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Author Topic: Idena is the first Proof-of-Person Blockchain  (Read 1510 times)
AndrewIdena
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October 22, 2019, 05:07:25 AM
Last edit: October 24, 2019, 08:51:06 AM by AndrewIdena
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#1

There is the first Proof-of-Person Blockchain. No money for stake or equipment needed, just an average laptop.
You can easily join mining of the first human-centric cryptocurrency at idena.io and share your opinion.

Where to start?
1. Visit the website idena.io to learn more about Idena.
2. Download and install the Idena Node and Idena Client executable files at  https://idena.io/?view=download or build them from source at https://github.com/idena-network.
3. Subscribe to the Idena Announcements channel at https://t.me/IdenaAnnouncements to follow updates.
4. Request an invitation code here or
in the Idena Telegram chat at https://t.me/IdenaNetworkPublic or
in the Discord: https://discord.gg/egaWtsf
5. Make sure your node is synchronized, and activate the invitation code. Check your identity status; it should be "Candidate". The invitation can not be activated in last 5 minutes before the validation.
6. Learn how to solve flips: read the article in our blog  https://medium.com/idena/how-to-prove-your-identity-anonymously-919bdfe5249a and test yourself https://flips.idena.io/?pass=idena.io

How to get validated?
1. Check the next validation time in the Idena app or at the website.
2. Your node must be fully synchronized before the session starts.
3. Your computer time must be synchronized with the internet time.
4. Solve the flips during the validation session. Be agile. The first 5 flips must be submitted in less than 2 minutes.

What's next?
1. Once your identity is validated, keep your node up and running in order to mine coins.
2. Learn how to create flips. Don't forget to create three fips  before the next validation in advance. Schedule your next validation.
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October 22, 2019, 05:33:59 AM
#2

There is the first Proof-of-Person Blockchain. No money for stake or equipment needed, just an average laptop.
You can easily join mining of the first human-centric cryptocurrency at idena.io and share your opinion.

Are you part of the team? seeing your username ends with idena. what makes it better for proof-of-person than the current pow and pos? please share more details and your own experience about your proof-of-person blockchain.

 
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October 22, 2019, 05:53:09 AM
#3

I have read this new proof of person on https://idena.io/, to put it simply we need to do a puzzle or captcha if we want to work as a node.
every single node is equivalent to one person, but this is tedious work for human to keep solving the puzzle. I do not think this new consensus will work out, this is not effective and efficient.

 
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October 23, 2019, 02:36:55 PM
Last edit: October 29, 2019, 06:55:22 PM by mprep
#4

There is the first Proof-of-Person Blockchain. No money for stake or equipment needed, just an average laptop.
You can easily join mining of the first human-centric cryptocurrency at idena.io and share your opinion.

Are you part of the team? seeing your username ends with idena. what makes it better for proof-of-person than the current pow and pos? please share more details and your own experience about your proof-of-person blockchain.

Yes, I contribute to the project.
Why not pow and pos? They both are based on capital. Larger players enjoy economy of scale and adopt anti-competitive practices. Smaller players vanish.

Is there any alternative basis that is not as concentrated as capital? It seems that human personhood is the most evenly distributed and scarce resource on Earth.



I have read this new proof of person on https://idena.io/, to put it simply we need to do a puzzle or captcha if we want to work as a node.
every single node is equivalent to one person, but this is tedious work for human to keep solving the puzzle. I do not think this new consensus will work out, this is not effective and efficient.

The validations will be less often as the network grows. Will validating once in 3 month be too much work?
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October 23, 2019, 03:05:34 PM
#5

There is the first Proof-of-Person Blockchain. No money for stake or equipment needed, just an average laptop.
You can easily join mining of the first human-centric cryptocurrency at idena.io and share your opinion.

It seems like a very unique idea. But what's the utility of this blockchain in real world?

Also I understand a turing code needs to be solved to work as a node in idena network and I also understand that the frequency of solving turing code will reduce as the network grows. What's the current frequency?

Also i see that it is not completely decentralized. Because if I am inviting someone, I will retain the full right to expel that person from the network. Any specific reason for that?

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October 23, 2019, 03:07:10 PM
#6

I have read this new proof of person on https://idena.io/, to put it simply we need to do a puzzle or captcha if we want to work as a node.
every single node is equivalent to one person, but this is tedious work for human to keep solving the puzzle. I do not think this new consensus will work out, this is not effective and efficient.

The validations will be less often as the network grows. Will validating once in 3 month be too much work?

Well, you did not mention it on the website that was why I said solving the puzzle or captcha is tedious work.
You should have at least said about validating once every 3 months on the website, and I still do not understand the function of the laptop in the minting process.
Quote
All validated participants are encouraged to do useful work for the network (hosting their nodes, creating and solving flips, inviting new users, and so on).
did not explain the process of minting using the hardware.

 
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October 23, 2019, 03:49:06 PM
Last edit: October 29, 2019, 06:56:25 PM by mprep
#7

There is the first Proof-of-Person Blockchain. No money for stake or equipment needed, just an average laptop.
You can easily join mining of the first human-centric cryptocurrency at idena.io and share your opinion.

It seems like a very unique idea. But what's the utility of this blockchain in real world?

Also I understand a turing code needs to be solved to work as a node in idena network and I also understand that the frequency of solving turing code will reduce as the network grows. What's the current frequency?

Also i see that it is not completely decentralized. Because if I am inviting someone, I will retain the full right to expel that person from the network. Any specific reason for that?

Idena is a strong bot protection: one person can not have multiple accounts, because the validation session starts at the same time globally. Useful for many projects that cannot be realized otherwise: true anonymous authentication, privacy-preserving Sybil-protected governance and fair voting for online communities and DAOs, global universal basic income initiatives, Sybil-protected marketing.

The current validation frequency is once in 4 days.

The person who invites you can terminate your identity only before your status is "Verfied", after the third validation it is no longer possible. This is done to prevent participants from buying and selling invitations and to encourage healthy network growth. When you are invited by your friend you will not be expelled.



Quote
Well, you did not mention it on the website that was why I said solving the puzzle or captcha is tedious work.
You should have at least said about validating once every 3 months on the website, and I still do not understand the function of the laptop in the minting process.

We mention that in the FAQ section:
https://idena.io/?view=faq#faq-validation-1

Quote
did not explain the process of minting using the hardware.

You need to run the node on your computer or laptop in order to produce blocks and vote for the block proposals.
https://idena.io/?view=technology
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October 23, 2019, 04:00:29 PM
#8

What does it mean in general? For POS coins you need to hold an amount of tokens to be eligible for rewards, for POW coins, you need to have a mining software and what do you mean by human mining from your laptop?

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October 23, 2019, 04:08:15 PM
#9

What does it mean in general? For POS coins you need to hold an amount of tokens to be eligible for rewards, for POW coins, you need to have a mining software and what do you mean by human mining from your laptop?

ITs said above that person can be a node by solving captcha. Interesting concept actually but then the decentralization is going to be questioned. It doesn't really matter if a person has multiple accounts as long as this other account can be a node still. When someone has the right to exclude you, its not going to look good.

Identity validation means KYC?

 
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October 23, 2019, 04:24:50 PM
Last edit: October 29, 2019, 06:56:44 PM by mprep
#10

What does it mean in general? For POS coins you need to hold an amount of tokens to be eligible for rewards, for POW coins, you need to have a mining software and what do you mean by human mining from your laptop?

