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Author Topic: I'm considering becoming a full node  (Read 319 times)
Longsword94
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February 06, 2020, 05:52:19 PM
Merited by bones261 (5), LoyceV (2), o_e_l_e_o (1)
 #1

What are the benefits for me?

If there is none economically (ex I don't recieve transaction fees) what are the actual minimum system requirements to do that?

I'm planning to have a 24/7 node working but I'm scared of electricity costs (in my country it's very expensive) so I'm considering on how to do that with the lowest expense possible.

I own several computers so I wouldn't need to buy hardware, but they either are very outdated or not really powerful (cpu and gpu wise)
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February 06, 2020, 06:00:34 PM
Merited by Jet Cash (5)
 #2

A standard pebtium laptop would take a week or two to download the blockchain (they aren't very fast).

If you can get better ram for it then you might be able to get it to go a bit faster.

There was a thread of people using raspberry pis which use about the same amount of electricity as some modems (afaik). See if you can find power ratings for the products you want to buy to see if its worth it. You don't get paid for hosting one anyway so it might or might not be worth doing it. You'll be propagating the network but there are a lot of nodes running already.

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February 06, 2020, 06:12:31 PM
Merited by suchmoon (7), joniboini (2)
 #3

What are the benefits for me?

If there is none economically (ex I don't recieve transaction fees) what are the actual minimum system requirements to do that?

I'm planning to have a 24/7 node working but I'm scared of electricity costs (in my country it's very expensive) so I'm considering on how to do that with the lowest expense possible.

I own several computers so I wouldn't need to buy hardware, but they either are very outdated or not really powerful (cpu and gpu wise)

A small netbook like this would consume little to none electricity. (~$150)

Running a node itself doesn't have any financial benefits directly but it allows you to become a part of the bitcoin network. You can observe the ongoing network activity without needing any third parties.

Or... you can create your own Lightning Node (Allows to send and receive very small amount of bitcoins) and BTCpay server (free open source payment gate for your business) on top of your full node if you are interested in those.




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Longsword94
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February 06, 2020, 07:18:23 PM
 #4

Yeah I know that nodes are already a lot, but volunteers would improve the blockchain security even if they are few.

One volunteer a day keeps the 51% attack away right?

As for the raspberry part I feel relieved. I've always been fascinated by hollywood hackers and when I see mining facilities my heart beats faster they look so cool! But ASICS are expensive and loud and in my country because of electricity costs they are useless with current bitcoin price... No way I would be able to run a mining node haha
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February 06, 2020, 09:26:09 PM
Merited by Jet Cash (5), joniboini (2)
 #5

No the pi is just a tiny computer.

And the 51% attack is based on miners, not nodes. Whether someone accepts your transaction is based on how their node is configured.

https://www.raspberrypi.org/

Discussion on it can be found here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5196287.msg52891211#msg52891211

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February 06, 2020, 10:37:11 PM
Merited by LoyceV (2), joniboini (2), ETFbitcoin (1)
 #6

One volunteer a day keeps the 51% attack away right?

It doesn't. 51% has absolutely nothing to do with helping to resist 51% attacks. Since the blocks generated during 51% attack, the ease of executing an attack with 10 nodes is the same as 10,000. Nodes would just accept the rogue blocks since they are still within the protocol rules.

In terms of security, it does help to improve the network's security by potentially make sybil attack harder. For a sybil attack to be executed with a large number or nodes, the attacker needs a lot more resources and nodes to have a chance at executing one.

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February 07, 2020, 06:46:07 AM
Merited by joniboini (2), AdolfinWolf (1), Husna QA (1)
 #7

What are the benefits for me?

1. Better privacy (if you use Bitcoin Core as your wallet)
2. Don't need to rely completely on another full node
3. Direct access to Bitcoin's blockchain, it's really useful if you're a software developer

If there is none economically (ex I don't recieve transaction fees) what are the actual minimum system requirements to do that?

