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Author Topic: [FLAGGED] [scam] BetKing.io broke ICO promise and dropped token value 99%  (Read 2701 times)
StackGambler
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March 22, 2019, 10:18:31 AM
 #21

What Dean did is obviously horrible. Loyce, thank you for the write-up. However, the way I see it, a part of the blame also falls into the hands of the victim. This wasn't a very clever or well thought out scam at all... any person, especially in the crypto world, who guarantees that a token won't fall below a certain point is probably scamming. I mean, the very idea is ridiculous. I feel very sorry for the people who lost money in this... although it was obvious, let it be a lesson to everyone not to fall for such blatant lies.

No one lost money in this (except me).
They claim to know people who say they have lost money but none of them have posted and none of them have been in contact with me which I'm sure if they did actually lose money or felt they had they would be in contact.

If he has the BKB he can't have lost money. If he sells or trades it and sells at a low price now then he would lose money but that would be his decision and I have explained how the new system works and that he should wait.
Instead he wants attention and just shouts scam (note Loyce didn't even buy tokens in the ico, he got them from bounty)
But it is not the concern of anyone in this forum who didn't own BKB from the original ICO.

Thank you for the clarification. I have two questions:

a) Is it true that you claimed that there is a price floor, ie. a minimum price for the token that the value would never fall below?
b) Has the price of your token fallen below this alleged price floor, if it exists?


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March 22, 2019, 10:32:59 AM
 #22

What Dean did is obviously horrible. Loyce, thank you for the write-up. However, the way I see it, a part of the blame also falls into the hands of the victim. This wasn't a very clever or well thought out scam at all... any person, especially in the crypto world, who guarantees that a token won't fall below a certain point is probably scamming. I mean, the very idea is ridiculous. I feel very sorry for the people who lost money in this... although it was obvious, let it be a lesson to everyone not to fall for such blatant lies.

No one lost money in this (except me).
They claim to know people who say they have lost money but none of them have posted and none of them have been in contact with me which I'm sure if they did actually lose money or felt they had they would be in contact.

If he has the BKB he can't have lost money. If he sells or trades it and sells at a low price now then he would lose money but that would be his decision and I have explained how the new system works and that he should wait.
Instead he wants attention and just shouts scam (note Loyce didn't even buy tokens in the ico, he got them from bounty)
But it is not the concern of anyone in this forum who didn't own BKB from the original ICO.

Thank you for the clarification. I have two questions:

a) Is it true that you claimed that there is a price floor, ie. a minimum price for the token that the value would never fall below?
b) Has the price of your token fallen below this alleged price floor, if it exists?



a) no. I gave an equation that calculated the price based on site profit. If the site had a big loss then the token price would have been lower than the ICO price.
b) there was no price floor
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March 22, 2019, 10:35:46 AM
 #23

What Dean did is obviously horrible. Loyce, thank you for the write-up. However, the way I see it, a part of the blame also falls into the hands of the victim. This wasn't a very clever or well thought out scam at all... any person, especially in the crypto world, who guarantees that a token won't fall below a certain point is probably scamming. I mean, the very idea is ridiculous. I feel very sorry for the people who lost money in this... although it was obvious, let it be a lesson to everyone not to fall for such blatant lies.

No one lost money in this (except me).
They claim to know people who say they have lost money but none of them have posted and none of them have been in contact with me which I'm sure if they did actually lose money or felt they had they would be in contact.

If he has the BKB he can't have lost money. If he sells or trades it and sells at a low price now then he would lose money but that would be his decision and I have explained how the new system works and that he should wait.
Instead he wants attention and just shouts scam (note Loyce didn't even buy tokens in the ico, he got them from bounty)
But it is not the concern of anyone in this forum who didn't own BKB from the original ICO.

Thank you for the clarification. I have two questions:

a) Is it true that you claimed that there is a price floor, ie. a minimum price for the token that the value would never fall below?
b) Has the price of your token fallen below this alleged price floor, if it exists?



a) no. I gave an equation that calculated the price based on site profit. If the site had a big loss then the token price would have been lower than the ICO price.
b) there was no price floor

Alright, I apologize for coming off as aggressive. From Loyce's post, I ascertained that you promised that the token would not fall below the ICO price. I guess that statement from his original thread is wrong. Thanks for the clarification, once again.