In order to mine, you have to prove you are a unique human during the validation session. Once your address is validated as a unique human, you can mine coins during the subsequent epoch. Mining requres neither stake nor mining hardware. It's based on the BFT consensus.



Quote

ITs said above that person can be a node by solving captcha. Interesting concept actually but then the decentralization is going to be questioned. It doesn't really matter if a person has multiple accounts as long as this other account can be a node still. When someone has the right to exclude you, its not going to look good.

Identity validation means KYC?

No KYC. No personal data. No trusted verifiers. Proof of person is based on the Turing test running at the same time for all participants in the network.

Invitations are needed to minimize the probability of a Sybil attack.
https://idena.io/?view=invitation#

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October 23, 2019, 06:07:02 PM
#11

I've tried to look for how you are preventing duplicate accounts and answers didn't make sense to me, but as you said in here:

Proof of person is based on the Turing test running at the same time for all participants in the network.

I feel stupid for not getting this but i have to ask. Does this mean that every user needs to be online solving the test at the same time in order to participate? It's the only semi-reasonable answer i am getting from this, even though it doesn't sound plausible or even reasonable. Please tell be i have been mistaken.

 
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October 23, 2019, 09:31:26 PM
#12

I feel stupid for not getting this but i have to ask. Does this mean that every user needs to be online solving the test at the same time in order to participate? It's the only semi-reasonable answer i am getting from this, even though it doesn't sound plausible or even reasonable. Please tell be i have been mistaken.

Itís correct though might seem weird. Every Idena user on a planet needs to appear online at the same time and solve 5 flips in less than 2 minutes in order to prove their uniqueness. Consider it as a global online party.
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October 23, 2019, 09:55:53 PM
#13


Invitations are needed to minimize the probability of a Sybil attack.
https://idena.io/?view=invitation#



this was one of the things that i liked
ive been happy to run a node for a week or two here so far, seems interesting idea
give this some time i will, see how it goes Smiley

 
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October 24, 2019, 05:31:07 AM
#14

What does it mean in general? For POS coins you need to hold an amount of tokens to be eligible for rewards, for POW coins, you need to have a mining software and what do you mean by human mining from your laptop?

In order to mine, you have to prove you are a unique human during the validation session. Once your address is validated as a unique human, you can mine coins during the subsequent epoch. Mining requres neither stake nor mining hardware. It's based on the BFT consensus.
I just feel curious what should be the main role of your token if you are not using your own consensus that puts human verification at the top of the things?

These days so many projects are forgetting to put the token as the main role of platforms. In POS, the owner of the token gets more benefits because it can use its token to earn even more.

When i have minted your coin and passed the validation session and i have proven if im a unique human and then after that i owned some coins and have you planned something good with your coin?

The utility should be on the top of the feature that must available on your token. Your consensus doesn't mean a lot if you are not putting utility usage for your token, right?  

 
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October 24, 2019, 06:23:44 AM
Last edit: October 24, 2019, 06:34:24 AM by DaMut
#15

Quote
Well, you did not mention it on the website that was why I said solving the puzzle or captcha is tedious work.
You should have at least said about validating once every 3 months on the website, and I still do not understand the function of the laptop in the minting process.

We mention that in the FAQ section:
https://idena.io/?view=faq#faq-validation-1


I did not find the 3 months of validation on FAQ, but I found this
Quote
The short validation session has a very limited time frame, less than two minutes, and consists of five flips, each of which is received only by 1Ė4 participants in the network (depending on the network size). This sessionís task is conducting a Turing test: telling humans from AI.

The long flip qualification session lasts 30 minutes and consists of 25-30 flips, each of which is received by a larger number of network participants (depending on the network size). This session enables the network to achieve a consensus on flip quality and the right answer to a flip.
See I was not wrong before, we need to work as a captcha solver in order to get validated, you should have made a full post of explanation about this project.
I am interested in becoming a node but the process confuses me, there is no clear minimum required hardware needed to run the node and there is no clear information about validation time.
You can not just say, you only need a laptop to work with it. There should be a requirement needed like, x Gb of ram or VGA or etc.

 
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October 24, 2019, 08:39:34 AM
Last edit: October 29, 2019, 06:57:13 PM by mprep
#16

Quote
I just feel curious what should be the main role of your token if you are not using your own consensus that puts human verification at the top of the things?

These days so many projects are forgetting to put the token as the main role of platforms. In POS, the owner of the token gets more benefits because it can use its token to earn even more.

When i have minted your coin and passed the validation session and i have proven if im a unique human and then after that i owned some coins and have you planned something good with your coin?

The utility should be on the top of the feature that must available on your token. Your consensus doesn't mean a lot if you are not putting utility usage for your token, right? 


Idena blockchain formalizes people so there might be use cases that we can not anticipate yet. E.g. onchain marketing: Idena participants voluntarily agree to consume ads published by a valid address which burns coins. Then advertisers have to compete for burning more coins in order to reach a certain group of users attention. Burnt coins are removed from the total supply. This  means that all newly mined coins equaly distributed amoung the variety of people can be sold to advertisers who will have shortage of coins.



Quote
See I was not wrong before, we need to work as a captcha solver in order to get validated, you should have made a full post of explanation about this project.
I am interested in becoming a node but the process confuses me, there is no clear minimum required hardware needed to run the node and there is no clear information about validation time.
You can not just say, you only need a laptop to work with it. There should be a requirement needed like, x Gb of ram or VGA or etc.

I have edited the initial post, now it should be clearer. The next validation time is a function of the network size, it is determined by the algorithm when the validation process is over and the number of valdated participants are known. The next validation time is always displayed on the main website and app page. By the way, today is the validation day.
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October 24, 2019, 08:52:19 AM
#17

Quote
See I was not wrong before, we need to work as a captcha solver in order to get validated, you should have made a full post of explanation about this project.
I am interested in becoming a node but the process confuses me, there is no clear minimum required hardware needed to run the node and there is no clear information about validation time.
You can not just say, you only need a laptop to work with it. There should be a requirement needed like, x Gb of ram or VGA or etc.

I have edited the initial post, now it should be clearer. The next validation time is a function of the network size, it is determined by the algorithm when the validation process is over and the number of valdated participants are known. The next validation time is always displayed on the main website and app page. By the way, today is the validation day.

Do you have any idea how many nodes are currently running right now? and what is the basic hardware requirement running the node?
I have a PC right now with 8 Gb ram and I am using this computer for 12 hours/day, I would like to run one of the nodes if it is possible using my personal computer.

 
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October 24, 2019, 09:26:18 AM
#18


Do you have any idea how many nodes are currently running right now?


There are 58 mining nodes running at the moment out of the total 75 validated addresses:
https://scan.idena.io/#miners


and what is the basic hardware requirement running the node?
I have a PC right now with 8 Gb ram and I am using this computer for 12 hours/day, I would like to run one of the nodes if it is possible using my personal computer.



That's fine for running the Idena node.

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October 24, 2019, 10:30:19 AM
#19

I feel stupid for not getting this but i have to ask. Does this mean that every user needs to be online solving the test at the same time in order to participate? It's the only semi-reasonable answer i am getting from this, even though it doesn't sound plausible or even reasonable. Please tell be i have been mistaken.

Itís correct though might seem weird. Every Idena user on a planet needs to appear online at the same time and solve 5 flips in less than 2 minutes in order to prove their uniqueness. Consider it as a global online party.
A very original way to protect the network from fraudsters. If I understand correctly, the scammers will have to have one laptop for each account at the time of verification and several pairs of hands, depending on how many accounts they have registered. To organize such a very problematic, which makes your solution in the fight against multi-accounts very workable, I'm delighted.  

