Bernard Madoff dies in prison. A 20 year long Ponzi

[dothebeats]

Dude's a legend and a smooth talker that he managed to get off the hook for decades even with authorities, investors, and outside citizens snooping constantly on his affairs. Had he not succumbed to greediness and just worked diligently and honestly at NASDAQ, he would have been a legend in a good way. I mean, the ones he scammed were not small fishes, and to think he could lie in front of them and kept it going is absolutely insane.

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[LogitechMouse]

It is amazing how long a Ponzi may last.

Its more amazing how these people felled into this kind of Ponzi Scheme.
Well, a 20 year old Ponzi Scheme isn't that easy to manage but that long will not last in our current era right now. I might say that there are some people who learned from the past.

I know that this man did a thing that changed the lives of many people negatively but still RIP for him because he is still a person and being happy to see a person die isn't a good thing.

[stompix]

The fact is that Madoff died in prison only because he stole money from some of the well known and powerful people. If he had cheated ordinary people, then in all probability he would have been living in luxury in London or some of the offshore tax havens. Take the case of Vijay Mallya of India.

Why do you compare two different countries when it comes to this?
People have been continuously convicted in the US for running Ponzi schemes even if the sums were far smaller and still got 20-30 years in prison.
Maddoff was found guilty on securities, mail, wire fraud as well as perjury, and on top of that money laundering, that's why that sentence.

Here are a few fresh examples of low-level Ponzi schemes:
https://www.justice.gov/usao-ma/pr/boston-man-pleads-guilty-investment-fraud-scheme
https://www.justice.gov/usao-ma/pr/connecticut-man-pleads-guilty-ponzi-and-tax-fraud-scheme
https://www.justice.gov/usao-ma/pr/former-belmont-resident-convicted-6-million-investment-fraud-scheme

The problem is with the Indian law system, has nothing to do with Maddoff, just because things are fucked up in some counties it doesn't mean this happens all over the world.

I mean, the ones he scammed were not small fishes, and to think he could lie in front of them and kept it going is absolutely insane.

Well, the really big fishes stayed away from him, and one thing that is mentioned quite a few times in the investigations is that he was picky about his investors, he tried to build a club where he would admit only the ones that he would have no troubles lying to them, other than a few banks most of the other funds that were involved were run by people from his own Jewish community or totally inexperienced rich people so we could probably talk about medium fishes here. Probably that's why it went for so long, he was choosing carefully his victims.

The real large investment funds stayed away from him and ignored everything, JP Morgan cut the ties with him, and later investigations showed they knew about risks years before but kept silent for different reasons.

 

[Lucius]

I didn't realize he was so old, but I guess time flies and I'd kind of forgotten all about him since he's been in prison.  Too bad, so sad about the judge not letting him out on compassionate grounds.  He didn't deserve that IMO.

I think he deserved the punishment he received, and the judge made a good decision - there should be no mercy for such human garbage, and I think he got it by not being sentenced to death (if at all possible for his crime). People like him are greedy to the bone and don't give a damn - they would take a crust of bread from a hungry man only if they could profit that way.

What I am personally sorry about is that there are no more such punishments for those who still follow his example today - of course they manage to catch some, but I believe that most of them manage to disappear long before they are exposed.

[jaberwock]

Madoff run what is considered one of the longer lasting Ponzi schemes. It lasted decades and it took with it the saving of many notable citizens, particularly those of the Jew community with whom he had close links. For example the Nobel price laureate Elie Wiesel, whose charity managed to lose in excess of 15M. And all these institutions...

Ponzi schemes are a very bad thing ,and the late investors are usually the ones who suffer the consequences, because at the time they get in there wouldn’t be any other person that will be investing and that means the scheme will come to an end and those late investors will lose their money in the investment. With all these things that has happened to these guys, I believe it’s going to be a lesson to those who are having plans to do such a thing, they will learn to avoid it and look for other things to do, because when you’re caught the law is never going to forgive you no matter how much you plead.

