Bitmain Introduces the S19 and S19 Pro

[mikeywith]

Sorry I haven't bought any of these 19 series and most likely won't be buying any for years to come, but what I know from people who I trust and who have these 19 series as well as the 17 series miners and all of them with no exceptions vouched for the 19 series over the 17 series, since these gears are still new nobody has enough data points to compare it against S9 or M21s for an example, it's easy to compare them to the 17 series because most people weren't as lucky as phill, gears were breaking after a very short period of mining, these S19s aren't doing that (YET), when something is extremely terrible it's very easy to compare it against anything else.

My concern is that the first a few batches of the S19/T19 are good and then the newer batches will not be as good, but I am known to be "paranoid" and Bitmain became my nightmare after having lost thousands of dollars on their mining gears, so my view could be biased.

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[Epochjump]

You are not paranoid. Bitmain's hardware is garbage. The S-17 series has literally destroyed miners and their businesses. They did nothing to support this garbage hardware. Now the S-19 has a solid Heat Sync on the chip side but still radiator style on back. Half fixed the engineering disaster of the S-17's. Bitmain needs to be taken down. They are greedy ruthless pigs. Stick with Micro BT. They are amazing on all fronts. Quality, efficiency and these beasts run like S-9's. Amazing units.

[philipma1957]

my micro bit has been meh.
my avalon has been meh
my innosilcion has been meh

my bitmain s17 t17 s17 pro s17+ really good.
my t17+
my t17e. so so.

we are on to next gen.
all of which worry me.

the s19 pro is a 3300 watt unit.
the microbit are 3300 watt units.

not a fan of that much power draw.

I can add a lot more gear. I have the power. I dont have confidence in the sellers.

This new gen gear locks you into specific power supplies. I dont like that.

[Epochjump]

Running 50 M30s 72 TH. 4 Months now. They run at 74TH and the Watts are lower than specs claimed. Like BM USED TO DO. Not only are they bomb proof, the FW is intuitive. If the machine senses too much heat, it will down tune itself. Then once the Temp returns to normal, it again adjusts back. Current gen Whatsminer's are unparalleled. If you're a commercial miner, you owe it to yourself to scrap Bitmain and go MicroBT current HW.

[mikeywith]

I can't vouch for M30S although I only heard good stuff about them I know that M21s is a BEAST, the only 17 series gear which I was kind of lucky with was the S17 pro, Phill was one of the few lucky guys who were not screwed by the 17 series, for most of us, it's hard to believe that anyone else could have had a good experience with the 17 series, in fact, if I didn't trust Phil I would think he is simply shilling those terrible gears, but I know he is telling the truth and I know he was just lucky and I am happy for him.

My experience with S9k, S9e, and all of the S17 series makes me hesitate to buy these new S19/S19 pro, I have always been a Bitmain fan, but when I tried MicroBT I knew bitmain was a joke, of course, with an exception of S9j, S9i, and S9.

[Epochjump]

All true my friend. I also had "better" luck with the 50TH Pro's but still pretty bad. 35% failure rates across my S17's. I only ran earlier iteration S9's and they were bomb proof for me. Less than 5% failure rate for years and even then BM stood behind them. Whole different BM now. BTW Micro BT is started and run by an ex-BM Engineer I believe.

[philipma1957]

These 10 are the warehouse owners we put them in around November 2019 some do normal some do turbo if you look closely you can see they earned 2.2btc  since we installed them last year

counting coupons these are paid off as they cost about 17,000 usd and 2.2 btc = more then 23,000 usd

[mikeywith]

Phil, that proof was really unnecessary, I know you are honest and you wouldn't lie about it, perhaps I failed to explain to myself, and just so that we don't go off-topic, I sent you a PM explaining what I meant.

I also had "better" luck with the 50TH Pro's but still pretty bad. 35% failure rates across my S17's.

30% and higher failure rates are very, very, very common with the S17 series, mine is well over 40%.  . the worst ones are the E and + versions, the T17 is half as bad, the S17 Pro is kind of good.

Anyway, I won't be buying any of these S19 gears, but I hope that they are robust enough and those who buy them can actually mine with them for at least a year or two before starting to see dead hashboards or toasted PSUs.

[philipma1957]

No worries internet always sound too formal it is hard to show you are laughing or not angry.

2x t17e = not good for me. rescueed the 2 units with down clocked after market
2x t17+ = not good for me. Rescued the 2 units with down clocked after market

3x t17 = good zero issues
3 s17 = 1 dead psu fixed it yesterday 2 good.
15 s17pro = all good. normal some turbo some.

So 25 units all still working 1 repair part  quite good.

actually better then anything I owned since the bitmain s-3 which were the best gear built by bitmain for uptime.