 
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October 24, 2019, 10:32:43 AM
#20


Do you have any idea how many nodes are currently running right now?


There are 58 mining nodes running at the moment out of the total 75 validated addresses:
https://scan.idena.io/#miners


and what is the basic hardware requirement running the node?
I have a PC right now with 8 Gb ram and I am using this computer for 12 hours/day, I would like to run one of the nodes if it is possible using my personal computer.



That's fine for running the Idena node.



I have downloaded the wallet and running it on my computer.
this is not fine at all, my disk is running for 90%-95% when I am running the node. It makes my computer very slow, and hard to use.
I do not think it is possible to run the node on VPS too because my account will be suspended if I am running it on my VPS, it requires 90% of the disk to run the node.

 
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October 24, 2019, 11:08:20 AM
Last edit: October 29, 2019, 06:57:34 PM by mprep
#21

I have downloaded the wallet and running it on my computer.
this is not fine at all, my disk is running for 90%-95% when I am running the node. It makes my computer very slow, and hard to use.

The slow disks might be loaded if you run the node for first time. It takes some to to synrchonize the blockchain data at the beginning.
You can see the if the node is synrchonized in the Idena Client user interface.

I do not think it is possible to run the node on VPS too because my account will be suspended if I am running it on my VPS, it requires 90% of the disk to run the node.

Many Idena participants are running their nodes on VPS. There were no issues with VPS performance until now.




A very original way to protect the network from fraudsters. If I understand correctly, the scammers will have to have one laptop for each account at the time of verification and several pairs of hands, depending on how many accounts they have registered. To organize such a very problematic, which makes your solution in the fight against multi-accounts very workable, I'm delighted. 
Yes, that's correct.



The next validation party starts in one hour and a half.
Invitations can be requested here.



Get ready! Validation starts in 30 minutes



Staring now!
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October 24, 2019, 01:50:55 PM
#22

If I may ask, does the mining require an actively powered laptop? What if I put bit off, will hit continue to mine?
The reason I asked this is that, that is the major problem I have in my location.

lucky.io  [ KEEP PLAYING! KEEP WINNING! ]
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October 24, 2019, 02:03:53 PM
Last edit: October 29, 2019, 06:58:13 PM by mprep
#23

If I may ask, does the mining require an actively powered laptop? What if I put bit off, will hit continue to mine?
The reason I asked this is that, that is the major problem I have in my location.

Once you're successfully validated you can activate the mining mode for your address. Then your node has to stay online synchronized in order to mine coins.
Otherwise if your node comes offline for more than 1 hour penalties are charged. You can deactivate the mining mode at anytime and enjoy the validation rewards only.



The validation session is finished.

Total 75 identities are validated. The validation report:
https://scan.idena.io/validation?epoch=15

Validation rewards paid:
https://scan.idena.io/rewards?epoch=15
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October 24, 2019, 02:36:20 PM
#24

The slow disks might be loaded if you run the node for first time. It takes some to to synrchonize the blockchain data at the beginning.
You can see the if the node is synrchonized in the Idena Client user interface.
You should have told us in the first place, I thought something wrong happened with my computer. How long it will take?
I have waited for 15 minutes and it kept showing 90%+


Many Idena participants are running their nodes on VPS. There were no issues with VPS performance until now.

Can I download the blockchain locally and then move the data to VPS and using it?

 
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October 24, 2019, 04:06:34 PM
#25


You should have told us in the first place, I thought something wrong happened with my computer. How long it will take?
I have waited for 15 minutes and it kept showing 90%+

It depends on your computer and the network speed. You can see the synchronization progress in the Idena Client user interface. Did you downloaded it?


Can I download the blockchain locally and then move the data to VPS and using it?

Yes you can move the full copy of the /datadir/ folder which is created in the same directory where the node is located.
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October 24, 2019, 06:04:21 PM
#26


Itís correct though might seem weird. Every Idena user on a planet needs to appear online at the same time and solve 5 flips in less than 2 minutes in order to prove their uniqueness. Consider it as a global online party.

Yeah, it felt strange for a while, but now when i've had time to think about it, it makes sense. It was just a new approach and hard to get my head around it first. Luckily i live in a timezone that allows me to participate without any problems.

 
                                . ██████████.
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October 25, 2019, 06:11:49 AM
#27

It depends on your computer and the network speed. You can see the synchronization progress in the Idena Client user interface. Did you downloaded it?
Yes, I have downloaded it but I did not see the progress bar on the client. It is normal? my network speed is 10 Mbps.
I am currently at blocks 405121 and it stopped. What should I do next?
do you have a video tutorial or something like that to help us run the node?

 
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October 25, 2019, 06:36:06 AM
#28

Don't you think that single individual could run multiple idena nodes in order to cheat or something? This is a potential problem... you think it doesn't matter or has it been solve?

Will download the node later and see how the whole thing works. I already bookmarked your site.
This looks very interesting.



BIG WINNER!
[15.00000000 BTC]


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October 25, 2019, 02:53:10 PM
Last edit: October 29, 2019, 06:59:17 PM by mprep
#29

Don't you think that single individual could run multiple idena nodes in order to cheat or something? This is a potential problem... you think it doesn't matter or has it been solve?

Will download the node later and see how the whole thing works. I already bookmarked your site.
This looks very interesting.

Individual must validate themself in order to mine coins.

The uniqueness of participants is proven by the fact that they must solve and provide the answers for flip-puzzles synchronously. A single person is not able to validate herself multiple times because of the very limited timeframe for the submission of the answers.

https://idena.io/?view=faq#faq-pop-1




Yes, I have downloaded it but I did not see the progress bar on the client. It is normal? my network speed is 10 Mbps.
I am currently at blocks 405121 and it stopped. What should I do next?
do you have a video tutorial or something like that to help us run the node?

Please check PM
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October 25, 2019, 03:42:23 PM
#30


Can you release a deb package for your Linux client? Looks like I have to compile it myself which I have to go all the stuff again that i completely forgotten how to find its dependencies but  I am interested to run a node with my old machine, maybe I can make this run the whole time while it still lives.

How much coins can we mine a day being a node?

 
                                . ██████████.
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October 25, 2019, 03:43:12 PM
#31

Don't you think that single individual could run multiple idena nodes in order to cheat or something? This is a potential problem... you think it doesn't matter or has it been solve?

Will download the node later and see how the whole thing works. I already bookmarked your site.
This looks very interesting.

Individual must validate themself in order to mine coins.

The uniqueness of participants is proven by the fact that they must solve and provide the answers for flip-puzzles synchronously. A single person is not able to validate herself multiple times because of the very limited timeframe for the submission of the answers.

https://idena.io/?view=faq#faq-pop-1


Thanks for the link. This particular one makes the whole cheating with multiple accounts question clear:
Quote
Would Mechanical Turk obliterate the validation?
If this becomes valuable, I imagine that a user will find it profitable to hire multiple people to solve captcha.

It is also possible that thousands/millions of sophisticated AI will be used to solve captcha?



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October 25, 2019, 03:49:19 PM
#32

There is the first Proof-of-Person Blockchain. No money for stake or equipment needed, just an average laptop.
You can easily join mining of the first human-centric cryptocurrency at idena.io and share your opinion.