According to https://bitcoin.org/en/full-node#minimum-requirements, it's

  • Desktop or laptop hardware running recent versions of Windows, Mac OS X, or Linux.
  • 200 gigabytes of free disk space, accessible at a minimum read/write speed of 100 MB/s.
  • 2 gigabytes of memory (RAM)
  • A broadband Internet connection with upload speeds of at least 400 kilobits (50 kilobytes) per second
  • An unmetered connection, a connection with high upload limits, or a connection you regularly monitor to ensure it doesn’t exceed its upload limits. It’s common for full nodes on high-speed connections to use 200 gigabytes upload or more a month.
  • Download usage is around 20 gigabytes a month, plus around an additional 195 gigabytes the first time you start your node.
  • 6 hours a day that your full node can be left running. (You can do other things with your computer while running a full node.) More hours would be better, and best of all would be if you can run your node continuously.
Note: many operating systems today (Windows, Mac, and Linux) enter a low-power mode after the screensaver activates, slowing or halting network traffic. This is often the default setting on laptops and on all Mac OS X laptops and desktops. Check your screensaver settings and disable automatic “sleep” or “suspend” options to ensure you support the network whenever your computer is running.
[/list]

Take note it's a bit outdated since Bitcoin's blockchain size is about 270GB. 1GB RAM is also enough with additional configuration & if you use lightweight Linux OS.

I'm planning to have a 24/7 node working but I'm scared of electricity costs (in my country it's very expensive) so I'm considering on how to do that with the lowest expense possible.

I own several computers so I wouldn't need to buy hardware, but they either are very outdated or not really powerful (cpu and gpu wise)

Then you might want to buy and use Raspberry Pi instead which uses between 5W - 15W (depends on type you bought)

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February 07, 2020, 05:48:55 PM
 #8

I run a node myself.
If you want to understand why it is important to run a node, you can revert to some very insightful resources like the following ones:


if you want to setup your node using a RaspbeyPi, you can follow this very good guide (the one I followed too, and I even translated in italian), that allow to get a 24/7 inexpensive node, with very little technical knwoledge.

 ]Beginner’s Guide to ️Lightning️ on a Raspberry Pi


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February 08, 2020, 10:56:04 PM
 #9

I have installed BitCoin Core, and have setup all that is needed , also get incoming peers, but still i see no transactions coming in. It looks like my node isn't running on a way. Do you guys have an idea ?
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February 09, 2020, 04:20:43 AM
 #10

I have installed BitCoin Core, and have setup all that is needed , also get incoming peers, but still i see no transactions coming in. It looks like my node isn't running on a way. Do you guys have an idea ?

Did someone send you any coins? If not, then you won't see any incoming transactions. Setting up a full node has nothing to do with collecting transactions.

If you have peers, that's enough.




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  WELCOME
BONUS
.INSTANT & FAST.
.TRANSACTION.....
.PROVABLY FAIR.
......& SECURE......
.24/7 CUSTOMER.
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February 09, 2020, 08:52:52 AM
 #11

I have installed BitCoin Core, and have setup all that is needed , also get incoming peers, but still i see no transactions coming in. It looks like my node isn't running on a way. Do you guys have an idea ?

Did someone send you any coins? If not, then you won't see any incoming transactions. Setting up a full node has nothing to do with collecting transactions.

If you have peers, that's enough.

Maybe he meant his mempool is empty and other nodes doesn't send unconfirmed transaction to his node. But this only happen if you explicitly configure Bitcoin Core only to accept Blocks.

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February 09, 2020, 09:12:44 AM
Merited by fillippone (2)
 #12

I have installed BitCoin Core, and have setup all that is needed , also get incoming peers, but still i see no transactions coming in. It looks like my node isn't running on a way. Do you guys have an idea ?

Did someone send you any coins? If not, then you won't see any incoming transactions. Setting up a full node has nothing to do with collecting transactions.

If you have peers, that's enough.

Maybe he meant his mempool is empty and other nodes doesn't send unconfirmed transaction to his node. But this only happen if you explicitly configure Bitcoin Core only to accept Blocks.

This is how my node looks right now and I don't have upnp enabled (so my node is not visible on bitnodes) and I can still see the mempool state.



While I am writing this post, another block was found and the number of unconfirmed tx's fell to 300-400. If it doesn't look like that screen shot, something isn't working properly probably.




