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Author Topic: IS THE LIGHTNING NETWORK UP AND RUNNING  (Read 226 times)
roosbit
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April 29, 2019, 11:24:00 AM
Last edit: May 08, 2019, 11:48:31 AM by roosbit
 #1

The lightning network has been something that has been considered to be the solution to some of the problems bitcoin has faced in the past , and is said to be the possible lasting solution for BTCs future use.

But my question is the lightning network up and running?

I have seen some services already using LN and I am fortunate to kind of use it  Roll Eyes...and honestly am not convinced that this is it, Why???
  • First, LN products like their wallets aren't user friendly IMO,example mobile wallets aren't easy to use like what we used too, i think you need some technical knowledge to use


  • Secondly, I feel we are just being charged more for the so called LN transaction which ordinary bitcoin transactions could do when a high TX fee is paid.

Is LN really UP AND RUNNING Huh
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April 29, 2019, 11:30:59 AM
 #2

That is right lightening network is not user friendly because of it high technicalities which have to be followed before establishing a transaction on the network and secondly despite the fact that it transactions fees a low you need to spend extre money to set up the lightening network channel before you are able to send and receive found.

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April 29, 2019, 11:41:48 AM
Last edit: April 29, 2019, 12:02:24 PM by mocacinno
 #3

This is just my personal opinion, but i'd answer your question as: Yes, the lightning network is up and running

1) the clients are becoming reasonable... As a gui client i use Eclair mobile, and eventough it has a learning curve, it's reasonable (at least, that's my opinion)
2) you are referring to the fee you have to pay for the on-chain transaction used for opening and closing transactions... Yes, this fee can be more than a "regular" on-chain transaction, since a lot of "regular" wallets allow you to cheap out on fees (they have an "economy" setting  that actually underestimates the needed fee... While most lightning network wallets usually seem to pay the optimal fee without leaving you the option to cheap out). However, once a channel has been openened, the fees are really small (at least, they've been small for all the payments i made).

The lightning network is still in an early stage, and it'll never be as safe as an on-chain transaction... But at the moment i consider is usable, the learning curve seems reasonable to me, there are a couple of reasonably good wallets,...

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April 29, 2019, 11:49:39 AM
 #4

Tough to understand initially due to the technicalities involved, but it is not the fully developed product since it is in its experimental phase currently. With time, it will become newbie friendly thanks to a plethora of tutorials to guide you and the node setup fees will continue to drop.

Also, Neutrino protocol will help by removing the necessity to download the entire blockchain.

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April 29, 2019, 01:57:57 PM
 #5

I read a blog post of the Atomic Swap wallet confirming they are going to implement the lightening network, I wonder if this will be for all users. The lightening network currently have some technical set back in which case of transactions, the sender and the receiver need to be online.
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April 29, 2019, 03:44:51 PM
 #6

LN is still on the process of development and improvement.
For you to be able to use it, you are required to reach a certain level of technical skills. You have to focus on setting up a Litecoin LN node. Once you're done with it, you can use the command line program to check out the comprehension tutorial. LN has a lot of improve yet it would provide us the convenience that we want.

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April 29, 2019, 09:45:43 PM
 #7

LN is up. but technically and analogically, its hopping

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April 29, 2019, 10:05:37 PM
 #8

I've used a lighting network wallet and you're correct that it is not a user-friendly wallet. But, it may not be user-friendly as we think still there's a progress that we can see. The fee is considerably low and the speed is quick. LN is for small payments and I'm looking forward to see large transactions that will go through LN. Give time to the development of LN and we're likely to see on how great such technology can make our problems solved in a decent manner.
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April 30, 2019, 04:59:06 AM
 #9


But my question is the lightning network up and running?
  • Secondly, I feel we are just being charged more for the so called LN transaction which ordinary bitcoin transactions could do when a high TX fee is paid.

Is LN really UP AND RUNNING Huh
yes. Lightning network are worked for all user have a node of them wallet to send and received fast. when you don't have node you can use custodial wallet to easy received and send payment as LN, but you have to high fee as usuall chain when send to on chain wallet legacy or segwit.

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April 30, 2019, 05:08:21 AM
 #10

Also have had a tough time using LN the first time, and to tell you the truth, even up to now I'm still trying to grasp the basics of several clients that are suggested due to their user-friendliness. LN surely is up and running, and a lot of people have already tried it including myself, though not without painstaking processes and a lot of head scratching involved.

