Any way how to legally transfer your crypto wealth to the tax-free countries?

[ATSgrowth]

Hello, is there someone who thought about the question of how to avoid taxes in your country? Or to pay lower taxes in other countries? I do not want to cheat on my country. But imagine that you live in a country, where I live  , and you have to pay tax from every crypto exchange. Correct, when you exchange for example BTC to ETH, you need to pay a 20% tax. That doesn´t make any sense, why I can´t pay only profit that I earn when I sell my cryptocurrencies to the fiat?

This is mainly caused because the governments do not understand cryptocurrencies and I do not want to pay someone for its ignorance.

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[sheenshane]

Remember that the fees on the exchanges are different from the VAT that you are paying for in your country.
If I were your place, I will pay tax and that's not a problem because that is a small amount that you contribute to the economic growth than you abide by the law by not paying tax in your country, and might the circumstances vary.

Luckily, I'm a part of the tax-free country and our citizens here that used cryptocurrency are no obligation to pay income tax when exchanging crypto for fiat. So, our government can't force anyone not to have to pay the value-added tax (VAT).

Can you state above which country you are? And if you don't mind, I think this is not an appropriate board just mo to Legal board.

Here’s what happens if you don’t pay your taxes.

[LeGaulois]

...

Such bullshit

What the VAT has to do with what @OP is talking about? He didn't mention it. We do not care about your VAT.

"If I was in your place"... But you're not.
"That's a small amount." How fo you even know if @OP is paying a small amount. Small amount+small amount+... = Big money!
Taxed by 20% and you call this a small amount? Are you here just to troll or what? I truly believe you never paid any income tax in your life.

Goin to jail for not paying taxes?  Hold on... you said it's just a small amount... do you think people go to jail for small amounts?

So, our government can't force anyone not to have to pay the value-added tax (VAT).

Clearly no idea what the dude was talking about

[boissonnea]

What the hell tell them that you have Bitcoin, Do not be an idiot
you can buy Bitcoin using anonymization conversion platforms, hide them and trade with them and then pay the tax once when you want to withdraw your profits, it is much less than that you send all the file that contains all the buying and selling operations to the platform.

Your continued payment of a 20% tax on all the profits you make for each sale or purchase will make you win a little.

[ATSgrowth]

...

Such bullshit

What the VAT has to do with what @OP is talking about? He didn't mention it. We do not care about your VAT.

"If I was in your place"... But you're not.
"That's a small amount." How fo you even know if @OP is paying a small amount. Small amount+small amount+... = Big money!
Taxed by 20% and you call this a small amount? Are you here just to troll or what? I truly believe you never paid any income tax in your life.

Goin to jail for not paying taxes?  Hold on... you said it's just a small amount... do you think people go to jail for small amounts?

So, our government can't force anyone not to have to pay the value-added tax (VAT).

Clearly no idea what the dude was talking about

Exactly, in the end, it is a big amount of money and this could be one of the reasons why cryptocurrencies are not widely used. Because when you pay for example for coffee, then you have to also pay additional tax because you are actually exchanging crypto into fiat and then buying a coffee for a price with VAT (another tax) included.

[LeGaulois]

...

Such bullshit

What the VAT has to do with what @OP is talking about? He didn't mention it. We do not care about your VAT.

"If I was in your place"... But you're not.
"That's a small amount." How fo you even know if @OP is paying a small amount. Small amount+small amount+... = Big money!
Taxed by 20% and you call this a small amount? Are you here just to troll or what? I truly believe you never paid any income tax in your life.

Goin to jail for not paying taxes?  Hold on... you said it's just a small amount... do you think people go to jail for small amounts?

So, our government can't force anyone not to have to pay the value-added tax (VAT).

Clearly no idea what the dude was talking about

Exactly, in the end, it is a big amount of money and this could be one of the reasons why cryptocurrencies are not widely used. Because when you pay for example for coffee, then you have to also pay additional tax because you are actually exchanging crypto into fiat and then buying a coffee for a price with VAT (another tax) included.

Don't worry I know what you mean, in my country cryptos gains are taxed by 30% maybe (if I'm correct) That's insane. I agree to be taxed but 30%?.