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February 09, 2020, 11:59:54 AM
Last edit: February 09, 2020, 12:17:54 PM by mathijsbok
 #13

this is how my screen looks like. So i get incoming and outcoming peers. But i have 00000 numbers of transactions

http://avgntiel.nl/BitcoinCoreMTB.png

And why my image doesn't show up ?

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February 09, 2020, 03:41:03 PM
 #14

this is how my screen looks like. So i get incoming and outcoming peers. But i have 00000 numbers of transactions



And why my image doesn't show up ?


You're a newbie so the images won't show up. Its normal as per the forum rules.

As for the mempool stats not showing up, it is a known bug [1] for Bitcoin Core 0.19.0.1. It's a GUI issue and should be fixed within the next release.

[1] https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/17576

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February 09, 2020, 03:43:52 PM
 #15

So better downgrade to 0.18 ?
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February 09, 2020, 04:03:04 PM
 #16

So better downgrade to 0.18 ?
It's a GUI bug. It doesn't really affect the functionality of the client as a full node. You can still get the mempool information albeit you'll have to input a few commands. Other than that, it functions the same as any other node.

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February 09, 2020, 04:04:12 PM
 #17

But when it is all running, were do i see the node rewards ?
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February 09, 2020, 04:08:55 PM
 #18

But when it is all running, were do i see the node rewards ?
What do you mean by rewards? Full nodes are not rewarded for running. Only miners who find blocks are rewarded.

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February 09, 2020, 04:21:31 PM
 #19

Hahhaha, what is then the usefull thing of Bitcoin Core ?
When you have it running but nothing get for it ?
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February 09, 2020, 04:25:48 PM
 #20

Hahhaha, what is then the usefull thing of Bitcoin Core ?
When you have it running but nothing get for it ?

What are the benefits for me?

If there is none economically (ex I don't recieve transaction fees) what are the actual minimum system requirements to do that?

I'm planning to have a 24/7 node working but I'm scared of electricity costs (in my country it's very expensive) so I'm considering on how to do that with the lowest expense possible.

I own several computers so I wouldn't need to buy hardware, but they either are very outdated or not really powerful (cpu and gpu wise)

A small netbook like this would consume little to none electricity. (~$150)

Running a node itself doesn't have any financial benefits directly but it allows you to become a part of the bitcoin network. You can observe the ongoing network activity without needing any third parties.

Or... you can create your own Lightning Node (Allows to send and receive very small amount of bitcoins) and BTCpay server (free open source payment gate for your business) on top of your full node if you are interested in those.

If you want quick moniez go set up a dash masternode, invest in shitcoins or play dice. You are in the wrong place for making easy money.




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February 09, 2020, 05:37:06 PM
 #21

One volunteer a day keeps the 51% attack away right?

It doesn't. 51% has absolutely nothing to do with helping to resist 51% attacks. Since the blocks generated during 51% attack, the ease of executing an attack with 10 nodes is the same as 10,000. Nodes would just accept the rogue blocks since they are still within the protocol rules.

In terms of security, it does help to improve the network's security by potentially make sybil attack harder. For a sybil attack to be executed with a large number or nodes, the attacker needs a lot more resources and nodes to have a chance at executing one.
The more honest full nodes there are on the network, the hardest it is for miners to perform attacks on the network or increase their earnings with malicious practices via Sybil attacks. For example, in a selfish mining attack, the attackers might have higher chances of having their split of a chain being accepted if they had poisoned the network with non-impartial nodes. So in an indirect way, honest nodes help also against mining attacks.

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February 14, 2020, 06:40:04 PM
 #22

Hahhaha, what is then the usefull thing of Bitcoin Core ?
When you have it running but nothing get for it ?
If you want to earn something and can keep a node running then you can try running a lightning node but I'm not sure how much you can earn from the fees of on - it'll be very little atm though.

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February 14, 2020, 07:12:52 PM
 #23

Hahhaha, what is then the usefull thing of Bitcoin Core ?
When you have it running but nothing get for it ?
If you want to earn something and can keep a node running then you can try running a lightning node but I'm not sure how much you can earn from the fees of on - it'll be very little atm though.

