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Author Topic: [2019-10-24] Lightning Network User Reportedly Loses 4 Bitcoin: What Happened  (Read 367 times)
malevolent
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October 28, 2019, 04:45:17 AM
Merited by vapourminer (1)
 #21

no, I think that was slush's pool that returned the accidental 100 BTC transaction fee (the original thread was here on Bitcointalk, cannot remember when though). P2pool would've been a nightmare to get overpaid fees refunded, there were usually 100-200 payouts per block, where the 50 or 25 BTC reward (don't think p2pool survived past 12.5 BTC) got paid to that many addresses. They'd all have to have been paying attention (and be sympathetic to the mistake too) to refund it all! Slush's pool is still pretty big last I checked.

In 2011-2013 there were more pools that did that as such mistakes were common (I would dare say depending on the payment method employed the vast majority of pools would try to return the money), including at least one case when individual miners returned a substantial percentage of bitcoins lost to an erroneously high fee transaction from a P2Pool block. Back then most people hanged out on bitcointalk and on several freenode irc channels so it was easier to reach a large percentage of the community. I mentioned P2Pool as an extreme case, IIRC that person was lucky that several larger miners returned the extra coins they made from that block, in another case less less than 10% were recovered but there were way more miners working on that block (399) after Bitcoin has attracted a lot of people during the two rallies that year: https://old.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1syu3h/i_lost_all_my_bitcoins_in_an_erroneous/?sort=new

AFAIK there are very few cases when user send Bitcoin to wrong address or spend too much on fees and got their Bitcoin refunded.

I've heard of quite a few cases, so unless you put effort into making a well-sampled poll, you won't know what are the odds of getting the bitcoins back.

And if someone has sent bitcoins to a wrong address, that's also often rectifiable if it's someone they know well enough, or a non-scammy cryptocurrency company (exchange, gamblign website, whatever), you just have to contact them. It's not the same thing as sending to 1BitcoinEaterAddress(...).

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October 28, 2019, 04:59:57 AM
 #22

Fair point, but AFAIK those company don't bother unless big amount of money is involved (usually due to security concern) or user are forced to pay small amount of recovery fees.

Sure and that's understandable, same with making all sorts of mistakes when dealing with/sending altcoins/tokens, time is money and there's no reason for a company to waste and pay for their employees time every time someone makes a mistake and accidentally loses $20 worth of coins/tokens.

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December 01, 2019, 02:27:46 PM
 #23

New thread about this story on reddit: https://wr.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/dn5520/how_4_btc_on_the_lightning_network_is_likely_not/

Seems like there was no 4 BTC loss, as there was no penalty transactions related to this node of lightning casino on blockchain, and seems like the user can even recover his funds (if the OP is correct). If the owner would manage to recover his coins, it would be a good sign that LN technology becomes more safe and robust for users.

The guy himself made a new thread on reddit today: https://wr.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/e4gjpx/im_the_guy_who_lost_4_btc_on_lightning_network/

Great news, with the help of the community he recovered most of them already! Turns out it's not as easy to lose your coins as some people thought.
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December 03, 2019, 02:17:36 AM
 #24

@hatshepsut93. However, was the stress worth it? I reckon, no.

This might be the first lesson that introducing postponed payments on bitcoin might open it to unsound transactions because of bugs and maybe also theft.

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hatshepsut93
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December 04, 2019, 05:58:55 PM
 #25

@hatshepsut93. However, was the stress worth it? I reckon, no.

This might be the first lesson that introducing postponed payments on bitcoin might open it to unsound transactions because of bugs and maybe also theft.

Well, he wasn't just some guy who wanted to experiment with Lightning and decided to put 4 BTC on mainnet into his channels - he was running a gambling service and could/did profit from it, so the risk and stress could be justified.

And there was no bugs or theft here, the guy just used dangerous functionality, but luckily for him the funds weren't lost in the end.
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December 05, 2019, 02:53:42 AM
 #26

@hatshepsut93. That also argues for my point on postponed settlements. Something similar to theft, fraud or loss might occur because payments are not final.

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malevolent
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December 05, 2019, 03:54:48 AM
 #27

Nice to see that all ended well. Even more so considering it seemed like it wasn't a person who could afford to lose so much.

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