To answer the question, instead to look for a tax-free country you should look for a P2P place to deal with people.
The idea is, instead to receive bank transfers from an exchange it's better to receive from random individuals: by logic when you receive a bank transfer from an exchange it's easy to guess you sold some coins for some cash. While with individuals, you can always say you sold your underwear or something else.

It's a lot easier to stay under the radar this way. Think about Paypal too, in my country under 10k per year and you're fine.

[ATSgrowth]

...

Such bullshit

What the VAT has to do with what @OP is talking about? He didn't mention it. We do not care about your VAT.

"If I was in your place"... But you're not.
"That's a small amount." How fo you even know if @OP is paying a small amount. Small amount+small amount+... = Big money!
Taxed by 20% and you call this a small amount? Are you here just to troll or what? I truly believe you never paid any income tax in your life.

Goin to jail for not paying taxes?  Hold on... you said it's just a small amount... do you think people go to jail for small amounts?

So, our government can't force anyone not to have to pay the value-added tax (VAT).

Clearly no idea what the dude was talking about

Exactly, in the end, it is a big amount of money and this could be one of the reasons why cryptocurrencies are not widely used. Because when you pay for example for coffee, then you have to also pay additional tax because you are actually exchanging crypto into fiat and then buying a coffee for a price with VAT (another tax) included.

Don't worry I know what you mean, in my country cryptos gains are taxed by 30% maybe (if I'm correct) That's insane. I agree to be taxed but 30%?.

To answer the question, instead to look for a tax-free country you should look for a P2P place to deal with people.
The idea is, instead to receive bank transfers from an exchange it's better to receive from random individuals: by logic when you receive a bank transfer from an exchange it's easy to guess you sold some coins for some cash. While with individuals, you can always say you sold your underwear or something else.

It's a lot easier to stay under the radar this way. Think about Paypal too, in my country under 10k per year and you're fine.

Thank you for your valuable idea. But, I have heard about specialized companies that focus on the study of blockchain transactions. They can interconnect your ID with one of your wallets, aren´t you afraid that in the future they will be even more advanced and one day they will reveal all transactions? When you send your coins for example from Binance to one of your addresses, it is obvious that it is probably yours and from this point you are trapped, or?

[JeromeTash]

Thank you for your valuable idea. But, I have heard about specialized companies that focus on the study of blockchain transactions. They can interconnect your ID with one of your wallets, aren´t you afraid that in the future they will be even more advanced and one day they will reveal all transactions? When you send your coins for example from Binance to one of your addresses, it is obvious that it is probably yours and from this point you are trapped, or?

It depends on how you earn your cryptos and what exchange you use but like it was suggested above. Just use p2p exchanges like local cryptos. I can't imagine paying a 20% tax for every exchange i make between BTC and ETH. That's a ridiculous amount to pay and honestly i would also try as much as possible to dodge such a tax.

If I were you, I would get Fresh bitcoin or ETH addresses that have no connection to my past bank accounts, deposit cyptoassets that i want to exchange for fiat  in them, if possible i would even use mixers(the fee you pay is way lower than that tax) and then use P2P exchanges. There is also a currency exchange section in this forum where you can carry out trade with other members.

[Paycheck]

I'll be damned if I ever will report gains on my coins for taxes.  Screw that noise.  I figure there's enough ways to dance around it.  Use Bitcoin ATMs to withdraw to cash if you don't mind paying the fee.  Withdraw in small amounts over time.  Send it to someone else's bank account with a lame story and have them give you the cash for a small fee.

If you have a lot, pay some local dumbass to set up a bank account that only you can control, and withdraw through that and hit the road.

As recently as 2014, the IRS really didn't know how to handle coin profits, it was a free for all.  Too bad I didn't have a lot more coins then.

[Kupid002]

Sell your bitcoins to a person you know that looking to buy it. If you have friend that's is also bitcoin investors that looking for it try to offer your bitcoin and sell it to them . In that case you  will never need the use of exchange or use other p2p option that can use to convert your bitcoin into cash without using exchange that is the only option you can try now.

