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Author Topic: Top Ten Signs You're a Fundamentalist Christian - Merry Christmas to all!!!  (Read 615 times)
ATMD
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January 04, 2019, 01:03:32 PM
 #41


So the Bible, Quran and Talmud are all wrong.  Thanks for agreeing.  Now, go burn these texts and try to be a better person than the people who wrote these books.


I don't claim to know what happened in the Bible. From general chatting with you, I already know you are more knowledgeable about the Bible than I am.

My beliefs are independent of the bible, the bible is not any evidence of God. I don't understand why this book keeps being discussed.

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mOgliE
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January 04, 2019, 01:13:03 PM
 #42

Sorry m0gliE, I wasn't referring to your post at all. I was answering af_newbie's question for examples of absolute morality.

Self-defense is not murder, murder is premeditated attempt to take someone's life, absolutely immoral. No gray area.

Lol I know you answered to af_newbie but that's a forum of public discussion so anyone can jump in the conversation you know?  Cheesy

murder = premeditated attempt to take someone's life. Great.
So if a woman raped daily by her husband, beaten nearly to death everyday, finally decides one day to poison her husband, it's absolutely immoral? No difference with a psycho serial killer?

If someone is drunk and takes the wheel and crashes in someone else and kill them, it's not premeditated so it's not murder?

There are THOUSANDS of grey areas that don't fit your narratives. That's why there is nothing absolute.

KingScorpio
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January 04, 2019, 01:35:23 PM
 #43

the religions are not wrong, its the problem how you think of them its not about right or wrong these religions are different experiancable frequencies of reality.

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ATMD
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January 04, 2019, 01:46:47 PM
 #44

Sorry m0gliE, I wasn't referring to your post at all. I was answering af_newbie's question for examples of absolute morality.

Self-defense is not murder, murder is premeditated attempt to take someone's life, absolutely immoral. No gray area.

Lol I know you answered to af_newbie but that's a forum of public discussion so anyone can jump in the conversation you know?  Cheesy

murder = premeditated attempt to take someone's life. Great.
So if a woman raped daily by her husband, beaten nearly to death everyday, finally decides one day to poison her husband, it's absolutely immoral? No difference with a psycho serial killer?

If someone is drunk and takes the wheel and crashes in someone else and kill them, it's not premeditated so it's not murder?

There are THOUSANDS of grey areas that don't fit your narratives. That's why there is nothing absolute.

Feel free to respond Moglie  Cheesy I was merely pointing out that my statements were not in response to your comments, so I can understand why you were wondering what I was talking about  Grin

If you ask me, the abused wife should leave him, not murder him. That would still be wrong

Murder is always wrong.

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January 04, 2019, 01:49:54 PM
 #45

Feel free to respond Moglie  Cheesy I was merely pointing out that my statements were not in response to your comments, so I can understand why you were wondering what I was talking about  Grin

If you ask me, the abused wife should leave him, not murder him. That would still be wrong

Murder is always wrong.

That settles it then. There is nothing absolute.

I find it perfectly ok for the wife to kill her husband in that case, that's just self defense.

Leaving is not an option when you're deeply under the material and psychological control of someone.

You find it wrong. I find it normal. We don't have the same definition of morality.

No moral is absolute. Nothing is absolute in fact, but especially not what is linked to ethics or morals.

CoinCube
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January 04, 2019, 06:57:18 PM
Last edit: January 04, 2019, 09:02:31 PM by CoinCube
 #46

Immanuel Kant
"Act only according to that maxim whereby you can, at the same time, will that it should become a universal law."

Jesus
"So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets."

Hillel the Elder
"What is hateful to you, do not do to your fellow: this is the whole Torah; the rest is the explanation; go and learn."

Slightly varying accents all describing the same foundational absolute.

Hmm... You just litteraly saif that morality is relative...

Your sentences say "don't so to others what you don't want them to do to you". Which means each people will have a different definition of what should and should not be done as each person will consider something as acceptable or not...

Example: I consider ok to take parts of what's mine for the need of others. Some people do not consider it ok. Who is right here? Following your maxime no one is right or wrong, it just depends if you accept it or not.

Moral truth is absolute and objective. The application of that truth to specific circumstance is varied and colored by the imperfect perspective of the actor.

Take af_newbies challenge for example.

Some of us are born psychopaths, some are narcissists, some of us are masochists, some of us lack empathy, some of us do not understand biology and animal suffering, including human suffering, some of us are not educated.  Do you see a problem?

He is of course correct that there are psychopaths and narcissists. However, if you look at their behavior they are not actually following a "do as you would be done by" code.

If you have ever seen someone of that temperament outsmarted or outmaneuvered their response almost always highlights their true philosophy. You do not see a calm acceptance of defeat at the hands of the more skilled or cleaver. Instead you see rage, anger, desire for revenge and power. The psychopaths wants to be free of constraint but they do not want to be the victims of their own philosophy. They want morality for sheep they can pray upon with only themselves exempt. It is a philosophy of power.

Those are really the only two alternatives a belief in objective morality or a philosophy of power. Everything else eventually finds it's way into one of those two camps. This hypothetical debate between Kant and Nietzsche highlights the contrasting views.

Kant vs Nietzsche
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHJFWJgXuXg

In the video Nietzsche accuses Kant of being a slave to reasons while Kant in turn calls Nietzsche a slave to passion.

You note that you are ok if others presumably government take parts of what is your's for the needs of others. You also note that some people do not consider it ok and ask who is correct. You are essentially asking if it ok to steal when it is necessary to achieve a greater good.

The answer is that it is never ok to steal, however, sometimes it may be necessary to prevent an even greater evil. Thus we steal from the population as a whole to fund the military and prevent the greater evil of conquest and murder against us by outsiders. The error arises in those who think that via preventing the greater evil the lesser evil becomes somehow good. It does not. It is choosing bad to avoid worse and acceptable only until we can figure out a way to avoid worse by choosing good.

The people who feel that the theft is not ok are correct but the fact that the theft is not ok does not mean we are currently powerful or wise enough to abolish it at this moment in history.      

ATMD
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January 04, 2019, 07:30:00 PM
Last edit: January 04, 2019, 07:54:35 PM by ATMD
 #47


I find it perfectly ok for the wife to kill her husband in that case, that's just self defense.

Leaving is not an option when you're deeply under the material and psychological control of someone.


Sorry but leaving is not an option but murdering is?

The woman would be fully guilty for intentionally murdering her husband.


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