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April 30, 2019, 05:55:22 AM
 #11

Network lightning will be a game changer after a mass adoption, but for now it is still in a development phase.

However, last results confirm that this technology is absolutely essential for crypto daily usage.

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April 30, 2019, 06:38:17 AM
 #12

    But my question is the lightning network up and running?

    Yes, even though technically multiple nodes which use LN protocol are up and running.

    • First, LN products like their wallets aren't user friendly IMO,example mobile wallets aren't easy to use like what we used too, i think you need some technical knowledge to use

    I agree, but the developer working hard to make it more user-friendly and it's far better compared with LN wallet few years ago.

    • Secondly, I feel we are just being charged more for the so called LN transaction which ordinary bitcoin transactions could do when a high TX fee is paid.

    That's because there are fees to open channel, close channel and routing transaction. Total/overall fees will be lower if you make lots of transaction on LN.

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    April 30, 2019, 06:38:34 AM
     #13

    This is just my personal opinion, but i'd answer your question as: Yes, the lightning network is up and running

    1) the clients are becoming reasonable... As a gui client i use Eclair mobile, and eventough it has a learning curve, it's reasonable (at least, that's my opinion)
    2) you are referring to the fee you have to pay for the on-chain transaction used for opening and closing transactions... Yes, this fee can be more than a "regular" on-chain transaction, since a lot of "regular" wallets allow you to cheap out on fees (they have an "economy" setting  that actually underestimates the needed fee... While most lightning network wallets usually seem to pay the optimal fee without leaving you the option to cheap out). However, once a channel has been openened, the fees are really small (at least, they've been small for all the payments i made).

    The lightning network is still in an early stage, and it'll never be as safe as an on-chain transaction... But at the moment i consider is usable, the learning curve seems reasonable to me, there are a couple of reasonably good wallets,...


    I believe Lightning is also better suited for multiple payments to a participant than a single payment. A good example might be a company that pays it employees in Bitcoin, or a dice site that "streams" the coins back to you if you win, as you "stream" coins to it as you lose. Hahaha.

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    April 30, 2019, 06:29:28 PM
     #14

    I believe Lightning is also better suited for multiple payments to a participant than a single payment.
    A good example might be a company that pays it employees in Bitcoin, or a dice site that "streams" the coins back to you if you win, as you "stream" coins to it as you lose.

    Both examples are wrong.

    Companies paying employees would have to time lock their entire payroll for months to years.
    No business is going to unnecessary lose access to their capital for such a long period of time,
    especially considering LN own developers still promotes itself as beta and not ready for large funds.

    Dice sites can take your initial deposit and you can choose your withdrawal at any point, (without time locks).
    Until LN has many direct fiat to LN markets where people can bypass the ridiculous time locking , it is of no real value.  Tongue
    When direct Fiat to LN conversions are the norm, makes you realize they never needed bitcoin at all.
    Just a financial asset pegged so the LN fractional reserve would be accepted to the clueless masses.




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    May 01, 2019, 08:59:23 AM
     #15

    I believe Lightning is also better suited for multiple payments to a participant than a single payment.
    A good example might be a company that pays it employees in Bitcoin, or a dice site that "streams" the coins back to you if you win, as you "stream" coins to it as you lose.

    Both examples are wrong.

    Companies paying employees would have to time lock their entire payroll for months to years.
    No business is going to unnecessary lose access to their capital for such a long period of time,
    especially considering LN own developers still promotes itself as beta and not ready for large funds.

    Dice sites can take your initial deposit and you can choose your withdrawal at any point, (without time locks).
    Until LN has many direct fiat to LN markets where people can bypass the ridiculous time locking , it is of no real value.  Tongue
    When direct Fiat to LN conversions are the norm, makes you realize they never needed bitcoin at all.


    Maybe you're right. But my point remains, for single payment, do on-chain, for small, multiple, repeating, continous payments, there's Lightning payments.

    Quote

    Just a financial asset pegged so the LN fractional reserve would be accepted to the clueless masses.


    Explain in full detail how LN is a fractional reserve. I want to learn.