[NeuroticFish]

Correct, when you exchange for example BTC to ETH, you need to pay a 20% tax

I know that many countries make you pay taxes for the profit on crypto. That's when you convert into fiat, as you said. But taxes at conversion crypto to crypto? That's insanely stupid.
But for crypto-to-crypto there are still exchanges where you don't need KYC   under certain daily amounts, find some reputable ones for that (Binance can be an option).
And of course, there are the decentralized exchanges, DEXes, which are P2P, but I don't have enough experience on those to tell more.

[ATSgrowth]

Thank you everyone for nice tips. I am not going to sell my cryptocurrencies, I believe in Bitcoin more than in the current financial system. But it is a kind of philosophical question about the future and how to legalize my Bitcoins, respectively pay fewer taxes in the end. Because some of my Bitcoins I earned from bounty campaigns (respectively earned ICO tokens then I exchanged them into BTC - and I should pay taxes at this point, I pray that it would be enough, when one day I come to financial authority, that I sold my Bitcoins and here is your 20% tax).  

[Hydrogen]

Hello, is there someone who thought about the question of how to avoid taxes in your country? Or to pay lower taxes in other countries?

There is a legal path which allows for this.

It is defined by renouncing citizenship with whatever nation demands exorbitantly high taxes.

There has been a significant uptrend in this practice as of the economic crisis of 2008. Many are abandoning citizenship of their nation of birth and taking up residence in low taxation nations with a lower overall cost of living. One segment of the demographic is known as "digital nomads". They could define part of the reason why countries like the philippine opt for 0% cryptocurrency taxes, in the hope of luring citizenship rescinders and their capital holdings into dwelling inside their borders. The same could be said of vanuatu et al.

[ATSgrowth]

Hello, is there someone who thought about the question of how to avoid taxes in your country? Or to pay lower taxes in other countries?

There is a legal path which allows for this.

It is defined by renouncing citizenship with whatever nation demands exorbitantly high taxes.

There has been a significant uptrend in this practice as of the economic crisis of 2008. Many are abandoning citizenship of their nation of birth and taking up residence in low taxation nations with a lower overall cost of living. One segment of the demographic is known as "digital nomads". They could define part of the reason why countries like the philippine opt for 0% cryptocurrency taxes, in the hope of luring citizenship rescinders and their capital holdings into dwelling inside their borders. The same could be said of vanuatu et al.

Awesome idea, about that I haven´t heard any time before. But the question is what everything you loose when you renounce your citizenship and continue living in the country. But, wait, I have different citizenship, but I pay taxes where I work - in which country I receive salaries. So that would mean that I have to move into the Philippines? 

[hugeblack]

Why do not you trade without the need to prove your identity and withdraw currencies in the form of products or devices? Suppose, that taxes on profits are about 30%. How much are taxes on the purchase of phones, PCs, and equipment? I think it's cheaper than a tax on capital.
You can sell these devices and phones at a price difference of 1% or less and thus make a profit without paying more taxes.

Buy 1 BTC --> start Binance trading (without KYC) ---> make 0.4BTC profits ---> buy devices with 1.4BTC ---> selling it with 1.39BTC

[Pluv56]

In my country no tax on it a very free country

[bobitza]

Hello, is there someone who thought about the question of how to avoid taxes in your country? Or to pay lower taxes in other countries? I do not want to cheat on my country. But imagine that you live in a country, where I live  , and you have to pay tax from every crypto exchange. Correct, when you exchange for example BTC to ETH, you need to pay a 20% tax. That doesn´t make any sense, why I can´t pay only profit that I earn when I sell my cryptocurrencies to the fiat?

This is mainly caused because the governments do not understand cryptocurrencies and I do not want to pay someone for its ignorance.

There are also some countries that do not need to pay taxes for converting cryptocurrencies. But you are living in your country, you have to accept the conditions there. I myself had to accept paying the charges I did not want. When I receive my coin then I want to exchange it for cash to spend it I have to pay. But that's the only way I have money to spend if I leave a coin I can't use in my daily life.

[ice18]

when you exchange for example BTC to ETH, you need to pay a 20% tax.

It sounds so strange. I thought that only exchanging crypto to fiat is a taxable event. How could it be proved that a person made crypto to crypto transaction? How is it possible to ascertain that somebody owns a certain amount of coins, while one can easily generate new address for each transaction?

