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Author Topic: Do I really have to pay taxes on crypto investments?  (Read 2423 times)
altcoinman
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June 16, 2020, 09:31:59 AM
 #601

Just entered the forum and seeing this discussion Ive realized that Bitcoin and AI might be our future.
you understand correctly. the thing is to find a way of eliminating human mistakes which is the reason for all the crises in the world. and technology is quite capable of doing that.
I don't see how technology is better than humans.
Because people are weak and prone to emotions, and the factor of personal enrichment has not been canceled. For some reason, I’m sure that if we consider the data obtained independently, for example from sensors, they will give a much clearer picture than the data collected by a person.

you do realize that all this technology you are talknng about was built by people and will be controlled by them in the future?

still...  if you try to build an algorithm, for example for the construction of a power plant, the solutions will be much clearer if you calculate them with a machine, starting with the design documentation and choosing a place - ending with the functioning of this complex. Of course, here you can allow the society to participate in the discussion, but why? If the AI is quite capable of seeing the risks and providing work.
in fact, you are right. the interaction of different countries with AI becomes more popular evry year. Any of the algorithms becomes self-learning, which means that the machine will be able to see the cycle and make a decision. But, as I would not like to see a completely “digitized” world where the machine makes decisions - I believe that there are very few other options, because people will not change, and most of the template work can be performed by the machine, with much greater efficiency and without human factors .
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peteresw
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June 16, 2020, 09:35:42 AM
 #602

Just entered the forum and seeing this discussion Ive realized that Bitcoin and AI might be our future.
you understand correctly. the thing is to find a way of eliminating human mistakes which is the reason for all the crises in the world. and technology is quite capable of doing that.
I don't see how technology is better than humans.
Because people are weak and prone to emotions, and the factor of personal enrichment has not been canceled. For some reason, I’m sure that if we consider the data obtained independently, for example from sensors, they will give a much clearer picture than the data collected by a person.

you do realize that all this technology you are talknng about was built by people and will be controlled by them in the future?

still...  if you try to build an algorithm, for example for the construction of a power plant, the solutions will be much clearer if you calculate them with a machine, starting with the design documentation and choosing a place - ending with the functioning of this complex. Of course, here you can allow the society to participate in the discussion, but why? If the AI is quite capable of seeing the risks and providing work.
in fact, you are right. the interaction of different countries with AI becomes more popular evry year. Any of the algorithms becomes self-learning, which means that the machine will be able to see the cycle and make a decision. But, as I would not like to see a completely “digitized” world where the machine makes decisions - I believe that there are very few other options, because people will not change, and most of the template work can be performed by the machine, with much greater efficiency and without human factors .

artificial intelligence and machine data processing do not have the main thing: common sense and human ethics. In self-learning, artificial intelligence cannot know where effectiveness will begin to go agains ethics and common sense. Therefore, with all the advantages, it also has disadvantages.
thomasjohn768
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June 16, 2020, 09:40:20 AM
 #603

Just entered the forum and seeing this discussion Ive realized that Bitcoin and AI might be our future.
you understand correctly. the thing is to find a way of eliminating human mistakes which is the reason for all the crises in the world. and technology is quite capable of doing that.
I don't see how technology is better than humans.
Because people are weak and prone to emotions, and the factor of personal enrichment has not been canceled. For some reason, I’m sure that if we consider the data obtained independently, for example from sensors, they will give a much clearer picture than the data collected by a person.

you do realize that all this technology you are talknng about was built by people and will be controlled by them in the future?

still...  if you try to build an algorithm, for example for the construction of a power plant, the solutions will be much clearer if you calculate them with a machine, starting with the design documentation and choosing a place - ending with the functioning of this complex. Of course, here you can allow the society to participate in the discussion, but why? If the AI is quite capable of seeing the risks and providing work.
in fact, you are right. the interaction of different countries with AI becomes more popular evry year. Any of the algorithms becomes self-learning, which means that the machine will be able to see the cycle and make a decision. But, as I would not like to see a completely “digitized” world where the machine makes decisions - I believe that there are very few other options, because people will not change, and most of the template work can be performed by the machine, with much greater efficiency and without human factors .

artificial intelligence and machine data processing do not have the main thing: common sense and human ethics. In self-learning, artificial intelligence cannot know where effectiveness will begin to go agains ethics and common sense. Therefore, with all the advantages, it also has disadvantages.
If we start a conversation about ethics, then at the end we will come to the definition of "good and evil", "morality" and other terms that have nothing to do with reality, and exist only for philosophical conversations, with a cup of coffee. And yes, in a critical situation, for example, if it can save a child’s life, any person will push all his ethical and moral standards to the level that will fit this situation. Therefore, I do not see anything wrong with this part if the machine determines such situations.

