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Author Topic: MtGox rehabilitation claims  (Read 203 times)
Tolosi
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March 24, 2020, 03:04:01 PM
Merited by NotATether (2)
 #1

MtGox rehalilitation trustee has published a draft plan. No fixed date yet. I understood that no new BTC/BCH will be purchased for purpose of rehabilitation of former MtGox customers.
If one claims BTC BCH then they will be sent to the exchange I suppose.
Can anybody shed some light on this ?
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March 24, 2020, 04:13:07 PM
 #2

If one claims BTC BCH then they will be sent to the exchange I suppose.

I don't quite understand what you mean by this. Yes, Mt. Gox customers affected by the hacks will receive their rehabilitation claim in the form of fiat, and I don't think they will allow people to post claims for BCH/BTC. Then again, it is subjected to the ruling of the courts which mostly goes on to favor the requests of Mt. Gox so far.

There was a link re: ruling on claims for rehabilitation somewhere in this forum though I can't seem to find it. Perhaps other users will have that link and paste it here for further reference and discussion.

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March 24, 2020, 05:09:54 PM
 #3

It is stated in the plan explicitly. Trustee intends to transfer BTC belonging to more than one creditor to an exchange in a single transaction. Exchange is then supposed to divide BTC to each creditor probably in accordance with instructiions received from the trustee. Seems complicated to me. The other option is to have fiat sent direct to creditor’s account.
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March 24, 2020, 06:28:12 PM
 #4

It is stated in the plan explicitly. Trustee intends to transfer BTC belonging to more than one creditor to an exchange in a single transaction. Exchange is then supposed to divide BTC to each creditor probably in accordance with instructiions received from the trustee. Seems complicated to me. The other option is to have fiat sent direct to creditor’s account.

So apparently they want to make the process more complicated and difficult than it already is? The trustee seems to be not in the mood to do it himself. Whatever the plans for rehabilitation are, for as long as the customers are paid accordingly (which I know they aren't, unfortunately), there should be no problems. And since I understand what you meant by your question, why in the world would a trustee entrust the settlement of the rehabilitation claims to another exchange? Wouldn't that be adding yet another layer of insecurity to an already complicated deal that they are fighting for years? If I were to receive something, perhaps I'd like to get mine without any hassles--fiat is the way to go for that matter.

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March 26, 2020, 02:58:28 AM
 #5

This whole situation is clear as mud, but I remain hopeful of one day getting my coins back. I think many of us would have likely spent those coins at much lower rates if we had access to them, so this may end up being a blessing for many of us who got caught up in this catastrophe.


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March 26, 2020, 07:35:03 AM
 #6

It is stated in the plan explicitly. Trustee intends to transfer BTC belonging to more than one creditor to an exchange in a single transaction. Exchange is then supposed to divide BTC to each creditor probably in accordance with instructiions received from the trustee. Seems complicated to me. The other option is to have fiat sent direct to creditor’s account.

So apparently they want to make the process more complicated and difficult than it already is? The trustee seems to be not in the mood to do it himself. Whatever the plans for rehabilitation are, for as long as the customers are paid accordingly (which I know they aren't, unfortunately), there should be no problems. And since I understand what you meant by your question, why in the world would a trustee entrust the settlement of the rehabilitation claims to another exchange? Wouldn't that be adding yet another layer of insecurity to an already complicated deal that they are fighting for years? If I were to receive something, perhaps I'd like to get mine without any hassles--fiat is the way to go for that matter.


I'm not familiar with the legislation regarding bankruptcies,but I assume that the trustee must follow the instructions and orders set by the court.The process of proving the claims is already complicated,but the court has to be 100% sure that there will be no scammers,who might benefit from the money,by submitting fake claims.If I had to choose,I would choose the fiat option too.Which crypto exchange platform can be trusted enough by a court,so that the exchange platform can receive and re-distribute coins to people that don't have accounts there?I'm glad that I didn't deposit any coins into MtGox back in 2012. Angry


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March 26, 2020, 09:38:25 PM
 #7

If one claims BTC BCH then they will be sent to the exchange I suppose.

I don't quite understand what you mean by this. Yes, Mt. Gox customers affected by the hacks will receive their rehabilitation claim in the form of fiat, and I don't think they will allow people to post claims for BCH/BTC.

