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Author Topic: The many accounts of korner (Bitcoin SV)  (Read 669 times)
Veleor
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December 22, 2019, 08:42:05 PM
Merited by vapourminer (1), nutildah (1)
 #21

Unfortunately trolling is subjective.  At what point does a contentious debate turn into "trolling?"

There are some recommendations from admin to identify trolls.

<...>

Habitual trolls are not welcome because they disrupt real discussion. Here are the recommendations (not policy) that I wrote for mods regarding trolls:

Trolls should be banned because they disrupt serious discussion. Identifying trolls is often difficult, however. I like to think in terms of "troll score": the higher the troll score, the more likely it is that a person is a troll. Examples of things that affect troll score:
- Having crazy positions (racism, etc.): large increase
- Posting long, well-reasoned posts: large decrease
- High posts-to-time-online ratio: small increase
- Been around for a long time: moderate decrease
- Posting many images: mild increase
- Much discussion of illegal sites: very mild increase
- Requires more moderation than is typical: moderate increase
- Using vulgarity, insults, or memes excessively: mild increase
- Posting topics with undescriptive titles: mild increase
- Seems disdainful of the Bitcoin community in general: mild increase
- Bumping old posts a lot: mild increase
- Giving people bad advice: mild increase
- Poor spelling/grammar: slight increase
- Criticizing moderation: moderate increase
- Complaining about anything: small increase
- Uses ad hominem attacks with unusual frequency: moderate increase
- Lying: moderate increase
- Inconsistent positions: moderate increase
- Posting the same arguments over and over again without bothering to respond to arguments against them: moderate increase
- Posting topics that will obviously evoke emotional responses: slight increase
- Posting replies that are themselves on-topic but which will obviously tend to bring the discussion off-topic: moderate increase
- Bumping old threads with replies that are not really worthwhile: moderate increase

None of these things alone warrant a warning, but when they occur habitually or when someone does many of them, they indicate that the poster is a troll.

Warn people who are doing many trollish things. Tell me if that doesn't help.
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December 23, 2019, 02:03:27 AM
 #22

One of the Russian moderators still takes it into consideration -- I'm not certain if this is the reason why the wex.nz account was banned, am trying to get some clarity in that thread about it:


Look at the list of his posts and you'll see why he was banned.

I'm going to guess it was the repetitive posting of a bitcoin address that didn't belong to him? Is that considered multiposting?


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December 23, 2019, 06:18:03 PM
 #23

I completely agree with your points regarding freedom of speech, but freedom of speech doesn't include freedom to disrupt and derail. I'd never dream of trying to have posts deleted or users banned simply because they are expressing unpopular opinions. The whole point of freedom of speech is protect unpopular opinions; popular opinions don't need protecting. I'm sure you've seen the relevant XKCD which explains it well.

This is argument is purely academic, and may even be off-topic some.  It does pertain to the subject of trolling, and banning, and "banning for trolling," so I'll risk continuing with it.

While true, the first amendment (and similar speech protections) apply only to the governmental authority, that doesn't mean others can't adopt a comparable approach.  If you mean this XKCD, then yes, I've seen it and I must admit I have issues with it.  The premise of the comic seems to argue that your protection to speech is only applicable to the government.  Well, what is a government?  Is it not a collection of individuals chosen to serve the common interests?  Frequently the common interest isn't commonly known or accepted.  Sometimes the minority voice is the only one speaking reason, which is why our laws protect that minority voice.  However, our laws only have the authority to protect the minority voice from the legal ramifications, not from the general public's reactions.

My main issues with that comic are cataloged in the forth pane.  The first thing written in that pane is factually wrong.  Yelling at someone can be deemed as a violation of their rights.  There are legal precedents that define it as "provocation."  Boycotts, censorship, and banishment aren't a violation of anyone's rights, but is it right?  Look at it from the perspective of someone with an unpopular opinion.  The majority starts calling for your ban, calling for a boycott of your products, forcing your publishers into cancelling your TV shows, radio shows, or podcost, and even threaten to boycott your sponsors.  Just because they don't like what you have to say.  Even if what you have to say is beneficial to the majority, or in their best interest, they don't like it and make a huge fuss to prevent you from speaking them again.

The reason I find such reactions destructive is because popular opinion has a way of becoming legislation.  It's a slippery slope.  People who react so vehemently to words with which they disagree are far more dangerous than any words ever spoken.

So lets take the discussion back to this forum; here we have a community that's common tie is financial freedom.  If you care about financial freedom you probably care about free speech, smaller governments, self reliance, and independence.  Maybe.  We have this opportunity to create a virtual civilization here on the internet where we get to put our principals to the test.  Exercise our convictions.  Can they pass the test?  As irritating and frustrating dissenting points of view can be, can we force ourselves to tolerate them for the overall benefit of liberty?


However, CH/TOAA (as an example), has literally been posting the same nonsense regarding trust/merit/gangs/inner circles/etc. for over a year now. Any thread remotely related to merit or trust, he shows up with the same wall of nonsense, and the thread is rapidly derailed. I don't know of anyone who has reasonably defended that, or possibly could, as "not trolling".