[Mauser]

Am still trying to wrap my head around the whole 2 decades part, someone run a ponzi for 2 decade very smoothly and people still patronise the scheme even when knowing it is a ponzi! And here I am thinking a ponzi can't last a decade let alone decades, (learning never stop as long as you breathe)
I don't know anything about his story but I feel he must be a very intelligent and smart guy to have been able to run this scheme for as long as he did before his passing,  
Such thing should not be condone but the ability to carry out such activity to that length is unbelievable.

To be honest, Bernie was very unlucky with the 2007/2008 financial crisis. Without the big bust of the housing market and the collapse of the big banks he probably would have been fine. Since most of high clients were rich families who didn't really need the money they were fine by just getting statements with how nice returns they are making. It was the financial crisis and subsequent margin callls in other funds which triggered an outflow of Bernie Madoffs fund. Also they SEC never found out about the Ponzi scheme, he confessed in the end. I saw an interview of one of the SEC lawyers who said that without the financial crisis he probably would have never been caught and they would have only found out about it after his death.

[eaLiTy]

It is amazing how long a Ponzi may last.

It is crazy to think that people will not learn from their blunders even though they know that they are investing in scam ponzi schemes and cryptocurrency market also had its fair share of ponzi schemes inspired by Bernard Madoff and if you look in this forum you will identify many promoting them including OneCoin, Bitconnect and PlusToken and even with all the warnings people will ignore them and invest in them and end up burning their money.

[jaysabi]

Yeah, Madoff fucked over a lot of rich people over a very long period of time--but if you've read a little bit into the history of the scam, there was one guy who kept questioning how Madoff was making such steady returns in both bull and bear markets.  He even reported his concerns to the authorities, who did absolutely nothing.

It sucks when anyone gets scammed, but I'd have much more sympathy for the victims if they weren't so rich to begin with (but I'm not saying they deserved it, because they didn't).  It does amaze me how brazen Madoff was to just flat-out lie to his clients for so long. 

I didn't realize he was so old, but I guess time flies and I'd kind of forgotten all about him since he's been in prison.  Too bad, so sad about the judge not letting him out on compassionate grounds.  He didn't deserve that IMO.

It wasn't just rich people who lost money. There were pension plans, investment advisers who invest for retail investors, non-profits, and regular people who were invested. It's just that the "rich" people dominated the headlines.

I generally agree that release from prison on compassionate grounds is overused. If you can't do the time, don't do the time. Prison is tough on purpose, you shouldn't get special treatment because you were old when you committed the crimes or got sick. That's the risk you took when you broke the law that you might have a miserable time in prison due to illness or old age.

[Johnyz]

It is amazing how long a Ponzi may last.

It is crazy to think that people will not learn from their blunders even though they know that they are investing in scam ponzi schemes and cryptocurrency market also had its fair share of ponzi schemes inspired by Bernard Madoff and if you look in this forum you will identify many promoting them including OneCoin, Bitconnect and PlusToken and even with all the warnings people will ignore them and invest in them and end up burning their money.

Fortunately, those ponzi scheme project that is being introduced here in forum is already taken down before they scam many people. Maybe Madoff took advantage of a slower technology before and the lack of knowledge of many about investments before that’s why they last for years. Now that he’s dead I’m sure the justice was already serve.

[AmoreJaz]

It is amazing how long a Ponzi may last.

It is crazy to think that people will not learn from their blunders even though they know that they are investing in scam ponzi schemes and cryptocurrency market also had its fair share of ponzi schemes inspired by Bernard Madoff and if you look in this forum you will identify many promoting them including OneCoin, Bitconnect and PlusToken and even with all the warnings people will ignore them and invest in them and end up burning their money.

