TMAN abuses DT system. Remove TMAN from DT, include him in Blacklist from future

[DabLjat]

Hello Bitcointalk community!

Yesterday for the creation of a topic [Challenge] Create your Trust list TMAN gave me a "red trust".



What is this topic for which give a negative trust, you ask? Here is the opinion of respected people, about the scope and content of my topic and the actions of TMAN:

TMAN, you're coming across as a real asshole here. AFAICT, that topic is highly analogous to the English discussions. The main addition is that they're looking to get more local representation in DT1, which is very reasonable.

#1 DabLjat explains 1) how to modify trust list. 2) They posted their trust list and suggest others to do the same and also as I understand, they suggested everyone to create custom trust list

That's it from me, I don't see anything wrong in this discussion except peloso person is trying to manipulate with people and some shitting on Lauda. So far it seems like regular discussion.

TMAN accuses me of abuse the DT system and what does he do? This person creates a topic that really abuses the DT system!
Massive abuse in the Russian section. of TMAN

Now look at the results:

- What are the abuses in the DT system as a result of my actions:

1. Nothing!

- What abuses in the DT system as a result of TMAN actions:

1. All honored users of the Russian local Board have a negative level of trust in the dt list:

~Alex_Sr - Alex_Sr (-6)
~peloso - peloso (-5)
~xenon131 - xenon131 (-3)
~Rooivalk - Rooivalk (-3)
~chimk - chimk (-2)
~esmanthra - esmanthra (-3)
~MaoChao - MaoChao (-3)
~DabLjat - DabLjat (-4)
~Polkeins - Polkeins (-3)
~madnessteat - madnessteat (-3)
~biom33 - biom33 (-3)
~Xal0lex - Xal0lex (-1)
taikuri13 (-4)
~goran - goran (-2)
~Provok - Provok (-2)
~Slasher - Slasher (-2)
~Whitemanwhite - WhiteManWhite (-2)
~TheFuzzStone -TheFuzzStone (-4 in DT1)
~zoldberg - zoldberg (-2)
~poptop - poptop (-2)
~be.open - be.open (-2)
~fzkto - fzkto (-2)
~Gary levanevskii - Gary Levanevskii (-2)
~3meek - 3meek (-2)
~chimk - chimk (-2)
~leonello - leonello (-2)
~MoxnatyShmel - MoxnatyShmel (-2)
~wh1rlw1nd - wh1rlw1nd (-2)
~xandry - xandry (1 instead of 3)

What are these people guilty of, you ask? Nothing! Their guilty according to TMAN is that they wrote in my topic!

2. Several users from this list as well as I received a "Red trust".



What are these people guilty of, you ask? Nothing!

How are we going to tolerate these "thugs" like TMAN in the list of the DT?

My suggestions:

1. Remove TMAN from DT1 and DT2 list. Include him in Blacklist from future selection.

2. Check out the other participants of this outrageous collusion on the availability of his of multiple accounts.

3. Remove from the DT1 from the list and add all participants of this outrageous collision in Blacklist from future selection.

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[JusticeForYou]

I personally don't find any abuse of the system by you and this seems to be common practice when it comes to putting trust on single users. I just find it as an discussion to get a local representative in the DT and that is a very fair desire of any person working in local boards. It should not be pointed as an abuse of trust network in any way.

There could be many more such discussion occurring behind this forum on other social mediums but that is just out of control of the forum and we cannot stop it.

[Lauda]

TMAN has absolutely not abused his position. He is free to exclude anyone at any time for any reason. Now, if you really want to talk about abuse let's start with this:

[TheNewAnon135246]

TMAN has absolutely not abused his position. He is free to exclude anyone at any time for any reason. Now, if you really want to talk about abuse let's start with this:

A lot of people seem to be confusing the trust system with the merit system. Leaving trusted feedback for being a "honored member" or "merit source" makes no sense. I have conducted a lot of deals of deals with Tman (most being over $10k), all without the use of escrow. Tman acts like a cunt from time to time but I would easily trust him with my priv keys.

[TMAN]

ill post this here are you may of missed it.

I feel there was abuse but as I had previously posted I don't believe everyone was involved and I do believe the local sections need representation on DT-2. My exclusions are not final, they were made due to what I saw as manipulation and gaming of the system and it seems others agree with me although I cannot remove any of my exclusions right now as I do not have the time to re go though the thread and make justifications to myself of who was actually involved, who I feel is guilty by association and who was in the wrong place at the wrong time. I will do this when I have the free time to dedicate and I will be speaking to other members of DT to justify my reasoning.

now just to confirm the exclusions were made as a preemptive measure by me and some innocent people quite possibly have got grouped in with others, but checking my un-trusted tags there is enough proof that members of that community are not fit to be on DT especially TheFuzzstone who had malicious intent to game the system and has resorted to retaliatory negs over this - the guys who are sitting back and letting this play out are the ones who are in with a much better chance of having the exclusions removed.