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rnold142
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June 16, 2020, 09:43:07 AM
 #604

Information has slipped that the very first Bitcoin addresses may be compromised, and the work carried out by people to update the Bitcoin code reduces the likelihood of hacking options.
thomasjohn768
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June 16, 2020, 09:46:41 AM
 #605

Information has slipped that the very first Bitcoin addresses may be compromised, and the work carried out by people to update the Bitcoin code reduces the likelihood of hacking options.

Hacking is always possible. Smart hacking will not compromise the system. For the system itself, it will be just a new reality in which it will logically work. Without human control, internal errors will be multiplied. My experience is that any systems fail.

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webtaxi
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June 16, 2020, 09:51:13 AM
 #606

centralized control is where someone sits there and follows all your transactions and tax reports?

altcoinman
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June 16, 2020, 09:54:58 AM
 #607

centralized control is where someone sits there and follows all your transactions and tax reports?


This is not necessary at all. A blockchain with an embedded data processing formula is quite capable of coping with this task. The control here is not over individual elements, but over the system as a whole, so that it does not fail.
peteresw
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June 16, 2020, 09:57:20 AM
 #608

I understand that we are close to the introduction of systems based on Bitcoin and other blockchains to the dominance of machines, but it is important to understand where to go anyway, and I do not want to go to the dominance of machines. I would prefer to see representatives of my kind as continuers of our civilization.
webtaxi
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June 16, 2020, 10:01:30 AM
 #609

I understand that we are close to the introduction of systems based on Bitcoin and other blockchains to the dominance of machines, but it is important to understand where to go anyway, and I do not want to go to the dominance of machines. I would prefer to see representatives of my kind as continuers of our civilization.

we return to Murphy’s law: in the absence of concepts of ethics and using only concepts of efficiency, a situation is possible where, in an unforeseen way, machine logic is not considering a person to be a person and in the most effective way to achieve basic goals destroys him quickly and without alternative. No matter how small this probability is, it exists, and therefore it is unacceptable to contribute to a situation in which it can be implemented. Therefore, you can use Bitcoin as a tool, but you can not make a person a tool for an uncontrolled Bitcoin. You look at today's little bitcoin, I look at the possibility of developing AI as a whole in any foreseeable or boundless perspective.
peteresw
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June 16, 2020, 10:04:10 AM
 #610

I understand that we are close to the introduction of systems based on Bitcoin and other blockchains to the dominance of machines, but it is important to understand where to go anyway, and I do not want to go to the dominance of machines. I would prefer to see representatives of my kind as continuers of our civilization.

we return to Murphy’s law: in the absence of concepts of ethics and using only concepts of efficiency, a situation is possible where, in an unforeseen way, machine logic is not considering a person to be a person and in the most effective way to achieve basic goals destroys him quickly and without alternative. No matter how small this probability is, it exists, and therefore it is unacceptable to contribute to a situation in which it can be implemented. Therefore, you can use Bitcoin as a tool, but you can not make a person a tool for an uncontrolled Bitcoin. You look at today's little bitcoin, I look at the possibility of developing AI as a whole in any foreseeable or boundless perspective.

faultlessness and rejection of Murphy's law implies rejection of probability theory. As soon as it is convincingly substantiated that it can be somehow managed, other options can be discussed, but for now, I hope it’s impossible to hope that something doesn’t happen when we talk about critical things. When designing for objects that can be life-threatening for many people, reliability is calculated from events with a probability of occurrence greater than or commensurate with the entire documented human history. And still, disasters at such facilities occur. Man has not created anything perfect yet, AI created by man will not be an exception either.
rnold142
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June 16, 2020, 10:07:15 AM
 #611

I have a question: where is the presence of a person in the blockchain and bitcoin? Smiley
altcoinman
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June 16, 2020, 10:10:41 AM
 #612

A great question to expand on. True, already said something like that, but I can once again reveal it. Both the blockchain in general and Bitcoin in particular at the current stage are completely controlled by a person. Updates and hard forks are an example of decentralized human control of the system, because by the decision of the majority the system can be replaced with any other one at all, and the blockchain can not oppose this, because it is just a banal tool for solving a specific problem.
rnold142
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June 16, 2020, 10:14:48 AM
 #613

A great question to expand on. True, already said something like that, but I can once again reveal it. Both the blockchain in general and Bitcoin in particular at the current stage are completely controlled by a person. Updates and hard forks are an example of decentralized human control of the system, because by the decision of the majority the system can be replaced with any other one at all, and the blockchain can not oppose this, because it is just a banal tool for solving a specific problem.

well, as long as the tool works correctly, there is no need to do anything with it, let it work.
altcoinman
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June 16, 2020, 10:18:17 AM
 #614

A great question to expand on. True, already said something like that, but I can once again reveal it. Both the blockchain in general and Bitcoin in particular at the current stage are completely controlled by a person. Updates and hard forks are an example of decentralized human control of the system, because by the decision of the majority the system can be replaced with any other one at all, and the blockchain can not oppose this, because it is just a banal tool for solving a specific problem.

well, as long as the tool works correctly, there is no need to do anything with it, let it work.