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    May 01, 2019, 09:35:38 AM
     #16

    Explain in full detail how LN is a fractional reserve. I want to learn.

    going with YOUR premiss that Msats are simple a measure of real bitcoins.

    when people pay for a channel using fiat/altcoin/coinbase balance/unconfirm(unlocked)btc. a service using the eltoo/factory concept creates a channel(HTLC) that contains msats

    this means say someone paid using $50 coinbase FIAT balance. they can have opened a channel by a service where the user agree's to accept 1000000000msats(~$50) which they are happy to agree as the value is ~$50. yet although Msats are supposed to be
    100000000000msat:1btc.. even though the fact that no btc was locked on btc blockchain, this means there is more pegged btc balance(msats) than actual locked BTC

    the 'hope' / aim of fractional reserve services are to not let those handling these extra amounts from doing a bank run and claiming the real asset they are pegged/tethered/represent as that would cause big issues as there is not enough vaulted up asset to cover it all.
    this is why you CANNOT broadcast a HTLC of Msats

    this is why its important to not conceive Msats as real btc. but as a pegged token
    this is why its important to not conceive a HTLC as the same thing as a bitcoin CLTV
    this is why understanding the 'factory' concept is totally different from the broadcast concept.
    this is why its important to understand there is no big community agreement/consensus. and any 2 parties can privately do as they like agreeing to a balance and then publishing available msats to the route system of litenodes that cant/wont check a blockchain for validity

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    May 01, 2019, 11:48:46 AM
    Merited by Wind_FURY (1)
     #17

    Dice sites can take your initial deposit and you can choose your withdrawal at any point, (without time locks).
    Until LN has many direct fiat to LN markets where people can bypass the ridiculous time locking , it is of no real value.  Tongue.

    That, or you aren't understanding the timelock part correctly.  You seem to be of the impression (or possibly just attempting to mislead less experienced users and give them the false impression) that you have to wait for the timelock to end before you can settle to the blockchain.  The idea is that you settle to the blockchain BEFORE the timelock expires.  It's a bad idea to wait for the timelock to run out.

    khufuking
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    May 01, 2019, 12:15:14 PM
     #18

    Lighting Network is up and running but it is just not for all at the moment, there is a couple of services available that is using Lighting Network at the moment but it requires good money and high tech knowledge that is normal as LN is still in its early phase but with time things will be much easier and better.

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    Itty Bitty
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    May 01, 2019, 01:16:10 PM
     #19

    LN is still on the process of development and improvement.
    For you to be able to use it, you are required to reach a certain level of technical skills. You have to focus on setting up a Litecoin LN node. Once you're done with it, you can use the command line program to check out the comprehension tutorial. LN has a lot of improve yet it would provide us the convenience that we want.


    You can download a mainnet (not testnet) desktop lightning wallet here (LND lightning labs) :

    https://blog.lightning.engineering/announcement/2019/04/23/mainnet-app.html


    Deposit a small amount of BTC you are comfortable with by pressing the small QR code on top left of main screen. (Note: You may have to wait longer than 6 confirmations initially as all the blocks and filters of the wallet  sync, so be patient.)

    After the funds show up in the wallet, you should be aware that the default condition of the wallet is that a lightning channel will automatically be opened for you (small fee is taken). In other words, you don't have to do anything, just wait until the BTC has confirmed in the channel.

    After that, you are ready to send lightning payments (it's more complicated to receive at first, but it can be done). YOU DON'T NEED A BITCOIN NODE RUNNING OR ANY TECHNICAL KNOWLEDGE.

    Go to https://yalls.org/ and pay for an article to read there, or maybe Satoshi's place and add pixels to a picture there.  (Note: When you copy the invoice you want to pay, paste it into the wallet using the "edit" function at top left of wallet)

    Seeing is believing!

    Khaos77
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    May 01, 2019, 04:58:15 PM
     #20

    Dice sites can take your initial deposit and you can choose your withdrawal at any point, (without time locks).
    Until LN has many direct fiat to LN markets where people can bypass the ridiculous time locking , it is of no real value.  Tongue.

    That, or you aren't understanding the timelock part correctly.  You seem to be of the impression (or possibly just attempting to mislead less experienced users and give them the false impression) that you have to wait for the timelock to end before you can settle to the blockchain.  The idea is that you settle to the blockchain BEFORE the timelock expires.  It's a bad idea to wait for the timelock to run out.

    Your Time lock is set for 2 weeks,
    so you show me by redeeming your bitcoin IOU in only 1 week and transferring that btc out to another address,
    go ahead and post the results and lets see if you are as clueless as you seem.  Cheesy
    or
    as I suspect, you end up waiting the additional week, until onchain redemption is possible.
    It is called a Time lock after all.

    FYI:
    Place a 1 year time lock on your funds, and redeem it onchain in one week and you have changed lightning entire PR campaign.
    Go ahead , show your wizardry.   Cheesy


     

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