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March 22, 2019, 10:50:40 AM
Last edit: March 22, 2019, 11:20:55 AM by LoyceV
 #24

Oh no, red trust that means nothing on a cesspit of a forum full of scammers, liars and trolls.
I like to think my red trust means something. There's a reason I'm the second most included user on DT1 Trust lists.

Quote
@Loyce - I didn't respond because your post has so many lies (posting jolly goods posts as evidence?) and assumptions you made wrongly (last buy back was a year ago?). You all twist my words every time I reply to anything and then use some random ambiguous claim as the start of your next smear campaign.
That's what you think this is? A smear campaign? The damage has been done by you, and you alone. Don't shoot the messenger.

Quote
You can give me -9999 trust all you want. Doesn't make a difference.
I can't give you -9999 on my own. That's not how the trust system works. But it probably won't make a difference indeed: -30 is pretty clear, you've completely lost the very good reputation you had a few years ago, and managed to make all users abandon a once popular online casino.

Quote
If you had have stuck to a civil discussion by email then I could have easily explained everything to you and point our where you were wrong and how things worked and helped you but guess you needed the attention here.
You did give me permission to post your emails, so let me do just that:

Email 1 (mine) March 14, 2019
Quote from: me, March 14, 2019
Howdy Dean,

Since your new EOS/BKT adventure doesn't appeal to me that much: can I
sell back the BKB tokens I still have (in my Betking account) at
$0.099 a piece, so my BetKing token holder adventure ends?

Thanks,
Loyce

Email 2 (BetKing)
Quote from: Support<support@betking.io March 14, 2019>
Hi
You can trade your BKB to BKT on the site at a ratio of 20 BKT per 1 BKB. We buy back BKT every hour on our exchange from the profit on casino and exchange in the previous hour.

Just so you know, there was 600 BTC used of the initial ICO fund to buy tokens back. I owned 70% of all BKB before releasing the new token on BetKing.
17% more have converted to BKT and are happy with the direction the new site is going, despite me clearly, which I've been open about, making some bad business decisions in the past year.

So, where is the scam? There's only about 13% of all BKB that has not been bought back using our initial ICO funds, since we didn't make profit, or converted to BKT. I imagine a lot of that would be bonuses and bounties that will never be reclaimed either and some people who just haven't checked back on the site in a while.

Still a scam yeah?

Do you know what would have made your tokens more valuable?
Helping to promote and support the site instead of accusing it of being a scam constantly in the forum.

Email 3 (mine)
Quote from: me, March 14, 2019
So you're saying I can sell $700 BKB tokens for $8 LTC?

Email 4 (BetKing)
Quote from: Support<support@betking.io March 14, 2019>
I'm saying have some sense for a minute. Or crawl back to the forum and post all this, I don't really give a shit.

Any normal person would know to hold and sell when price goes up.
It's obvious we were going to have dumpers right at start with the promos.

If you decide to sell for less than you put in that is your own fault not mine
I think I've been pretty civil, and there was no offer to "help me".

This wasn't a very clever or well thought out scam at all... any person, especially in the crypto world, who guarantees that a token won't fall below a certain point is probably scamming.
It could have worked out, of BetKing would have used the funds as promised and kept a dollar amount. I guess I was slightly naive there.



If he has the BKB he can't have lost money. If he sells or trades it and sells at a low price now then he would lose money but that would be his decision
So you're saying you don't lose money at all if something drops 99% in value, as long as you don't sell the worthless token? With the same logic you can create 100 million tokens out of thin air, and say it's worth millions! O wait, you did Shocked

Quote
Instead he wants attention and just shouts scam
Lack of attention is the least of my problems Tongue
I don't just "shout", I've provided several links with enough evidence to convince people.

Quote
(note Loyce didn't even buy tokens in the ico, he got them from bounty)
Hey, I predicted this:
No, he told me by email a week ago that I can sell tokens at BetKing's exchange. The 1% is based on my math.
Or do you have a loophole  "They only lost bitcoin! Bitcoin is not money!"   Roll Eyes
I think the loophole is going to be that I didn't buy the tokens. But if that's the excuse, it means apparently some tokens are more equal than others.