To put it in perspective. Bitmain wrote apologies for the 17 series and here I am with an almost perfect record for the gear. It is funny.  I am also grateful.

[mikeywith]

For those who are interested, bitmain just restock their miners.



S19 pro = $3359
S19     = $2612
T19     = $2003

Shipping date, 1-31 July 2021, so you will probably get them by med august 2021 (if everything goes fine).

What's everybody's take on these prices for a gear that will get delivered after 8 months from now?

[philipma1957]

Oh I just unlocked the wallet and sent them all my btc.

 Not!

On a more serious note 📝 we are still waiting on the first s19pro we ordered.

Why should we buy more?

even though I am down some hash 1.25+.5=1.75 ph vs the 2.0 we had.

 it earns more than it has in a while.

I also grabbed a lot of gpu hash and if I am picky I can get it cheap with good warranty.

I even have a return window it the gpu phase crashes I have until Jan31 to return gear.

I wont be buying any gear from bitmain for a long time.

[NotFuzzyWarm]

Shipping date, 1-31 July 2021, so you will probably get them by med august 2021 (if everything goes fine).
What's everybody's take on these prices for a gear that will get delivered after 8 months from now?

7-8 month or more lead time? Bitmain is insane...

Granted I have not bought any BM gear for several years now (s9 batch-25 is the last I bought) but even if I did still use them, no frickin' way would I buy with 8mo (or more) leadtime!
In the words of Nancy Regan - just say NO!

[HagssFIN]

The lead time is so long that it probably makes more sense to buy Avalon 1246, which is in the same power efficiency area as T19.

Or MicroBT hardware, if it has reasonable lead time via some distributor.. (their own web shop shows all sold out).

[aurel57]

I don't think the math works for me to be buying.

[philipma1957]

We have a s19 pro due in 30 days. I will post how it runs.

This era is reminding me of 2016-2017.

Everything was going up and it became easier to get gpus.

Not that I advocate gpu to shit coin to btc. But today right now I am pushed in that direction.

To me I am Always looking at:

debt
cash
coin
asics
gpus

diff
price
profit per algo.

I then juggle all of the above.

I would love to buy some bitmain gear,but  7 month lead time for gear is almost never good.


I could justify getting a unit from bitmain on the books for 2020.
For the following reasons

USA tax law allows me to have ending inventory subtracted from profits of selling gear.

I still sell a lot of gear and have been consistently do my returns to reflect my gear sales.

So ordering a s19pro from bitmain counts as ending inventory since I paid in 2020.

So it is essentially a 3500 tax deduction.

I can buy the btc from coinbase. So it is not btc out of pocket it is cash out of pocket.

It would mean a certain 1200 savings in tax for this year.

So it lower risk of buying a s19pro.

But I could also order 6x 3060ti units for Jan 15 delivery at the same cost.

 same tax break and gear is on hand in under a month vs over six months.

I mention all this due to the past 2016-2017 time frame.

I will make a decision to buy a s19pro or 6 x. 3060tis this week.

To all buying a s19 pro may be okay if you report taxes. It can make your choice easier to do.

[PopoJeff]

Bitmain website just updated next available delivery dates to August.
Id love to grab one, but I don't like the idea of paying now, and waiting 8 months for delivery.
(Although I could reduce my 2020 tax liability by buying now)

[philipma1957]

Bitmain website just updated next available delivery dates to August.
Id love to grab one, but I don't like the idea of paying now, and waiting 8 months for delivery.
(Although I could reduce my 2020 tax liability by buying now)

I am considering getting a few.

Or some more gear before New Years eve.

[MoparMiningLLC]

it so stupid that they are pushing to August for buyers like us, yet there are companies getting deals for thousands of miners and Bitmain has no issue filling those orders.... or is that why the normal buyer has to wait so long?

[philipma1957]

even though I have purchased more than 150k in gear from them I am a nobody to them.

I have three choices wait til aug for two or three s19s
Buy some shit gear but for bitcoin  on ebay get it in under 10 days.

Or buy new gear other then asics mine and convert.

I have 300kwatts to burn and I burn only 110 of them.

I just set up Five non asics put into my friends office.

I will setup 2 non asics put them in the solar array.

and possibly use nine non asics ordered from alibaba.

I need to spend 5k on gear from now till dec 31 for tax purposes.

[MoparMiningLLC]

I need to spend 5k on gear from now till dec 31 for tax purposes.

you can always buy and send me gear Phil lol j/k but yes I know what you mean. I need to spend some as well and while I can afford to, it seems a waste and pointless to do so with the calculated ROI being nothing ever on current prices and difficulty with the expectation that difficulty will increase/