Where to start?
1. Visit the website idena.io to learn more about Idena.
2. Download and install the Idena Node and Idena Client executable files at  https://idena.io/?view=download or build them from source at https://github.com/idena-network.
3. Subscribe to the Idena Announcements channel at https://t.me/IdenaAnnouncements to follow updates.
4. Request an invitation code here or
in the Idena Telegram chat at https://t.me/IdenaNetworkPublic or
in the Discord: https://discord.gg/egaWtsf
5. Make sure your node is synchronized, and activate the invitation code. Check your identity status; it should be "Candidate". The invitation can not be activated in last 5 minutes before the validation.
6. Learn how to solve flips: read the article in our blog  https://medium.com/idena/how-to-prove-your-identity-anonymously-919bdfe5249a and test yourself https://flips.idena.io/?pass=idena.io

How to get validated?
1. Check the next validation time in the Idena app or at the website.
2. Your node must be fully synchronized before the session starts.
3. Your computer time must be synchronized with the internet time.
4. Solve the flips during the validation session. Be agile. The first 5 flips must be submitted in less than 2 minutes.

What's next?
1. Once your identity is validated, keep your node up and running in order to mine coins.
2. Learn how to create flips. Don't forget to create three fips  before the next validation in advance. Schedule your next validation.
Proof of person 🤔 sounds weird. That's how gym reward a crappie project, came up with proof of exercise (POE). I hope this one won't be a total mess also. Well, we keep learning so I will like to know more about this proof of person algorithm. POW and POS are the algorithms I'm used to.

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October 27, 2019, 09:55:38 PM
Last edit: October 29, 2019, 07:01:02 PM by mprep
#33

Can you release a deb package for your Linux client? Looks like I have to compile it myself which I have to go all the stuff again that i completely forgotten how to find its dependencies but  I am interested to run a node with my old machine, maybe I can make this run the whole time while it still lives.

Sorry, we don't release builds of Idena Client for the Linux yet.
In order to build the client from source code you'd need the following:
1. install npm
2. get the source code from the github release
3. npm install
4. npm run start

How much coins can we mine a day being a node?

There are 51,840 DNA coins are minted per day maximum. 50% is mined while producing the blocks. The rest of the coins are minted during validation sessions. The coins are distributed between all validated participants.
https://idena.io/?view=faq#faq-economy-2



It is also possible that thousands/millions of sophisticated AI will be used to solve captcha?

Hopefully this will answer the question:
https://medium.com/idena/ai-resistant-captchas-are-they-really-possible-760ac5065bae



Announcement
Please doublecheck the time of next validation in Idena app
If you had the clocks change to the winter time this weekend in your country then the validation time for you will be shifted for 1 hour

The validation time is always fixed at 13:30 UTC
Idena app displays the proper validation time for your local time zone


Idena Node version 0.13.2 is available
Changes:
- Validation session critical bug fix (false late submission)
The update is highly recommended for the successful validation:
https://idena.io/?view=download

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October 28, 2019, 02:14:29 AM
#34

Announcement
Please doublecheck the time of next validation in Idena app
If you had the clocks change to the winter time this weekend in your country then the validation time for you will be shifted for 1 hour

The validation time is always fixed at 13:30 UTC
Idena app displays the proper validation time for your local time zone


Idena Node version 0.13.2 is available
Changes:
- Validation session critical bug fix (false late submission)
The update is highly recommended for the successful validation:
https://idena.io/?view=download



i been trying to get validated for a week+, never seems to work and just eats way too much bandwidth sitting open fully synced
im just gonna uninstall this, i cant just sit and watch a wallet 24 hours a day for a captcha to pop up, someone sent me an invite code, why is that not enough?
you guys really should have thought this through...

 
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October 28, 2019, 04:29:27 AM
#35

Interesting. Watching to see how the POP plays out.

USE CASE is necessary. You are at the point of a truly fair distribution IF this ends up working, but even if successful at distribution of coins, and keeping the network running, what is it all for?

What am I missing here??

Very interesting start. We need new ideas in the space really bad
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October 28, 2019, 04:37:55 AM
Last edit: October 29, 2019, 07:01:31 PM by mprep
#36

i been trying to get validated for a week+, never seems to work and just eats way too much bandwidth sitting open fully synced
im just gonna uninstall this,

Did you try to use lowpower parameter to run the node? This should help for you:
https://idena.io/?view=guide#guide-issues-1

i cant just sit and watch a wallet 24 hours a day for a captcha to pop up

You can close the wallet if you don't want to mine the coins all the time.
You need to appear online at the certain time and solve 5 flips in less than 2 minutes to validate yourself.
Just make sure your node is fully synchronized right before the validation.

someone sent me an invite code, why is that not enough?
you guys really should have thought this through...

No, unfortunately that's not enough. The invitation itself can not guarantee that one person has only one address.
If someone can send you multiple invitations then you can have multiple accounts. Then you can issue more invitations for yourself and thus grow millions of fake accounts.

Just look at the facebook struggling with billions of fake accounts:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/niallmccarthy/2019/05/24/facebook-deleted-more-than-2-billion-fake-accounts-in-the-first-quarter-of-the-year-infographic/#7efd1f767e30


 






USE CASE is necessary. You are at the point of a truly fair distribution IF this ends up working, but even if successful at distribution of coins, and keeping the network running, what is it all for?

What am I missing here??

Idena blockchain formalizes people so there might be use cases that we can not anticipate yet. But there are some issues that hopefully POP may address:
1. Fair voting and the governance. The hardest issue in the blockchain space is how to establish democratic decision making.
2. Concentration issue. There are 3 mining pools conrtol 51% of the Bitcoin hashrate. Bitcoin mining is concentrated in one area. 80% of the hashrate is located in China. Ethereum PoS will not change the game. The initial wealth of is in few hands. 70% of ETH was premined. 53% of ETH owned by 400 wallets.
3. Blockchain scalability issue. Running multiple shard-chains is not safe when the stake is concentrated.






Validation is starting. Get ready!



Validation report is available

85 identities are validated: https://scan.idena.io/validation?epoch=16

192 flips where created before the validation: https://scan.idena.io/validation?epoch=16#flips
- 180 flips are qualified
- 7 flips did not reach consensus about the right answer and were disqualified
- 5 flips reached a weak consensus about the right answer

Validation rewards paid to participants: https://scan.idena.io/rewards?epoch=16
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October 28, 2019, 03:22:17 PM
#37

-snip-
2. Learn how to create flips. Don't forget to create three fips  before the next validation in advance. Schedule your next validation.
There's an error in the OP, I guess it should be flips  Roll Eyes just saying.
Looks quite interesting, I think I will try this out, can have my invite code PM'ed here?
Are those invite codes, the only method for keeping nodes unique or the system is also looking at IP addresses, stuff like that?

 
                                . ██████████.
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October 28, 2019, 04:59:15 PM
#38

i am proud that i finally found the time to make it three times in a row to the validation time window without beeing terminated Wink  



Idena blockchain formalizes people so there might be use cases that we can not anticipate yet. But there are some issues that hopefully POP may address:
1. Fair voting and the governance. The hardest issue in the blockchain space is how to establish democratic decision making.
2. Concentration issue. There are 3 mining pools conrtol 51% of the Bitcoin hashrate. Bitcoin mining is concentrated in one area. 80% of the hashrate is located in China. Ethereum PoS will not change the game. The initial wealth of is in few hands. 70% of ETH was premined. 53% of ETH owned by 400 wallets.


Sounds good, but... - how can you be sure that those new PoP-Accounts dont concentrate all in the same fabric halls in china again?  Or - more likely when it comes to cost of human work - this time in nigeria or other countries known for their strong "airdrop mafia", monopolizing multiple accounts which are keeped alive by random third world workers from the street?

