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Question: Did Satoshi think that quantum computers will exist?
yes - 32 (74.4%)
no - 11 (25.6%)
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Author Topic: Did Satoshi think that quantum computers will exist?  (Read 1823 times)
satoshyknew
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October 16, 2019, 02:54:58 PM
 #61

* 100% sure that it is a prize competition
* 100% sure that you can solve it only with the blockchain
* still trying to solve it
* one day someone will solve it

Sergio says that the slope in the picture (This is Satoshi) https://bitslog.com/2013/04/17/the-well-deserved-fortune-of-satoshi-nakamoto/ is caused by restarting the application to mine (wallet) but it is possible that each 'black branch' represents one solution. That would avoid that only one winner gets the whole coins.

Yes, for sure Satoshi is one of the genius people

He would try to distribute the prize but let it still huge.
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hundredpercent
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October 17, 2019, 02:30:15 PM
 #62

December 2015 a Bitcointalk member discovered a puzzle transaction while playing around with his bot:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1306983.msg13381244#msg13381244
At that time nobody declared such a puzzle transaction which was created January 2015 until the creator of that competition came out 2 years later:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1306983.msg18765941#msg18765941
As of 01/10/2019 there are still more than 100 BTC to win. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5166284.0

We think that the early mined coins of Satoshi are also a prize competition and that Satoshi is waiting this coins to be moved. We also think that he will not respond after somebody moves the first coins but it will be a message to the Bitcoin community that the private keys are somehow on the blockchain. If Satoshi disagreed with that conclusion he would have moved the coins to other addresses.

Re: Maybe Satoshi created the greatest prize competition https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5150688.0
satoshyknew
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October 23, 2019, 02:20:05 PM
 #63

Satoshi knew that one day quantum computers will exist and will be able to move the early mined coins (P2PK) and created an unofficial prize competition to accelerate the development.

Satoshi:
However, if something happened and the signatures were compromised (perhaps integer factorization is solved, quantum computers?), then even agreeing upon the last valid block would be worthless.
True, if it happened suddenly.  If it happens gradually, we can still transition to something stronger.  When you run the upgraded software for the first time, it would re-sign all your money with the new stronger signature algorithm.  (by creating a transaction sending the money to yourself with the stronger sig)

Nobody is asking why he did not move and is not moving these early mined unmoved P2PK coins:
https://bitslog.com/2013/04/17/the-well-deserved-fortune-of-satoshi-nakamoto/
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=175996.0

Our guess is that he knew that the early mined coins will be moved one day. So he created a 'prize competition'. Otherwise he could move the coins to quantum resistant P2PKH addresses, but he did not and is not doing.

The only question is:
Who will win the race and get the early coins?

Quantum computing or solving the "Satoshi Prize Competition".

Nobody can stop that race.
qubitasic
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October 25, 2019, 02:15:14 PM
 #64

In particular, all coins suspected to be Satoshi's are in P2PK outputs. If those moved ever, even to a different sig algo, it would cause enormous chaos.

assuming satoshi can still move their/his coins, this is a likely reason why it's not happening. Although we shouldn't discount the most conservative thing that all 2009 era mined BTC key holders could do; start by moving their BTC with the highest block number, and do it very very slowly. Satoshi could potentially do so too (we have zero clue what's going on with satoshi in so many ways), so assuming that chaos was not the intention, I expect that if those coins ever did move, that's what would happen; starting at block ~50,000, then working backwards from there.

In such a sequence of events, it could be interpreted as a signal that those early miners are losing confidence in the safety of ECDLP protected coins. Of course, those people may have other reasons to not publicly announce why they're moving to different keys (which are not necessarily anything to do with the safety of the public key cryptography), so you are indeed correct; the lack of information will cause uncertainty, and the uncertainty will rock the Bitcoin ecosystem.

I hope such people (whether satoshi or not, there are others) are reading some of these discussions (it would surely be prudent to do so). If so, I also hope they will consider a slow and orderly move to new key types, and act sooner rather than later.
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November 07, 2019, 03:41:49 PM
 #65

HUAWEI CEO REN Zhengfei: "Blockchain/crypto is worthless when facing quantum computing"
https://twitter.com/DoveyWan/status/1192186523740856320

The blockchain community should immediately begin working on three issues to prevent being overtaken by quantum computers, a cryptography expert says. Xinxin Fan, head of cryptography at privacy- and IoT-focused blockchain platform IoTeX, published an article in The International Business Times on Nov. 7, calling on the blockchain community to be constantly updated about the progress made on quantum computers.
https://cointelegraph.com/news/blockchain-must-solve-these-3-issues-to-avoid-quantum-threat-expert
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November 09, 2019, 08:26:07 AM
 #66

Satoshi is much aware of quantum computer and its upcoming supremacy but satoshi bitcoin alogarthim  is much advance than all these features of quantum computing
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November 09, 2019, 08:40:17 AM
 #67

He probably had them in mind, at least as a possibility. He's likely the only one who can answer with any certainty, but I think that he must have had them in mind, since he's clearly well-educated and thoughtful.