They are paying claims in fiat money, BTC and BCH. Any other cryptocurrencies like BSV will be liquidated into cash.

According to the draft, they won't be purchasing any BTC or BCH to fulfill claims, so if current assets are insufficient those claims will be partially converted to cash.

The reverse is not true. If fiat assets are insufficient to cover cash payments, the trustee plans to sell more bitcoins:

Quote
Further, the draft rehabilitation plan, which is yet to be filed and approved in a court, added that the trustee also intends to allow BTC/BCH creditors to request payments in cash if desired.

"Consequently, a sufficient amount of cash must be secured as the source for distribution for both fiat currency claims and BTC/BCH claims for which cash payment is requested. For reasons including this, the Trustee may, with the permission of the court, sell all or part of the BTC/BCH constituting the Debtor's assets," the plan says.

Kobayashi said in the outline that the policy is "not to purchase additional BTC/BCH." Therefore, the existing BTC/BCH holdings may not be sufficient as a source for all claims in those assets.

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March 27, 2020, 12:05:31 AM
 #8

MtGox rehalilitation trustee has published a draft plan.
This is never ending story. Literally.
If i would lost money/BTC on MtGox then it would be like twisting the knife in my body every time they give people hope to receive their BTC/money back.
Its so crazy long and its so wrong i can't even describe it. Shame on this whole process.
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March 27, 2020, 12:10:19 AM
 #9

MtGox rehalilitation trustee has published a draft plan.
This is never ending story. Literally.
If i would lost money/BTC on MtGox then it would be like twisting the knife in my body every time they give people hope to receive their BTC/money back.
Its so crazy long and its so wrong i can't even describe it. Shame on this whole process.

They even admitted to liquidating 60,000 bitcoin in first half of 2018, which almost assuredly was the sole reason for the insane dump that consequently caused the whole market to collapse
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March 27, 2020, 08:15:04 AM
 #10

They even admitted to liquidating 60,000 bitcoin in first half of 2018, which almost assuredly was the sole reason for the insane dump that consequently caused the whole market to collapse

I think they have a preference in making settlements with cash payments instead of crypto. When Mt.Gox crashed in 2014, BCH didn't even exist and since the BCH and BSV forks made duplicates of the bitcoin assets that left them with 3x as much recovery money. Apparently, even that isn't enough to refund everyone.

This whole situation is clear as mud, but I remain hopeful of one day getting my coins back. I think many of us would have likely spent those coins at much lower rates if we had access to them, so this may end up being a blessing for many of us who got caught up in this catastrophe.

I feel bad for you and everyone else who lost their coins to the Mt.Gox debacle. Look how long it's taking. Cry

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March 27, 2020, 10:47:46 AM
 #11

This whole situation is clear as mud, but I remain hopeful of one day getting my coins back. I think many of us would have likely spent those coins at much lower rates if we had access to them, so this may end up being a blessing for many of us who got caught up in this catastrophe.

It’s just another load of bull shit paper work. I’d take the coins I lost there at $250 just to get ‘anything’ back from that travesty. As far as I’m concerned it’s lost money now so I’d take any 3 figure $ sum per coin.

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March 27, 2020, 11:28:04 AM
Merited by OgNasty (2)
 #12

It’s just another load of bull shit paper work. I’d take the coins I lost there at $250 just to get ‘anything’ back from that travesty. As far as I’m concerned it’s lost money now so I’d take any 3 figure $ sum per coin.

So did you give the Fortress offer some thought?

https://www.coindesk.com/investor-fortress-raises-buyout-offer-for-mt-gox-creditor-claims-by-71

I'm not sure what I'd do if I were in this situation. That raised offer would look compelling to me. Giving up 12% off for instant fulfilment starts to look properly tempting.
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March 27, 2020, 01:53:11 PM
 #13

It seems to me that it is difficult to get anything from MtGox now, these scammers are not going to return any money.
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March 27, 2020, 02:11:49 PM
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 #14

It seems to me that it is difficult to get anything from MtGox now, these scammers are not going to return any money.

Nice shitpost.

You don't get any money back from Gox, you get it back from the administrator of the bankruptcy who does happen to have the funds. The sticky bit is getting them back to people. There are still lawsuits outstanding against Gox put together by assholes and then there's the sheer slowness of law.
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March 27, 2020, 10:57:38 PM
 #15

This whole situation is clear as mud, but I remain hopeful of one day getting my coins back. I think many of us would have likely spent those coins at much lower rates if we had access to them, so this may end up being a blessing for many of us who got caught up in this catastrophe.

