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Author Topic: Bitmain Introduces the S17+ and T17+  (Read 557 times)
Biffa
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October 09, 2019, 01:59:46 PM
Last edit: October 11, 2019, 02:36:35 PM by Biffa
Merited by frodocooper (3)
 #1





Should be interesting to see the prices, I suspect they will be $3K plus if not more for the S17+, T17+ is about the same speed as a S17E but slightly less efficiency so maybe closer to $2.1 - 2.2?

S17+ is close to same efficiency as the S17Pro 50/53/56

T17+ is between S17E and T17e in terms of efficiency

It'll all come down to price, but I think this is the start of a major ramp up in difficulty and a direct attack on their competitors to wipe them off the board

[EDIT]
Updated with prices:

S17+ $2833

T17+ $1802

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philipma1957
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October 09, 2019, 02:53:26 PM
Last edit: October 10, 2019, 01:37:08 AM by frodocooper
 #2

Yeah the s9s will now fall off. Being replaced with serious gear.

It is funny but this gear 73th at 40 watts a th is a bad fit for my 30amp circuits .

I prefer s17 53 or s17 53 pro.

I can run two of them and pull about 4600 watts on a 30 amp circuit.

If I run the s17 + it will pull about 2920 watts which is not a good use of a 30 amp circuit.

I suppose I could use a hp Pdu make it run 1 s9 and 1 s17+ that would be about 4300 maybe 4400 watts a circuit.

I see BTC as the super highway and alt coins as taxis and trucks needed to move transactions.
wndsnb
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October 09, 2019, 03:09:54 PM
Merited by frodocooper (2)
 #3

Seriously ... How many more S17 variations can they come up with? Just trying to milk every last cent out of those 7nm chips I guess. So this is basically a 73th s17 Pro with no low power mode, so should be priced somewhere between a pro and non-pro per th.

I'll wait 3 more weeks for the S17e+ pro... lol.
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October 09, 2019, 03:26:48 PM
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Seriously ... How many more S17 variations can they come up with? Just trying to milk every last cent out of those 7nm chips I guess. So this is basically a 73th s17 Pro with no low power mode, so should be priced somewhere between a pro and non-pro per th.

I'll wait 3 more weeks for the S17e+ pro... lol.

  It is more industrial and less home friendly.

Also pulling say 3000 watts it would be better on a 20 amp 220 volt circuit vs a 30 amp 220 volt circuit. Most likely I will not be getting it.
I will focus on s17 and s17 pro as the 2225 to 2300 watt draw they do is more attractive to me.

I see BTC as the super highway and alt coins as taxis and trucks needed to move transactions.
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October 09, 2019, 03:33:50 PM
Last edit: October 10, 2019, 01:38:28 AM by frodocooper
 #5

These would drop right in at farms that were running old S9s at close to 1500W each.
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October 09, 2019, 03:39:46 PM
Last edit: October 10, 2019, 01:38:59 AM by frodocooper
 #6

I know some farms have lots of 20amp breakers with a dual 20amp socket. They are a straight drop in power wise.   So pull 28th add 73 th in about two minutes. Also drop one Ethernet cable.

With bitmain dropping so much gear so quickly I now have a clear path to grow the gear.

I buy 1 or 2 s17's a month using paypal to pay for them.
By the ½ ing we will be all s17 gear.  Over 3ph in gear.

I see BTC as the super highway and alt coins as taxis and trucks needed to move transactions.
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October 09, 2019, 06:02:31 PM
Last edit: October 10, 2019, 01:39:23 AM by frodocooper
Merited by frodocooper (2)
 #7

I wonder if they will be listed super high, then do the "actual" sale price and whatever difference in price to the real price, then refund you on your bitmain account like they've done before.
PopoJeff
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October 09, 2019, 07:17:17 PM
Merited by frodocooper (2)
 #8

Seems with Bitmain, I cannot place an order for an item..... without a newer, better version being released before the one I ordered even ships

Home garage miner: 1-s9i, 1-s17 pro 50, 1-s17 56
AlecMe
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October 09, 2019, 08:21:51 PM
 #9

wait, 3kw (on two cables) cannot run on a 30amp breaker if another miner is plugged in on the same breaker(ie. a t17e which draws almost as much)? the circuit is 220v; also, i smell s19's for the halving  Lips sealed
PopoJeff
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October 09, 2019, 08:54:39 PM
Merited by frodocooper (2)
 #10

wait, 3kw (on two cables) cannot run on a 30amp breaker if another miner is plugged in on the same breaker(ie. a t17e which draws almost as much)? the circuit is 220v; also, i smell s19's for the halving  Lips sealed

Sure they can.  A 3000 watt units is 12.5A on a 240v circuit.  Two units pulling 25A on a 30A circuit, run with 10ga wire will be just fine.  24A on 10ga wire is recommended, but if its a short wiring run, say under 25', there should be no problems.

Home garage miner: 1-s9i, 1-s17 pro 50, 1-s17 56
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October 09, 2019, 10:12:08 PM
Last edit: October 10, 2019, 01:41:54 AM by frodocooper
 #11

Borderline at best  more then likely you will trip your circuit breakers over and over.  running 2 units pulling 6000 watts on a 30 amp circuit is possible but not a good idea.

6000/7200 = 5/6 = 83.333%    which is over code.  This assumes an exact 240 volt output   many of us run from 217 to 227 as the norm.

I have 3 spots with 220/240

One does  217 to 227  this would never work  with 2 units on 1 30 amp circuit.

one does  234 - 237  I would bet against this one not tripping gear out.

one does  237 - 243  this could work.

I have pushed all 3 locations

the 217 to 227  prefers 4800 watts or less on a 30 amp circuit.

the  234-237    can do 5100 watts no issues

the 237-243 can approach 5800 watts in the winter.

there is no way would I try 2 s17+  on 1  30 amp circuit.

