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Author Topic: Can we have the Forum Rules as a separate sticky in B&H please!  (Read 157 times)
Pmalek
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June 16, 2019, 08:05:31 AM
Merited by Daniel91 (1)
 #1

This has probably been suggested before, so sorry if it is a repeat.

The user iamsheikhadil has a valid point when he says:
Frankly, many newbies (most I would say) and even me, didn't even know the meaning of "meta". When I joined first in the forum, I directly entered "beginner" section. I didn't know much rules. Then I hopped from topics to topics to learn. After a lot of days I entered "meta" and saw the rules.

Why can't we have a copy of the Forum Rules as a sticky in B&H as well?
I know that there is a thread by Lauda > Newbies - Read before posting and in this thread there is a link to the rules. I think it wouldn't hurt if there is also a separate sticky just for the Forum Rules.

iamsheikhadil is correct when he says the following as well:
If you look closely to the rules in the original thread in meta, you will see a lots of rules. But the most important rule - "plagiarism" is at the last. The most important rule is at the bottom of the list of rules.

Rule #33:
Posting plagiarized content is not allowed.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=703657.0

Can we change this? The reason that so many accounts get banned should be on top, flashing images, rockets, explosions and babes in bikinis.
Jokes aside, I think this could easily be changed to put more emphasise on the problem of plagiarism. 

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June 16, 2019, 09:19:08 AM
Merited by suchmoon (4)
 #2

If newbies fail to read a sticky thread with a topic like;
Then I sincerely doubt they'd read through a separate thread for the forum rules.
There are also ethics and basics that a newbie should know besides the rules that are contained in that thread. One can know the rules but still ask unnecessary questions like 'how many activity to get to Jr member?'. Everyone is encouraged to read and consume knowledge before posting on the forum.

Can we change this? The reason that so many accounts get banned should be on top, flashing images, rockets, explosions and babes in bikinis.
Jokes aside, I think this could easily be changed to put more emphasise on the problem of plagiarism. 

Babes in bikinis would not be a bad idea.
But from my little observation, those who plagiarize are aware that it is against the forum rules and do it for personal gain, to either get merit of complete a task. How much effort should be put in to try and keep them here?

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June 16, 2019, 10:16:59 AM
 #3

If newbies fail to read a sticky thread with a topic like;
Then I sincerely doubt they'd read through a separate thread for the forum rules.
Pretty much this. I think we already have too many stickies dotted about the place - it gets to a point where people become blind to them, sort of like banner blindness that we all get with repetitive ads.

I think the best solution, which has been discussed many times before, is to show all newbies a welcome message. theymos even wrote one a while ago (Writing a welcome message), but it has unfortunately never been implemented. I do think the message he wrote is too long winded though - it should probably be condensed to a couple of paragraphs at most, essentially saying "Don't spam or plagiarize, read the stickies, and here's a link to the rules".

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June 16, 2019, 11:13:04 AM
 #4

Whether the rule "posting plagiarised content is not allowed" comes first or last makes no difference in my opinion, when you get into the forum and you get to see the rules, you ought to read it ardently and avidly down to the last one,you're not expected to merely glance through it. So the rule being the last really changes nothing, neither does it make a case for plagiarists, you can as well flash in in their faces and still it'll make no difference.

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June 16, 2019, 02:00:15 PM
 #5

This has probably been suggested before, so sorry if it is a repeat.

The user iamsheikhadil has a valid point when he says:
Frankly, many newbies (most I would say) and even me, didn't even know the meaning of "meta". When I joined first in the forum, I directly entered "beginner" section. I didn't know much rules. Then I hopped from topics to topics to learn. After a lot of days I entered "meta" and saw the rules.

Why can't we have a copy of the Forum Rules as a sticky in B&H as well?
I know that there is a thread by Lauda > Newbies - Read before posting and in this thread there is a link to the rules. I think it wouldn't hurt if there is also a separate sticky just for the Forum Rules.

iamsheikhadil is correct when he says the following as well:
If you look closely to the rules in the original thread in meta, you will see a lots of rules. But the most important rule - "plagiarism" is at the last. The most important rule is at the bottom of the list of rules.

Rule #33:
Posting plagiarized content is not allowed.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=703657.0

Can we change this? The reason that so many accounts get banned should be on top, flashing images, rockets, explosions and babes in bikinis.
Jokes aside, I think this could easily be changed to put more emphasise on the problem of plagiarism. 

thanks Pmalek , I hope a rule list in the beginners section is implemented Tongue

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June 16, 2019, 02:17:14 PM
 #6

@Theymos has/had the idea of displaying a welcome message for new users, depicting the essentials amongst which plagiarism was to be highlighted amongst a narrow selection of common rule violations (see Writing a welcome message). The message was planned to also be shown in the Help section.