Those kind of bad actors allready seem to have killed mannabase.com (a centralized so called cryptoubi-project of 2016/2017, lacking sybil restistance) with thousands of fake-accounts, even while mannabase was worth nearly nothing on fiat exchange.

Ubic.network has different interesting approach to avoid sybil attacks, using proof of e-passport and thereby proof of nationality - maybe you could distribute your idena-PoP more globaly, using something like UBIC as an optional second layer?



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October 28, 2019, 05:04:27 PM
#39

Is there anything the mined coins can be used for? What's the economy behind the coin? Why should anyone actually *use* Idena?
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October 28, 2019, 05:35:09 PM
Last edit: October 29, 2019, 07:03:27 PM by mprep
#40

-snip-
2. Learn how to create flips. Don't forget to create three fips  before the next validation in advance. Schedule your next validation.
There's an error in the OP, I guess it should be flips  Roll Eyes just saying.
Looks quite interesting, I think I will try this out, can have my invite code PM'ed here?
Are those invite codes, the only method for keeping nodes unique or the system is also looking at IP addresses, stuff like that?

Invitation code sent. Please check your PM.
Invitation code itself doesn’t make your node unique. It allows you to take part in the online validation party.
If you manage to solve flips in time your node becomes validated as unique.



i am proud that i finally found the time to make it three times in a row to the validation time window without beeing terminated Wink 
Congrats!!

Sounds good, but... - how can you be sure that those new PoP-Accounts dont concentrate all in the same fabric halls in china again?  Or - more likely when it comes to cost of human work - this time in nigeria or other countries known for their strong "airdrop mafia", monopolizing multiple accounts which are keeped alive by random third world workers from the street?
Those kind of bad actors allready seem to have killed mannabase.com (a centralized so called cryptoubi-project of 2016/2017, lacking sybil restistance) with thousands of fake-accounts, even while mannabase was worth nearly nothing on fiat exchange.

Bitcoin has a strong economic incentive to concentrate mining in the areas with cheap electricity. This makes other players leave.
Essentially there is no equal access to mining. The fact is the mining is the closed club both for PoW and PoS.

In contrast PoP allows for the equal access to minining.
Nothing else is needed to prove your humanness and uniqness.

You're right, there is no way to fight against fabric halls in China. But good news is the bad actors can only grow extensively. They have to coordinate more and more workers at the same place at the same time. Coordination costs might grow nonlineral.

Ubic.network has different interesting approach to avoid sybil attacks, using proof of e-passport and thereby proof of nationality - maybe you could distribute your idena-PoP more globaly, using something like UBIC as an optional second layer?

Crypto UBI is one of the possible use cases for Idena since the list of validated participants is shared on the blockchain.
Any centralized service can use it for its purposes.




Is there anything the mined coins can be used for? What's the economy behind the coin? Why should anyone actually *use* Idena?

Idena democritizes mining: any person on the planet (who able to solve flips) can mine the coins.

But what is the economy behind the coin?

Consider the use case of Sybil-protected maketing on the blockchain
1. Assume that Idena participants voluntarily agree to consume ads published on the blockchain by an advertiser.
2. However such an advertiser has to burn coins in order to reach a certain group of users attention.
3. Burnt coins are removed from the total supply. Thus multiple advertisers competing with each others will always have a shortage of coins.
4. Due to that assumption the newly minted coins which are equaly distributed amoung the people and can be sold to advertisers.
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October 29, 2019, 09:27:08 AM
#41

Idena democritizes mining: any person on the planet (who able to solve flips) can mine the coins.

But what is the economy behind the coin?

Consider the use case of Sybil-protected maketing on the blockchain
1. Assume that Idena participants voluntarily agree to consume ads published on the blockchain by an advertiser.
2. However such an advertiser has to burn coins in order to reach a certain group of users attention.
3. Burnt coins are removed from the total supply. Thus multiple advertisers competing with each others will always have a shortage of coins.
4. Due to that assumption the newly minted coins which are equaly distributed amoung the people and can be sold to advertisers.


So you mine coins by watching ads and solving captchas?

And why would you democratize earnings by burning coins from advertisers rather than paying them to consumers of ads?
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October 29, 2019, 01:58:53 PM
#42

So you mine coins by watching ads and solving captchas?
No, you don't have to watch ads to mine the coins.
Watching ads is the possible way to bring demand for the coin into the Sybil protected network.

And why would you democratize earnings by burning coins from advertisers rather than paying them to consumers of ads?

Unfortunately it might not work. There is no way to prove the ads consumtion without establishing a trust. People may click ads without intention to consume it. Advertizer may also decline to pay for the ads consumption.
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November 01, 2019, 02:18:27 PM
#43

OK so I'm an official Idena newbie now, one epoch old  Cheesy
Must say that initial process is quite fun and not all that hard to grasp.
I have this one concern though; what happens if some douchebag starts to create completely nonsensical captchas, on purpose of course? Is there any fail safe against this? Would be a shame if someone was surprised by impossible captcha from the day one. 

 
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November 01, 2019, 02:32:33 PM
#44

Announcement
Please doublecheck the time of next validation in Idena app
If you had the clocks change to the winter time this weekend in your country then the validation time for you will be shifted for 1 hour

The validation time is always fixed at 13:30 UTC
Idena app displays the proper validation time for your local time zone


Idena Node version 0.13.2 is available
Changes:
- Validation session critical bug fix (false late submission)
The update is highly recommended for the successful validation:
https://idena.io/?view=download



i been trying to get validated for a week+, never seems to work and just eats way too much bandwidth sitting open fully synced
im just gonna uninstall this, i cant just sit and watch a wallet 24 hours a day for a captcha to pop up, someone sent me an invite code, why is that not enough?
you guys really should have thought this through...

Actually, that is one major problem that I am seeing here. Along the way, users will get tired of validating themselves and waiting for the exact time of this session. They might forgot later on that they have this app running and check for the next validating session. Sorry, but I think this is not a sustainable approach to retain your users. Let us see how many users  will continue to support this after 6 months of using this app.

 
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November 03, 2019, 12:23:16 PM
#45

Announcement
Please doublecheck the time of next validation in Idena app
If you had the clocks change to the winter time this weekend in your country then the validation time for you will be shifted for 1 hour

The validation time is always fixed at 13:30 UTC
Idena app displays the proper validation time for your local time zone


Idena Node version 0.13.2 is available
Changes:
- Validation session critical bug fix (false late submission)
The update is highly recommended for the successful validation:
https://idena.io/?view=download



i been trying to get validated for a week+, never seems to work and just eats way too much bandwidth sitting open fully synced
im just gonna uninstall this, i cant just sit and watch a wallet 24 hours a day for a captcha to pop up, someone sent me an invite code, why is that not enough?
you guys really should have thought this through...

Actually, that is one major problem that I am seeing here. Along the way, users will get tired of validating themselves and waiting for the exact time of this session. They might forgot later on that they have this app running and check for the next validating session. Sorry, but I think this is not a sustainable approach to retain your users. Let us see how many users  will continue to support this after 6 months of using this app.
It also seems to me that such verification will bother users. Moreover, there is a human fact where you can forget about the verification or not be near the computer in time.But Iím still interested in what will come of it and I will participate.