What? btc to eth conversion with 20% tax? OMG this is insane what country is that thats too much if you convert 10k usd worth btc to eth then you have to pay 2k usd for tax?

[btcltcdigger]

Hello, is there someone who thought about the question of how to avoid taxes in your country? Or to pay lower taxes in other countries? I do not want to cheat on my country. But imagine that you live in a country, where I live  , and you have to pay tax from every crypto exchange. Correct, when you exchange for example BTC to ETH, you need to pay a 20% tax. That doesn´t make any sense, why I can´t pay only profit that I earn when I sell my cryptocurrencies to the fiat?

This is mainly caused because the governments do not understand cryptocurrencies and I do not want to pay someone for its ignorance.

I'm not sure there is a way to do it, unless you know and trust someone in THAT taxless or tax-less country.
However, there might be alternatives for you;

If your country supports Revolut and if it's available for you there, you can easily sell your crypto on Coinbase and then SEPA transfer your funds to Revolut account. I believe fees are something along the range of maybe 1-2% and you can then spend your money using Revolut by either paying for stuff, or withdrawing at an ATM.

The other option, again if available where you live, might be Crypto.com card. It functions same as Revolut, but it has an advantage that you can exchange crypto to fiat directly in Crypto.com app.

EDIT: One thing i forgot, KYC is mandatory for these 2 options i listed, keep that in mind

[Findingnemo]

Avoiding tax isn't illegal, you have lot of way to convert your money into fiat in your country itself and you don't have to pay 20% tax all the transfers.Peer to peer trading can help you to deal with converting fiat. Or you can buy something with cryptos and then later sell it on amazon or any e-commerce site to make it legal money with less tax.

[akhjob]

Thank you for your valuable idea. But, I have heard about specialized companies that focus on the study of blockchain transactions. They can interconnect your ID with one of your wallets, aren´t you afraid that in the future they will be even more advanced and one day they will reveal all transactions? When you send your coins for example from Binance to one of your addresses, it is obvious that it is probably yours and from this point you are trapped, or?

If you are worried that someone may trackback the transactions from an exchange and eventually find your wallet, convert all your exchange holdings into Monero and then use xmr.to to convert it back to Bitcoin and send it to your Wallet. This way nobody can find your wallet.

[gentlemand]

Avoiding tax isn't illegal, you have lot of way to convert your money into fiat in your country itself and you don't have to pay 20% tax all the transfers.Peer to peer trading can help you to deal with converting fiat. Or you can buy something with cryptos and then later sell it on amazon or any e-commerce site to make it legal money with less tax.

That's not avoiding, that's evasion. That's what sends them coming down on you hard.

OP's question largely depends on what country they're in and what their policies are.

In the UK you'd have to move away and convince them that you'd permanently moved to remove any tax liability. We have a few local tax havens like the Isle of Man and the Channel Islands where there's no capital gains if you didn't fancy going far.

There's no such as sending your BTC to another country and staying put while it's cashed out and then comes back magically free of tax. If that were possible the entire world would be doing it.

[Lanatsa]

Avoiding tax isn't illegal, you have lot of way to convert your money into fiat in your country itself and you don't have to pay 20% tax all the transfers.Peer to peer trading can help you to deal with converting fiat. Or you can buy something with cryptos and then later sell it on amazon or any e-commerce site to make it legal money with less tax.

Its tax evasion and we know its illegal in any aspect!

When a certain government or country do really impose strict laws about taxation then as a citizen then you would really need to abide with the rules or else you would face up charges.

What sucks here is that the amount or percentage been asked is 20% which is totally bullshit if i were to say.Its too damn high and if i do live on such country i might

consider on evading taxes too. 

[btcltcdigger]

These replies if it's legal or not reminds me of this



I think most countries tax only fiat, or crypto ONCE it's converted to fiat.
And at that, over a certain amount. In EU its 10k euro. Which means, technically you can go to other country, withdrw 1 BTC (at current price) and bring cash. That's legal.
Countries can't track cash.

Having said that, if your income is lets say $2000  month, but you're spending $5000 a month without any loan, you'll get on their radar.

That is why many banks are now forcing people into cashless society, where everything has to pass through your bank account, and is reported to the govt.