The above got stuck in the conceptualization plane though, perhaps due to comments with multiple suggestions that may have caused @theymos rethink the content and left it for later on. The welcome message would be a good spot though to emphasize what was intended to be displayed in the draft:

<…> Common rule violations

These are the most common rule violations that newbies make. There are other rules than these.

  • Plagiarism: If you copy some text from somewhere, then you should have a good reason for it, and you must link to the source. Doing otherwise is plagiarism. Changing a few words around doesn't matter. If we find that you plagiarized, then you absolutely will be permanently banned, even if we find it years after you did it.
  • Multi-posting: Do not post twice in a row in a topic. Instead, edit your old post.
  • Low-content posts: Do not post low-content garbage like "agreed!", "nice project!", etc. You can be banned for this, and it's also pointless if you want to increase your rank, since you will never get merit for such posts.
<…>

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June 17, 2019, 08:38:40 AM
 #7

How much effort should be put in to try and keep them here?
Lets not focus on those who want to cheat their way to the top. Lets focus on those who come here as bitcoin and crypto enthusiasts but are felling overwhelmed and maybe not sure where and how to start.

Snip
A welcome message is a good idea. I wonder why it was never added. The main focus of the message is on plagiarism and low quality spam posts - exactly how it should be. I wouldn't add anything else to it except the link to the rest of the rules.

@theymos
Can we have this implemented maybe?

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June 17, 2019, 09:40:07 AM
 #8

I think if Forum Rules in the sticky thread in B&H would definitely let every newbies to read it and it would be a great idea if there is a notice above that will going to suggest to read all the forum rules and regulations to avoid getting ban in the future. Giving them a warning will let them feel to understand and read all the forum rules and maybe will get back after just in case they forget the rules and regulations for the forum.

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June 17, 2019, 09:42:58 AM
 #9

The main rules (or 'guidelines') should be displayed upon sign up with a link to read the full ones which we should urge all users to read fully before they start posting. Far too many newbies are completely oblivious to the rules and Meta is the last sub board people usually end up in. I would say half of the threads that end up in there aren't even created in Meta but moved from elsewhere (especially when made by newbies). We should also have some of the most commonly broken rules displayed at the top of pages like don't post ref links, alt coins don't belong in this sub etc etc. The warnings could maybe just be displayed for only newbies and they go away once you get one merit.

@Theymos has/had the idea of displaying a welcome message for new users, depicting the essentials amongst which plagiarism was to be highlighted amongst a narrow selection of common rule violations (see Writing a welcome message). The message was planned to also be shown in the Help section.

The above got stuck in the conceptualization plane though, perhaps due to comments with multiple suggestions that may have caused @theymos rethink the content and left it for later on. The welcome message would be a good spot though to emphasize what was intended to be displayed in the draft:

<…> Common rule violations

These are the most common rule violations that newbies make. There are other rules than these.

  • Plagiarism: If you copy some text from somewhere, then you should have a good reason for it, and you must link to the source. Doing otherwise is plagiarism. Changing a few words around doesn't matter. If we find that you plagiarized, then you absolutely will be permanently banned, even if we find it years after you did it.
  • Multi-posting: Do not post twice in a row in a topic. Instead, edit your old post.
  • Low-content posts: Do not post low-content garbage like "agreed!", "nice project!", etc. You can be banned for this, and it's also pointless if you want to increase your rank, since you will never get merit for such posts.
<…>

Something like this would be ideal, but not the full thing theymos posted. I think it's too long and newcomers will just gloss over it. Give them the abridged / most important rules then provide some links for further reading, like the full rules/guidelines, helpful guides and a history of the forum or whatever. If they're greeted with a barrage of text most will just treat it like they do with t's and c's and skip it.

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June 17, 2019, 09:48:25 AM
 #10

I asked for this before but got no support : https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=4546818.0

Yeah but it's not so easy to spot, we are talking about newbies here, and they don't really like to lurk around and read, which is their problem of course.
But maybe we can prevent a little but of spam by adding the rules on the top.


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June 17, 2019, 10:04:08 AM
 #11

The warnings could maybe just be displayed for only newbies and they go away once you get one merit.
The Welcome message written by @theymos has still been an unofficial one, and has not yet been sticked as pop-up welcome message for new registered account (I guess it is because @theymos has not officially announced about the Welcome message implementation). Furthermore, I don't think that the exclusive criteria of Welcome message should be one merit earned. Sometimes, people can get merit easily by joking posts, or something like this; it means such criterion solely does not make sure that Newbies whom earn their first merit actually read forum rules.

I suggest a combination between one merit earned and a threshold of their log-in time (such as 7 days) - like what we have with Flags, newbie-warning flags.
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