A Question to Generic Board Regulars

[actmyname]

^{(Bitcoin Discussion, Economics, Speculation, Gambling discussion, the like)}


Why?

Certainly, if you've gone through any of the threads, you have seen a reply reiterated or quoted to which the respondent agrees and adds a common-sense reply.

Surely, by scanning through the topics, there have been posts that were regurgitated or responded-to with an agreement via quote.

It is highly probable that when a user reads the board, they have witnessed a point of discussion that has been repeated or referred to by another user in a consensus.


Is there really anything useful in these boards anymore?^* There are so many topics opened that are looking for generic replies.

_{*save for Wall Observer}

Example: When Will the Bear Market End?

No one knows when will this bear market will end. You will only determine that bulls are coming if theres a sudden massive increase in market cap of all coins.

No shit, Sherlock.

Here's a reply:

[...]

Yeah no one know. because even though the price rose a few percent then the price could go back down very sharply like yesterday's price change.
it proves that the bear trend is not over yet. so keep getting ready. bull trend may occur in the near future

Another one:

[...]

Yeah there is no one knows? a few days ago, I was sure that the bear trend was over but what was happening on the market now proved that the bear trend was still not over and we don't know when the bull trend is happening, but I still believe that the bull trend will definitely happen, the key is dont be panic..

And here's one that replies to the reply:

[...]

[...]

Absolutely, no one can forsee on the future, we are normal humans who only predict on future. Perhaps, we based our prediction on how the market run and how it has been and differentiate the last year and the current year situation. But I have a huge instinct that a bull run will occur in a particular way.

I couldn't have asked for a better set of examples.

Few more posts that are definitely the highest degree of discussion.

I think bear market will stop when there is good news that can trigger an increase in bitcoin prices if there is no good news, it will be very difficult to increase prices.

No one will be able to determine when the bear market will end since the price is based on supply and demand and the best way for you to earn profit is to conduct your own research to determine the next price stamp in the market statistics.

maybe the bear market will end when there is good news that makes a lot of investors buy bitcoin and the movement of coin prices experiences a price increase, if it doesn't exist then it will be very difficult to stop the bear market and surely the price of bitcoin will tend to always go down.

I mean honestly: are there any good posts to be found? Maybe the first one or two replies are useful. The other 233 are not.

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[SushiMonster]

Maybe some of them are just posting for the post count. Of course, signature campaigns. 

[actmyname]

Maybe some of them are just posting for the post count. Of course, signature campaigns.  

I'm asking those that aren't sig spammers. We already know the reason that the individuals of which I've highlighted post in these sections. Low-effort title-reading one-minute post nonsense.

[TheBeardedBaby]

^{(Bitcoin Discussion, Economics, Speculation, Gambling discussion, the like)}
~
Why?
~

Money


It's simple as that. In addition to the signature campaigns, people are developing and selling accounts, even a newbie accounts.
There are some random new users trying to copy what other "regular" users do in hope to get merit, then they come in meta and complain about how they have hundreds of good quality comments but get no merit...

Money is everything...

[o_e_l_e_o]

I browse Bitcoin Discussion daily, although I comment there far less.

I always sort by time of thread creation, rather than by last post, (https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?board=1.0;sort=first_post;desc) for exactly the reasons you state. There are a handful of regulars on Bitcoin Discussion who will post sensible and interesting replies to a topic within the first page or two. However, after that, and certainly by page 5 onwards, 99% of threads are not worth reading. As you give prime examples of, the replies are completely generic and meaningless. There is no actual discussion going on, just spammers churning out their one or two lines to hit their bounty requirements, most of which are saying something that has been said several times already.

The question is what we can do to fix this? I spend a lot of time reporting spammy replies, which always get marked as "good", but I have a lot of "unhandled" reports for suggesting threads to be locked. We can never hope to delete all the spammy posts - the volume is simply overwhelming at the moment - but if we rapidly locked or removed the threads (including a mass lock of all dead threads in these boards which are frequently necrobumped with more spam), we might start to get on top of things.

[lobcmt2]

They are likely from Get-Cashers.
I think we have some interesting name-callings for forum users, Spambies, Get-Cashers.

To be honest, I got the name-calling, Get-Cashers from Jet Cash.
From there: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1756906.msg49527422#msg49527422

[Jet Cash]

I've been pretty critical of the moderation on the generic boards, and I think the problems stem from a lack of guidance in this It was pointed out that, apart from Welsh, all the mods are old timers ( that's rich coming from me isn't it ). Maybe it's time that we had some defined objectives for these boards, and perhaps a few new hands on the tiller to help with the redirection. Both Bitcoin and the global economies have changed dramatically, and there is a lot of resistance to this amongst the established sites such as Facebook and YouTube - is Bitcoin Talk becoming another one? I don't believe that this is what Theymos wants.

