and that was when bitcoin was $350. If a whale wanted to sell say 25000 coins now on say coinbase instead of otc would they have enough fiat to cover the sale of $100 million?
There is 2 billion dollars exchanging hands every single day according to the coinmarketcap.
This is not taking the over the counter or direct changes and also some exchanges in local communities as well. It tells me there is at least 50+ billion dollars all invested into crypto by the looks of it.

You can't assume just because 2 billion dollar exchanging hands that means 2 billion is in the market, that's just buying and selling every single day, some people buy and not sell and some people already bought gets out which makes it 1 less that is bought making it zero but one buying and not selling makes it plus one.

The money involved is definitely not the marketcap because when someone pays 20 thousand dollars for bitcoin that doesn't make all of it purchased at that price. Hence, you have to take the average. I think that is why about 50 billion dollars or so is involved in bitcoins system, that's not crypto though, crypto probably has over 100 billion easily, this is just bitcoin.

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December 27, 2018, 03:28:13 PM
 #6

There is no fiat currency in the Bitcoin system. The whole point of Bitcoin is to get away from central banks and their worthless fiat currencies.
I think they really confused in Bitcoin system. Because all the crypto platform is totally different from Fiat system and this year one country is intiate the Fiat system of Bitcoin. So central banks are trying to regulated the Fiat currency But Bitcoin is decentralized transparent crypto currency and this will not properly enter into Fiat system.

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December 27, 2018, 04:03:11 PM
 #7

Fiat doesn't enter in to the bitcoin system, it only changes hands as a result of it. There's little need for anyone to hold fiat in bitcoin, other than a little by exchanges or by traders looking to be able to buy dips.

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December 27, 2018, 04:10:04 PM
 #8

Bitcoin market cap values are calculated in the terms of dollar or other fiat currencies but it doesn't means that fiat money is involved in the crypto fieldthe prices were just based on satoshi and one bitcoin will be always equal to one bitcoin.

Marketcap gives very little indication of much fiat has actually changed hands.

Let's say I want to go and buy 10 bitcoins. I go to my favorite exchange, and put down a buy order of 10 bitcoins. I buy the first sell order at the current price ($3,800). Then I buy the next sell order at a few cents higher. And then the next sell order a few cents higher than that. And so on and so on until all the sell orders combined reach my total of 10 bitcoins. All in, I'll pay more than $38,000, because each subsequent sell order is more expensive. Let's say the final sell order was at $3,900. This means that somewhere between $38,000 and $39,000 has changed hands. However, given that the final sell order was $100 more than the first, I've just increased the marketcap of bitcoin by $1.75 billion (17.5 million coins * $100 per coin). An increase in marketcap of almost $2 billion has been achieved by spending less than $40,000.


I think that is why about 50 billion dollars or so is involved in bitcoins system, that's not crypto though, crypto probably has over 100 billion easily, this is just bitcoin.

My example above becomes even more ridiculous when you consider altcoins. I can create an altcoin with 1 billion tokens in circulation and then sell a single token for $1 to my friend. My altcoin would now have a one billion dollar marketcap despite only one dollar changing hands.
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December 27, 2018, 04:11:22 PM
 #9

The money involved is definitely not the marketcap because when someone pays 20 thousand dollars for bitcoin that doesn't make all of it purchased at that price. Hence, you have to take the average. I think that is why about 50 billion dollars or so is involved in bitcoins system, that's not crypto though, crypto probably has over 100 billion easily, this is just bitcoin.
It's quite safe to say that the whole idea of market caps versus the fiat value they represent is flawed to the core. It wouldn't surprise me if there is less than 10% of the total crypto market cap in actual fiat circulating through the market.

The different markets are so thin, that a relatively low amount of fiat is needed to significantly increase the total crypto market cap, especially when people pull out their sell orders and decide to hodl.

I find it a better indicator to judge coins by their actual availability in buy support. I know it's not a perfect indicator since order books can be manipulated, but at least it's way better than hot air market caps.

XRP is the biggest joke in that sector.

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December 27, 2018, 04:18:48 PM
 #10

There's very little fiat in the bitcoin system because most entities involved have little need for holding large amounts of fiat. If you want to consider the worth of bitcoin in terms of fiat then you can consider marketcap but that is not even a true reflection of the value because if all bitcoin were sold right now the market price would crash considerably.

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December 27, 2018, 06:07:26 PM
 #11

This is a dead interesting question but the only people who could give us an answer would be the exchanges and services like Localbitcoins. They could supply the inflows into their bank accounts. They certainly won't though.

Considering the amount of investment places like Coinbase pulls in there must be enough for its investors to feel confident interest is high.
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December 27, 2018, 07:34:36 PM
 #12

This is a dead interesting question but the only people who could give us an answer would be the exchanges and services like Localbitcoins. They could supply the inflows into their bank accounts. They certainly won't though.

Then there's peer-to-peer cash trades (where traders avoid escrow) and more importantly, OTC trades. People always say the OTC markets are thick but none of the brokers release any public data. That's one of the big selling points of OTC: privacy.

I'm guessing there's a lot of money on the sidelines waiting for the right time to enter, on exchanges and in people's bank accounts. There's a lot of fiat money that can't be captured in any sort of analysis.

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December 27, 2018, 08:08:44 PM
 #13

To my knowledge the fiat circulation into cryptocurrency will not exceed more than 4%, even what I've mentioned seems to be high. As the value is highly fluctuating it is impossible to have a perfect and calculated value of the fiat in the entire cryptocurrency system.

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December 27, 2018, 09:06:01 PM
 #14

You can always try to look in the buy order book, and see how many buy order the exchange displays.
A whale would most likely make a temporary marked cash on any exchange if he dumped 25.000 Bitcoin on all open buy orders.
Most of the daily volumes we see are trading bots selling and buying the same Bitcoins again and again.
So if the unthinkable event happens, that every owner of Bitcoin wanted to sell their Bitcoins today, to all open sell orders the price of Bitcoins would go to near nothing.
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