Why are profits so low?

[adaseb]

I agree with the above poster a few posts back. Basically mining these days is very easy to do and anyone can do it.

So this creates a huge supply of miners and causes the difficulty to go up and leaves less profit for everybody else's.

This is basically the way business is these days. Where there is easy money to be made, many people will pounce as fast as they can to get a piece of the profits.

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[Ryzen2700x]

I think soon mining will be back with new 7nm GPU's/CPU's/Asics,
Just remember- going down from 12nm to 7nm for AMD meant "Same performance at half the power"- so just this will make mining much more profitable :-=).

[lunobird]

I think soon mining will be back with new 7nm GPU's/CPU's/Asics,
Just remember- going down from 12nm to 7nm for AMD meant "Same performance at half the power"- so just this will make mining much more profitable :-=).

Tell that to the bitmain S15 folks. They are on 7nm now and it's not profitable unless you have near free electric

[minerja]

I think soon mining will be back with new 7nm GPU's/CPU's/Asics,
Just remember- going down from 12nm to 7nm for AMD meant "Same performance at half the power"- so just this will make mining much more profitable :-=).

You're missing the point entirely.
Is not just the nanometers, or the efficiency, you have to consider the "whole", and the biggest problem at the moment is the value of the coins.
Unfortunately, the idea of anonymous / decentralised / "give the banks the finger" has been blown out of the water. Yes, you can do all that with individual coins, but when you need to exchange to FIAT or virtually anything you now buy, needs "KYC", therefore the interest is rapidly diminishing. I can't see any reason why BTC will rise from the ashes...i think this is its new level, which against worldwide inflation, will diminish in value each year....BUT, hopefully i am completely wrong

[minerja]

Mining is simply too easy, anyone can do it.  Since the barrier to entry is so low it became over saturated and made the profit margins razor thin. 

Total rubbish...the technical side of mining might be easier than ever, but the cost of entry is the prohibitive part now. There was a time when any decent cpu and / or 1 single mid end gpu would yield good profits, but now, if you cant buy a 1080ti rig (or equivalent) there is basically no point starting, and dont know about you, but i dont have 5K sat around so i can buy a rig whenever i want...besides, if i did, there are much safer / more profitable ventures outside of crypto now.

It's becoming polarized like never before...either  "hobby mine" or "professional", the amateur part has completely gone...

[d57heinz]

Mining is simply too easy, anyone can do it.  Since the barrier to entry is so low it became over saturated and made the profit margins razor thin. 

Total rubbish...the technical side of mining might be easier than ever, but the cost of entry is the prohibitive part now. There was a time when any decent cpu and / or 1 single mid end gpu would yield good profits, but now, if you cant buy a 1080ti rig (or equivalent) there is basically no point starting, and dont know about you, but i dont have 5K sat around so i can buy a rig whenever i want...besides, if i did, there are much safer / more profitable ventures outside of crypto now.

It's becoming polarized like never before...either  "hobby mine" or "professional", the amateur part has completely gone...

Yep. Capitalism. It’s what ends up happening every time and what destroys civilization. Profits come before people. Sickness envelops and it goes down hill from there.  I look at the world atm as a big episode of “big brother”(show on cbs).  You’ve got your have and have nots and then you have big brother poking at you just to stir the pot for a good show.  Fucking joke!  We have to be a better than this.

BR

[Metroid]

I think soon mining will be back with new 7nm GPU's/CPU's/Asics,
Just remember- going down from 12nm to 7nm for AMD meant "Same performance at half the power"- so just this will make mining much more profitable :-=).

You're missing the point entirely.
Is not just the nanometers, or the efficiency, you have to consider the "whole", and the biggest problem at the moment is the value of the coins.
Unfortunately, the idea of anonymous / decentralised / "give the banks the finger" has been blown out of the water. Yes, you can do all that with individual coins, but when you need to exchange to FIAT or virtually anything you now buy, needs "KYC", therefore the interest is rapidly diminishing. I can't see any reason why BTC will rise from the ashes...i think this is its new level, which against worldwide inflation, will diminish in value each year....BUT, hopefully i am completely wrong

We live in a community where these people dont care about this, saw eos rose today 20% and is not even its fork going on, it makes no sense for it rising like that, eth yes, monero yes, cause those coins will be forking, now, eos no, xrp no, so the same thing can be said for the 7nm gpus, my point is, they buy 7nm gpus regardless of it gives performance or not, they dont care, put the bill on the credit card company and gambles on, total dementia, that is the reason why coins crashed so hard, the same people making mistakes and mistakes, over and over.

ETH soon to be around $210 at least, if not then eth mining is closer to death if same difficult continues, see easy money right, sounds like but its not.