I have an inchoate thread in serious discussion - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5104486.0
and acarli has made a helpful reply which has led me into a bit more research.

I started another one which had some useful replies - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5102098.0
but some of them related to TA, and I agree that this should be on stats boards. I am more interested in empirical discussions about fundamentals. Unfortunately serious discussion is not used a great deal, and it would be great if this type of topic could be included in more popular boards such as Bitcoiin Discussion. It's getting pretty hard to generate some good discussions, and I think there are a few reasons for this.

- Some of the great posters are pretty inactive in Bitcoin Talk now.
- Moving threads onto unsuitable boards based on historic concepts, discourages members from starting the better threads.
- The beginners and help board does contain some useful threads at a primary level, but I believe that some secondary level threads would help to retain new members, so would the removal of the rubbish.
- There is a lot of petty bitching and acrimonious attacks on a few of the boards, and this creates a bad image of Bitcoin Talk. Much of this is related to trust and reputation, and I'm not sure how to improve on this. Shadow banning has been suggested for some members, and I think this could be useful to improve the comfort level in reading threads.

[KingZee]

People who don't sig spam in those thread probably do it for the post count though. It's still a concern for low-ranked members and it's the <<<smartest>>> way to do it unnoticed in the sea of redundancy.

Reporting the threads that are clearly only going to generate trash is an option, I've done it a few times with a plagiarising newbie that just pasted snippets of blog posts as opinions, to which others quickly flock and start spouting more nonsense at it. But it's probably only going to get deleted in case you did it soon enough.

But like oleo said, the worst is the old threads that people just won't let die. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5091362.0 or similar. Always on the first page, brings no news or originality.

It's not easy to come up with a non-destructive solution, might be even impossible. You'd have to make a much broader definition of spam, and it won't make people happy.

[Jet Cash]

I've just looked at the profile for the Beginners and Help moderator.
Last Active:   04 April 2018, 13:24:05

I wish I could find jobs that paid me for that much effort.

[r1s2g3]

@,OP
After 2 or 4 useful reply, rest of the people  just copy the main idea.

I am looking at below topic.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5103224.20

OP in this topic is referring to vulnerability in forked blockchains.
But first replier replied  about hardware wallet ( no link with OP topic).  Now all of the herd is replying about hardware wallet information there.

I guess, it is now clear how shit posting continues.

I've just looked at the profile for the Beginners and Help moderator.
Last Active:   04 April 2018, 13:24:05

I wish I could find jobs that paid me for that much effort.

I do not think Theymos pays inactive moderator but problem is that he is not a active recruiter.

[hilariousetc]

We already know the answers to these questions. When you have campaigns that will pay for any generic spam then users will continue to make them and over multiple accounts. People aren't going to waste time writing a paragraph when they don't need to. Write a generic sentence then move on to another thread or account. The only way you'll stop this is either by removing signatures or making sure campaign managers do their job properly. 

I've just looked at the profile for the Beginners and Help moderator.
Last Active:   04 April 2018, 13:24:05

I wish I could find jobs that paid me for that much effort.

He hasn't been a moderator for quite some time. Theymos just hasn't removed his name from there. Being a moderator here doesn't mean you get paid every month regardless of work you put in. If you do nothing then you'll get nothing. If you do a little you'll get a little.

[examplens]

^{(Bitcoin Discussion, Economics, Speculation, Gambling discussion, the like)}


Why?



I mean honestly: are there any good posts to be found? Maybe the first one or two replies are useful. The other 233 are not.

I was wondering about it a while ago, but I got the answer that there was not really a lot of rubbish there and it's possible to find a useful discussion.
it has become a place to fulfil weekly signature posts quota. I'm thinking what would be if it does not count post from this mega-discussion-threads, but if these threads were forbidden for signature in any way, we would have an invasion of spam across the rest of the forum.

[actmyname]

We already know the answers to these questions. When you have campaigns that will pay for any generic spam then users will continue to make them and over multiple accounts. People aren't going to waste time writing a paragraph when they don't need to. Write a generic sentence then move on to another thread or account. The only way you'll stop this is either by removing signatures or making sure campaign managers do their job properly.

I've already addressed earlier that I'm referring to the users that aren't signature spammers. As in, users looking to fuel discussion or users who read the section.

If, however, there are no proper users that frequent the section... it should really have more thread-closings. Don't rid of the section entirely, but punish shitty posts like we did the megathreads.

[YOSHIE]

^{(Bitcoin Discussion, Economics, Speculation, Gambling discussion, the like)}

Why?

