does it really make sense trading on Bitcoin?

[exstasie]

since I discovered this crypto market I have always been fond of trading, and I have always tried to train and educate myself to improve my skills.

On the other hand I always had to live side by side with those who call themselves holders, i.e. those who don't take decisions.
They just accumulate no matter what, based on the faith that bitcoin's price will always increase (I said price, not value, on puropse. They talk about disrupting, about new order but all they care for is to have a share of the pie, like anyone else)

Now, this is the exact opposite of what I think of investing: blindingly relying on something that you cannot control but, for the time being, they are being proved right.

If it proves right that the real, deep power of bitcoin is scarcity, and that this scarcity will always push its value (and price) higher, IF this is true, what sense does it even make trading bitcoin?

I can think of a couple reasons.

It's worth trading if you're confident you can increase the number of BTC you own. That simply compounds the gains from holding.

There are also plenty of people out there who are more concerned about protecting their trading capital (in USD terms) than whether or not they lose coins. Those people will hold USD as a hedge sometimes and will probably lose coins over time. To them, it's worth it to not have to ride out Bitcoin's infamous shakeouts and crashes.

Don't get me wrong, I still hate holders ok, with their mantras, their plan-b and stf shit, butwhat I mean is may be they are right. May be BTC is in that phase where it still pays being herd, the herd of holders..

I can sympathize. And yep, we're definitely in a phase where it'll pay off big to hold.

[AakZaki]

<snip>

What makes you unbelievable and unreasonable, the real evidence around us is plentiful. As long as there is consensus and confidence in the value of digital currencies, this trade will continue. Maybe you need to dig deeper into the initial process of bitcoin so that it can be trusted and traded. Regarding scarcity and price, this is the same as many people believe, when the demand for Bitcoin is increasing but this is not accompanied by an increase in stock because the supply of bitcoin has been determined by its creator and cannot be increased.

[boyptc]

Don't mind others' business.

Just mind yourself and how you'll deal with this market. If your sole plan is to do the same as holders, you can follow each step that they do.

But if you don't like them, then dollar-cost average or trade or whichever strategy you come up with. Satisfy yourself which is productive to you.

Nothing beats out and no other thing that would be satisfying if you do just follow your own rules and plans!

It doesnt matter if your a hodler or an active trader as long on what satisfies you then go for it.Dont mind with others sentiments or commentaries because

its your own money and you do have the full rights on how you would gonna deal with the market.If you do lose then its your lose not theirs.So its better to stick on it.

We do have our own ways and own paths to deal on.

Yes.

If someone does make it look bad that others do and they don't hurt nor scam others, what's wrong looking at them if they do no harm to people and they enjoy doing things such as holding.

There's nothing wrong with that but it's best if you have found a strategy that will make you happy and profitable.

[niccolo_21]

thanks for your answers, and please let me articulate better what I think.

Have you ever visited a symbolic place BEFORE the social networks came up?

Like, I don't know, eating a piece of the famous cake with your wife at the the Sacher hotel's restaurant in Wien; or taking a walk along the Adrian Wall in Scotland or I don't know finding yourself in a spot in some city where some important or historical picture has been shot and suddenly realizing that you are there, in the very same place?

All of this, any of this, could feel unique especially if you do that with someone you love in your life.

Now, try and do that NOW, now that social networks have completely eaten everything. No stone has been left unturned: that feeling of uniqueness, of discovery is truly always harder and harder to find, because everyone can "reach" anyplace and anything and make it "social", "trendy", trivial.

And this is the point: when you watch them taking selfies, let's say in a place that you discovered with your own efforts (or with your own casuality) you think to yourself: how can they consider themselves UNIQUE if they are doing something so common, so predictable, so "social"?

That's it. That's the exact same question that I have when I think (and read) about holders, or better said HODLERS.

They like to think themselves as someone who is going against something: against the system, against the herd, against the institutions, against the banks.. but they are all the same: they ARE THE HERD..

They are exactly like tourists with your special places on the social networks, with all their passwords and hashtags: #planB, #StockToFlow, #disrupting, #shortthebanks, #neworder ecc ecc

When, let me say that again, all they really want is just a piece of the pie. Like anyone else, like you and I.

And what I have learned from the market is that herds are usually punished.

My sadness, my disappointment was just may be having to realize that this time being herd pays off.

