DefaultTrust changes

[Timelord2067]

I'd like to see the "provably fair" details for this lottery.

I'm not suggesting any kind of favoritism

Just some random statistic: 60% of the users who never lost the DT1-lottery have at "L" in their username, vs. less than 38% of the users who lost the lottery at least once.

I'm not drawing any conclusions, but currently 63.6% of the users who never lost the DT1-lottery have an "L" in their username

Oh goodie - I'm in with a chance then... 

[LoyceV]

It says in his trust that this account is either sold or hacked, but this account is still a valid DT2. Is that normal or what?

The account is included by TECSHARE:

Trust list for: hashman (Trust: +0 / =0 / -4) (7 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP) (created 2020-03-21_Sat_06.09h)

hashman's judgement is Trusted by:
1. TECSHARE (Trust: +48 / =5 / -1) (DT1! (0) 777 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)

For the record: TECSHARE included him more than a year ago, while the negative feedback appeared less than half a year ago. TECSHARE should check this

I noticed this case too when I posted the lists. I can create a weekly list of all DT-members with one or more negative feedbacks, but that will also include many users who have a lot of positive feedback.

[Timelord2067]

Do we distrust hashman for their account being hacked?  (I've done so recently for kenzawk and sardasa until such time as they are able to secure their accounts) Or, do we distrust for being an account seller? (I have some added, and some not added IIRC) If it's the latter, how far back do we go since their last transactions?

[Vod]

#3
I will periodically (maybe every month) be reconstructing the default trust list to include everyone who matches these criteria:
 - If rank was determined solely using earned merit, then you must be of at least Member rank.
 - You must have been online sometime within the last 3 days.
 - Your trust list must include at least 10 users, not including ~distrust entries.
 - You must not be banned or manually blacklisted from selection.
 - You must have posted sometime within the last 30 days.
 - You must have at least 10 people directly trusting you each with an earned merit of at least 10, not including merit you yourself sent. These "votes" are limited.
 - You must have at least 2 people directly trusting you with an earned merit of at least 250, not including merit you yourself sent. These "votes" are limited.

(Forgive me, didn't catch up on entire thread)

 - You must have been online sometime within the last 3 days.
 - You must have posted sometime within the last 30 days.

What about an addition criterion?
 - You must have learned xx merit in the last yy days?

Such an addition would remove me, since I have not been making useful posts recently.  But it would make the list more closely match the current community vibe.

I am never completely tied to anything, but let's try this for at least a few months and see how it works.

Any thoughts you'd like to share? 

[peloso]

What about an addition criterion?
 - You must have learned xx merit in the last yy days?

its bad and stupid idea
this will give gangs advantages and gang representatives will get into d1

[LoyceV]

What about an addition criterion?
 - You must have learned xx merit in the last yy days?

Such an addition would remove me, since I have not been making useful posts recently.  But it would make the list more closely match the current community vibe.

Even if someone becomes less active, that doesn't mean their older Trust ratings (and their Trust list) are instantly outdated. I like to think the feedback I've left doesn't really depend on how the community "vibes" at any moment.

[Vod]

I like to think the feedback I've left doesn't really depend on how the community "vibes" at any moment.

So you would rather it depend on a lottery system, where everyone has an equal and growing chance?

this will give gangs advantages and gang representatives will get into d1

Adding a filter never increases the number of results...

[LoyceV]

So you would rather it depend on a lottery system, where everyone has an equal and growing chance?

That's not ideal either. I just don't think giving Merit more power is going to improve DT1. I'm currently the Most generous recent merit sender, and I can already imagine the drama it's going to create when I single-handedly merit someone into DT1.

[LFC_Bitcoin]

I'm currently the Most generous recent merit sender, and I can already imagine the drama it's going to create when I single-handedly merit someone into DT1.

Yeah but you don’t hand out hundreds of Merit to the same poster(s) over a very short period of time so it’s hard to see how you alone would vote somebody into DT1.

As long as the required Merit total is high then I don’t think it’s a bad idea but then again just because somebody is a good quality poster it doesn’t mean they won’t scam. Most scams are carried out or attempted by low ranking accounts but a bigger scam is more likely to be carried out by a high ranked account due to them supposedly being more trustworthy.

Ahhh, who fucking knows. Maybe just leave it as it is, there’s always the possibility of DT1 members turning to the dark side, we’ve seen it in the past so it doesn’t matter what tweaks are implemented, it’s always possible.

We just have to hope that supposedly good & trustworthy posters police themselves.

[fillippone]

So you would rather it depend on a lottery system, where everyone has an equal and growing chance?

That's not ideal either. I just don't think giving Merit more power is going to improve DT1. I'm currently the Most generous recent merit sender, and I can already imagine the drama it's going to create when I single-handedly merit someone into DT1.

I am the Top-merited user, recent merit, I am of course the tool of a secret conspiracy plot to create havoc in the DT1.
As long as I am selected in DT1, not obvious fact, lately.

<...>
Ahhh, who fucking knows. Maybe just leave it as it is, there’s always the possibility of DT1 members turning to the dark side, we’ve seen it in the past so it doesn’t matter what tweaks are implemented, it’s always possible.