Please people stop being emotional and give it a week tops

@DabLjat in bold unless you missed it - untrustworthy attacks wont make this better as I will have another reason not to trust you to be anywhere near DT and that is these emotional outbursts.

[creeps]

TMAN is just doing his job, and I don’t think there’s an abuse on his power. If you feel bad about what you get, then prove to him that you’re innocent, but.....

These says it all, same day and almost same comments there might be no abuse but you must go with the process and don’t make any move that can make the situation worst.

[cabalism13]

Nice another TMAN's Princess .
Mate, I guess you're a womanizer you have so many princess out here.
I advice you to make use of contraceptives. This might help you a bit.

[r1s2g3]

Look like decentralization of DT caused a lot of problem. User who become DT overnight have no idea how to use DT.  
Why not forum start a DT room for the DT where they discuss with each other, understand the system better.

Look like Theymos need to add one more condition that you have given feedback to at least  10 distinct user before Jan 2019 to be included in DT.
Those who started giving feedback after announcement of trust system, only score of 1 will be taken for each month no matter how many feedback you give. I guess these people will get 10 month to understand how to give feedback or trust.

Everybody now clearly able to see their judgement also when somebody include them in the DT custom trust list.

[cabalism13]

Look like decentralization of DT caused a lot of problem. User who become DT overnight have no idea how to use DT.  
Why not forum start a DT room for the DT where they discuss with each other, understand the system better.
Look like Theymos need to add one more condition that you have given feedback to at least  10 distinct user before Jan 2019.

It doesn't concern us mate as long we don't make a wrong move on these Cult. Let them be, in fact this is an open forum, everybody has his/her own understanding in terms of these rules.
Neither I, can give -ve trust whenever I like, I can exclude all of them whenever I like. It's just a matter of understanding for each personality of every individual here.

Those who started giving feedback after announcement of trust system, only score of 1 will be taken for each month no matter how many feedback you give. I guess these people will get 10 month to understand how to give feedback or trust.

Then, what if the person has committed numerous times of crimes? He will definitely get away of having more red scores just because of that.

[suchmoon]

These says it all, same day and almost same comments there might be no abuse but you must go with the process and don’t make any move that can make the situation worst.

Here's some context for these ratings and for the OP's complaint:

The Russian board voted TheFuzzStone into DT1. TheFuzzStone has the OP and some other users in this trust list therefore making them DT2 members. Some of these users, including the OP, immediately posted numerous positive trust ratings without references. This, as well as some of TheFuzzStone's comments indicating his inability to separate "trust" from "like" prompted some DT1 members (including myself) to exclude him. So these users, including the OP, are no longer in DT. All this happened within a few hours on Jan 14th.

This upset quite a few members of the Russian community but the fact is that this is exactly how the system is supposed to work. I have tried to explain to them that a more qualified DT1 member would benefit them a lot more, not to mention that they already have other DT2 members among them so there is no lack of scam busting power or whatever they're looking for regarding DT.

TMAN wears his heart on his sleeve, most of us here know that, but perhaps the Russian board not so much. I'd go the cheesy route and suggest everyone step back and start over but I know that's not gonna work.

[DabLjat]

Please people stop being emotional and give it a week tops

You not understanding the purpose of my topic created a new topic in which you think a huge amount of nonsense, then based on this fictional nonsense paint people's trust and make the largest local Board in the forum in a negative trust.

This behavior is typical for the Nazis-let's first shoot, and then figure out who is to blame. And then you ask what we are so nervous and emotional?

The problem could be solved peacefully without emotion writing in our topic, or raising the question in the topic DefaultTrust changes.

You, instead of sitting down and talking, decided to use brute force as usual and get now the "revolt senseless and merciless in the best Russian traditions"

TMAN, you're coming across as a real asshole here.

I think that says it all! Nothing to add!

[TMAN]

TMAN wears his heart on his sleeve, most of us here know that, but perhaps the Russian board not so much. I'd go the cheesy route and suggest everyone step back and start over but I know that's not gonna work.

I am happy to sort this out civilly without a total war - I dont need the red army after me, I live to close..

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5098962.0

i'll stick this here - as I already have said AlexSr has my vote, I have seen nothing other than excellence from him, the posters in meta not so much.

Up to these guys really - they can keep getting all autistic about it or try to realize that some of us have the forums best interest at heart and not a total personal agenda

[DabLjat]

I have tried to explain to them that a more qualified DT1 member would benefit them a lot more, not to mention that they already have other DT2 members among them so there is no lack of scam busting power or whatever they're looking for regarding DT.

Are you ready to provide a list?

As soon as they see a decent list of DT2 with proportional representation of Russian local Board - then all questions will disappear!