Alright, I apologize for coming off as aggressive. From Loyce's post, I ascertained that you promised that the token would not fall below the ICO price. I guess that statement from his original thread is wrong. Thanks for the clarification, once again.
This is correct, I used the wrong term. I should have said "pegged in dollar" instead of "fixed dollar price". I've changed it in my OP.
The dollar-value of BKB-tokens varied slightly depending on the site's profit. However, the latest value I've seen was $0.099 per BKB token, which is what should have been used for the quarterly buybacks at that point.
Because the evidence is scattered over several long topics, it's a lot of work to cover all the details. Let me quote this:
The buy back price offered by BetKing will be based on the current total bankroll profit.So for example if the price of the token at the end of the crowdsale was $0.014 and the bankroll profit was $1,000,000 then the buy back price would be $0.024 (1,000,000/100,000,000 + 0.014).

Every quarter BetKing will offer to buy back up to 10% of a holders tokens at the current buy back price.
Since the site didn't have many players, bankroll profit was small compared to the total ICO amount. Note that any expenses other thank bankroll profit (or loss) shouldn't influence the token value.

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March 22, 2019, 10:56:32 AM
 #25

LoyceV, it seems like he didn't guarantee anything: it appears to me that BetKing just didn't make profit, and thus the token fell. Has he stated anywhere that the token can't fall that low? I can't find where he said that. I obviously trust you more than him; I just don't see the evidence.

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March 22, 2019, 11:20:44 AM
Last edit: March 22, 2019, 11:59:07 AM by game-protect
 #26

Dean personally profited by the terms of the ICO when the price of bitcoin went up (by pegging the token to USD, while holding btc). I agreed it was fair, because under the same terms Dean would personally lose if the price of bitcoin went down. When I inquired about how that is possible, and at what price bitcoin would need to drop to make that untenable, he said "even at $1" he could do it, because he has system in place to automatically sell bitcoin and would always honor the buy backs.
No, scam artist Dean Nolan did not benefit by pegging the token to USD!

The terms of the fantasy token ICO clearly stated that the profit from currencies will be added to the token value:    

Quote
The token value is calculated as:

I + (P /100,000,000)

Where I is the initial token price after the IC0, $0.09286 and P is the total site profit from all games and currencies at the current exchange rate in $.
He simply scammed the investors with not adding the profit from all currencies to the token value!

If he would not have stated in the fantasy token ICO that the currencies profit will be added to the token value, then he could have legally benefited from the value increase of the currencies.

It would be still a scam because he did not fulfill the buyback assurance and investors were unjustifiably bound too long and could not participate in the value increasement of the crypto currencies.
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March 22, 2019, 11:33:45 AM
 #27

LoyceV, it seems like he didn't guarantee anything: it appears to me that BetKing just didn't make profit, and thus the token fell. Has he stated anywhere that the token can't fall that low? I can't find where he said that. I obviously trust you more than him; I just don't see the evidence.
The value wasn't exactly quaranteed, the guarantee was that buybacks would happen quarterly.

The value (in dollars) was supposed to be based on the formula I posted above. For the token value to fall a lot, the bankroll must have suffered huge losses (which means players winning hundreds of Bitcoins). That didn't happen.
Any other expenses shouldn't have influenced the token price.

This post that shows the BKB value at that time:
The $0.0945 on top left on dice page is the current value of 1 token based on my buy back program
The latest value I've seen was $0.099, and I've never read about a large drop in value due to tremendous bankroll losses. That's not even debated here, the value dropped because the quarterly buybacks ended.

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March 22, 2019, 11:36:05 AM
 #28

LoyceV, it seems like he didn't guarantee anything: it appears to me that BetKing just didn't make profit, and thus the token fell. Has he stated anywhere that the token can't fall that low? I can't find where he said that. I obviously trust you more than him; I just don't see the evidence.
The value (in dollars) was supposed to be based on the formula I posted above. For the token value to fall a lot, the bankroll must have suffered huge losses (which means players winning hundreds of Bitcoins). That didn't happen.
Any other expenses shouldn't have influenced the token price.