That's all

[MCobian]

You can't blame other people for having a different strategy, everyone must have a different strategy in generating profits.
Please just use a strategy that is considered comfortable to be used by each person, and it's best not to hate other people
who have different strategies. So the freedom of everyone to choose to be holders or traders, I think both crypto holding
and crypto trading are profitable.

[Quidat]

You can't blame other people for having a different strategy, everyone must have a different strategy in generating profits.
Please just use a strategy that is considered comfortable to be used by each person, and it's best not to hate other people
who have different strategies. So the freedom of everyone to choose to be holders or traders, I think both crypto holding
and crypto trading are profitable.

We do have indeed our own ways and i cant really see the point on why there are people who do have this kind of mindset where they do criticize
on what are the ways or methods on other people been using on their trades neither they do held up or simply making active trades.It doesnt really
matter because it would really be on different method and as mentioned we do have our own ways and also it doesnt mean that it does work for you
it would work into others or it do works for them but doesnt work on you.So its just normal for us to seek out on what do suit out and profitable for us.

[Sled]

If you keep yourself doubted about the capability of Bitcoin, you'd better not use it instead.
The majority of traders are using this coin and they don't seem to have regrets instead of seeing them become profitable. In fact, this is my first choice when I come into trading and I'm not wrong in choosing this. And one reason I choose Bitcoin because of its high volatility, which I think that it is more profitable than those less volatile coins.

[Cherylstar86]

<snip>

What makes you unbelievable and unreasonable, the real evidence around us is plentiful. As long as there is consensus and confidence in the value of digital currencies, this trade will continue. Maybe you need to dig deeper into the initial process of bitcoin so that it can be trusted and traded. Regarding scarcity and price, this is the same as many people believe, when the demand for Bitcoin is increasing but this is not accompanied by an increase in stock because the supply of bitcoin has been determined by its creator and cannot be increased.

That's the reality of bitcoin in the first place and we can't scrutinize it's capabilities, and I think OP's statement was due to his frustrations. Most probably he's been trading bitcoin without proper knowledge about, buying while price was too high can affect every desire once the price won't pump. Patience is very important to develop good skills towards trading, and on my own opinion everything make sense about bitcoin. Let's be thankful for the holders who remains faithful for such a long time, despite of many challenges.

[Rengga Jati]

You don't need to hate the holder for any reason, because this is the choice. And holders also don't hate traders, because this is also their choice. Both holders and traders can make their respective contributions to the development of crypto. So there is no need to worry about what the holder wants. They have their own strategy. And maybe, the holder is a trader. He can be both at the same time. Because this is a strategy, a strategy to win something, to get profits according to your wishes and targets.
So why bother thinking about them?

Don't mind others' business.

Just mind yourself and how you'll deal with this market. If your sole plan is to do the same as holders, you can follow each step that they do.

But if you don't like them, then dollar-cost average or trade or whichever strategy you come up with. Satisfy yourself which is productive to you.

I love how you immediately say this. Mind your own business so that you can be more focus on what you do, not what the other do. 

[Mrengage]

since I discovered this crypto market I have always been fond of trading, and I have always tried to train and educate myself to improve my skills.

On the other hand I always had to live side by side with those who call themselves holders, i.e. those who don't take decisions.
They just accumulate no matter what, based on the faith that bitcoin's price will always increase (I said price, not value, on puropse. They talk about disrupting, about new order but all they care for is to have a share of the pie, like anyone else)

Now, this is the exact opposite of what I think of investing: blindingly relying on something that you cannot control but, for the time being, they are being proved right.

If it proves right that the real, deep power of bitcoin is scarcity, and that this scarcity will always push its value (and price) higher, IF this is true, what sense does it even make trading bitcoin?

I mean, you could always do it of course, but there's no much relevance about it..

on the other hand a trader could argue: "look at gold. Gold is scarce as well but it's not always rising".

yes of course, but at the same time it will unlikely come back to its lowest prices, to the price levels of, say, 70s or 80s..

Don't get me wrong, I still hate holders ok, with their mantras, their plan-b and stf shit, butwhat I mean is may be they are right. May be BTC is in that phase where it still pays being herd, the herd of holders..