It’s just another load of bull shit paper work. I’d take the coins I lost there at $250 just to get ‘anything’ back from that travesty. As far as I’m concerned it’s lost money now so I’d take any 3 figure $ sum per coin.

Anyone would give you that amount. As has been stated, you could get nearly $1,200 per coin anytime you wanted if you actually had any there. Personally, I think we’ll probably end up getting around $4,000 per coin once everyone is paid and capital gains are figured in. At the time, I would have likely voluntarily agreed to lock up my coins this long for that return, so it’s hard to be too mad if it comes to fruition.


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March 28, 2020, 08:16:21 AM
 #16

It’s just another load of bull shit paper work. I’d take the coins I lost there at $250 just to get ‘anything’ back from that travesty. As far as I’m concerned it’s lost money now so I’d take any 3 figure $ sum per coin.

So did you give the Fortress offer some thought?

https://www.coindesk.com/investor-fortress-raises-buyout-offer-for-mt-gox-creditor-claims-by-71

I'm not sure what I'd do if I were in this situation. That raised offer would look compelling to me. Giving up 12% off for instant fulfilment starts to look properly tempting.

What does this instant fulfillment refer to, does that mean Mt. Gox customers get their settlements paid immediately? I think even starting the formal process of paying back Mt. Gox customers will take several months to start because other customers are trying to nab larger than their share of the pie https://bitcoinist.com/mt-gox-ex-ceo-asks-judge-to-dismiss-last-remaining-lawsuit/ and 12000 people asking for different prices. I'm not sure if CoinLab* with their own lawsuit is still trying to milk money out of Mt.Gox. Mt. Gox customers don't have any influence over this offer so it's possible that it falls apart and everyone remains stuck with $483/bitcoin payouts.

*It's malicious for companies to expect to be repaid with customer's money by pretending to be shareholders, only Karples and McCaleb were the two Mt.Gox shareholders when it collapsed and neither of them want to receive proceeds from this.

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March 28, 2020, 10:03:09 AM
 #17

What does this instant fulfillment refer to, does that mean Mt. Gox customers get their settlements paid immediately?

Fortress buy your claim from you now for a reduced rate and they claim it themselves when the process is complete. As you point out there's still a lot of potential friction ahead which makes their offer one that I myself would probably take up.

One of the core organisers of Gox victim groups took a similar deal which paid a fair bit less and then walked away from the whole thing.
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March 28, 2020, 10:11:48 AM
 #18

It’s just another load of bull shit paper work. I’d take the coins I lost there at $250 just to get ‘anything’ back from that travesty. As far as I’m concerned it’s lost money now so I’d take any 3 figure $ sum per coin.

Anyone would give you that amount. As has been stated, you could get nearly $1,200 per coin anytime you wanted if you actually had any there. Personally, I think we’ll probably end up getting around $4,000 per coin once everyone is paid and capital gains are figured in.

What is the $4,000 estimate based on? It seems reasonable considering what Fortress is offering and the return they probably expect, but are there recent financials available that would shed some light?

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March 28, 2020, 10:40:52 AM
 #19

What is the $4,000 estimate based on? It seems reasonable considering what Fortress is offering and the return they probably expect, but are there recent financials available that would shed some light?

No idea where the $4000 figure has come from.

I'm not sure how up to date this is but this has been referred to in the past - https://www.ozcoin.com.au

"The formula is: $440 per coin plus $0 damages (damages only apply to fiat, not BTC) plus 18% of your bitcoins plus the same number of bitcoin cash (dollar numbers in USD)."



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March 28, 2020, 11:14:36 AM
 #20

What is the $4,000 estimate based on? It seems reasonable considering what Fortress is offering and the return they probably expect, but are there recent financials available that would shed some light?

No idea where the $4000 figure has come from.

I'm not sure how up to date this is but this has been referred to in the past - https://www.ozcoin.com.au

"The formula is: $440 per coin plus $0 damages (damages only apply to fiat, not BTC) plus 18% of your bitcoins plus the same number of bitcoin cash (dollar numbers in USD)."

It’s based on the BTC and Yen the trustee is holding. There is a 0% chance that we will see only $440 per coin.


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