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Author Topic: Blockstream Jade - fully open source hardware wallet  (Read 363 times)
witcher_sense (OP)
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January 05, 2021, 11:43:29 AM
Merited by Symmetrick (7), hugeblack (6), dkbit98 (4), malevolent (2), Pmalek (2), ABCbits (1), Rath_ (1)
 #1


If you prefer open source hardware wallets, then take a closer look at this new product from - Blockstream Jade.

Recently, Blockstream team (Blockstream CEO Dr. Adam Back and Blockstream Chief Architect Lawrence Nahum) has announced their new hardware wallet Jade with fully open source hardware and software.

This wallet will support Bitcoin BTC and all Liquid assets of the Liquid Network (L-BTC, Tether (USDt), L-CAD, JPYS and others).



The hardware wallet is available for pre-order at an affordable price.



Additional information (Q&A from recent AMA on Reddit):

Q: Is the WiFi in the MCU disabled via firmware? Do you have plans to use WiFi in the future?
A: The WiFI in the MCU is currently disabled but can be enabled. Jade comes with two firmware variants, one with radio and one without radio. The one without radio doesn't have the WiFi or BLE drivers to work. Jade ships with the BLE firmware but comes with BLE off by default.

Q: Is Jade PSBT compatible?
A: Jade uses wally which has PSBT support. At the moment Jade supports Green multisig which doesn't take advantage of PSBT yet. We plan to add to Jade single sig and PSBT support.

Q: Where is it manufactured?
A: Same manufacturer as M5 Stack but a custom model for Blockstream.

Q: Are you selling device at-cost or at-loss?
A: No we are not subsidizing the hardware, keep in mind Jade is based on libwally which does most of the heavy lifting.

Q: What is "server enforced PIN protection"?
A: The mnemonic when generated is immediately encrypted using AES256 using a secret key that is computed through an encrypted and authenticated channel with a [remote] blind oracle server, the authentication involves ephemeral elliptic curve Diffie Hellman exchange with a known server key. The encrypted mnemonic is then stored on the encrypted flash of the Jade and protected by secure boot [v2].

The blind server is not aware of the actual PIN nor can brute force it. The blind server also is not associated with the users account (it is not associated with the per user derivation paths)

If the PIN is entered incorrectly 3 times the server and Jade both delete the secret requiring a from scratch mnemonic restore on Jade.

The companion app nor any ISP/WiFi AP in the middle can inspect the data passed between Jade and the oracle, including being able to tell if the PIN is correct or wrong (other than potential timing attacks). The oracle is available via Tor and open source and in the future users will be able to run their own and point their Jade to it if they prefer.


Q: Can it be used with non-Blockstream wallets?
A: At the moment it is not supported but full support is planned. Currently it may work but may require to confirm change manually and may not enforce single sig path anti-ransom checks.

Q: Why did you choose to make this device?
A: The initial experiment was porting libwally to esp32 and was based on the [PocketSprite](https://pocketsprite.com/) but most of the development occurred on any of the easy to find esp32 boards and then on real Jades.

We think the market has good hardware wallets but felt there was space for something a bit different, with some different design decisions and feature set. Specifically we wanted to experiment with Liquid features as well as advanced bitcoin features.

Q: How does the security model compare to Trezor, Ledger, Coldcard?
A: Jade doesn't have a secure element so there's that.

However it has secure boot + encrypted flash and as per prior answer it has a blind oracle enforced PIN. This acts almost as a remote 'secure element'.


Q: How should we define a “hardware wallet” – should the definition include Internet-connected devices that communicate with servers? Is an airgap important or is it just security theater?
A: Hardware Wallet have a thinner surface of attack compared to your average internet connected laptop or mobile phone. This both when it comes to the OS stack as well as radio/network.