I am afraid routing fees are totally inadequate to compensate for hardware, running costs and time spent to run a lightning node.
Running a node for the fees means doing so for the least important of the reasons.

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February 15, 2020, 06:00:13 AM
Merited by fillippone (2)
 #24

Hahhaha, what is then the usefull thing of Bitcoin Core ?
When you have it running but nothing get for it ?
If you want to earn something and can keep a node running then you can try running a lightning node but I'm not sure how much you can earn from the fees of on - it'll be very little atm though.

I am afraid routing fees are totally inadequate to compensate for hardware, running costs and time spent to run a lightning node.
Running a node for the fees means doing so for the least important of the reasons.

Don't forget transaction fees when you open and close channel. Even faucet could give you more Bitcoin rather than routing fees.

Only exchange/services who might earn profit since they have many LN channel for routing purpose.

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February 15, 2020, 07:40:43 AM
 #25


Don't forget transaction fees when you open and close channel. Even faucet could give you more Bitcoin rather than routing fees.

Only exchange/services who might earn profit since they have many LN channel for routing purpose.
Absolutely.
My badly explained point is that even running a node, already fully setup, has running cost in terms of resources (electricity, time and risks) that greatly overtake the eventual revenues.
This is in the present, I don’t know in the future (many years ahead) when L1 will be saturated and L2 will be more used.

If you are looking for quick and easy revenue, this is not the direction worth looking at.

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February 16, 2020, 04:57:04 PM
 #26

Yeah it's not a fast way for getting a good revenue stream. But if you're not paying for electric or anything then it's an idea...

And you don't have fees to open a node, just fees if you start a channel. If you help someone else start theirs you don't pay their fees.

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February 18, 2020, 04:10:41 PM
 #27

Not my topic but question to the people replying to this - what kind of security risks (if any) come with running a full node from your residential connection?

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February 18, 2020, 05:20:19 PM
 #28

Not massively risky I would say.
If properly configured the attack footprint of a full node is definelty not too big.
You can find a few hint on how to strenghten your node here (albeit the guide is specific for a specific hardware configuration, you can find some useful hints).
If you don't run your node under TOR you might discole your IP, this may lead to ddos attacks.
Something is actually mentioned in the bitcoin.org website:

https://bitcoin.org/en/full-node#possible-problems


Quote
Possible Problems
  • Legal: Bitcoin use is prohibited or restricted in some areas.
  • Bandwidth limits: Some Internet plans will charge an additional amount for any excess upload bandwidth used that isn’t included in the plan. Worse, some providers may terminate your connection without warning because of overuse. We advise that you check whether your Internet connection is subjected to such limitations and monitor your bandwidth use so that you can stop Bitcoin Core before you reach your upload limit.
  • Anti-virus: Several people have placed parts of known computer viruses in the Bitcoin block chain. This block chain data can’t infect your computer, but some anti-virus programs quarantine the data anyway, making it more difficult to run Bitcoin Core. This problem mostly affects computers running Windows.
  • Attack target: Bitcoin Core powers the Bitcoin peer-to-peer network, so people who want to disrupt the network may attack Bitcoin Core users in ways that will affect other things you do with your computer, such as an attack that limits your available download bandwidth.


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February 18, 2020, 05:21:17 PM
 #29

Not my topic but question to the people replying to this - what kind of security risks (if any) come with running a full node from your residential connection?

If you decide to contribute to the network, your IP will be visible to everybody. At worst your IP can get DDOS'ed probably but since your router is behind a firewall and only your fullnode will use the port that you forwarded, I don't think there are any serious risks like getting hacked etc...

If you only download the data and not upload, it is not risky at all.




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February 18, 2020, 05:34:50 PM
 #30

Not my topic but question to the people replying to this - what kind of security risks (if any) come with running a full node from your residential connection?

As long as you're network has strict rules, you'll normally be fine.

There are always vulnerabilites in certain things but as long as you ensure security remains pretty tight and you don't try to change any settings you don't understand (typically on the router) and the firewall remains as strong or only allows connectios to go through to that computer (on the 8333 port) then you should be safe.


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February 18, 2020, 09:21:23 PM
 #31

Not my topic but question to the people replying to this - what kind of security risks (if any) come with running a full node from your residential connection?

