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Author Topic: Vod is a liar.  (Read 6821 times)
OgNasty
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April 26, 2019, 09:15:41 PM
Last edit: May 08, 2019, 08:27:18 AM by OgNasty
Merited by xLays (1)
 #1

I gave Vod a couple chances to apologize for his lies, but he seems to not realize that his actions are not acceptable behavior.

This recent bit of drama is due to Vod interjecting himself into a thread where he stated a lie about me as his reasoning for looking the other way as scammers pollute the DT network.

Here's an example of the trust system's stupid shit.  Last of the V8s claims I scammed 2,100 BTC.  This is untrue, and yet some of the con-artists on DT have actually included this moron.  

Reminds me of when, years ago, I initially PMed you about including the moron Quickseller in your DT2 trust list.

You promptly told me he had done nothing wrong to you.  

So why the hypocrisy here?   "Last of the V8s" has done nothing wrong to everyone else... :/

Not only is that a lie as I have explained to him multiple times why I have left the feedback I have, but he continued stating other lies as can be seen throughout that thread, escalating his attacks to provably honest community organizations I support.  More of Vod's lies are detailed on this post: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5122617.msg50665442#msg50665442 but I would recommend reviewing the entire thread.


Once I called Vod out, he decided to leave me a negative trust rating.





Vod's negative feedback with me seems to stem from this specific quote:

This while continually asking me to leave you a trust rating and add you to my network while showering me with Merit at the time.  Between that pathetic manipulation attempt failure escalating to you telling me that you'd add me to your distrust list unless I removed trust ratings for Anduck and Quickseller and if I did you would add me to your trust list

I think this can be broken down to 3 specific claims that I will prove the reasoning for my opinion below.  I think after reviewing all available information, it should become clear that Vod is a dangerous addition to the trust network, who has no problem enabling scammers out of fear, and abuses the responsibilities given to him by this forum.

1) Vod asked for my trust multiple times.
2) Vod uses Merit questionably.
3) Vod said he would add me to his distrust list unless I removed trust ratings for Anduck and Quickseller.





1) Vod asked for my trust multiple times.

Besides the fact it is weird to be sent a message from such a long term member that you've rarely if ever communicated with, having them mention trust like in these quotes definitely seemed to me as though Vod was asking for trust without any sort of basis.  I had to explain this to him to the point of frustration as these quotes show.  There is always much more, but I tried to make this as short as possible.  Setting things up we have to start at the beginning and I highlighted a particular line that I think applies to the current trust rating Vod has left me.

Hey Guys,

I'm sending this to everyone on level 1 of the DefaultTrustList.

I understand my position on default trust in now in peril because of my morals and actions.

Having an MSDN subscription myself, I KNOW that I am only allowed a certain number of product keys.  Giving a key to someone else (stealing) takes away my ability to use it, meaning I have to spend more money.

I wasn't prepared for the overall community to ignore the negative aspects of this theft, and view this as an internal Microsoft issue.  To me it's theft, but to many others it was business as usual, because it was bitcoin.  This was shocking, but not something I can change.
 
I'm going to lay off the negative trust from now on.  I will continue to leave negative trust on those accounts who are clearly doing wrong, but I will do my best to cut back on the controversial reports.  If I am unsuccessful, I understand I will be removed.

The last thing I want to see is my three+ years of reporting scams and scammers to disappear into untrusted feedback.  I have done a LOT of good work here.  I would rather abandon my account and walk away than see all that work go to waste.

Finally, no matter what your individual choices, I respect everyone's right to manage their list as they see fit.  You will never see any outcry from this account.

Thank you for your time,

Vod/(removed)

The above was the first message sent addressing me directly from Vod.  It was sent to everyone in DT1 and seemed to make users uncomfortable from the response to it.  Besides Vod making a 360 from his humble days before he felt like god (that quote further below) to what he is doing now, it was pretty clear he was willing to go a step further than others when it came to his personal trust ratings.

Why was I never added to your trust list?  Tongue

I don't think we've ever had any dealings.

The first time you have to explain it, it seems innocent enough...

I have left trust for QS not to make some statement on the internet, but because I actually trust him. I would be happy to demonstrate this trust by publicly sending him BTC to an address he posts if you don’t believe me...  It isn’t political, this is how I honestly feel.

After explaining yet again why (above), he again asks for trust later that same day (below) since I've left feedback for QS.  