Fortunately, those ponzi scheme project that is being introduced here in forum is already taken down before they scam many people. Maybe Madoff took advantage of a slower technology before and the lack of knowledge of many about investments before that’s why they last for years. Now that he’s dead I’m sure the justice was already serve.

am seeing a lot of ponzi websites outside the forum. offering high ROIs/passive income. but it is really up to the individual if he will be a victim of this scheme. their strategy is the same, deposit and earn passive income at a high rate. then, ask yourself - where are they getting the money that they will pay you as dividends if there is no clear source of their income? and normally, it also comes from the users' deposits.
madoff was just of the many individuals that successfully implemented his ponzi but at the end, he and his family suffered. maybe youre right, the technology before was different than what we have now. so he managed to sustain his scheme for 2 decades. today, once there is unsatisfied client, he can always make noise via social media and people will be aware of it.

[Kong Hey Pakboy]

Dude's a legend and a smooth talker that he managed to get off the hook for decades even with authorities, investors, and outside citizens snooping constantly on his affairs. Had he not succumbed to greediness and just worked diligently and honestly at NASDAQ, he would have been a legend in a good way. I mean, the ones he scammed were not small fishes, and to think he could lie in front of them and kept it going is absolutely insane.

I wouldn't really say that he is a legend, remember that this dude swindled billions of dollars and the biggest Ponzi scheme in history so far, I would say infamous to connote that this person is known for something bad. That is the reason why he created the Ponzi scheme, if he didn't do so, he would still be trading and not getting enough money, the reason is that he wants to be at the top and I don't think that he is going to redeem himself even if he were to work honestly, the dude was doing insider trading before the Ponzi.

[Kakmakr]

They should hunt all of these "Ponzi" guys down and get them to die in jail too. These bloody Ponzi's that are using Bitcoin as a payment option has killed off millions of potential buyers of Crypto currencies, because those people got burnt and they now do not want anything to do with Crypto currencies.

If you watched the whole movie that was done on Maddof's ponzi, you would have seen how ruthless these people were. They could care less if you invested your pension money that you saved up for 40 years. 

[bryant.coleman]

They should hunt all of these "Ponzi" guys down and get them to die in jail too. These bloody Ponzi's that are using Bitcoin as a payment option has killed off millions of potential buyers of Crypto currencies, because those people got burnt and they now do not want anything to do with Crypto currencies.

If you watched the whole movie that was done on Maddof's ponzi, you would have seen how ruthless these people were. They could care less if you invested your pension money that you saved up for 40 years. 

Do you really think that arresting these ICO scammers is going to be easy? Maddof was arrested because he dealt with fiat currency and that made it easy to trace him. On the other hand, the ICO promoters are mostly anonymous and they move their funds from one country to the other in a matter of minutes. Because of the trans-national nature of their crimes, it is extremely difficult to identify them and to get them deported to the country where they committed the crimes.

[Hydrogen]

Would UBI (universal basic income) qualify as a ponzi scheme?

I think that might make for an interesting discussion.

Its an excellent point to acknowledge Bernie Madoff's ponzi scheme lasting 20 years. There are programs and financial arrangements structured very similarly to a ponzi scheme with real world longevity. I wonder if we'll eventually pay a price for our cultural trend of hopping on bandwagons with as little thought or consideration as possible. Programs like UBI might never enjoy widespread support, if people are willing to think about and question options put on the table. UBI's similarity to a ponzi scheme is something that could definitley use more attention imo.

[wheelz1200]

Yeah, Madoff fucked over a lot of rich people over a very long period of time--but if you've read a little bit into the history of the scam, there was one guy who kept questioning how Madoff was making such steady returns in both bull and bear markets.  He even reported his concerns to the authorities, who did absolutely nothing.

It sucks when anyone gets scammed, but I'd have much more sympathy for the victims if they weren't so rich to begin with (but I'm not saying they deserved it, because they didn't).  It does amaze me how brazen Madoff was to just flat-out lie to his clients for so long. 

I didn't realize he was so old, but I guess time flies and I'd kind of forgotten all about him since he's been in prison.  Too bad, so sad about the judge not letting him out on compassionate grounds.  He didn't deserve that IMO.

When you are so big the authorities don't look into you, he has savy investors how would he scam anyone, lol?  Convenient how they turn a blind eye.

Saddest part of the whole story is the people that lost everything and were legitimately taken and lost everything they had.  Point in case never put all your eggs in one basket...even with bitcoin.