BTC is not always stable hope u know, I presume you try using USDT pairs and see the difference. IMO, few traders I know used usdt pairs when I asked they said they like it most because BTC doesn't affect it when it's dipping and USDT is a Fiat not crypto.

[XZERO1]

since I discovered this crypto market I have always been fond of trading, and I have always tried to train and educate myself to improve my skills.

On the other hand I always had to live side by side with those who call themselves holders, i.e. those who don't take decisions.
They just accumulate no matter what, based on the faith that bitcoin's price will always increase (I said price, not value, on puropse. They talk about disrupting, about new order but all they care for is to have a share of the pie, like anyone else)

I think it should be no wonder that people are different and so are their strategies on making money off the market, both sides have their own reason for doing it that way and not the other way, long-term investors doing just that because they deeply believe what they bough is really undervalued right now and 2-3x is not enough return for them and they're willing to gamble and wait longer until they think it's at the right value(price), on the other hand traders don't pay that much attention to the fundamental and future potential or even if they do they just don't care much about it and they're not going to wait that long and risk losing money because they're in it for the short-term return.

But over all in my opinion the best strategy would be to be invested in some coins/tokens long-term and on the side make some shorter-term trades as well, that way you have the both sides, and you're minimizing your risk exposure and you're not missing out on any possible profit coming from either strategy.

[davinchi]

Obviously people will have different opinions on how bitcoin should be treated, some may hold it, some may trade it, some may work to earn it while some may spend it on stuff instead of see it as a way to profit. Everyone can look at bitcoin differently, it is not really something we need to be decisive about, there is no "best" way to look into bitcoin and use it, doesn't matter how you do it, as long as you are in the crypto world and you are playing a part in growing it, that would mean that you are doing a good job for the whole crypto community.

Only people who are not doing any favors here are the type of people who constantly spread FUD about how bitcoin will be gone one day. Those people who spread doom on bitcoin are both useless because we are doing awesome, but also hurtful if they are ever successful.

[usekevin]

since I discovered this crypto market I have always been fond of trading, and I have always tried to train and educate myself to improve my skills.

On the other hand I always had to live side by side with those who call themselves holders, i.e. those who don't take decisions.
They just accumulate no matter what, based on the faith that bitcoin's price will always increase (I said price, not value, on puropse. They talk about disrupting, about new order but all they care for is to have a share of the pie, like anyone else)

I think it should be no wonder that people are different and so are their strategies on making money off the market, both sides have their own reason for doing it that way and not the other way, long-term investors doing just that because they deeply believe what they bough is really undervalued right now and 2-3x is not enough return for them and they're willing to gamble and wait longer until they think it's at the right value(price), on the other hand traders don't pay that much attention to the fundamental and future potential or even if they do they just don't care much about it and they're not going to wait that long and risk losing money because they're in it for the short-term return.

But over all in my opinion the best strategy would be to be invested in some coins/tokens long-term and on the side make some shorter-term trades as well, that way you have the both sides, and you're minimizing your risk exposure and you're not missing out on any possible profit coming from either strategy.

Traders will be two different type.One type of trader is short term traders.They are margin trader, will sell their in short term with the minimum money as a profit. Only experienced people will get into long term trading.Because they will have huge believe on bitcoin and they will hold the bitcoin till the price of bitcoin had reached maximum value.

[ScamViruS]

If you keep yourself doubted about the capability of Bitcoin, you'd better not use it instead.
The majority of traders are using this coin and they don't seem to have regrets instead of seeing them become profitable. In fact, this is my first choice when I come into trading and I'm not wrong in choosing this. And one reason I choose Bitcoin because of its high volatility, which I think that it is more profitable than those less volatile coins.

You will never succeed in that thing unless you stop doubting it. Most of the traders who come to crypto trading prefer to trade bitcoin. But everyone has their own way of accepting something so it is better to leave it to them. I trade bitcoin to increase the amount of bitcoin I hold, so the more volatile the market, the more ways for me to take a position in the market. So it would be better if everyone took everything in their own way.

[boyptc]

~snip~

Thank you for sharing what you think about holders. It's your thought and opinion so that's it. But as I've said, it is what it is and we can live peacefully without minding others business.

Don't mind others' business.

Just mind yourself and how you'll deal with this market. If your sole plan is to do the same as holders, you can follow each step that they do.

