Liberated: LoyceV's Legendary Little Lightning Loans Lowered

[thehun]

I'm ready  

Please pay 0.101 mBTC here:

Code:

lightning:lnbc101u1pw0u9skpp5lj2yggxc5jfy7hsr428ck2tutem8ec5nu3daqa20nn2ynrxv22mqdqdwpshjgrzv93kkxqr4rqrzjqwryaup9lh50kkranzgcdnn2fgvx390wgj5jd07rwr3vxeje0glc7zxwl5qq04qqqqqqqqlgqqqqqeqqjq0nqj27c6434zsat2py74a3atfle4vrdtvsxt484f2sv4dde4l7ukkphlnmygu3l3mdwsd72r20399e8vp279q769l2lkqvmhn9n595qq0vk5yq

Payment failed for some reason. I tried it twice with the same result

[1713532069]

1713532069

[1713532069]

1713532069

[1713532069]

1713532069

[1713532069]

1713532069

[LoyceV]

Maybe Eclair didn't keep running in the background, I'll keep the screen on for a while. Try again?

[thehun]

Maybe Eclair didn't keep running in the background, I'll keep the screen on for a while. Try again?

Failed again 

[LoyceV]

I don't know what causes it. Try paying to https://tippin.me/@LoyceVVal ?

[thehun]

I don't know what causes it. Try paying to https://tippin.me/@LoyceVVal ?

This one worked  

Payment hash 65109e8e0a6d9882674787c282bbc797684ce3a8665fb2836086113af8d6c605

I like the concept and the speed of LN transactions but I feel like there is still a lot to improve before we can think of mass adoption. Setting up an incoming channel should be a lot easier and it's not very convenient to need to have the client running all the time if you want to receive something. Also, 6 hours max expiry for a payment request is not enough.

In any case, thanks for a great trade!

[LoyceV]

This one worked  

I've sent it from Tippin to my Eclair wallet with no problems.

I like the concept and the speed of LN transactions but I feel like there is still a lot to improve before we can think of mass adoption. Setting up an incoming channel should be a lot easier and it's not very convenient to need to have the client running all the time if you want to receive something.

We're playing with experimental technology here. It's fun to do, but far from finished. From what I've seen, custodial wallets work easier than non-custodial wallets. For decentralization, I hope latter wallets will be improved, but I'm okay with using a custodial wallet for small payments if I have to.

Also, 6 hours max expiry for a payment request is not enough.

In many cases 10 minutes is enough, but indeed for payments through different time zones it's not very convenient if it expires before the other party has even seen it.

In any case, thanks for a great trade!

Thanks for joining this test

[wwzsocki]

...I don't have an android device, so Eclair is not an option for me.

Same here and additionally Bluewallet wich PrimeNumber7 used is only for Android and Mac. I have only windows on my computers and my phone.

This is a great opportunity to learn about the LN and the best way to do it is to send a transaction, download wallet, just do all of this, step by step by yourself.

From the discussion in this thread, I see that already involved members gathered a lot of new knowledge about the LN network.

Great idea @Loycev if you know any windows wallet which is safe to use I will be glad to try it.

[LoyceV]

Great idea @Loycev if you know any windows wallet which is safe to use I will be glad to try it.

Top 11 Wallets for the Bitcoin Lightning Network gives 3 options. I can't tell you how safe they are, and I haven't tested them.

[Rath_]

Great idea Loyce! What node are you connected to?

Code:

lightning:lnbc100u1pws3w8tpp5eyzwh4hwtqkj83yeueqkgaycjxtnzqyza8fwkdvd6wakv6unx4dqdp2f3hhjcm92csxcmmpdcsxvmmjyppxjazrwfuhqar90qcqzpgxqyz5vq02ly82jzuhayx6pcd78p4xygmvnf44xwtq657llpnfu2k7qf2fwhlepgzqqzdd89kzsdkrjwpslrh0qkw70mfq5q0wvvmjd45fjveygpu307qq

[...]and then I'll setup my Lighting node as I dream to do this for very long time now.

If you need any help, hit me up! I can also help with setting up Zap on your mobile which will make it easier for you to manage your node.

[LoyceV]

What node are you connected to?

I'm currently connected to one of ACINQ's nodes, which is the easiest to connect to from Eclair.

Code:

lightning:lnbc100u1pws3w8tpp5eyzwh4hwtqkj83yeueqkgaycjxtnzqyza8fwkdvd6wakv6unx4dqdp2f3hhjcm92csxcmmpdcsxvmmjyppxjazrwfuhqar90qcqzpgxqyz5vq02ly82jzuhayx6pcd78p4xygmvnf44xwtq657llpnfu2k7qf2fwhlepgzqqzdd89kzsdkrjwpslrh0qkw70mfq5q0wvvmjd45fjveygpu307qq

Funded! Welcome my third customer
I paid a whopping 5.52 satoshi on fees.