This is one post that shows the BKB value at that time:
The $0.0945 on top left on dice page is the current value of 1 token based on my buy back program
The latest value I've seen was $0.099, and I've never read about a large drop in value due to tremendous bankroll losses. That's not even debated here, the value dropped because the quarterly buybacks ended.

Oh, I see. If the site suffered losses, the token value would fall, but the site did not suffer major losses. Thanks for explaining.

Dean, can you elucidate why the token value fell below ICO prices, then? It does look like you weren't buying back responsibly (as disclosed).

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March 22, 2019, 11:51:26 AM
Last edit: March 22, 2019, 04:59:56 PM by JollyGood
 #29

Scammer Dean Nolan wrote: "All the trust comes from me and the fact that I ran BetKing for 3.5 years without any issues and returned 6000 Bitcoin to investors when I closed instead of doing an exit scam or running with the funds. No resume or profile pic can give that kind of trust": https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2053407.msg20700042#msg20700042

Scammer Dean Nolan wrote: "Token Price - The total funds raised will determine the price per BetKing Bankroll token.We will take the total value of all funds at the current exchange rate at the end of the crowdsale to determine the total raised funds.E.g. If we raised $1,000,000 then the price per token would be $0.014 (1,000,000 / 70,000,000).

The buy back price offered by BetKing will be based on the current total bankroll profit.So for example if the price of the token at the end of the crowdsale was $0.014 and the bankroll profit was $1,000,000 then the buy back price would be $0.024 (1,000,000/100,000,000 + 0.014).

Every quarter BetKing will offer to buy back up to 10% of a holders tokens at the current buy back price": https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2053407.msg20470774#msg20470774

What a pathetic liar scammer Dean Nolan is. BKB Tokens were supposed to have a minimum value of $0.09286 as calculated after the ICO and then on top of that any profit as stated above in the pre-ICO example and below in the post-ICO comment on December 03, 2017 that scammer Dean Nolan posted:

"The token price was $0.09286 after the ICO. The token value is calcualted as $0.09286 + ((total bankroll profit of eth, btc, ltc in $ at current exchange price) / 100,000,000) Which is now $0.0966. A profit of $0.00374 per token": https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2150057.msg25690525#msg25690525

The value of BKB held by LoyceV should have been 7278 BKB x $0.09286 (+profits) = $675.84 minimum flat rate without any profits to take in to consideration. If the site made no profit it should guarantee a buy-back of BKB at $0.09286. Simple.

So why did scammer Dean Nolan allegedly use 600 BTC of bankroll assets (nearly 50% of the ICO income) to fund buy-backs when it was not necessary?

How many of the tokens bought back were owned by scammer Dean Nolan? There is a massive conflict of interest there

Why did he damage the bankroll to buy-back BKB tokens when he clearly should have not touched it and if necessary should have used the remaining 50% of the ICO funds allegedly kept for "marketing, promotions, seo, design, development, server costs and legal" instead?

All evidence suggests embezzlement and siphing-off funds. An audit should prove beyond doubt where the funds went and where the remaining funds are but scammer Dean Nolan will not release that information because it will prove his guilt.

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March 22, 2019, 02:21:19 PM
Merited by allyouracid (1), LoyceV (1), JollyGood (1)
 #30

I thought Dean left this forum:
I'm done with this forum now.

Dean screwed investors more than a year ago, it was pointed in this thread https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=4751127.0;all
Quote from: dean
I'm buying tokens back with my own profit, the 30 million tokens I keep from the ICO.
http://archive.is/9opwz#selection-6385.0-6387.1

ICO terms:
Quote
-30 million will be retained by BetKing for ICO bounties, testing bounties, advisors, hiring, future marketing and development.
-After the crowdsale at least 50% of the funds raised will be used for the house bankroll that players bet against and winnings are paid from.The remaining funds will be used for marketing, promos, seo, design, development, server costs and legal.
http://archive.is/tdcWr