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November 04, 2019, 02:56:01 PM
#46

Quote
OK so I'm an official Idena newbie now, one epoch old  Cheesy
Must say that initial process is quite fun and not all that hard to grasp.
I have this one concern though; what happens if some douchebag starts to create completely nonsensical captchas, on purpose of course? Is there any fail safe against this? Would be a shame if someone was surprised by impossible captcha from the day one.

The correct answers are not predefined. There is no concensus in solving such senseless captchas, they are not qualified and thus excluded from the validation score. https://idena.io/?view=faq#faq-flip-creation-4


Quote
Actually, that is one major problem that I am seeing here. Along the way, users will get tired of validating themselves and waiting for the exact time of this session. They might forgot later on that they have this app running and check for the next validating session. Sorry, but I think this is not a sustainable approach to retain your users. Let us see how many users  will continue to support this after 6 months of using this app.

Quote
It also seems to me that such verification will bother users. Moreover, there is a human fact where you can forget about the verification or not be near the computer in time.But Iím still interested in what will come of it and I will participate.

The time between validations is a function of the network size. The bigger the network the less frequent validations. Will a validation once in three months be too much? Some people will be always more motivated than others to spend their time validating themselves and mining. Participants' motivation will also grow with the growth of the Idena coin valuation.
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November 04, 2019, 03:33:39 PM
#47

Will a validation once in three months be too much?
I think that validation every 7days is perfectly fine. Firs of all, it is meant for those who want to mine the coin, right?
To be able to simply use it, send it and trade it, one does not have to be validated. So there is no absolute need for people to take part in one, weekly event, that only lasts an hour, to accept DNA as payments etc. Those who complain about validation are either lazy and want to take profit, for doing absolutely nothing or where rejected during the validation (mindless zombies?)  Roll Eyes .
It's like running a mining rig, you just don't turn it on and count free money, it requires at lest some dedication and supervision over the process. OP don't bother with non constructive critiques, this is cool project, with loads of potential.

Now, could you make the node window to hide itself in to tray, like the client app does? More of an aesthetic issue but seem important, no body will like to stare at this nameless icon all day.

 
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November 05, 2019, 09:31:04 PM
#48

Very interesting concept. I can remember human mining has been done before where humans have to solve puzzles. I just cannot remember when but a few years back. I will try and look for it. I find it very interesting to see what methods people come up with to finish the phrase "proof of ..." in the never ending pursuit of fairness. Mining from scratch with PoW is unfair. Distributing fairly for PoS is also difficult. Human mining can be fair if you can make it immune against bots. Perhaps the validation activities you do will counter the bots.

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November 11, 2019, 07:07:22 AM
#49

I have a small question, is there a minimum hardware system requirement for the node and client to install on the VPS server ?

 
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November 11, 2019, 08:05:05 AM
#50

I constantly forget to do the validation. So i guess i have to but this from exchanges as it seems easier solution when ever it hits into them.
Or is this traded OTC in somewhere and if so, what's the market cap right now?

 
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November 13, 2019, 06:41:45 PM
#51

@AndrewIdena

I must admit your responses are impressive.

Definitely following the progress of this
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November 14, 2019, 06:51:32 PM
Last edit: November 18, 2019, 11:20:03 AM by AndrewIdena
Merited by poptok1 (1)
#52



Now, could you make the node window to hide itself in to tray, like the client app does? More of an aesthetic issue but seem important, no body will like to stare at this nameless icon all day.


Working at it.

I have a small question, is there a minimum hardware system requirement for the node and client to install on the VPS server ?

Please check here https://idena.io/?view=guide#guide-remote-0

I constantly forget to do the validation. So i guess i have to but this from exchanges as it seems easier solution when ever it hits into them.
Or is this traded OTC in somewhere and if so, what's the market cap right now?

Check OTC local room of the Idena community channel https://discord.gg/cyWs66H

Validation starts in less than 2 hours

❗️Make sure you have Wait for validation status displayed in app. Otherwise please submit 3 flips or activate the invitation code.

Please don't forget to update your Idena client before the validation: The latest version is 0.0.49.
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November 16, 2019, 04:20:39 PM
#53


watching  Cool


Bitcoin.Barcelona - @BTCbarcelona 
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November 16, 2019, 04:21:03 PM
#54

Very interesting concept. I can remember human mining has been done before where humans have to solve puzzles. I just cannot remember when but a few years back. I will try and look for it. I find it very interesting to see what methods people come up with to finish the phrase "proof of ..." in the never ending pursuit of fairness. Mining from scratch with PoW is unfair. Distributing fairly for PoS is also difficult. Human mining can be fair if you can make it immune against bots. Perhaps the validation activities you do will counter the bots.



You're thinking of Raiblocks which is now Nano.
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November 16, 2019, 04:40:38 PM
#55

I constantly forget to do the validation. So i guess i have to but this from exchanges as it seems easier solution when ever it hits into them.
Or is this traded OTC in somewhere and if so, what's the market cap right now?

Simple thing would be to set simple alarm reminder, that is once every five days at the moment.
There is no exchanges yet. There is OTC in discord.
You still need to be validated to mine it.

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November 17, 2019, 03:19:19 AM
#56

This reminds me of Nano where you had to solve captchas to mine the coin. NANO is doing pretty well market cap wise, so maybe Idena will be a big success!

So the primary use case for Idena is for marketers/advertisers to reach users and solicit data?
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November 17, 2019, 12:34:30 PM
#57

I  see the next validation in 4 days according to the website. As a 1st timer, does that mean I"ll have to wait for  4 days to start mining?

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November 17, 2019, 12:50:08 PM
Last edit: November 17, 2019, 01:03:00 PM by alamin99
#58

Looking very interesting to me. Grin

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November 17, 2019, 01:12:18 PM
#59

I  see the next validation in 4 days according to the website. As a 1st timer, does that mean I"ll have to wait for  4 days to start mining?
if you have passed the validation, no need to wait, turn on the online mining function and start earning  Wink

I have a small question, is there a minimum hardware system requirement for the node and client to install on the VPS server ?

Please check here https://idena.io/?view=guide#guide-remote-0

Thanks for the answer ! I read, but apparently missed this

 
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November 17, 2019, 01:16:23 PM
#60

I  see the next validation in 4 days according to the website. As a 1st timer, does that mean I"ll have to wait for  4 days to start mining?
if you have passed the validation, no need to wait, turn on the online mining function and start earning  Wink
I've just downloaded the latest node and the windows client and the client is currently synchronizing with the network. I've not even received my invitation code, hence asked if I need to wait till the next validation shown on the website.

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November 17, 2019, 01:23:07 PM
#61

I  see the next validation in 4 days according to the website. As a 1st timer, does that mean I"ll have to wait for  4 days to start mining?
if you have passed the validation, no need to wait, turn on the online mining function and start earning  Wink
I've just downloaded the latest node and the windows client and the client is currently synchronizing with the network. I've not even received my invitation code, hence asked if I need to wait till the next validation shown on the website.

In this case, you must pass the validation first ,then you can enable the mining function  Wink

 
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November 17, 2019, 07:39:25 PM
#62

What does this mean "Proof-of-Person"? Does this means that we can mineyour coins with laptop but just one laptop per person and we need to do a KYC?

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November 17, 2019, 08:35:00 PM
#63

What does this mean "Proof-of-Person"? Does this means that we can mineyour coins with laptop but just one laptop per person and we need to do a KYC?
There is no KYC in this project. No personal data is necessary to start "mining" with your laptop.
Of course if you disregard your IP as personal data. System is designed this way that typically, only one person can get verified on one particular machine at a specific time. Will it prove itself sealed against abusers, time will tell but so far it works quite alright.