<...>

"If it works, ain't fix it".

Agree.

[JayJuanGee]

I am thinking that Vod is proposing a minimum number of merits earned in a recent period, such as 5 merit or 10 merits in the past 90 days or some kind of de minimus threshold in order to meet DT1 criteria.  

I personally don't believe it is a necessary extra criteria to add in part because the current criteria only requires one post in the past 30 days, even though it requires to be online in the past 3 days.  

At the same time, I understand the logic of one more criteria that Vod is seeming to suggest could be a way to weed out certain members from being eligible for DT1 status, and could be something for theymos to consider as a potentially valid consideration.  Such additional criteria would be similar to already existing criteria that theymos already created but just create another de minimus kind of angel in the giving value to merit direction, and would not necessarily be an overly burdensome extra criteria if it were considered over a longer than 30 day period..  requiring even one merit per 30 day period might be burdensome or "awkward" or turn DT1 wannabe members into "subconscious" merit beggars, perhaps?  hahahahaha

[teeGUMES]

I am thinking that Vod is proposing a minimum number of merits earned in a recent period, such as 5 merit or 10 merits in the past 90 days or some kind of de minimus threshold in order to meet DT1 criteria.  

I personally don't believe it is a necessary extra criteria to add in part because the current criteria only requires one post in the past 30 days, even though it requires to be online in the past 3 days.  

At the same time, I understand the logic of one more criteria that Vod is seeming to suggest could be a way to weed out certain members from being eligible for DT1 status, and could be something for theymos to consider as a potentially valid consideration.  Such additional criteria would be similar to already existing criteria that theymos already created but just create another de minimus kind of angel in the giving value to merit direction, and would not necessarily be an overly burdensome extra criteria if it were considered over a longer than 30 day period..  requiring even one merit per 30 day period might be burdensome or "awkward" or turn DT1 wannabe members into "subconscious" merit beggars, perhaps?  hahahahaha

The way people and their actions are tracked by other members on this site whether it be merit given, feedback left, trust inclusions, trust exclusions, and everything else people can scrape this would be just another drama point to fill Meta with "blow my brains out" threads every month.

[suchmoon]

So you would rather it depend on a lottery system, where everyone has an equal and growing chance?

That's not ideal either. I just don't think giving Merit more power is going to improve DT1. I'm currently the Most generous recent merit sender, and I can already imagine the drama it's going to create when I single-handedly merit someone into DT1.

I think it would make sense to have the current 10/250 merit requirement adjusted so that only merits earned in the last 12 (or 24) months are counted. Right now anyone who earns, farms, or buys 10+ merits gets to vote forever and eventually dormant voters will be the majority.

[LoyceV]

Theymos updated DT1. I'm out!

Here are the changes:
Old:
     1. Legendary SebastianJu (Trust: +22 / =0 / -0) (46 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
     2. Legendary Vod (Trust: +24 / =2 / -5) (1489 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
     3. Legendary Anduck (Trust: +19 / =2 / -1) (68 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
     4. Legendary peloso (Trust: +3 / =2 / -2) (149 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
     5. Legendary Mitchell (Trust: +39 / =1 / -0) (488 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
     6. Legendary TheNewAnon135246 (Trust: +22 / =0 / -0) (907 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
     7. Hero Member hybridsole (Trust: +22 / =0 / -0) (266 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
     8. Legendary hedgy73 (Trust: +25 / =0 / -0) (71 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
     9. Legendary willi9974 (Trust: +7 / =0 / -1) (128 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    10. Hero Member JohnUser (Trust: +3 / =0 / -0) (212 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    11. Staff sapta (Trust: +10 / =0 / -0) (191 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    12. Legendary LFC_Bitcoin (Trust: +10 / =0 / -0) (1960 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    13. Legendary ezeminer (Trust: +28 / =0 / -0) (96 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    14. Legendary bones261 (Trust: +3 / =0 / -0) (777 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    15. Legendary LoyceV (Trust: +24 / =2 / -0) (5100 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    16. Legendary TryNinja (Trust: neutral) (1411 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    17. Legendary eddie13 (Trust: +4 / =1 / -0) (969 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    18. Legendary Yatsan (Trust: +4 / =2 / -0) (547 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    19. Legendary xtraelv (Trust: +5 / =0 / -0) (1548 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    20. Hero Member imhoneer (Trust: +2 / =0 / -0) (421 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    21. Sr. Member fzkto (Trust: +3 / =0 / -0) (233 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    22. Legendary Steamtyme (Trust: +7 / =2 / -0) (1560 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    23. Copper Member bavicrypto (Trust: +31 / =0 / -0) (143 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    24. Hero Member GreatArkansas (Trust: +4 / =0 / -0) (810 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    25. Hero Member tvplus006 (Trust: +12 / =0 / -0) (1154 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    26. Staff mole0815 (Trust: +5 / =0 / -0) (1129 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    27. Hero Member madnessteat (Trust: +5 / =0 / -0) (987 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    28. Sr. Member Ratimov (Trust: +8 / =0 / -0) (1159 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)