If you decide to contribute to the network, your IP will be visible to everybody. At worst your IP can get DDOS'ed probably but since your router is behind a firewall and only your fullnode will use the port that you forwarded, I don't think there are any serious risks like getting hacked etc...

If you only download the data and not upload, it is not risky at all.

Ya I figured the most would be DDoS. Is getting DDoS'd while running a full node common in the Bitcoin world? I've run private game servers and it's very common in that world  Angry

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February 18, 2020, 09:50:43 PM
 #32

Not my topic but question to the people replying to this - what kind of security risks (if any) come with running a full node from your residential connection?

If you decide to contribute to the network, your IP will be visible to everybody. At worst your IP can get DDOS'ed probably but since your router is behind a firewall and only your fullnode will use the port that you forwarded, I don't think there are any serious risks like getting hacked etc...

If you only download the data and not upload, it is not risky at all.

Ya I figured the most would be DDoS. Is getting DDoS'd while running a full node common in the Bitcoin world? I've run private game servers and it's very common in that world  Angry
I have been running a node since a year now.
It never happened to me.
This is my experience.

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February 18, 2020, 11:07:16 PM
 #33

Ya I figured the most would be DDoS. Is getting DDoS'd while running a full node common in the Bitcoin world? I've run private game servers and it's very common in that world  Angry
I have been running a node since a year now.
It never happened to me.
This is my experience.

I think they go after the nodes used for more.. The last DDoS afaik was electrum, so that was specific to nodes hosting their servers.

If you run a node, you're only one in eleven thousand so there's a chance you might not ever be DDoSed (especially if the network keeps growing and you don't stand out much).

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February 19, 2020, 06:12:07 AM
Merited by fillippone (1)
 #34

Not my topic but question to the people replying to this - what kind of security risks (if any) come with running a full node from your residential connection?

If you decide to contribute to the network, your IP will be visible to everybody. At worst your IP can get DDOS'ed probably but since your router is behind a firewall and only your fullnode will use the port that you forwarded, I don't think there are any serious risks like getting hacked etc...

If you only download the data and not upload, it is not risky at all.

Ya I figured the most would be DDoS. Is getting DDoS'd while running a full node common in the Bitcoin world? I've run private game servers and it's very common in that world  Angry

It rarely happens because there aren't many options to DDoS full nodes. Additionally, Bitcoin Core have mechanism to block peers/nodes who attempt to DDoS by sending invalid information.

You probably don't need to worry about it too much, unless your node is part of public service (e.g. pools, block explorer, exchange, etc.)

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February 19, 2020, 07:11:06 PM
 #35



It rarely happens because there aren't many options to DDoS full nodes. Additionally, Bitcoin Core have mechanism to block peers/nodes who attempt to DDoS by sending invalid information.

You probably don't need to worry about it too much, unless your node is part of public service (e.g. pools, block explorer, exchange, etc.)

I thought you'd ddos the router and not the machine? Unless you can find a port on the same machine thst is more vulnerable to attacks...

Not sure if we've moses on from accelerated denial of service (using timeservera) as that flaw may have been patched or there might have been something more efficient.

I think the reason people aren't using DoS attacks more is because they're not very worthwhile. Especially since most people can get a new ip pretty quickly too or can push their node through a different network.

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February 20, 2020, 08:40:48 AM
 #36



It rarely happens because there aren't many options to DDoS full nodes. Additionally, Bitcoin Core have mechanism to block peers/nodes who attempt to DDoS by sending invalid information.

You probably don't need to worry about it too much, unless your node is part of public service (e.g. pools, block explorer, exchange, etc.)

I thought you'd ddos the router and not the machine? Unless you can find a port on the same machine thst is more vulnerable to attacks...

Not sure if we've moses on from accelerated denial of service (using timeservera) as that flaw may have been patched or there might have been something more efficient.

I think the reason people aren't using DoS attacks more is because they're not very worthwhile. Especially since most people can get a new ip pretty quickly too or can push their node through a different network.

DDoS the router or other vulnerability of the client's device are also possible, but it's different topic and i was talking about possibility of DDoS from Bitcoin network protocol.

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