You won't catch me defending the methods, or what he has to say.  But I can't in good conscience, justify banning him for being an irritant and yes, a troll.  Speaking of CH, has anyone else noticed how quite it's been the last few days?




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December 23, 2019, 08:19:05 PM
 #24

Dipshit moved a Russian thread into Altcoins:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5152339

And locked the English BSV thread. This is typical korner shenanigans.

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December 23, 2019, 08:55:52 PM
 #25

Dipshit moved a Russian thread into Altcoins:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5152339

And locked the English BSV thread. This is typical korner shenanigans.

The last post in the locked thread points to a new thread which shows up on the first page the altcoins board.  It must have received a super-troll-bump.

Or a super-shill-bump?  Huh

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December 23, 2019, 09:26:29 PM
 #26


It's now in Off Topic (perhaps mods moved it) and all posts have been wiped. It had a few pages of Russian posts when I made that post earlier.

The last post in the locked thread points to a new thread which shows up on the first page the altcoins board.  It must have received a super-troll-bump.

Or a super-shill-bump?  Huh

Yeah he replaced the aforementioned Russian thread with a new one. He's got a sockpuppet account with a decent amount of merits, probably enough to bump to the front page: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=2708940

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January 07, 2020, 03:48:03 PM
 #27

OK, so we have a banned user now claiming to be an nChain employee (for the second time):

Sorry, but my contract with nChain not expired.

I dunno, this guy purely exists to be disruptive here. He doesn't work for nChain as he knows almost nothing about Bitcoin or BSV. He just gets a kick out of trolling. There's a couple other members like that who exist and haven't been banned. Apparently the one thing they are good at is riding the line between what the mods consider trolling and not trolling, even though everybody else considers them to be a troll. Oh well. Just thought this thread could use a bump.

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January 12, 2020, 01:43:53 PM
 #28

It would appear that the Bitcoin SV account has been temp banned as korner is now using another account, Alert!, to continue his trolling saga.

This is his first thread. Unsurprisingly, it is self-moderated:

[FAKE ANN] BitcoinFX - Thread Duplicator & Troll

Troll's profile: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=30

Duplicated ANN there: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5216304
Original ANN there: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5211986

Alert! was named as an alt of korner in the OP of this thread, and first identified by Ratimov as belonging to korner here:

Eщe oдин aльт кopнepa Alert!

Кopнep, cкoлькo ты иx yжe нaклeпaл? Cheesy

Please report him for ban evasion. I have reported him for ban evasion twice thus far. One report was marked "good" (which is encouraging) and the other is unhandled (but its been less than 12 hours, so...).

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January 12, 2020, 11:11:05 PM
 #29

@nutildah

Account reported for ban evasion. I got your back, my friend.

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January 13, 2020, 05:40:45 PM
Last edit: January 17, 2020, 09:16:53 AM by Ratimov
Merited by nutildah (2)
 #30

Hi. My list is once again confirmed that I add all the alts correctly, even without direct evidence. My methodology is based on comparing korner and his alts behavior, and it is always the same. The nicknames change, and the behavior and thinking are the same.

Quote
57 Accounts Connected:

korner                  banned
WEX-UNOFFICIAL  banned
wex.nz                  banned
Alex LZ Saver        banned
reckon                  banned
CKAMEP                banned
anna.mayzus         banned
btc-e.nz                banned
Kryptoart              
Anti Bitcoin          
Anti-Bitcoin           banned
Sara Parker          
ERC-721
tet8        
ERC-223               banned
Scamer  
Anti Scam             banned
Trollface               banned
Polizei                   banned
Skammer        
RACIB                   banned
Sorbent                banned
exp0it                  banned
Error13                 banned
Alter7                   banned
Alexey Vlasov
KraftsHerz
frnk
Kurabye
ttom777
mtgox.com
binance.com
Ethereum Classic
Bitcoin Gold
ne0n
Bitcoin Cash
Bitcoin SV
Sakasara
WORLD_EXCHANGE_SERVICES
wex.com
Alfabank
novacoin.org
Cause Rebecca         banned
infekted
Viva-E Official
Olga Buzova
STOP SCAM              banned
KOPHEP
Bordijo
VIVA-E
WEX-SCAM
Anti-DT Alliance
Virsec
Anti-Polizei
Alert!
~DefaultTrust
ProfessionReporter

Sooner or later he still gives away his alts himself, for example by supporting his ridiculous flags. So today he gave away a bunch of his alts after a statement like that:

УPAA! Hacтaлo вpeмя apмии Кopнepoв!
Bce бyдyт  зaфлaгoвaны! Moe дeлo бyдeт жить вeчнo! He бyдeт вaм чиcтoты и пopядкa! Бyдeт тoлькo xaoc и paзpyшeниe! Moй пocлeдoвaтeли - я вaми гopжycь! Taкoй мoмeнт тpoгaтeльный, aж cлeзy пycтил!
ProfessionReporter - мoлoдeц!

http://archive.md/piYEJ#selection-1569.0-1577.29

translate:
Quote
EEE! It's time for the korner's army!
Everyone will be flagged! My cause will live forever! You will not be clean and orderly! There will only be chaos and destruction! My followers, I'm proud of you! It's a touching moment, and it's a tear!
ProfessionReporter - good for you!