[YOSHIE]

Everyone has the right to give their opinion on the bitcointalk forum, whether it's wrong or right, @TMAN does what he has to do, and @DabLjat responds to what he knows, so for that to be true or false I think have to go back to @theymos rules how DT1 system is running properly, forum rules.

#1
As a special exception to the normal algorithm for determining a user's trust network, if you are on the default trust list ("DT1") but more other DT1 members distrust you than explicitly trust you, then it is as if you are distrusted by the default trust list for all purposes except for this very DT1-composition determination.

So if someone on DT1 is doing something stupid, you can ask other DT1 members to distrust them.

The point of this problem is actually here, this is clearer right and wrong.

Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5098584.msg49279469#msg49279469

I thought that I had a good idea for limiting each individual truster when handling the last two criteria: set it up as a circulation problem as below, and then find the maximum flow. The "user tX"s through whom flow passes would be the DT1s selected.



(The orders of the users would be randomized on each run.)

All diseases have a cure, and all problems speak with the heart or head cold all problems are solved.

[madnessteat]

Sorry for my English.

I do not understand why I was also added to this list. I was just trying to understand how the new DT system works in the Russian locale. I'm an honest man, miner. I'm a person, not someone's alts. Registered on the forum less than a year ago, when I learned about the bounty. For six months of participation in social bounty companies, I realized that it does not make money. I participate only in signature, create sets of stickers for telegrams, animation. I have not bought or sold any merit. The more I communicate on the forum, the more I learn new information. This forum is really very good.

Not everybody can be considered scams and conspirators.

TMAN did not answer my question, and for me it is very important!

[cryptohunter]

Yep tman is a scumbag and a moron he is certainly an abuser of the trust system

Let's get him gone before he does more damage.

[suchmoon]

I have tried to explain to them that a more qualified DT1 member would benefit them a lot more, not to mention that they already have other DT2 members among them so there is no lack of scam busting power or whatever they're looking for regarding DT.

Are you ready to provide a list?

As soon as they see a decent list of DT2 with proportional representation of Russian local Board - then all questions will disappear!

A list of what? If I see someone qualified I'll surely include them. You don't need my list. There are Russian DT2 members with no trust activity. Maybe you can start with a petition to them to make use of the system. Maybe you can push to show trust ratings on boards rampant with scams. There are probably other things that can be done to improve the system instead of handing out green ratings to your buddies.

There is nothing wrong with building a local Russian trust network. But since DT1 and DT2 levels are also part of the forum-wide default network you shouldn't expect to be in it if you build your network out of "likes".

[cryptohunter]

I have tried to explain to them that a more qualified DT1 member would benefit them a lot more, not to mention that they already have other DT2 members among them so there is no lack of scam busting power or whatever they're looking for regarding DT.

Are you ready to provide a list?

As soon as they see a decent list of DT2 with proportional representation of Russian local Board - then all questions will disappear!

A list of what? If I see someone qualified I'll surely include them. You don't need my list. There are Russian DT2 members with no trust activity. Maybe you can start with a petition to them to make use of the system. Maybe you can push to show trust ratings on boards rampant with scams. There are probably other things that can be done to improve the system instead of handing out green ratings to your buddies.

There is nothing wrong with building a local Russian trust network. But since DT1 and DT2 levels are also part of the forum-wide default network you shouldn't expect to be in it if you build your network out of "likes".

You'll include anyone dirt bag. Nobody trusts you one inch out side of meta club.

You have added a proven liar and people implicated in extortion schemes and escrow abuse and trust abuse

You should be taken off DT at once.

[DabLjat]

I have tried to explain to them that a more qualified DT1 member would benefit them a lot more, not to mention that they already have other DT2 members among them so there is no lack of scam busting power or whatever they're looking for regarding DT.

I think I asked a simple question. You said that there are other representatives of the Russian local Board in the list of DT2. Are you ready to provide this list? On the basis of what data did you conclude about the sufficient representation of Russians in the lists of DT1 and DT2?

[r1s2g3]

Those who started giving feedback after announcement of trust system, only score of 1 will be taken for each month no matter how many feedback you give. I guess these people will get 10 month to understand how to give feedback or trust.

Then, what if the person has committed numerous times of crimes? He will definitely get away of having more red scores just because of that.

You got it wrong , this score is not the tagged score that you are seeing in other user's profile.

This will be a new kind of eligibility score to become a DT1 member. If you have already given feedback to 10 or more distinct user before the announcement new trust system   then it will make your score more or equal to 10. Community member can see your rating to 10 distinct user and can make  a verdict who good is your judgement and how active you was previously.

So what new users that had not make any feedback yet?
Now if they make feedback to 10 distinct user in a day or in a month should I take their score as 10?

Irrespective of how many feedback they do to distinct user in a month, their max score for a month will be 1 and it will take them minimum 10 month to be eligible for DT and community will also able to see their judgement before voting them for DT.