 
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November 18, 2019, 04:30:22 PM
#64

This is really a great idea. But how do I know it's legit and what will you be responsible for in the long run?
And where will your income come from? Hope to receive your reply soon. thanks

 
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November 18, 2019, 06:27:32 PM
#65


Invitations are needed to minimize the probability of a Sybil attack.
https://idena.io/?view=invitation#



this was one of the things that i liked
ive been happy to run a node for a week or two here so far, seems interesting idea
give this some time i will, see how it goes Smiley


Sounds good =)
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November 20, 2019, 06:06:27 PM
#66

This is really a great idea. But how do I know it's legit and what will you be responsible for in the long run?
And where will your income come from? Hope to receive your reply soon. thanks

Idena is an open source project: https://github.com/orgs/idena-network/

You can read about Idena coin minting and foundation payouts here: https://idena.io/?view=faq#faq-economy-3

This reminds me of Nano where you had to solve captchas to mine the coin. NANO is doing pretty well market cap wise, so maybe Idena will be a big success!

So the primary use case for Idena is for marketers/advertisers to reach users and solicit data?

Idena formalizes people on the blockchain so there might be use cases that we can not anticipate yet: democratic voting in online communities or bot-protected marketing, free speech platforms without abuse and other projects that need privacy-preserving authentication.
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November 21, 2019, 09:23:42 AM
Last edit: November 21, 2019, 12:55:01 PM by Tytanowy Janusz
Merited by poptok1 (1)
#67

I support this project for last month by mining/inviting/answering questions on telegram/bumping this thread/talking about it on BTT on my local board. But there is one thing that is bothering me and my local community about IDENA. It's the amount of tokens that was premint.



36 000 000 coins...

Daily distribution is equal to 51 840 coins. It means that community will have more coins than IDENA team after 700 DAYS !
Currently IDENA team have more than 82% of supply- after 20 epoch (100 days of mining)
Community will have more than 80% of coins (healthy situation) after 7,6 years.

Don't get me wrong. I appreciate your work and i agree that you should be fairly rewarded but in my opinion current situation will scare every possible investor away.

I'm not saying that you should burn part of those coins (in fact that would be the best for community, but as I already said I agree that You should be fairly rewarded). I'm saying that You should reconsider locking 50-80% of those coin for next 2 year. In my opinion it will show your commitment, faith in the future of the project, decrease circulating supply, what will increase listing price and financial motivation for community to become node (faster project grow).

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|ROULETTE
MINES
TOWERS
DICE
CRASH
──── ─── ─
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November 21, 2019, 09:34:15 AM
#68

-snip-
reconsider locking 50-80% of those coin for next 2 year. In my opinion it will show your commitment, faith in the future of the project, decrease circulating supply, what will increase listing price and financial motivation for community to become node (faster project grow).
I'm also supporting this idea presented by Tytanowy Janusz.
AndrewIdena please consider and consult this proposal with your team, as the well-being of this project is not without meaning to all of us. I would say that burning or locking 50% of this really big pre-mine, should suffice as a token of being a serious dev. Good image is sometimes more valuable than money and in the long run... who knows Smiley   

 
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November 21, 2019, 01:05:01 PM
#69


I'm not saying that you should burn part of those coins (in fact that would be the best for community, but as I already said I agree that You should be fairly rewarded). I'm saying that You should reconsider locking 50-80% of those coin for next 2 year. In my opinion it will show your commitment, faith in the future of the project, decrease circulating supply, what will increase listing price and financial motivation for community to become node (faster project grow).


I'm also supporting this idea presented by Tytanowy Janusz.
AndrewIdena please consider and consult this proposal with your team, as the well-being of this project is not without meaning to all of us. I would say that burning or locking 50% of this really big pre-mine, should suffice as a token of being a serious dev. Good image is sometimes more valuable than money and in the long run... who knows Smiley   

The project roadmap is quite substantial. Idena has had no coin offering. We are considering various options of Idena development funding, so most of the coins are reserved. We believe that the proportion of the premint and mining is healthy compared to most crypto projects.
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November 22, 2019, 08:50:53 PM
#70


I'm not saying that you should burn part of those coins (in fact that would be the best for community, but as I already said I agree that You should be fairly rewarded). I'm saying that You should reconsider locking 50-80% of those coin for next 2 year. In my opinion it will show your commitment, faith in the future of the project, decrease circulating supply, what will increase listing price and financial motivation for community to become node (faster project grow).


I'm also supporting this idea presented by Tytanowy Janusz.
AndrewIdena please consider and consult this proposal with your team, as the well-being of this project is not without meaning to all of us. I would say that burning or locking 50% of this really big pre-mine, should suffice as a token of being a serious dev. Good image is sometimes more valuable than money and in the long run... who knows Smiley   

The project roadmap is quite substantial. Idena has had no coin offering. We are considering various options of Idena development funding, so most of the coins are reserved. We believe that the proportion of the premint and mining is healthy compared to most crypto projects.

I hope that you will use your premine in your actual developments and not for your team's gain in the future.
People are hesitant because they have seen countless projects that are promising not to touch their holdings.
But later on, when the price is doing good, they will suddenly dump their coins and be gone.
So having a detailed roadmap is not an assurance that you will stop at some point.
But then good luck to your project and hopefully will last longer as compared to your contemporaries.

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November 22, 2019, 10:02:43 PM
Last edit: November 22, 2019, 10:17:09 PM by contraband
#71

  Depends on the teams credibility and ability.

What credibility does the team have and what is their past experience?

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November 25, 2019, 10:24:23 AM
Last edit: November 25, 2019, 10:57:12 AM by AndrewIdena
#72

 Depends on the teams credibility and ability.

What credibility does the team have and what is their past experience?



Idena is built by an anonymous group of computer scientists with extensive experience in launching large-scale blockchain infrastructure projects.

The project is fully open source. You can review the code on the github: https://github.com/idena-network   
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November 25, 2019, 11:25:38 AM
#73

You have any idea when whitepaper will be published although this idea sounds great. The link buttons on the official website is not working properly they need your attention kindly fix this issue and make it working.

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November 25, 2019, 06:03:40 PM
#74

Idena Node version 0.14.0 is available

Changes:
1. Block proposing mechanism improvement reducing the network traffic
2. Node synchronization improvements
3. Burning transactions support
4. Identity profile data support
5. Consensus protocol improvements
6. Flips distribution protocol improvement
7. Peering improvements during the validation session
8. Bugs fix

This is a fork. The miner status is deactivated for all nodes: please activate
All balances and identity states are saved

❗️Update is required. The older version is not supported

Please update:
https://idena.io/?view=download
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November 26, 2019, 06:03:05 PM
#75

Idena Node version 0.14.0 is available -snip-
I must say that recent update is quite an improvement.
Client uses 50Mb less RAM and the processor usage dropped about 2-3%.
That's definitely impressive these days. Hope you will follow this path Smiley
O and BTW, consider this 50% pre-mint lock once more. Or maybe just promise you wont dump 100%, the day some exchange will list DNA? Pretty please Roll Eyes For the sake of long term and HODL philosophy!

 
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November 28, 2019, 10:16:47 AM
#76

10% more nodes in a matter of 5 days (130-144) one day after hard fork (great one BTW). You guys doing great work. 20 next epoch and we will see 1000 nodes if we will continue to grow that fast Smiley

Now back to the economy of coin...
We are considering various options of Idena development funding, so most of the coins are reserved.