BTC is only rising because of eth, everything is rising because of eth and eth itself is not rising like them hehe

[leonair]

Making a profit into mining nowadays are so hard if you're a small time because even though the numbers of miners subsided yet the level of difficulty is still high and getting a break-even to the costs of mining are less likely to happen not unless you have a free electricity based on the latest rates so it's obvious that mining is a pure investment that needs perseverance.

To those miners that still mining right now would definitely earn their fruits of labor.

[leowonderful]

Making a profit into mining nowadays is impossible because even the numbers of miners subsided but still the level of difficulty is still high and getting a break-even to the costs of mining is so impossible based on the latest rates so it's obvious that mining is a pure investment that needs perseverance.

To those miners that still mining right now would definitely earn their fruits of labor.

Really ain't even perseverance that matters in the end except if you have very, very cheap electrical rates right now. If you're in the red or barely in the green and mining right now, it's a good choice to just sell off your hardware and just buy coins through an exchange or P2P exchange if you don't want to deal with KYC. You can buy through PayPal without verification on a site like LBC or Paxful, but note you'll be paying a fee for doing so. Doesn't make sense to mine anymore for most people, and mining at a loss is just plain stupid no matter how you put it. If you're making just a few pennies a day per card, it's really not worth the cost to maintain the rigs.

[fanatic26_]

Making a profit into mining nowadays is impossible because even the numbers of miners subsided but still the level of difficulty is still high and getting a break-even to the costs of mining is so impossible based on the latest rates so it's obvious that mining is a pure investment that needs perseverance.

To those miners that still mining right now would definitely earn their fruits of labor.

See people spit out this same old crap about getting into it. Just because you are a solo user with no access to capital or skilled labor, does NOT mean its impossible. Just that its impossible from your tiny world view.

Heres a little secret: Since the beginning, to make a profit you have to expand your operation. You either expand or die, thats never changed. What changed is the mindset of people who entered the game during the crazy price run of 2017 and expected the outrageous profits to continue forever.

[Metroid]

Making a profit into mining nowadays is impossible because even the numbers of miners subsided but still the level of difficulty is still high and getting a break-even to the costs of mining is so impossible based on the latest rates so it's obvious that mining is a pure investment that needs perseverance.

To those miners that still mining right now would definitely earn their fruits of labor.

See people spit out this same old crap about getting into it. Just because you are a solo user with no access to capital or skilled labor, does NOT mean its impossible. Just that its impossible from your tiny world view.

Heres a little secret: Since the beginning, to make a profit you have to expand your operation. You either expand or die, thats never changed. What changed is the mindset of people who entered the game during the crazy price run of 2017 and expected the outrageous profits to continue forever.

We certainly did not want that level of profit or this level of loss, both sides have become extreme, making $10 per gpu was stupid, making $0.10 per gpu is stupid. It only makes sense to buy coins right now, any mining attempt will make any confident troll to commit suicide.

Off topic, eos so far increased 19% and no news, nothing, no fork and yet it increased more than anything, red flag professional scamming scheme on the works. ETH has 10 times more volume and yet the price increased only 2% hehe

[leonair]

Making a profit into mining nowadays is impossible because even the numbers of miners subsided but still the level of difficulty is still high and getting a break-even to the costs of mining is so impossible based on the latest rates so it's obvious that mining is a pure investment that needs perseverance.

To those miners that still mining right now would definitely earn their fruits of labor.

See people spit out this same old crap about getting into it. Just because you are a solo user with no access to capital or skilled labor, does NOT mean its impossible. Just that its impossible from your tiny world view.

Heres a little secret: Since the beginning, to make a profit you have to expand your operation. You either expand or die, thats never changed. What changed is the mindset of people who entered the game during the crazy price run of 2017 and expected the outrageous profits to continue forever.

I'm speaking on behalf of small-scale miners just like the OP, I assumed and not to the miners in the whole world especially those with mining farms. I'm saying this now because it's the reality and currently happening right now, if you have a big world view then good for you but do you have any rigs and did some expansion before? if you don't mind me asking.

[philipma1957]

Making a profit into mining nowadays is impossible because even the numbers of miners subsided but still the level of difficulty is still high and getting a break-even to the costs of mining is so impossible based on the latest rates so it's obvious that mining is a pure investment that needs perseverance.

To those miners that still mining right now would definitely earn their fruits of labor.

See people spit out this same old crap about getting into it. Just because you are a solo user with no access to capital or skilled labor, does NOT mean its impossible. Just that its impossible from your tiny world view.

Heres a little secret: Since the beginning, to make a profit you have to expand your operation. You either expand or die, thats never changed. What changed is the mindset of people who entered the game during the crazy price run of 2017 and expected the outrageous profits to continue forever.

I'm speaking on behalf of small-scale miners just like the OP, I assumed and not to the miners in the whole world especially those with mining farms. I'm saying this now because it's the reality and currently happening right now, if you have a big world view then good for you but do you have any rigs and did some expansion before? if you don't mind me asking.