[glowing10]

Avoiding tax isn't illegal, you have lot of way to convert your money into fiat in your country itself and you don't have to pay 20% tax all the transfers.Peer to peer trading can help you to deal with converting fiat. Or you can buy something with cryptos and then later sell it on amazon or any e-commerce site to make it legal money with less tax.

This is as good as tax theft because there is no way you are adjusting as per any provision provided by your country law where you can take tax refund or set off against anything. This you are doing it by your own will, and you are still liable to pay your taxes. Government still can charge you for this and must pay tax penalty in such instance.

[imstillthebest]

....

i heard on a news one time that person got arrested for bringing so much cash while travelling . how could you carry that 1 btc worth of cash ? thats already alot compare to the guy's on the said news  but why convert to cash when crypto arent trackable anyway ?  your pic was correct . its not illegal if no one will know about it . laslty , are there countries that are tax free ? thats freakin cool lol . what country was that .

[traderethereum]

I think most countries tax only fiat, or crypto ONCE it's converted to fiat.
And at that, over a certain amount. In EU its 10k euro. Which means, technically you can go to other country, withdrw 1 BTC (at current price) and bring cash. That's legal.
Countries can't track cash.

Having said that, if your income is lets say $2000  month, but you're spending $5000 a month without any loan, you'll get on their radar.

That is why many banks are now forcing people into cashless society, where everything has to pass through your bank account, and is reported to the govt.

When you withdraw 1 bitcoin and send it to your bank, that will make the bank alarm sound, and they will investigate how you can get that money before it's transferred into your account.
I think he can withdraw for a little amount less than $500 to his bank account, so that will not make the bank suspicious.
I think the bank will not ask if you got a transfer for a small amount to your account, and they will feel that you have other jobs.
But you can search for other people who want to buy bitcoin from you, and they can transfer the money to your bank account, but once again, don't sell it for a large amount of bitcoin.

[-CryptoViking-]

....

i heard on a news one time that person got arrested for bringing so much cash while travelling . how could you carry that 1 btc worth of cash ? thats already alot compare to the guy's on the said news  but why convert to cash when crypto arent trackable anyway ?  your pic was correct . its not illegal if no one will know about it . laslty , are there countries that are tax free ? thats freakin cool lol . what country was that .

Well you convert to cash if you need to buy something that you can't yet buy with crypto, simple as that. So you need some way to avoid tax. Some people buy gold with crypto and then resell the gold as there are some places where you can buy gold, no questions asked.

People don't get arrested for carrying 10k, 20k dollars, people can get arrested if they are connected to suspicious activity and they do have large piles of cash with them. Then questions are asked and things start to move in a direction you don't want them to move

[btcltcdigger]

Well you convert to cash if you need to buy something that you can't yet buy with crypto, simple as that. So you need some way to avoid tax. Some people buy gold with crypto and then resell the gold as there are some places where you can buy gold, no questions asked.

People don't get arrested for carrying 10k, 20k dollars, people can get arrested if they are connected to suspicious activity and they do have large piles of cash with them. Then questions are asked and things start to move in a direction you don't want them to move

Honestly, most jewlers will do this for you if you agree to go OTC. They sell goods, get profit, and avoid taxes. Win win win.
On a lesser scale, pawn shops are an option as well

[romero121]

I don't know how things work with the taxation on cryptocurrency transactions made in converting to fiat or wise versa. Myself encountered an issue with the bank where I have the account. I sold bitcoin when it was around $7500. A huge amount deposit into my account was marked and I was called by an authority from the bank for enquiry. I've been questioned from where did my money came. It was my money, and I need to answer the banking sector. I mentioned it as a pay send by my friend for my house construction. After all this I was allowed to withdraw my balance from the account.

Here if I've said the money was from selling bitcoin the bank might have not allowed me to withdraw the money. They just try to freeze it and send it to the reserve. This wis what happens, as of now I haven't found something perfect as taxation on cryptocurrency in my country.

[atjiat]

I don't know how things work with the taxation on cryptocurrency transactions made in converting to fiat or wise versa. Myself encountered an issue with the bank where I have the account. I sold bitcoin when it was around $7500. A huge amount deposit into my account was marked and I was called by an authority from the bank for enquiry. I've been questioned from where did my money came. It was my money, and I need to answer the banking sector. I mentioned it as a pay send by my friend for my house construction. After all this I was allowed to withdraw my balance from the account.