According to whitepaper only 6,48M out of 36M (18%) coins are reserved. That is not "most of the coins". Rest of them are just rewards for core team/founders/seed investors (by the way did you found seed investors and paid them with DNA or those 9,72M are also reserved founds for future investors/project development?)

Idena has had no coin offering.

That's a point for you in (community coins) vs (team coin) ratio case. But to be honest, from investor perspective seeing coin with such economy on my exchange i would think what is better:
1- coin with 44M supply 36M preminted in hands of team and 8M mined by community
2- coin with 44M supply 36M preminted 30M sold in ICO, 6M in hands of team locked for 2 years, 8M mined by community.

I'm not sure but second option guarantee that supply is more decentralized, coin is better priced (38M tokens are being traded out of 44M) and its supply won't be multiplied by 5 in one night after one person decide to dump. Second option seems to be safer for me as secondary market investor. That's why i still think that 80% in hands of team now and 50% after 700 days will scare every investor away and i do agree with poptok1

O and BTW, consider this 50% pre-mint lock once more. Or maybe just promise you wont dump 100%, the day some exchange will list DNA? Pretty please Roll Eyes For the sake of long term and HODL philosophy!





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November 28, 2019, 01:52:36 PM
#77


The problem with this kind of premine are forks and clones.

Don't get me wrong, I love the Idena idea and implementation, and I think devs should be paid. This is a work. And Idena is really original and is working now. It is not a concept.
But soon (when the alt community react to this great coin) I predict someone will fork the project with 0 premine. And this will be a challenge for Idena.

Other solution would be implementing a DAO with the nodes as a masternodes and some percentage of the reward of the blockchain for development. This would be the ideal solution IMO.


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November 29, 2019, 01:20:35 PM
#78


The problem with this kind of premine are forks and clones.

Don't get me wrong, I love the Idena idea and implementation, and I think devs should be paid. This is a work. And Idena is really original and is working now. It is not a concept.
But soon (when the alt community react to this great coin) I predict someone will fork the project with 0 premine. And this will be a challenge for Idena.

Other solution would be implementing a DAO with the nodes as a masternodes and some percentage of the reward of the blockchain for development. This would be the ideal solution IMO.

It will not because who wants a copy instead of the orginal? How well are those bitcoin, monero, ethereum forks doing. It would only be very bullish to see forks of Idena in the future.
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November 29, 2019, 02:08:02 PM
#79


Monero is just a fork of Bytecoin without the premine


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November 30, 2019, 02:54:28 AM
#80

I read in the IDENA FAQ that the total supply of IDENA is not limited. Why do you make IDENA coins is not limited? wouldn't it be better if the total supply was limited.

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December 02, 2019, 12:13:23 PM
#81

I really wish I could love the project.
I tried.
I tried hard.
But the constant re-evaluation got on my nerves really fast.

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December 02, 2019, 06:25:15 PM
#82

I really wish I could love the project.
I tried.
I tried hard.
But the constant re-evaluation got on my nerves really fast.

You didn't try hard enough then, you just have to validate your node once a week. How hard is that for free coins?  Cool
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December 03, 2019, 08:40:29 AM
#83

I read in the IDENA FAQ that the total supply of IDENA is not limited. Why do you make IDENA coins is not limited? wouldn't it be better if the total supply was limited.

There are constant of 51 840 IDENA coins being distributed daily. Current circulating supply is equal to 44 934 700 what gives us 52k x 365 / 45M = 42% inflation annually ... pretty much but let's take a look at that after 10 years.

circulation supply 234 150 700 and still the same 52k coins daily what gives us 8% inflation. It's still not what average crypto enthusiast is looking for BUT ...

1-" Miners get 10% of transaction fees, 90% of the fees are burnt. "
2- ~5-20% of minted coins are being burned due to mining penalty, stake loss due to 2 wrong validations in a row
3- even more coin will be burned due to penalties (f.e shitty flips) and due to IDENA showing its real world value:
"100% of ad payments will be burnt"


So IDENA supply is not limited but if project will succeed I believe that it will reach max supply one day and due to amount of coins being burned the total supply will start to decrease.

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Apened
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December 03, 2019, 10:42:27 AM
#84

This is really a new project for me i haven't heard a Prrof of person blockchain before and upon reading it its nice butni have some questions how about it usage is it going to run only by that as it must have its use. I want to know in a simplest way why they chose PoP work and so its advantages over Pos and Pow.

 
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cri79pop
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December 03, 2019, 10:50:01 AM
#85

36 million premine to 0.1$ price at this moment(i asked to buy from team and they offer me DNA to 0.1$) means 3,6 million . I think is too much for a project like this. So it is a sign of scam for me. DYOR!
solosequenosenada
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December 03, 2019, 02:55:38 PM
#86

This is really a new project for me i haven't heard a Prrof of person blockchain before and upon reading it its nice butni have some questions how about it usage is it going to run only by that as it must have its use. I want to know in a simplest way why they chose PoP work and so its advantages over Pos and Pow.

Proof of person

The Idena network allows for a proof of humanity and proof of uniqueness for its participants. We call it Proof-of-Person (PoP). Idena does not require any personal data sharing, does not reveal a personís identity, and does not need a third-party identification center. Idena is based on a network of people mutually validating their humanness and uniqueness. How is it possible?


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reb0rn21
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December 03, 2019, 07:29:27 PM
#87

36 million premine to 0.1$ price at this moment(i asked to buy from team and they offer me DNA to 0.1$) means 3,6 million . I think is too much for a project like this. So it is a sign of scam for me. DYOR!

pls go buy some chines scam you have 99.999999% of them with billions of premine CKB, etc
if you think some should sell you blockchain project which is build from zero and not cloned as 99.99% shitcoins?
And if you think its a scam why did you even ask to buy all the premined coins

you have active OTC but no you want to buy all cheap, LOL

Dual mine Zilliqa pool with any other POW coin: http://rudnik.hopto.org:5000/
cri79pop
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December 04, 2019, 01:04:42 PM
#88

36 million premine to 0.1$ price at this moment(i asked to buy from team and they offer me DNA to 0.1$) means 3,6 million . I think is too much for a project like this. So it is a sign of scam for me. DYOR!

pls go buy some chines scam you have 99.999999% of them with billions of premine CKB, etc
if you think some should sell you blockchain project which is build from zero and not cloned as 99.99% shitcoins?
And if you think its a scam why did you even ask to buy all the premined coins

you have active OTC but no you want to buy all cheap, LOL
i did not ask to buy all, i asked buy 2000 euro value. If you think a project like this worth 3,6 million just premine have to be crazy or part of team.  Wink
poptok1
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December 04, 2019, 01:28:51 PM
#89

i did not ask to buy all, i asked buy 2000 euro value. If you think a project like this worth 3,6 million just premine have to be crazy or part of team.  Wink
Usually merchandise is worth exactly what buyer is ready to pay for it so, it is hard to determine the exact value here.
You are somewhat right, that 3.6 million is kinda overpriced but it is like that only when it comes to ordinary people like us.
Somewhere out there, there maybe a person willing to pay this much, we can't deny devs the right to do whatever they please with their work, right? Question of ethics, morality of such action is yet another pair of shoes. If you still willing to buy, just post your OTC offer here. I'm more than sure you will find more reasonable propositions among supporters, heck I even consider your offer myself.    

 
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December 04, 2019, 03:33:20 PM
#90

While there is a testnet, I think it's too early to seriously talk about any price on the coin will be the official launch of the mainnet and will then be seen  Wink

 
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