New:
     1. Staff HostFat (Trust: neutral) (93 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
     2. Staff gmaxwell (Trust: +14 / =0 / -0) (2408 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
     3. Administrator Cyrus (Trust: +12 / =0 / -0) (135 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
     4. Legendary vizique (Trust: +38 / =0 / -0) (494 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
     5. Sr. Member Ticked (Trust: +32 / =0 / -0) (207 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
     6. Legendary figmentofmyass (Trust: neutral) (699 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
     7. Legendary jeremypwr (Trust: +16 / =2 / -0) (310 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
     8. Global Moderator hilariousandco (Trust: +18 / =3 / -0) (778 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
     9. Legendary arulbero (Trust: +5 / =0 / -0) (519 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    10. Hero Member Lydian (Trust: +2 / =0 / -0) (154 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    11. Legendary Rmcdermott927 (Trust: +28 / =1 / -0) (53 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    12. Legendary Royse777 (Trust: +3 / =0 / -0) (685 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    13. Legendary klarki (Trust: +4 / =0 / -0) (172 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    14. Legendary The Pharmacist (Trust: +26 / =3 / -0) (2466 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    15. Legendary johhnyUA (Trust: +0 / =0 / -2) (776 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    16. Hero Member Coin_trader (Trust: +7 / =2 / -0) (57 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    17. Copper Member crwth (Trust: +5 / =1 / -0) (562 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    18. Hero Member Kryptowerk (Trust: +34 / =0 / -0) (543 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    19. Legendary Vispilio (Trust: +11 / =2 / -1) (884 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    20. Hero Member be.open (Trust: +1 / =1 / -5) (328 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    21. Legendary krogothmanhattan (Trust: +76 / =0 / -0) (1482 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    22. Hero Member JollyGood (Trust: +9 / =1 / -1) (591 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    23. Hero Member AlyattesLydia (Trust: +1 / =0 / -0) (459 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    24. Legendary El duderino_ (Trust: +24 / =0 / -0) (3436 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    25. Hero Member vycl87 (Trust: +2 / =0 / -0) (549 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    26. Hero Member asche (Trust: +7 / =1 / -0) (1027 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    27. Copper Member DireWolfM14 (Trust: +17 / =1 / -0) (1522 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)
    28. Sr. Member zasad@ (Trust: +1 / =0 / -0) (817 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)

[Lauda]

New:
   20. Hero Member be.open (Trust: +1 / =1 / -5) (328 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)

I just don't understand. Previously, everyone ru DT1 who added a user be.open to the trust list, get ~.
And now he's back in DT1. So what was the point of all this fighting with other people's trust lists? Then why be.open isn't on the blacklist for DT1? Couldn't anybody alert theymos you about this?

He is too lenient. Currently many scammers from the Russian and Turkish section (less of the former) are inside both levels. It is so.

[nutildah]

New:
   20. Hero Member be.open (Trust: +1 / =1 / -5) (328 Merit earned) (Trust list) (BPIP)

I just don't understand. Previously, everyone ru DT1 who added a user be.open to the trust list, get ~.
And now he's back in DT1. So what was the point of all this fighting with other people's trust lists? Then why be.open isn't on the blacklist for DT1? Couldn't anybody alert theymos about this?

Its also bad form for DT1s to be including this user, and subsequently other DT1s for including people that include them.

By that I am talking about DT1s who have included 3meek or fzkto (which is incidentally only 3meek).

[3meek]

Okay, guys!  I deleted my review! And I also removed be.open from my trust-list!

[LoyceV]

Couldn't anybody alert theymos about this?

You're free to do so, but I don't expect theymos to get involved. It's up to DT1 to fix DT1, and as long as there's no clear abuse, I don't think he'll get blacklisted. Besides, blacklisted users can still be on DT2.

The Default trust breakdown shows many users who have almost as many inclusions as exclusions. Those users move in and out of DT1 depending on the monthly composition.

And now there's 8!
The following users have been on DT1 since I started keeping track, without ever getting excluded:

    15 qwk
     15 owlcatz
     15 o_e_l_e_o
     15 mprep
     15 coinlocket$
     15 Lesbian Cow
     15 Lafu
     15 Jet Cash

I'm out Who's going to be the longest standing DT1 member?

[Last of the V8s]

That's an extremely personal question probably best asked on a different forum altogether; and some of these people might be ladies.

[Timelord2067]

Theymos updated DT1. I'm out!
...

There goes your "L" theory

I just don't understand. Previously, everyone ru DT1 who added a user be.open to the trust list, get ~.
And now he's back in DT1. So what was the point of all this fighting with other people's trust lists? Then why be.open isn't on the blacklist for DT1? Couldn't anybody alert theymos about this?

The DT gangs that Troll the forum will look in the mirror and see a shadow that must be put down.  Kind of sad really.  Be your own self and decide for yourself who you trust or distrust and don't let them influence you - it's only for their own gain, not yours.

Okay, guys!  I deleted my review! And I also removed be.open from my trust-list!

bones261 is another one who rolled over and played dead when told to.

Must be embarrassing (being you) grovelling to the DT Trolls.