For maximum security you probably want to avoid radio all together, however then you can't use a hardware wallet with iOS. Well unless you use the camera, which is something we are working on (it works but requires some improvements)


Links:
https://store.blockstream.com/product/blockstream-jade/
https://blockstream.com/jade
https://blockstream.com/2021/01/03/en-secure-your-bitcoin-and-liquid-assets-with-blockstream-jade/
https://github.com/Blockstream/Jade
https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/kqgehd/were_the_blockstream_team_and_we_just_announced/
https://twitter.com/Blockstream
https://www.reddit.com/u/adam3us/
https://www.reddit.com/u/bitfast/

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January 05, 2021, 12:11:41 PM
Last edit: January 05, 2021, 12:21:44 PM by dkbit98
 #2

I saw yesterday this news and I like that Jade wallet will be fully open source with nice presale price, but some wannabe expert writers from this forum are maybe going to sue them, because Jade is not 'the real hardware wallet' as it does not have secure element holly grail  Cheesy, but it does have secure boot and encrypted flash.

Good thing about it is that we can use any M5STack device with their open source software:

Quote
As Blockstream Jade is fully open source, advanced users can flash Blockstream Jade’s firmware onto their own hardware (we’d recommend the M5Stack Fire). This ensures that users can build their own Bitcoin and Liquid wallets to minimize supply chain risks.
https://blockstream.com/2021/01/03/en-secure-your-bitcoin-and-liquid-assets-with-blockstream-jade/

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January 05, 2021, 04:07:11 PM
Merited by hugeblack (6), Rath_ (2)
 #3

Yeah, but for now it only supports Blockstream Green, might not be a big deal for some people but I have had more issues with their server and connectivity then any other wallet.
Give me a nice wallet like electrum that I can connect to my own server and I'll be happy.
Yeah, you can turn on SPV and list trusted servers, but I have never been able to get it to work properly with their app either.
Could just be me, but there are enough other wallets out there that do it properly.

Beyond that,

Additional information (Q&A from recent AMA on Reddit):
Q: Where is it manufactured?
A: Same manufacturer as M5 Stack but a custom model for Blockstream.

If you can't come out and say it's made in China, (good or bad no opinion here) then you are playing politics and that's BS.

-Dave


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January 06, 2021, 12:02:42 AM
 #4

I can't recall seeing any hardware wallet in this price range equipped with a camera. Would anyone be interested in a review of this device?* I have already got a couple of hardware wallets, but it never hurts to get an extra one. I am aware of the limited functionality at launch, so I would keep updating my review over time. I kind of trust Blockstream more with their promises than Trezor which has implemented only one feature taking advantage of the model T's built-in SD card reader - probably, out of necessity.

* - it's not that I need to somehow justify the purchase of another hardware wallet...
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January 06, 2021, 12:17:29 PM
 #5

If you can't come out and say it's made in China, (good or bad no opinion here) then you are playing politics and that's BS.

Isn't iPhone also made in China but nobody say made in PRC even if everyone knows it?  Cheesy

They said full support is planned for other wallets and it may even work now (probably for Electrum).

Would anyone be interested in a review of this device?

I would test it, and maybe Blockstream CEO and active forum member Adam Back is going to provide some test devices for fellow bitcointalk members Wink

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January 07, 2021, 08:55:52 PM
 #6

The standout concern for me here is this reliance on a remote server for the "server enforced PIN protection"... does this mean that if the "blind oracle" is offline for whatever reason, that you can't actually use the device? Huh

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January 08, 2021, 10:37:48 AM
 #7

If I understood properly, this is a bitcoin and liquid assets only type of hardware wallet. No ether or other alts will be supported.
I am not happy having WIFI on it. It introduces another potential attack vector for no reason. I am not really comfortable with the bluetooth feature by Ledger either.

The price tag is OK but I hope it will work with other wallets besides Blockstream as well. 

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January 08, 2021, 11:53:58 AM
 #8

Adam Back said that they have firmware that can remove radio drivers, and you can consider USDT as altcoin that will be supported in Jade wallet as well as any token listed on Liquid network.