You trust Quickseller, but not me?

 Huh

Clearly he asked for my trust in suggestive ways enough times to the point I was beginning to become frustrated.

We've had this discussion.  You and I have never interacted.  Quickseller has used me for escrow and purchased goods from me on multiple occasions over a period of years.

Let us not continue to rehash these same discussions.  


2) Vod uses Merit questionably.

You can see the merit activity here.  What happened during the periods I received merit for Vod?  The first merit was during some sort of argument with Quickseller, which was a short period before leaving me the second merit and alluding to deserving my trust with the quote shown directly above, "You trust Quickseller, but not me?" which I had already explained to him in detail multiple times.  The next quote was where we left things in negotiations where given all the previous discussion seemed to be waiting for Vod message me about sponsorship.  It was the last communication with Vod before the sudden blasting of Merit in November felt like he was letting me know he still hadn't forgotten about our open negotiations, which fell apart after I publicly made it clear I wasn't interested in sponsoring a site that has algorithms controlled by a single person whom it personally benefitted.  

I have not forgotten about you.  I'm just very busy right now cleaning the site up for production use - I've have a few people approach me now for services.

He also demanded merit from me in PM.  I don't think anyone else has ever done this to me.

I'll expect to see some merit from you as stated when I launch the new URL and new design sans big banner ad in your face.  Smiley


3) Vod said he would add me to his distrust list unless I removed trust ratings for Anduck and Quickseller.

This is clear, and Vod didn't limit it to just me either.  At the time of our conversations about the trust network involving Anduck and Quickseller, Vod had me in his trust settings as Trusted.  This was reflected at: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;dtview - Vod made it known that in order to remain there, I would need to remove feedback for Anduck and Quickseller, otherwise I would be distrusted.

After I noticed that Vod had suddenly flipped from trusting to distrusting me, I sent him a message and got this response:

You trust Anduck and Quickseller.  Sorry.

He then made it pretty clear that it was for this specific reason, which I assume meant if I were to remove those feedbacks I would return to being trusted by Vod.

Anyway, nothing against you.  The mark is to negate trust left To Anduck and Quickseller.

When I pointed out that his distrust was specific to me, he responded by spreading his net wider:

I have now updated my trust list to include all 41 profiles that trust Quickseller.


Back in the day when I thought of myself as a god (yesterday) I still listened to people and changed my mind from time to time.

Do as I say but not as I do?  Can Vod listen and change his mind?

2 Don't judge me by who I leave positive trust to.

I never trusted Vod's network, and I think after reading this post it is understandable why.  I never considered casting negative trust until this experience with him though.  I wish Vod had apologized and admitted he was in the wrong so we could have moved forward like adults and avoided this nonsense.  I know I had better uses for my time today.





Additionally, quotes like this show that Vod is motivated not by trying to have an accurate trust system, but by his fear of negative trust (see also the first quote in #1 he sent to all DT members).  Due to this, I think him and those who have fallen victim to selling out their morals in order to be in the current DT1 network should be excluded, preferably by other users, as I think it is clear that the trust network is going down a dangerous path guided by fear over truth.

but this latest drama with Lauda has opened my eyes a bit...

Yeah, I've distanced myself with her.  What can you do?  You speak out and you get negative trust...

How do I defriend Lauda without getting negative trust from her and ruining five years?

Do you think it’s acceptable that Lauda hasn’t tagged aTriz yet? Do you think there is any reason why everyone shouldn’t tag aTriz for what he did?

Let me answer that this way - how can I leave negative trust for either of them without ruining my account?

As for your account being ruined if you tag one of them, I’m well aware. I guess the difference is that I do what I feel is right regardless of how it may effect me, and you appear to be having your true opinions silenced out of fear. So forgive me if I take your criticisms with a grain of salt.

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Vod
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April 26, 2019, 09:31:36 PM
 #2

I am calling you a liar
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5122617.msg50652615#msg50652615

You are now calling me a liar.

I'm on DT for now, so I will make my case in trust feedback.
You are not on DT for now, so you'll make your case on multiple threads.

Just don't expect me to respond to a liar.  Smiley  Carry on.

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April 26, 2019, 09:59:38 PM
Merited by OgNasty (1)
 #3

I am calling you a liar

You are now calling me a liar.

The difference is that your lies are verifiable and proven.