I also installed BlueWallet, which allows receiving Lighting payments without funding a channel first. Using a custodial wallet certainly has benefits. BlueWallet recommends to only use it for small amounts.
From what I've seen, it charges (up to) 1% in fees for making a payment. For small payments, that's totally acceptable, and much less than the on-chain fee I paid to close a channel that failed to open (due to my low funding fee).

[PrimeNumber7]

From what I've seen, [BlueWallet] charges (up to) 1% in fees for making a payment. For small payments, that's totally acceptable, and much less than the on-chain fee I paid to close a channel that failed to open (due to my low funding fee).

My understanding is BlueWallet will force the user to reserve 1% for possible LN channel fees, but will not necessarily actually charge this much, depending on the LN network fees. I have noticed their LN fees to be higher than sending transactions while connected to a few well connected nodes found on 1ML. The total cost, including tx fees, and fees paid to 3rd party nodes when using a non-custodial wallet, remains lower using BlueWallet.

[LoyceV]

My understanding is BlueWallet will force the user to reserve 1% for possible LN channel fees, but will not necessarily actually charge this much, depending on the LN network fees. I have noticed their LN fees to be higher than sending transactions while connected to a few well connected nodes found on 1ML. The total cost, including tx fees, and fees paid to 3rd party nodes when using a non-custodial wallet, remains lower using BlueWallet.

I noticed BlueWallet is just a bit inaccurate. I did this starting with an empty wallet:
I deposited 200 sat. It shows the deposit correctly, but the balance shown was 198 sat.
I withdrew 196 sat. It shows the withdrawal correctly, the remaining balance was 2 sat.
I withdrew 2 sat. The balance now shows 0 sat, but the withdrawal is shown as 4 sat.

All in all nothing I worry about, and I assume they'll fix those tiny details at some point.

[Rath_]

I would like to repay my loan. Feel free to charge me more I am going to open a bigger channel anyway. I will use Eclair Mobile this time so the routing fee should be different. By the way, a new non-custodial Lightning Network wallet has been released. It's available for both iOS and Android so it's perfect for most people here.

[LoyceV]

I would like to repay my loan. Feel free to charge me more

I like it, deal I've increased the interest by 2% (from 100 to 102 satoshi). Please pay 0.00010102 BTC:

Code:

lnbc101020n1pwskh3rpp55cf2tn68dmg4pskula9elmk2yle0rsu7hfcewpx7l9m6wn8r2w8qdqqxqr4rqrzjqwryaup9lh50kkranzgcdnn2fgvx390wgj5jd07rwr3vxeje0glc7zxwl5qq04qqqqqqqqlgqqqqqeqqjq0dj7h8kdr68g6hp8222fwrps0y6pkd8pzmyjelzg6qts8nnxn77zecgtgzh07sr45j9z8k83m732jm70w0e9g9gjdewnjfhc7sju45qqy3y8zm

I am going to open a bigger channel anyway. I will use Eclair Mobile this time so the routing fee should be different. By the way, a new non-custodial Lightning Network wallet has been released. It's available for both iOS and Android so it's perfect for most people here.

I'll check it.

[Rath_]

I like it, deal I've increased the interest by 2% (from 100 to 102 satoshi). Please pay 0.00010102 BTC:

Paid. The routing fee was lower this time, 2.01 satoshi and the transaction was instant despite being connected to different nodes.

[LoyceV]

Paid.

Received.

The routing fee was lower this time, 2.01 satoshi and the transaction was instant despite being connected to different nodes.

With Eclair and the node I'm connected to, any transaction up to 3 satoshi doesn't take a fee and is very fast, anything above that charges a (small) fee and takes a bit longer (maybe 5 seconds) to find a route).
I've tried BlueWallet a couple of times too, but it's quite annoying with the amount of confirmation screens I get. That's probably good for serious usage, but not for testing it and sending a couple hundred transactions in a short time.

It probably doesn't help that I use a tablet for testing, while Eclair and BlueWallet are designed to be used on a phone. I just don't want to experiment on devices that I use for other things.

[bitmover]

Hello Loycev
I would like to participate

I was trying to open a channel but I am receiving weird messages
"Channel capacity not valid"
Cani use some already opened channel?

Sorry I am a newbie with this

[LoyceV]

I was trying to open a channel but I am receiving weird messages
"Channel capacity not valid"

What wallet are you using?

Cani use some already opened channel?

I think that's only possible if you use a custodial wallet.

[bitmover]

What wallet are you using?

I am using Éclair wallet.
Do I need to send some funds to the wallet so I  open a channel?

[LoyceV]

I am using Éclair wallet.
Do I need to send some funds to the wallet so I  open a channel?

Yes. A channel needs at least 1 mBTC (some nodes require more), and to do that, you'll need to fund the Eclair wallet first (on-chain).