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November 09, 2019, 09:52:37 AM
 #68

Yes, for sure Satoshi is one of the genius people, who devoted their time and life for doing something amazing just like Bitcoin or crypocurrency, and for sure he knows that technology will continue to develop more over the years, so it doesn't matter whether he predicted it or not, what matters is that he created something different.

Maybe, he already knew that quantum will exist because blockchain was develop and study for long years and quantum as well. satoshi might know or already heard that quantum developers are already having ideas for doing this and also for sure that satoshi is not afraid of that because he also have the idea that this have a disadvantage. blockchain will remain that everyone needed. the idea of satoshi is a far different from this new quantum technology.

Watch out for this SPACE!
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November 09, 2019, 10:37:44 AM
 #69

From the topic subject, it seems that you are already assuming that quantum computers will impact the bitcoin and bitcoin community big. Well, in my point, we need first to gather information with regards to quantum computers and its possible potential to affect cryptocurrency. In this case, making an assumption about  Satoshi and bitcoin community having a risk with quantum computers.

Why do I need to tell you this?

Simple, because our words are powerful and it can affect the mindset of mostly newbies in the cryptocurrency space to believe that quantum computers do really might harm the blockchain.
quantuminfo
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November 12, 2019, 03:59:36 PM
 #70

https://www.cnet.com/news/for-faster-quantum-computing-microsoft-builds-a-better-qubit/
For faster quantum computing, Microsoft builds a better qubit

Google just announced quantum supremacy, a milestone in which the radically different nature of a quantum computer lets it vastly outpace a traditional machine. But Microsoft expects progress of its own by redesigning the core element of quantum computing, the qubit.
Microsoft has been working on a qubit technology called a topological qubit that it expects will deliver benefits from quantum computing technology that today are mostly just a promise.
"We've really spent the recent few years developing that technology," Krysta Svore, general manager of Microsoft's quantum computing software work, said. "We believe we're very close to having that."
The key advantage of Microsoft's topological qubit is that fewer physical qubits are needed to make one logical qubit, Svore said.
Specifically, she thinks one logical qubit will require 10 to 100 physical qubits with Microsoft's topological qubits. That compares to something like 1,000 to 20,000 physical qubits for other approaches.
paskah01
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November 13, 2019, 04:04:10 AM
 #71

Satoshi Nakamoto is a mathematician. I am a physicist. I had  a mathematics professor that could be compared with Satoshi Nakamoto. When bitcoin was invented in 2009, the quantum adventure was at its beginnings.

I made my PhD thesis on quantum wells (in 2000), in 2009 what was in my PhD thesis was learned in the QM in the 2nd year of faculty.  When bitcoin was invented no one could say that Quantum Computers will be invented in 10 years.

Thus, Satoshi Nakamoto did not think that quantum computers will exist when he invented the bitcoin.





Google has claimed "their processor was able to perform a calculation in three minutes and 20 seconds that would take today's most advanced classical computer, known as Summit, approximately 10,000 years."

"But quantum computers won't break every piece of cryptography, only some. Specifically, public-private key encryption, diffe-hellman key exchange, and digital signatures will be broken, but hashing and symmetric encryption cannot be broken even in theory by a quantum computer........"

To continue the explanations go to https://zoobc.how/?qa=132/think-quantum-computers-possibly-able-hack-compromise-crypto and in case you're interested to the project, please join the forum and see the discussion on https://zoobc.org/
boris1044
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November 13, 2019, 08:36:43 PM
 #72

Satoshi has mined the most coins.
In 2010 they were talking about lost coins and Satoshi said

Quote
Think of it as a donation to everyone.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=198.0

1. He thought the coins are lost forever and we have a lot of 'shalecoins' https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5134441.0 and they will become active one day

or

2. Satoshi created the greatest prize competition and the privatekeys are somehow within the blockchain. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5150688.0



1. Yes, with quantum computers they would become active. Did Satoshi think that quantum computers will exist?

Satoshi is a rogue AI from the future, running on a time-traveling quantum computer. Bizarre, and the stuff movies are made from. That's what I choose to believe: he's the quantum computer himself.
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November 13, 2019, 08:59:47 PM
 #73

Satoshi Nakamoto is a mathematician. I am a physicist. I had  a mathematics professor that could be compared with Satoshi Nakamoto. When bitcoin was invented in 2009, the quantum adventure was at its beginnings.

I made my PhD thesis on quantum wells (in 2000), in 2009 what was in my PhD thesis was learned in the QM in the 2nd year of faculty.  When bitcoin was invented no one could say that Quantum Computers will be invented in 10 years.