Anyway, for this thread:
Quote
Remaining token holders have the benefit that their tokens have much more value the longer they hold them. They can choose to never sell them back to me for many years or if the site was to be sold.
http://archive.is/9opwz#selection-6393.0-6393.198

Quote
My buy back price does not reduce after buying back. So if sa I bought 10% of tokens back for $1 or whatever after first quarter.
The remaining tokens are still worth $1 and then have the profit of next 3 months added on top of that
http://archive.is/yxKBo#selection-849.0-851.102

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March 22, 2019, 02:27:32 PM
 #31

Now I understand: The 30 million tokens retained for ICO bounties, testing bounties, advisors, hiring, future marketing and development are his profit! Cheesy

Quote from: dean
I'm buying tokens back with my own profit, the 30 million tokens I keep from the ICO.
http://archive.is/9opwz#selection-6385.0-6387.1

Quote
-30 million will be retained by BetKing for ICO bounties, testing bounties, advisors, hiring, future marketing and development.
-After the crowdsale at least 50% of the funds raised will be used for the house bankroll that players bet against and winnings are paid from.The remaining funds will be used for marketing, promos, seo, design, development, server costs and legal.
http://archive.is/tdcWr
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March 22, 2019, 07:29:24 PM
 #32

Really funny how Betking/Dean came here once to explain, and is suddenly silent after the precisions provided.

Will add my neg pretty soon to the collection

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March 22, 2019, 07:47:19 PM
Last edit: March 22, 2019, 10:05:28 PM by JollyGood
 #33

Really funny how Betking/Dean came here once to explain, and is suddenly silent after the precisions provided.

Will add my neg pretty soon to the collection


Yes it is very amusing to see scammer Dean Nolan chatting to a newbie about plenty of things but not addressing the key allegations against him.

And when the questions along with evidence stacked up against him he decided to go quiet again.

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March 23, 2019, 02:55:18 AM
Last edit: March 23, 2019, 04:51:54 PM by RHavar
Merited by StackGambler (2), LoyceV (1)
 #34

Anyone else think BillyBurns is also Dean?  [Removed analysis, as I think it was wrong and BillyBurns is not Dean]
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March 23, 2019, 02:56:34 AM
Last edit: March 23, 2019, 11:40:36 PM by StackGambler
 #35

snip

Oh, Ryan. You never fail to amuse. Excellent detective work. I'd consider that pretty irrefutable proof that they're the same person.

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March 23, 2019, 03:21:00 AM
 #36

Oh, Ryan. You never fail to amuse. Excellent detective work. I'd consider that pretty irrefutable proof that they're the same person.

Well Dean claims he has people working for him, so it's certainly possible BillyBurns is one. I do find it rather unlikely that he's some unbiased observer though Tongue
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March 23, 2019, 05:05:48 AM
Merited by LoyceV (1)
 #37

-snip-

BillyBurns (aka GNIKTEB on BetKing as seen on the screenshot) appears to be an admin/moderator on BetKing. His name is red in chat, and so is Dean's. All normal player names are blue. I think it's more likely that he is someone hired by Dean. (program choice is weird though; why Windscribe & ProtonVPN?)

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March 23, 2019, 07:42:13 AM
Last edit: March 23, 2019, 08:27:23 AM by BetKing.io
Merited by LoyceV (1)
 #38

...

Your detective work is very, very poor.

Think about one thing....multi monitor setup? You should know quite how this wouldn't work logistically for me.

Same desktop? I've not used Windows for over a year. You knew that too.
I only know 3 of those icons and don't have steam installed, I don't play games.

If you had saw my desktop I wouldn't care (but think logically, would I ever post a screenshot with all my desktop in view? especially under some account you claim to be me)
Also, his screenshot was to show a 9900x payout win (which happened when i was sleeping btw).
If you check his screenshot with the 9900x I posted on twitter and telegram you would see I cut out only the bet details dialog. Not the whole desktop.

However what you are doing is bordering on doxing someone else just because they post about the site? That is terrible behaviour and surely is against the forum rules.

Instead of getting off on the little fame you get from these trolls worshipping you why don't you stick to your retirement with your gf and your bike?
Or is selling btc too hard for you too still since running from the US?