Here if I've said the money was from selling bitcoin the bank might have not allowed me to withdraw the money. They just try to freeze it and send it to the reserve. This wis what happens, as of now I haven't found something perfect as taxation on cryptocurrency in my country.

I think that, first of all, it all depends on how the government legalized the activities of citizens in the cryptocurrency market. If the cryptocurrency is legalized in a specific country, then there are no problems with providing specific information in a banking institution. They will one way or another make a note about the origin of your funds. In each country, everything happens in a different way, but for example in Ukraine there are certain limits for funds that are of cryptocurrency origin, where the corresponding requirements are set for the user.

[MikeyVeez]

You can create a company on Malta, or in another tax heaven country and then deposit your money here. Then you will have money that comes from the company that is in a tax heaven country. Hope you understand. 

[shlomogold]

Hello, is there someone who thought about the question of how to avoid taxes in your country? Or to pay lower taxes in other countries? I do not want to cheat on my country. But imagine that you live in a country, where I live  , and you have to pay tax from every crypto exchange. Correct, when you exchange for example BTC to ETH, you need to pay a 20% tax. That doesn´t make any sense, why I can´t pay only profit that I earn when I sell my cryptocurrencies to the fiat?

This is mainly caused because the governments do not understand cryptocurrencies and I do not want to pay someone for its ignorance.

you can become Monaco resident. 0% income tax

[claire_lovely]

I found this service which looks great for offshore tax strategies:
https://nomadcapitalist.com/

Even if you live in a country where it is taxed, you can buy from other users instead of exchanges to prevent the government from knowing how much cryptocurrency you have.

This wallet will also use CoinJoin to shuffle transactions for further privacy:
https://wasabiwallet.io/

[rodskee]

This is mainly caused because the governments do not understand cryptocurrencies and I do not want to pay someone for its ignorance.

Even if the government knows nothing about crypto currencies yet it is their obligation to seek for taxes in any profiteering we are having,and it is our obligation to Pay taxes in same manner.

why not wanted to pay for your obligation?

hope you'll find country to transfer your account without scamming happen.

[Cryptoangel01]

Move over to my country buddy and enjoy your stack without the government coming for your neck lol. By the way I'm from Nigeria Africa, you can check us out and meet me in pm. I would love to have you hear 

[slapper]

Avoiding tax can make you go to jail. However, a 20% tax is somehow unreasonably high. I do not know which country you are currently live in but I believe that the government does not like cryptocurrency or blockchain at all. Making a nonsense tax rate like this is the reason why bitcoin does not have any spot to shine. I have heard the news that Korea has also put a tax on Bitcoin exchange at a ridiculous rate. Well, try to buy bitcoin from other's countries and I guess you can have a more acceptable price

[LeGaulois]

.

Buying bitcoins in another country, a company located in another country, doesn't help. Taxes are paid after you sold your bitcoins.
Here we're talking about tax gains, not the VAT.

If a country has a high rate of taxes it doesn't make it unfriendly to cryptocurrencies. It's because the country considers Bitcoin as a type of investment and tax it as it taxes others investments in the same category.

If my country taxes my gains on real estate at 30% it doesn't make it unfriendly to real estate investment

Good luck to live in Monaco. And if you're trying to save some bucks from the taxes, it doesn't make sense to move there. Perhaps you won't pay a tax but you will pay your rent double, electricity triple, and so on.

[gentlemand]

Good luck to live in Monaco. And if you're trying to save some bucks from the taxes, it doesn't make sense to move there. Perhaps you won't pay a tax but you will pay your rent double, electricity triple, and so on.

As you say by the time you add up buying property your tax saving, unless you're talking tens of millions of dollars, will evaporate. And after all that outlay you're stuck in Monaco which is a comically horrid place to live. There's something in the mind set of people willing to give up everything and embrace something worse for nothing other than money that's reflected strongly in places like these.

[Miaallen]

I understand your point here. I actually first thought u wanted to evade tax which is illegal. And on how your case is, you might need a partner who lives in Africa as most of the countries there hardly levy taxes on their citizens beyond the corporate and civil servants.