Quote
Flexibility. The esp32 MCU cpu has ble+wifi support. It's a common embedded SoC with a range of IoT kits with buttons and screen you can buy like M5Stack fire, which changes the supply chain tampering risk, if you DIY. We also have an optional firmware that removes radio drivers.
https://twitter.com/adam3us/status/1347304560075943939

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January 13, 2021, 07:18:19 AM
 #9

The standout concern for me here is this reliance on a remote server for the "server enforced PIN protection"... does this mean that if the "blind oracle" is offline for whatever reason, that you can't actually use the device? Huh
I don't like the idea of being reliant on third-party servers either, especially when it comes to managing your own keys. With that design of a hardware wallet, you can't access your funds independently, you have to rely on others and ask their permission to join, which is a terrible idea by itself and goes against principles of decentralization. Moreover, you need an Internet connection just to unlock your hardware wallet, which makes things too complicated if you want to sign messages offline. The good part is that the blind oracle will be open-source in the future, so users will be able to run their own oracles. I am not sure how it will work though.

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January 15, 2021, 10:08:30 PM
 #10

The good part is that the blind oracle will be open-source in the future, so users will be able to run their own oracles. I am not sure how it will work though.
Lets see if / when they actually release it. And what the requirements are.
Yes, you can run your own oracle just compile this code and there is no support.
Yes, you can run your own oracle, you just need to have a fully synced node and some other stuff.
etc.
Yeah, I might be a bit (a lot) dramatic about it, but the entire point of a hardware wallet is as you said, NOT to rely on other people / software.

-Dave

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July 03, 2021, 09:41:36 PM
Merited by HCP (2), SFR10 (1)
 #11

Anyone who is interested to learn everything about Blockstream's JADE hardware wallet should watch very good review from Alex Waltz aka @raw_avocado.
This guy is making a great Bitcoin related content, and I have no idea how he only have 159 subscribers and some craptalkers and pumpers have over 100k,
but I guess anything is possible on Youtube and they are probably going to tech-hell with their recent censorship politics.
Among other things it's interesting to see Jade size comparison with other hardware wallets like Coldcard, Trezor One and Ledger.


Video: https://youtu.be/qzQjECidF88

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July 03, 2021, 11:18:21 PM
 #12

It's come in at a VERY competitive price ($39.99!!?! Shocked, sadly out of stock or I'd probably be ordering one to play with)... and the camera for QR code scanning is definitely a bonus.

I'm still not overly enthusiastic about the whole "blind server" thing... or the complexities involved with recovery... but it is at least possible to run your own server if you want.

Hopefully they get some more stock in the not too distant future, so I can actually get one and have a proper play with it.

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July 04, 2021, 02:57:24 AM
Merited by SFR10 (1)
 #13

It's the first time I've heard of it, the changes that occurred from the date of writing this topic would be good to predict the future development of such a project, but in general, the price may be the only thing that will push me to try this wallet.

blockstream wallet gave me a bad experience using greenwallet (which I don't want why they keep managing it the same old way.
) So I wouldn't be excited to try them hardware wallet.

In general, competition in hardware wallets market does not require that the code be open-ended, as much as it meets the initial needs of most customers.

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July 04, 2021, 03:54:44 AM
 #14

If you can't come out and say it's made in China, (good or bad no opinion here) then you are playing politics and that's BS.
I hate the way he dodged that question too, and I might agree with you about the politics part if I didn't think that he might be concealing its place of manufacturing because of the stigma (true or not) that products made in China tend to be crap.

This guy is making a great Bitcoin related content, and I have no idea how he only have 159 subscribers and some craptalkers and pumpers have over 100k,
but I guess anything is possible on Youtube and they are probably going to tech-hell with their recent censorship politics.
I bookmarked that video to watch later, as it's very late where I am and I'm very tired.  Oh by the way, the reason a ton of idiots on Youtube have so many subscribers is that Youtube attracts people who just want to watch drama by people you probably wouldn't give a damn about in real life--or product promoters.  Just look at the recommended videos on their home page when you're not logged into anything Google and you'll see what I'm talking about.  And oh boy, their censorship nonsense deserves a thread of its own in the Off-Topic section. 