Im just saying that a person decides whether to make changes.
webtaxi
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June 16, 2020, 10:21:04 AM
 #615

A great question to expand on. True, already said something like that, but I can once again reveal it. Both the blockchain in general and Bitcoin in particular at the current stage are completely controlled by a person. Updates and hard forks are an example of decentralized human control of the system, because by the decision of the majority the system can be replaced with any other one at all, and the blockchain can not oppose this, because it is just a banal tool for solving a specific problem.

well, as long as the tool works correctly, there is no need to do anything with it, let it work.

Im just saying that a person decides whether to make changes.

To control the system as a whole, it is not necessary to control each specific part of the system. A person controls the entire Bitcoin as a whole, as a system, he also decided that inside this whole system works in a certain way, not allowing to intervene in individual procedures.
altcoinman
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June 16, 2020, 10:24:16 AM
 #616

A great question to expand on. True, already said something like that, but I can once again reveal it. Both the blockchain in general and Bitcoin in particular at the current stage are completely controlled by a person. Updates and hard forks are an example of decentralized human control of the system, because by the decision of the majority the system can be replaced with any other one at all, and the blockchain can not oppose this, because it is just a banal tool for solving a specific problem.

well, as long as the tool works correctly, there is no need to do anything with it, let it work.

Im just saying that a person decides whether to make changes.

To control the system as a whole, it is not necessary to control each specific part of the system. A person controls the entire Bitcoin as a whole, as a system, he also decided that inside this whole system works in a certain way, not allowing to intervene in individual procedures.
Well, what if you remove a person from Bitcoin? Theoretically, what will happen to this system if mining is fully automated, and improvements associated with an increase in transaction speed, for example, will not be required.
webtaxi
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June 16, 2020, 10:29:20 AM
 #617

A great question to expand on. True, already said something like that, but I can once again reveal it. Both the blockchain in general and Bitcoin in particular at the current stage are completely controlled by a person. Updates and hard forks are an example of decentralized human control of the system, because by the decision of the majority the system can be replaced with any other one at all, and the blockchain can not oppose this, because it is just a banal tool for solving a specific problem.

well, as long as the tool works correctly, there is no need to do anything with it, let it work.

Im just saying that a person decides whether to make changes.

To control the system as a whole, it is not necessary to control each specific part of the system. A person controls the entire Bitcoin as a whole, as a system, he also decided that inside this whole system works in a certain way, not allowing to intervene in individual procedures.
Well, what if you remove a person from Bitcoin? Theoretically, what will happen to this system if mining is fully automated, and improvements associated with an increase in transaction speed, for example, will not be required.

As for the option, when mining is fully automated, and the person is not needed for updates: at the current stage it is almost unbelievable, because the programs will still crash.
altcoinman
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June 16, 2020, 12:25:21 PM
 #618

A great question to expand on. True, already said something like that, but I can once again reveal it. Both the blockchain in general and Bitcoin in particular at the current stage are completely controlled by a person. Updates and hard forks are an example of decentralized human control of the system, because by the decision of the majority the system can be replaced with any other one at all, and the blockchain can not oppose this, because it is just a banal tool for solving a specific problem.

well, as long as the tool works correctly, there is no need to do anything with it, let it work.

Im just saying that a person decides whether to make changes.

To control the system as a whole, it is not necessary to control each specific part of the system. A person controls the entire Bitcoin as a whole, as a system, he also decided that inside this whole system works in a certain way, not allowing to intervene in individual procedures.
Well, what if you remove a person from Bitcoin? Theoretically, what will happen to this system if mining is fully automated, and improvements associated with an increase in transaction speed, for example, will not be required.

As for the option, when mining is fully automated, and the person is not needed for updates: at the current stage it is almost unbelievable, because the programs will still crash.

agree. And the more complicated the program is, the more their failures become systematic and go to the same statistical basis on which modern microprocessors work, when it becomes enough for the statistical number of elements to work, and not 100%. Accordingly, no matter how many bulky programs of any kind, errors are inevitable, you will have to modify them.
rnold142
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June 16, 2020, 12:28:07 PM
 #619

What is the advantage of bitcoin? It is a voluntary choice of each and every user individually. And so it should remain in the future. Because, choosing a vector of development, not only we define what will happen tomorrow, but also what will happen in 100 years.
thomasjohn768
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June 16, 2020, 12:31:31 PM
 #620

Modern Bitcoin would hardly have appeared without blast furnaces, although then it was almost impossible to imagine. Therefore, refusal of control should not be allowed now, until the consequences are visible that may become obvious in the future.

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