After that for 2 minutes the korner's flag was supported by his alts:




WEX-SCAM, KOPHEP, Anti-DT Alliance, Olga Buzova, VIVA-E, Virsec, Alex LZ Saver, Alert!, Bitcoin Cash, binance.com, Alfabank

It's a korner's alts 1000%

korner's alts put many flags on different users. Check who supports them. That's basically the korner's alts, especially if they're from a list of 57 accounts, it's probably them.

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January 13, 2020, 05:49:58 PM
 #31

Hi. My list is once again confirmed that I add all the alts correctly, even without direct evidence. My methodology is based on comparing korner and his alts behavior, and it is always the same. The nicknames change, and the behavior and thinking are the same.

...

korner's alts put many flags on different users. Check who supports them. That's basically the korner's alts, especially if they're from a list of 57 accounts, it's probably them.

Check this out, he's been talking to himself in the new Bitcoin SV thread.  Cheesy

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5211986.msg53592925#msg53592925

What a nutjob.

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January 13, 2020, 06:04:46 PM
 #32

What a nutjob.

He's now attempting to dox Ratimov. This anarcho-communist approach of letting sockpuppeting assholes evade their bans (and generally do whatever they want) has some disadvantages to put it mildly.

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January 13, 2020, 06:17:15 PM
 #33

Check this out, he's been talking to himself in the new Bitcoin SV thread.  Cheesy
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5211986.msg53592925#msg53592925

It's one of his habits, communicating with himself. All the more so in self-moderated topics. He deletes others' messages and leaves his own. All korne's alts do that. Cheesy

He's now attempting to dox Ratimov. This anarcho-communist approach of letting sockpuppeting assholes evade their bans (and generally do whatever they want) has some disadvantages to put it mildly.

I do not understand at all, he is already making a mess on the whole forum with his themes and flags, why globes will not be banned him? It's clear to everyone that is korner  Undecided

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January 13, 2020, 06:57:41 PM
 #34

I do not understand at all, he is already making a mess on the whole forum with his themes and flags, why globes will not be banned him? It's clear to everyone that is korner  Undecided

I believe the theory behind the extremely lax rule enforcement is that it's better to have an asshole go unpunished than a good person punished unjustly, but given that (a) the punishment is just a ban, not incarceration or death penalty; and (b) the sockpuppeting here is so blatantly obvious - I'm with you on this one, I don't understand it either.

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January 15, 2020, 07:31:36 PM
 #35

korner's alt - Alert! banned



This idiot is setting himself up, and nobody pays attention to him in the Russian locale. Cheesy

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January 16, 2020, 01:43:02 PM
 #36

korner's alt - Alert! banned



This idiot is setting himself up, and nobody pays attention to him in the Russian locale. Cheesy


What hasn't the KOPHEP account been banned yet? It literally spells "korner" in cyrillic, does it not?

I guess its because he's only created 4 bullshit flags, so far...

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January 16, 2020, 01:47:05 PM
 #37

korner's alt - Alert! banned



This idiot is setting himself up, and nobody pays attention to him in the Russian locale. Cheesy


Good too see ban evaders are banned again without blockchain evidence. I thought it was just a thing of past.
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January 16, 2020, 01:49:41 PM
 #38

What hasn't the KOPHEP account been banned yet? It literally spells "korner" in cyrillic, does it not?
I guess its because he's only created 4 bullshit flags, so far...


It's true. That's 100% korner's alt. By all signs and behavior. But global moderators don't seem to have enough evidence to give him a ban...

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January 16, 2020, 02:01:36 PM
 #39

I dunno, this guy purely exists to be disruptive here. He doesn't work for nChain as he knows almost nothing about Bitcoin or BSV. He just gets a kick out of trolling.

Hmmm, so one of his alts is bitcoin cash with which he posts this:

BSV - Scam. This is not Original Bitcoin. It's a fork of BCH

and then start a whole discussion with his alts:

Look how that turned out for the market.

to end with him arguing against himself...has he ever insulted himself with his alts?  Cheesy

I've never bothered with the bch and bsv trolls and I don't frequent the altcoin section other than reporting bumper but...
Is there any reason why he is doing this?
Can someone point to the moment when all this madness started and what triggered it? Was a grudge behind a red tag or what?

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January 16, 2020, 02:51:14 PM
Merited by suchmoon (7), stompix (1)
 #40

<...> Can someone point to the moment when all this madness started and what triggered it? Was a grudge behind a red tag or what?

According to the message in the Russian section, korner said that he used to be one of the clients of the WEX exchange and gone insane after he allegedly lost funds there.

But given a number of points, I think that this is another lie from korner, who is acting like a victim.
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