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April 26, 2019, 10:18:38 PM
Last edit: April 26, 2019, 11:25:56 PM by Quickseller
 #4

Vod doesn’t look very good here. There are a number of concerns about him.

It looks like Vod may have been using his position as a merit source to highlight businesses that he was is negotiations with to sell advertising space with, this is shady at best and amounts to selling merit at worst.

Vod is unwilling to do what is right within the trust system if doing what is right is not beneficial to him.

Most bizarrely, according to what OgN posted, Vod thinks of himself as god:
Back in the day when I thought of myself as a god (yesterday) I still listened to people and changed my mind from time to time.

I cannot imagine anyone who makes this kind of statement ever being taken seriously.

Find the fire hydrant in my Avatar for a prize.
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April 26, 2019, 11:12:03 PM
 #5

Vod doesn’t look very good here. There are a number of concerns about him.

This is a useful post sponsored by LiveCoin.   Tongue

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April 26, 2019, 11:15:33 PM
Merited by TMAN (2), TECSHARE (1), khaled0111 (1), xtraelv (1)
 #6

some great "old" forum members consuming much of their time and efforts fighting against one another, that is a big win for the real scammers whom the trust system was invented to fight.

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April 27, 2019, 12:00:47 AM
 #7

some great "old" forum members consuming much of their time and efforts fighting against one another, that is a big win for the real scammers whom the trust system was invented to fight.

Would be glad to give you merit for this, but you're simply too damn obviously correct, so I can't. (You stated the obvious.)

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April 27, 2019, 12:14:34 AM
Last edit: April 27, 2019, 12:52:56 AM by EcuaMobi
Merited by suchmoon (9), LoyceV (2), Steamtyme (1)
 #8

I'm glad to see negative feedback is removed from several profiles who posted here.
We should try and leave negative trust only if we strongly believe someone has scammed or is trying to do so, especially after this welcomed change:
Logged-out users will now see a warning in trust-enabled sections if more DT members neg-trust the topic starter than positive-trust him.

This increases the responsibility of DT members not to give negative trust for stupid reasons, but only for things that cause you to believe that the person is a scammer.

Leaving neutral trust or ~excluding someone from the trust list is one thing, but negative trust must be reserved to fight scammers, not for ego fights or misunderstandings.



Edit: Please note I'm not supporting one or the other party. Please don't try to make it look like I do. I want to be as far away from this senseless discussion as possible.
All I'm saying is this fight (as well as a lot of other recent discussions on Meta and Reputation) is not about scams so no negative trust is deserved.

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April 27, 2019, 12:46:08 AM
 #9

I'm glad to see negative feedback were removed from several profiles who posted here.

Yes, I think once Vod started shamefully lying about the legitimacy of the PMs I posted here, which is easily provable by Administrators, action needed to be taken.  Hopefully in the future it doesn't take intervention for Vod to act like an adult.

Vod, you are a liar and owe me an apology.  Here's your proof:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5136576

So many words and no proof that I ever sent PM(s)

I'm sure an Administrator could verify that all of the messages I quoted from you are from legitimate Vod PMs.  Keep digging that hole.

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April 27, 2019, 12:49:51 AM
 #10

Yes, I think once Vod started shamefully lying about the legitimacy of the PMs I posted here

Where did I do that to your cherry picked quotes?   Tongue

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April 27, 2019, 01:51:47 AM
 #11

Vod, you are a liar and owe me an apology.  Here's your proof:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5136576

So many words and no proof that I ever sent PM(s)

Click on my quote link above to see what I actually typed.  OG cherry picked only the first part of my sentence, so I would appear to be claiming I never sent any PMs at all.

lol

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April 27, 2019, 10:32:25 AM
Merited by Welsh (2), qwk (1), o_e_l_e_o (1)
 #12

Wouldn’t it just be best to shake hands (virtually) & sort this out gentlemen?

It’s quite clear that neither Vod or Og are scammers or untrustworthy. You two guys are two of the most respected members on the forum.

Come on guys, remove the red trust you’ve given each other & move on. There’s nothing to gain from continuing needless feuds. A lot of less respected members admire & look up to you two.

You can both tell me to fuck off but I think forgiveness & burying grudges goes a long way for well being & good karma.

Good luck to you both & peace.

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April 27, 2019, 10:52:39 AM
Merited by LFC_Bitcoin (1)
 #13

Wouldn’t it just be best to shake hands (virtually) & sort this out gentlemen?
Agreed! I think it would be good if several established forum members just get a beer together.