I would do 2 s17+ and 1 s9  =  2950 + 1350 = 4300 watts which is no worries

now most of my gear is in clifton which runs in the 217 to 227 volt zone
So I do not try  to get to 5000watts on any circuit.

We also have an issue that low volts occurs  say 190 volts  every 10-14 days for about 10 minutes  we think it is a power station issue  so pushing circuits is simply not justified for us.

If you have a very steady 240 volts in a very cool space maybe you can do 2 of these units and pull about 5840 watts on a 30 amp circuit.  I am sure people will try it and some may do okay.

I see BTC as the super highway and alt coins as taxis and trucks needed to move transactions.
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October 09, 2019, 10:17:34 PM
Last edit: October 10, 2019, 01:43:23 AM by frodocooper
Merited by philipma1957 (2), HagssFIN (2), frodocooper (2)
 #12

Seems with Bitmain, I cannot place an order for an item..... without a newer, better version being released before the one I ordered even ships

Bitmain does a perfect "Carrot and stick"


PopoJeff
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October 10, 2019, 12:37:43 AM
Merited by frodocooper (2)
 #13

So, lets get crazy and say two units will run 6000w.
And your "iffy" voltage gets down to 220v

That'll make your two units draw about 27A. Maybe 27.5A

Breaker isnt tripping til 30A. But its close.
Your power would have to drop to 200v to trip your breaker.

10ga wire is rated for 30A, but the 80% rule (24A) is recommended. But, thats put in place due to longer runs.

You'd probably be just fine if your circuit run was short.

But to be safe, 40A breaker with 8ga wire would be recommended for two of these units. But 30A, 10ga can be done if you know what you're doing electrically.

Home garage miner: 1-s9i, 1-s17 pro 50, 1-s17 56
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October 10, 2019, 04:21:13 AM
Merited by frodocooper (2)
 #14

I would like to see them produce smaller units - with half the hash and half the power consumption of these current new ones - this would be much easier to incorporate into my mining space. and its much less of a loss should a unit go down.

instead of 73 TH/s with 40 j/th - why not a 35 TH/s with 40 j/th  - just cut these damn things in half.

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October 10, 2019, 04:31:04 AM
Last edit: October 11, 2019, 01:09:44 AM by frodocooper
 #15

They want to move to industrial clients. No more complex then this.

The best units for efficiency are all pulling lots of power.
They are all 220 volts.

S17 50th pro is the lowest power about 2050 watts at middle speed.

S17+ 73 th is high power 2920 watts

M20s. 68 th is 3350 watts

So high power industrial gear is what they push.

I see BTC as the super highway and alt coins as taxis and trucks needed to move transactions.
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October 10, 2019, 05:51:15 AM
 #16

Another reason why I still like Bitmain is the two power cables (splitting the W's and allowing me to use them, still).

I hope Bitmain will still keep this feature.

Also, I will measure my circuits today to be sure where I stand
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October 10, 2019, 06:49:32 AM
Merited by frodocooper (2)
 #17

Another reason why I still like Bitmain is the two power cables (splitting the W's and allowing me to use them, still).

I hope Bitmain will still keep this feature.

Also, I will measure my circuits today to be sure where I stand

How have they done that design?

Is there a risk for phase-to-phase short circuit if you put your power cords into two different circuits which are on different phases ?

This was something I was worried about when I heard about that design.

And I also worry about how well will the protection work in a fault situation with a two circuit setup. Even if those two circuits would be on same phase.

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October 10, 2019, 07:32:48 AM
Last edit: October 11, 2019, 01:11:08 AM by frodocooper
 #18

It is more industrial and less home friendly.

Also pulling say 3000 watts it would be better on a 20 amp 220 volt circuit vs a 30 amp 220 volt circuit. Most likely I will not be getting it.
I will focus on s17 and s17 pro as the 2225 to 2300 watt draw they do is more attractive to me.

Funny, I have the same problem, I run a 32amp circuit but I pull max 4000W per circuit. with all the new machines running 3000-3300W I'm pretty much in a dilemma. If they made a machine with 2000W with the same efficiency, I'd be happy to put 2 on a circuit and call it a day.
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October 10, 2019, 08:14:12 AM
Last edit: October 11, 2019, 01:12:52 AM by frodocooper
Merited by frodocooper (3)
 #19

How have they done that design?

Is there a risk for phase-to-phase short circuit if you put your power cords into two different circuits which are on different phases ?

This was something I was worried about when I heard about that design.

And I also worry about how well will the protection work in a fault situation with a two circuit setup. Even if those two circuits would be on same phase.

I am presuming they are using one cable to power 1.5 board? With the other one covering the other half. The tricky part would be making sure the fans run, so probably a fail-safe power from both cables 'just in case' with the normal cut off if the temperature reaches X degrees.

You can power-up two boards with from 2 PSU (found this guy who did it https://youtu.be/Af76eBsH35A?t=480/ )

Not sure about the half a board powered by one cable and the other one by another, unless one cable does 2 boards and the other cable the other board and the 4 fans and PSU fans  Huh would love to know more though.

Found this about them https://www.antminerdistribution.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/S17-S17-Pro-T17-Server-Manual.pdf but nothing about the power cables (or at least I did not see).
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October 10, 2019, 10:18:49 AM
Last edit: October 11, 2019, 01:13:36 AM by frodocooper
 #20

They want to move to industrial clients. No more complex then this...

I get that totally but still, if they keep climbing, a lot of us will have to redo or at least reconsider our electrical wiring and such. I run 30 amp circuits on 220v so I should be ok for a while but at the rate they are climbing, those soon will not be sufficient.

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