Certainly, if you've gone through any of the threads, you have seen a reply reiterated or quoted to which the respondent agrees and adds a common-sense reply.

Surely, by scanning through the topics, there have been posts that were regurgitated or responded-to with an agreement via quote.

Is there really anything useful in these boards anymore?^* There are so many topics opened that are looking for generic replies.

Regarding:

Additional Questions and Answers Frequently Asked Questions about Serving on the Economic, Bitcoin, and Regular Institutions of the General Board.
Actually includes a number of questions
and answers to help implement changes in the section.
answers to additional questions are included with the notification.
That question and answer too.
The person in charge, the forum also reviews and approves the assignment of the Service, which is still implemented.

Under Admin and mod direction, the general board continues its important role to "help individuals build information about Economics and Bitcoin or trade, accept posting procedures, comply with agreements, and become better followers of bitcointalk members.

Strengthened RDU forums and Institutions - represented by their, who are members of the general council will increase the effectiveness of the council.

[mikeywith]

No one knows when will this bear market will end. You will only determine that bulls are coming if theres a sudden massive increase in market cap of all coins.

No shit, Sherlock.

these kind of posts not only count as shitposts, they are also wrong and misleading to say the least, and the funny part is they go uncorrected. the one i quote from OP is an example, a user who apparently  has no idea how the market cap works trying to solve a puzzle of price related subject, and nobody bothered to correct him.

[vit05]

^{(Bitcoin Discussion, Economics, Speculation, Gambling discussion, the like)}
~
Why?
~

Money


It's simple as that. In addition to the signature campaigns, people are developing and selling accounts, even a newbie accounts.
There are some random new users trying to copy what other "regular" users do in hope to get merit, then they come in meta and complain about how they have hundreds of good quality comments but get no merit...

Money is everything...

Not just money. But the value that the dollar has in the country where that person lives. Recently, in Nigeria, a discussion about the readjustment of the minimum wage has occurred. The minimum wage was only $50 a month. To earn $50 per month, the Nigerian worker would probably have to work in very stressful situations, of great physical effort, with great risks to his health. In many other countries, $ 50 is the smallest amount a worker could earn for a single days of work.

For a young person, who lives in a country with such low pay, when compared to other countries, with the unemployment rate close to 50% among young, some of the opportunities offered in the forum can be very interesting. But most of those users are not able to participate in the forum effectively. To begin with, there is the language barrier, they usually have not studied anything about technology and cannot read any programming language. So it's really very unlikely that they can write more than 3 lines about Bitcoin or a specific subject related to technology in English.

Today, even the campaigns that pay using BTC pay very little, and they are very disputed. So we have a situation of a person who has only a smartphone and a limited internet connection. The only opportunity that the forum offers is to participate in altcoins campaigns.

The problem is that altcoins campaigns are almost like playing at casinos. Many of those campaigns pay in tokens that are not listed on any exchange. Whose value of selling is impossible to predict. It can even be zero. It is a very high risk for someone who is not in the forum for speculating, but rather seeking a source of income. They need money.

What is the best way to reduce the risks and have some steady source of income?

Have multiple accounts participating in multiple campaigns. If you're going to take this as a job, It's the only possibility. I imagine that each campaign asks for something like 30 posts a day. 30/5 days week = 6. multiplied by 5 = 30 posts a day. I do not believe anyone has the ability to write 30 quality posts on a subject that does not completely dominate, using a poor quality smartphone and a limited internet connection, which makes it impossible to do long research.

So these topics are created and receive commented from people who are likely using multiple accounts. It is more efficient already knowing the subject of the topic and answering it several times, using different accounts, in intervals.

The forum would need to make it difficult to create multiple accounts whose purpose is spam. And increase the financial cost of runing a signature campaign. It is necessary to create a Proof-of-Work for the forum.

Proof-of-Work (PoW) system (or protocol, or function) is an economic measure to deter ... service abuses such as spam on a network by requiring some work from the service requester

[dothebeats]

I'm a generic board regular, though I always find myself lurking in the Developmental and Technical Discussion, alongside Bitcoin Technical Support and never post a reply since I know I don't know that much compared to other users and I'm just trying to read as much as I can to at least know what to do if a rare case happens to me and my client.

On the wee hours of the day if I have the time, I only report and never post anything, though I find it hilarious seeing multiple replies with the same thought being rehashed into different words over, and over, and over again. Idk, aside from the hilarity that I found on these generic boards, I also found some interesting albeit somewhat nonsense topics like this one which appeared very recently.

No one knows when will this bear market will end. You will only determine that bulls are coming if theres a sudden massive increase in market cap of all coins.

No shit, Sherlock.

Exactly this.