The drama between good members doesn't do anyone nor Bitcoin nor the forum any good. And we all must have some common ground, after all that's why we're here.

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April 27, 2019, 11:27:24 AM
 #14

No, VOD is not a good member. He abuses the trust system to silence the truth being spoken.

I do not feel that his actions would warrant him being classed as a "good" member at all.

Why should honest members need to have a beer and pretend his actions were legitimate?  if he is a liar he must be called out as a liar. No nice beers and pretending it did not happen. This does not appear a 50/50 fault scenario. Where you can kiss and make up.

Liars, scammers, trust abusers, these are not good members. You would do well to start realizing that.
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April 27, 2019, 01:18:51 PM
Last edit: April 27, 2019, 01:33:51 PM by OgNasty
 #15

Come on guys, remove the red trust you’ve given each other & move on. There’s nothing to gain from continuing needless feuds. A lot of less respected members admire & look up to you two.

I never left Vod red trust. The lies and red trust all came from Vod in this situation. The only thing that has happened so far is that Vod removed the false red trust rating he left me. Still no apology for the lies or attempt at damaging my reputation.

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April 27, 2019, 01:23:48 PM
 #16

Really happy to see this sorted out between VOD and OgNasty.  Grin

Both of you surely insprire new and learning members like me, on this forum to grow and follow some of your step's here.

Grab a blunt both of you.

Peace!
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April 27, 2019, 02:04:55 PM
 #17

Really happy to see this sorted out between VOD and OgNasty.  Grin

Both of you surely insprire new and learning members like me, on this forum to grow and follow some of your step's here.

Grab a blunt both of you.

Peace!


I think you are unable to grasp that nothing has really changed except I suspect Theymos ordered VOD and lauda to remove their trust abuse.  Which is of course the correct thing to do in this instance.  Nobody here believes Ognasty is a scammer, so him having scam tags is laughable.  

I am kind of upset they removed them (sorry OG no offence to you with that) because someone with his long term honest standing here that is  being cast as a scammer by these observable liars and scammers demonstrated SOMETHING had to be done. Sadly it seems that they realize they stepped over their abusive threshold with Theymos by fucking with OG and retracted them now. This does not help at all with the larger issue that DT is riddled with scammers, liars, and trust abusers like VOD and Lauda and their colluding ass kissing clingons.

It would be better had they still refused to remove their trust abuse and Theymos went  full Thanos on these observable dirt bags and blacklisted the entire swathes of observable dirty turds infesting DT. Let's have some observably honest and long term legends on there with no dirt in their past histories who we can TRUST.
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April 27, 2019, 02:50:27 PM
 #18

<...>
It would be better had they still refused to remove their trust abuse and Theymos went  full Thanos on these observable dirt bags and blacklisted the entire swathes of observable dirty turds infesting DT. Let's have some observably honest and long term legends on there with no dirt in their past histories who we can TRUST.

Okay.. This is Alex-Jones level trolling. You've officially elevated. (and gone completely nuts?)


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April 27, 2019, 05:26:46 PM
Merited by LoyceV (1)
 #19

I'm glad to see negative feedback is removed from several profiles who posted here.
We should try and leave negative trust only if we strongly believe someone has scammed or is trying to do so, especially after this welcomed change:
Logged-out users will now see a warning in trust-enabled sections if more DT members neg-trust the topic starter than positive-trust him.

This increases the responsibility of DT members not to give negative trust for stupid reasons, but only for things that cause you to believe that the person is a scammer.

Leaving neutral trust or ~excluding someone from the trust list is one thing, but negative trust must be reserved to fight scammers, not for ego fights or misunderstandings.



Edit: Please note I'm not supporting one or the other party. Please don't try to make it look like I do. I want to be as far away from this senseless discussion as possible.
All I'm saying is this fight (as well as a lot of other recent discussions on Meta and Reputation) is not about scams so no negative trust is deserved.

Very well said.  The trust system should not be used for personal vendettas. 


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April 27, 2019, 05:45:15 PM
 #20

~I suspect Theymos ordered VOD and lauda to remove their trust abuse.~
I suspect you're full of it!
  • Trust isn't moderated.
  • If Admin wants to remove trust, he doesn't need anyone's cooperation.
  • Theymos believes in freedom of speech and decentralization, at most he would exclude someone who's trust he disagrees with, effectively having one vote like any other DT1.

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