Pathetic. Reported to mods. (not that they ever bother to do anything anyway)
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March 23, 2019, 08:34:40 AM
Last edit: April 04, 2019, 09:39:16 PM by mprep
Merited by RHavar (10), LoyceV (1)
 #39

You jumped to wrong conclusions if u want to have a chat with me on skype lets go. Witch hunt is unreal, I'll prove I'm not Dean in like 500 million ways. With all that investigated work I would expect nothing less than accepting the challenge!



Like same OS that dean uses and multi-monitor setup (ok, that's weak...).

Windows and two monitors really?.....


We see files we wouldn't expect an end-user of BK to have:
https://i.imgur.com/mdoEjwH.png


Yeah that's because I made threads in other forums

 
An interesting email address:
https://i.imgur.com/HWGU


O shit a fan of anarcho capitalism not many of those involved in bitcoin or gambling sites

Which got banned from bitcoin.com for spamming betking  Grin (and using a VPN too, like Dean says he does)
O man he used a vpn GOT HIM! So do like 70% of the other people  on dice sites

And keen interest in betking (ok, weak...):         https://i.imgur.com/HWGUraG.png     
That's because I made the threads

Shares the same interest in boxing and sports betting as Dean:
Whats the demographic for the avg dice user? I'm going to guess male... between the ages of 18-35, whats the demographic of a fight fan? Im guessing male...... and ages of 18-35

Uses the same programs as I know Dean to use:
https://i.imgur.com/lvGXg7g.png

 This makes sense because betking didn't have a bunch of poker pros  around, and steam is so very rare.

Now this is interesting, we can deduce he is in same timezone as Dean by comparing against the bet he's viewing in UTC
https://i.imgur.com/POB3wN8.png[img]No idea what this is, but it caught my eye:[img]https://i.imgur.com/lvGXg7g.png


I don't know exactly what your talking about here but all I know is i have west coast time so do like approx 50 million other people


And I suspect not many users have  a betking chrome profile:
https://i.imgur.com/wj1sfMN.png

my profile could be a egg, it could be blank, it could be a bk profile it doesn't matter what it is the email does its job even if it is a picture of a pile of poop

Conclusion -  You guys all out for a witch hunt and it's clearly obvious you all want to see Dean fail and find anything bad you can out about him, not to help other people not help yourself but only see him suffer.











Oh, Ryan. You never fail to amuse. Excellent detective work. I'd consider that pretty irrefutable proof that they're the same person.

This is the problem with these trolls, you consider that pretty irrefutable proof... When your making some pretty big accusations. I would hate for your opinion to be at the hands of another human being on trial. You don't have the ability to look at things objectively, you want Dean to be me so you will let your subjective feelings cloud your judgement. This post by you show's that your claims should have little credability in the future.

Rhavar should have 100% not posted this, he should have tried to get in contact with me and explain what he had and ask me to verify or give him proof. I'm sure he was sitting there feeling so gleeful as he compiled his circumstancial evidence. So proud to unleash his findings.

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LoyceV
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March 23, 2019, 09:05:49 AM
 #40

Your detective work is very, very poor.
That's funny, coming from someone who claims JollyGood is game-protect, and claims asche is likely to be marlboroza.

However what you are doing is bordering on doxing someone else just because they post about the site? That is terrible behaviour and surely is against the forum rules.
If someone posts something by himself, analyzing the screenshot isn't considered doxing.

Quote
Instead of getting off on the little fame you get from these trolls worshipping you why don't you stick to your retirement with your gf and your bike?
Or is selling btc too hard for you too still since running from the US?
Please refrain from going off-topic.



Screenshot of BetKing.io's recently Sent feedback:
Image loading...
I love the trust abuse. Very mature!



Disclaimer:
Note that meriting a post doesn't necessarily mean I agree with the post. It means the post is worth reading, and in this case can also mean it's worth reading because it says a lot about the person posting it.



BillyBurns: I don't think you're Dean's alt account. But know that users have been tagged for promoting scams before, and since the consensus is that BetKing's ICO turned into a scam, it's probably time to stop promoting the site.

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