But if you don't like them, then dollar-cost average or trade or whichever strategy you come up with. Satisfy yourself which is productive to you.

I love how you immediately say this. Mind your own business so that you can be more focus on what you do, not what the other do. 

Exactly.

[Fredomago]

If you keep yourself doubted about the capability of Bitcoin, you'd better not use it instead.
The majority of traders are using this coin and they don't seem to have regrets instead of seeing them become profitable. In fact, this is my first choice when I come into trading and I'm not wrong in choosing this. And one reason I choose Bitcoin because of its high volatility, which I think that it is more profitable than those less volatile coins.

You will never succeed in that thing unless you stop doubting it. Most of the traders who come to crypto trading prefer to trade bitcoin. But everyone has their own way of accepting something so it is better to leave it to them. I trade bitcoin to increase the amount of bitcoin I hold, so the more volatile the market, the more ways for me to take a position in the market. So it would be better if everyone took everything in their own way.

Well said! If you want to see yourself succeeding then stop doubting, it won't help you instead of doing that why not begin to do your deeper research, keep adding knowledge to yourself, it helps to open your mind to plan ahead of time. You have to keep competing this venue of investment is open for everybody.

Different strategy in hope with single goal to achieved, no one invested here and  think of losing it and letting their hard-earned money to waste for nothing, we all here with the same thing in mind. Maximized everything to enjoy all the benefits.

[militiariko]

It is actually convenient trading bitcoin especially when you focus on a single exchange, buy low then sell high, taking profits at every strides. It is easy because you get to study, monitor and check price alerts only for btc pairs. With consistency, you can take profits well

[wxa7115]

since I discovered this crypto market I have always been fond of trading, and I have always tried to train and educate myself to improve my skills.

On the other hand I always had to live side by side with those who call themselves holders, i.e. those who don't take decisions.
They just accumulate no matter what, based on the faith that bitcoin's price will always increase (I said price, not value, on puropse. They talk about disrupting, about new order but all they care for is to have a share of the pie, like anyone else)

Now, this is the exact opposite of what I think of investing: blindingly relying on something that you cannot control but, for the time being, they are being proved right.

If it proves right that the real, deep power of bitcoin is scarcity, and that this scarcity will always push its value (and price) higher, IF this is true, what sense does it even make trading bitcoin?

I mean, you could always do it of course, but there's no much relevance about it..

on the other hand a trader could argue: "look at gold. Gold is scarce as well but it's not always rising".

yes of course, but at the same time it will unlikely come back to its lowest prices, to the price levels of, say, 70s or 80s..

Don't get me wrong, I still hate holders ok, with their mantras, their plan-b and stf shit, butwhat I mean is may be they are right. May be BTC is in that phase where it still pays being herd, the herd of holders..

Of course it still makes sense to trade bitcoin, and the reason for that is very obvious, let us suppose that there is a long term holder that is only holding one bitcoin and the price of bitcoin grows 10 times its current price but despite that growth he still has only one bitcoin, the price of his bitcoin has increased but the number of bitcoins he is holding has not.

But as a trader supposing that you have a way to profit from the markets you will end up with more bitcoin in your wallet which will increase your profits in the case you are in the market during the time in which the movement that we describe in the paragraph above happens, a trader will always be more profitable than a long term holder as long as he knows what he's doing, but people love holding bitcoin because it gives great profits with no effort and in a very short amount of time.

[Boov]

It is actually convenient trading bitcoin especially when you focus on a single exchange, buy low then sell high, taking profits at every strides. It is easy because you get to study, monitor and check price alerts only for btc pairs. With consistency, you can take profits well

Yeah, we really can take profits but without having a strong foundation on your knowledge I am not confident that we're going to make it successfully. Convenience in trading comes after hardwork and there's no easy task in real world, everything comes with challenges and efforts for us to reach our dreams to gain good amount of profit on trading.

[Janation]

It is actually convenient trading bitcoin especially when you focus on a single exchange, buy low then sell high, taking profits at every strides. It is easy because you get to study, monitor and check price alerts only for btc pairs. With consistency, you can take profits well

That still depends.

Does that person have that time to be able to check price charts and exchange so that he can take advantage of the changes that are happening? Does he know that it is a falling point or an increasing point so he can decide whether he will invest or ge will sell it? It is hard and if that person didn't know that, he will regret it.