Thus, Satoshi Nakamoto did not think that quantum computers will exist when he invented the bitcoin.





Google has claimed "their processor was able to perform a calculation in three minutes and 20 seconds that would take today's most advanced classical computer, known as Summit, approximately 10,000 years."

"But quantum computers won't break every piece of cryptography, only some. Specifically, public-private key encryption, diffe-hellman key exchange, and digital signatures will be broken, but hashing and symmetric encryption cannot be broken even in theory by a quantum computer........"

To continue the explanations go to https://zoobc.how/?qa=132/think-quantum-computers-possibly-able-hack-compromise-crypto and in case you're interested to the project, please join the forum and see the discussion on https://zoobc.org/

There are not many quantum computers in the world, and if someone wants to crack cryptography they will have very big problems. So I think no one dares to do it
SMSKWSMSKW
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November 19, 2019, 03:02:40 PM
 #74

"In order to have any effect on bitcoin or most other financial systems it would take at least about 1500 qubits and the system must allow for the entanglement of all of them," "By comparison, Google's measly 53 qubits are still no match for this kind of cryptography."
https://hackernoon.com/quantum-computing-and-blockchain-facts-and-myths-l71w28d2

For faster quantum computing, Microsoft builds a better qubit - Microsoft's new approach to quantum computing is "very close," an executive says.
"We've really spent the recent few years developing that technology," Krysta Svore, general manager of Microsoft's quantum computing software work, said Thursday after a talk at the IEEE International Conference on Rebooting Computing. "We believe we're very close to having that." Specifically, she thinks one logical qubit will require 10 to 100 physical qubits with Microsoft's topological qubits. That compares to something like 1,000 to 20,000 physical qubits for other approaches.
https://www.cnet.com/news/for-faster-quantum-computing-microsoft-builds-a-better-qubit/

Can somebody explain, please? 1,500 qubits required and Microsoft will have 1,000 to 20,000?
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November 21, 2019, 05:40:08 PM
 #75

Either way, we are still likely decades away from this threatening bitcoin.
we are currently no where near the physical qubits to be overly concerned.

Thank you.
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November 26, 2019, 03:31:58 PM
 #76

Blockchain latest news: a state-owned quantum computer could break blockchains in as little as three years  https://www.computing.co.uk/ctg/news/3033006/state-owned-quantum-computer-break-blockchains-three-years 'A commercially viable quantum computer is still probably a decade away but the first rudimentary, state-owned device capable of breaking common one-way encryption algorithms like AES and elliptic curve cryptography could be with us much sooner.'
'Whoever achieves it first - and it could be within as little as three years according to Cheng - don't expect to learn about it in the news.'

He knew.
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November 29, 2019, 04:18:57 PM
 #77

Quantum Computing: The Real Game Changer

'Some say that quantum computers would be an end to the blockchain technology. I honestly think there is a possibility of this happening, I might not be able to talk much about it here.'
https://medium.com/the-andela-way/quantum-computing-the-real-game-changer-e60010d77fe4
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December 02, 2019, 02:40:47 PM
 #78

Researchers from the Russian Quantum Center suggested that quantum computing could eventually obsolete blockchain altogether.

"Within ten years, quantum computers will be able to calculate the one-way functions, including blockchains, that are used to secure the Internet and financial transactions. Widely deployed one-way encryption will instantly become obsolete." https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-018-07449-z

Quantum computers put blockchain security at risk - Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies will founder unless they integrate quantum technologies, warn Aleksey K. Fedorov, Evgeniy O. Kiktenko and Alexander I. Lvovsky.
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December 02, 2019, 03:52:25 PM
 #79

Researchers from the Russian Quantum Center suggested that quantum computing could eventually obsolete blockchain altogether.
If they are speculating that Quantum computer could make the blockchain obsolete then i can speculate that the bitcoin core will come up with a solution that could secure even the quantum attack and then they will spend another billion to do further research to break those system and it will be a never ending battle and once they burn enough billions they will eventually stop these bullshit research Tongue.
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December 02, 2019, 05:45:36 PM
 #80

Researchers from the Russian Quantum Center suggested that quantum computing could eventually obsolete blockchain altogether.
If they are speculating that Quantum computer could make the blockchain obsolete then i can speculate that the bitcoin core will come up with a solution

That's not an issue. Bitcoin developers have already post quantum solutions.
But there are lots of 'shalecoins', https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5134441.0 coins with no owner. With quantum computers, these coins will become active and change the Bitcoin ecosystem.

Satoshi had already thought of the quantum computers, and the possible decoding of the privatekeys if it became available, ..
His coins would be quantum secured, if he sent them to P2PKH addresses. But he did not and isn't doing.
2. Satoshi created the greatest prize competition and the privatekeys are somehow within the blockchain. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5150688.0

and privatekeys are somehow within the blockchain = quantum computer?

We will get the answer with quantum computers. As soon as possible.
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