It's come in at a VERY competitive price ($39.99!!?! Shocked, sadly out of stock or I'd probably be ordering one to play with)... and the camera for QR code scanning is definitely a bonus.
That is an incredible price, but only if the wallet is a good one.  Bear in mind that the Keepkey is going for $41.09 on Amazon right now, and it's nothing more than a nice-looking paperweight.  From what I've read about the Jade wallet in this thread, it has a few problems that I wouldn't be comfortable with and that would certainly keep me from actually using it to store anything more than some bitcoin dust.  But I have to say, it's a damn good looking wallet and I'd be willing to try it out if it ever becomes available again.  I'm not sure why it's sold out, because I can't imagine there's so much demand for it that their Chinese manufacturers are unable to keep up with production.

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July 04, 2021, 08:02:15 AM
Merited by ABCbits (1)
 #15

Hopefully they get some more stock in the not too distant future, so I can actually get one and have a proper play with it.
You can make your own DIY Jade wallet with small esp32 devices that are even cheaper, purchased locally or on internet, than load it with Jade's open source code and you are good to go.
I think Jade is based on M5StickC PLUS ESP32-PICO that costs around $20, but it works also on M5Stack ESP32 or M5Stack Core2 ESP32 AWS with secure element.
Even TTGO T-Display ESP32 works with Jade's code and it can be purchased for around $10 online.


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July 04, 2021, 08:52:31 AM
 #16

...and I have no idea how he only have 159 subscribers and some craptalkers and pumpers have over 100k,
It's because of the fact they talk crap that they have many subscribers. People like to hear how the next coin is going to get them rich and they seek out those who "promise" that. On the other hand, they'll get easily bored with just tech stuff although that is supposed to be the essence of it. And most of those crypto YouTubers always organize some giveaways, and we all know how big suckers people are for free stuff.

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July 04, 2021, 01:10:20 PM
 #17

Among other things it's interesting to see Jade size comparison with other hardware wallets like Coldcard, Trezor One and Ledger.
That's one of the few things I like about Jade but having said that, I wouldn't be ordering one [regardless of it being out of stock or not] if everything stays exactly the same [I do know there'll be more software updates and support].
- One side of the box had a "DontTrustVerify" tag but looks like I have to trust something.

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July 05, 2021, 12:48:09 PM
 #18

That's one of the few things I like about Jade but having said that, I wouldn't be ordering one
I heard that Blockstream developers are working on some new generation hardware wallet with many improvements, but they wanted to create cheap basic open source model that anyone can build in their own home easy.
I am not a fan of their pin server thing but I consider it something like 2fa people use all the time.

One side of the box had a "DontTrustVerify" tag but looks like I have to trust something.
Question is can you personally verify anything really or you trust more things in your life than you think.
They created open source code for their wallet and you can verify it if you know how to do it.

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July 05, 2021, 09:11:11 PM
Merited by ABCbits (1), dkbit98 (1)
 #19

The interesting thing about the PIN server... is that you can actually run your own. They do provide the code: https://github.com/Blockstream/blind_pin_server

Of course, there is no guarantee that the PIN server you are connecting to is actually running this code... unless you do run your own. Tongue

And I've no idea how easy it is to setup, resource requirements etc, but maybe it could be a nice little addition to something like a RaspiBlitz/Umbrel/MyNode setup. Huh

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July 07, 2021, 07:51:00 AM
 #20

The interesting thing about the PIN server... is that you can actually run your own. They do provide the code: https://github.com/Blockstream/blind_pin_server

Of course, there is no guarantee that the PIN server you are connecting to is actually running this code... unless you do run your own. Tongue

And I've no idea how easy it is to setup, resource requirements etc, but maybe it could be a nice little addition to something like a RaspiBlitz/Umbrel/MyNode setup. Huh
If there is no guarantee that the server you are connecting runs a proper code, then there is no point to ever try to connect to these servers. Besides, not only should users able to run their own blind servers but also they should be able to tether their wallets to a server without any Internet connection. I can easily (not really, but still) broadcast a signed message using different means, but I can't sign my transaction in the case of Jade wallet because I can't get my god damn PIN offline. What's the point of using a tool that makes Bitcoin worse, less functional, and less censorship resistant? Maybe, I am wrong but it seems that things haven't changed much since the first announcement.

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