I was 1 gpu grew to 80 1080tis and I did contraction in Jan 2018. I went to cash and began attempted to get cheap power deals.  I know have 4 power deals  and I am expanding >  I am burning about 75kwatts  right now which is the most power I have ever used .  hoping to go to 125kwatt by end of year.


I don't know how small fanatic_26 ever was but I was small and I no longer think I am small.

still tiny compared to a 40 megawatt farm but growth is in the works.

[YuSoDum]

I'm thinking about selling off my single rig or 4 gpus and buying another 3d printer. I mean, for us little people, it just doesn't seem profitable anymore. I love mining, trying new software/pools/operating systems, but i am beginning to wonder if I should really continue or not....

[jmigdlc99]

so it is 2 ways for miners.

1.) instead of scaling up, consider looking ways to cheapen your electrity like philipma1957

2.) diversify outside crypto, business, rentals etc.

of course you should strike gold first before doing 1 and 2..unless you already have capital ready.

Sadly i'm one of those that philipma calls have "busted out" of crypto mining. I was able to make some profit for a year and half worth of mining but the power where i live costs $0.15++ so i've since stopped all operations.

Could you explain #2 and how we can use our mining hardware to diversify outside crypto? Do you mean i should sell/rent out my GPUs to a cybercafe or something?

[arielbit]

so it is 2 ways for miners.

1.) instead of scaling up, consider looking ways to cheapen your electrity like philipma1957

2.) diversify outside crypto, business, rentals etc.

of course you should strike gold first before doing 1 and 2..unless you already have capital ready.

Sadly i'm one of those that philipma calls have "busted out" of crypto mining. I was able to make some profit for a year and half worth of mining but the power where i live costs $0.15++ so i've since stopped all operations.

Could you explain #2 and how we can use our mining hardware to diversify outside crypto? Do you mean i should sell/rent out my GPUs to a cybercafe or something?

It is totally out of crypto like real estate,rooms, apartments for rent other business stuff that gives income, just like the warehouse owner where philipma is mining, he has his cut of the profits too(different countries have different economic scenarios).

crypto may give us a jump start so we can grow our mining by scaling up and renewable energies or we can venture to other things.

if we are making money off the other venture we entered, just make sure you buy BTC/alts when the market bottoms out. remember it is not just the early miner who strike it big in BTC, there are also normal employees and business owners who put money on BTC when it was still less than a 100 $

[BitBustah]

Anyone thinking of getting into crypto now will be MUCH better off buying the coins instead of purchasing mining equipment.

I do think a lot of people are using free electricity from rental agreements, schools, businesses that they have access to which has over saturated the mining game causing profits to shrink to nothing.

[lunobird]

my rigs cost me about $12 per day in electricity

im mining about $18+ per day worth of crypto, which i will not mention

to me, i am still profitable which is why i still mine

i do not sell my crypto to pay for electricity, i do that out of my own pocket

i invest all my mining earnings into a coin that i believe will be worth something greater in the future (gambling)

you are not winning, your gpus are getting old and useless, at least you are being smart for not selling your coins but would have been lot easier just to buy the coins from your pocket and wait it to multiply. you trolls just dont get it.

i am mining $18 worth at a cost of $12

how am i losing?

30 percent of any gains go to a IRS.
Your time spent to maintain rigs has a cost
The cost if the equipment to pay itself takes years.
Saving up for new equipment every 2 years.

That's how you can lose. All miners should be losing on paper taking Everything into account from a business operational farm perspective. Unless your a small timer and don't care for such things.

[lunobird]

Anyone thinking of getting into crypto now will be MUCH better off buying the coins instead of purchasing mining equipment.

I do think a lot of people are using free electricity from rental agreements, schools, businesses that they have access to which has over saturated the mining game causing profits to shrink to nothing.

I agree. Last year I only mined 5 Ltc with L3+.

I paid 2k for it on an early batch. Spent $800 on electric. And I had to pay IRS 30 percent of earned income.

So after spending $2800 and only mining 5 Ltc thats like paying $560 per litecoin not including the 30 percent IRS cut. If I did include IRS cut that's about paying $800 per litecoin.

So yes it's better to buy Ltc at all time high $400 than to buy mining gear.

Mining is a suckers game. All luck and most will fail. Mining gear hardware sellers know this and it's a way to trap new freshbait moonboy crypto newbs.

That's the reason I'm 90 percent coin investor and 10 percent miner.  I am not trying to spread any fud trying to scare others off.  Just letting people know the risk and mistakes I made so that way future investors that are wise will learn from the mistakes of others and not for themselves.  I learned a lot from other people's mistakes in the last bull run and was able to avoid some disasters.

[susila_bai]

It is long back clearly known that Mining cost is high and due to that today mining is very bad idea and in 2020 when next halving will come then the outcome of btc will become 50% less, then even with low mining cost it wont give you profit until btc price is not increased above $6000.