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Author Topic: This is why Bitcoinica users must wait in line for withdrawals  (Read 4924 times)
paraipan
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December 01, 2011, 01:17:05 AM
 #41

By the way, if anyone has what it takes to build a killer exchange, email me at ryan@xwaylab.com.

I'll invest with capital, code and business straightaway.

The exchange guys don't know how to talk to people. The landscape is broken. A fix is needed.

nicely put, you should teach them a lesson zhou

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December 01, 2011, 02:18:03 AM
 #42

, and you have a wonderful cesspool of shady dealings, slightly mangled laws, and wanna-be gangsters all over the place.

Yes some of that... but mostly just free people engaging in businesses without asking for permission from clowns with badges. Thank god there are people who just move forward without pleading with the gatekeepers. Heroes all.

EVorhees, I really like what you say. Thank you or taking the time to speak your mind so succinctly. I think it's important work.

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December 02, 2011, 03:05:48 AM
 #43

I think this thread should be bumped.  If enough people get pissed, mtgox might do something.

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December 02, 2011, 03:28:47 AM
 #44

I think this thread should be bumped.  If enough people get pissed, mtgox might do something.
Or a replacement will rise up and take market share away from Gox. The best vote we have is with our economy. Move it elsewhere if they do not adjust.

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December 02, 2011, 04:35:09 AM
 #45

I think this thread should be bumped.  If enough people get pissed, mtgox might do something.
Or a replacement will rise up and take market share away from Gox. The best vote we have is with our economy. Move it elsewhere if they do not adjust.

My vote.  Speak with your wallets, everyone understands that language. 

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ineededausername
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December 02, 2011, 05:33:05 AM
 #46

I think this thread should be bumped.  If enough people get pissed, mtgox might do something.
Or a replacement will rise up and take market share away from Gox. The best vote we have is with our economy. Move it elsewhere if they do not adjust.

My vote.  Speak with your wallets, everyone understands that language. 

We need a new exchange! However, I don't think any of the existing exchanges is good enough.  Time to make my own!?!?!?? Tongue

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December 02, 2011, 05:56:55 AM
 #47

Well, the fiat money market is more decentralized than bitcoin exchanges.

What we need is a standard for cross exchange arbitrage with regular players being able to participate in an equal way, and a FOSS toolkit to implement it. Forex already does that to some extend and we would be damned if we weren't able to come up with something.

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December 02, 2011, 10:34:14 AM
 #48

Well, the fiat money market is more decentralized than bitcoin exchanges.

What we need is a standard for cross exchange arbitrage with regular players being able to participate in an equal way, and a FOSS toolkit to implement it. Forex already does that to some extend and we would be damned if we weren't able to come up with something.

For example, there can be multiple Bitcoinicas running at the same time and hedge against each other. Each Bitcoinica is a market maker with some extent of centralization, while the network of Bitcoinicas can be decentralized. We can simulate how inter-bank markets work in real world this way.

Generally, Bitcoinicas should trust each other more than any market participant. So this solution is better than OTC.

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December 02, 2011, 11:10:10 AM
 #49

while the network of Bitcoinicas can be decentralized

Join them through Ripple !!!
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December 02, 2011, 11:47:57 AM
 #50

I am working with FellowTraveler to try to get Open Transactions actually tested. TO me it has looked like what is needed for a long time now, but even just actually trying having a third party pour contracts into its end and try to issue them to a server has exposed some pretty trivial little glitches that just had not really been noticed a lot when one person is doing all the testing the same way on the same architecture with the same "how to do copy and paste" habits (include the linefeed at end of file or not, for example).

Finally we are zeroing in on this kind of "oh was I meant to / not meant to include that whitespace" type of detail in how different people and maybe even different architectures (linefeed? don't you mean carriage-return?) handle minutiae of what exactly is the payload that one is to hash.

I am really hoping that this time around we can get Open Transactions to a useable state quite soon, at which point I would not be surprised to see it used for a new generation of stock/commodity/forex markets/exchanges and gosh knows what else.

Yes ripple has nice concepts, but for some time it has seemed to me that such parts of how ripple works as eventually will maybe get incorporated into Open Transactions; or a using of OPen Transactions to do some of what ripple bank to bank systems wouyld probably like to do/have, has seemed more likely sooner than waiting for ripple itself to become our solution of choice.

-MarkM- (See OT-server alpha testing thread at https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=53329.0 )

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December 16, 2011, 11:36:00 AM
 #51

Mew! Fuck legal!

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December 18, 2011, 12:02:04 AM
 #52

FWIW, you can search for the corporate status of Xwaylab here:

https://delecorp.delaware.gov/tin/GINameSearch.jsp

It looks like the registration was done via this online corporation factory:

http://www.incorporate.com/business_structures.html

The paperwork is up to date.  With no offense intended to zhaotong, if this corp was just formed by a minor who (as I understand it) is a foreign national on some $99 website, I'd question the actual validity of the corporation itself.  A minor can basically disaffirm any contract, saying they didn't know what they were signing.

MtGox's legal concerns are legitimate.
zhoutong
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December 18, 2011, 05:16:06 AM
 #53

FWIW, you can search for the corporate status of Xwaylab here:

https://delecorp.delaware.gov/tin/GINameSearch.jsp

It looks like the registration was done via this online corporation factory:

http://www.incorporate.com/business_structures.html

The paperwork is up to date.  With no offense intended to zhaotong, if this corp was just formed by a minor who (as I understand it) is a foreign national on some $99 website, I'd question the actual validity of the corporation itself.  A minor can basically disaffirm any contract, saying they didn't know what they were signing.

MtGox's legal concerns are legitimate.

In Delaware, any corporation must have a registered agent. You simply can't incorporate elsewhere other than "a $99 website". Also, all the personal information is held by the registered agent instead of the state office. It's the partner's responsibility to ensure my eligibility to commit and enforce a contract, not the state's.


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zhoutong
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December 18, 2011, 05:18:23 AM
 #54

FWIW, you can search for the corporate status of Xwaylab here:

https://delecorp.delaware.gov/tin/GINameSearch.jsp

It looks like the registration was done via this online corporation factory:

http://www.incorporate.com/business_structures.html

The paperwork is up to date.  With no offense intended to zhaotong, if this corp was just formed by a minor who (as I understand it) is a foreign national on some $99 website, I'd question the actual validity of the corporation itself.  A minor can basically disaffirm any contract, saying they didn't know what they were signing.

MtGox's legal concerns are legitimate.

Also, I'm not hiding anything. In Bitcoin community basically we rely on personal trust and reputation a lot. The legal backing is just an extra enforcement. You don't have to trust my company more than myself.

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kgo
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December 18, 2011, 08:30:20 AM
 #55



In Delaware, any corporation must have a registered agent. You simply can't incorporate elsewhere other than "a $99 website". Also, all the personal information is held by the registered agent instead of the state office. It's the partner's responsibility to ensure my eligibility to commit and enforce a contract, not the state's.



I'm not trying to discredit you here or cast aspirations on you character, but it's ultimately up to the judicial branch to ensure your eligibility to commit and enforce a contract.  Not the "state" or your registered partner.  And in the US, a minor doesn't have the capacity to get involved in any legal agreement.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capacity_%28law%29

I do wish you the best of luck, but understand why Mt Gox won't establish an exception to you, even though you may be technically incorporated via some registered agent.
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December 18, 2011, 02:08:55 PM
 #56

In the US all a minor can do is drive a car and buy guns. Strange country they have there...

Matthew N. Wright
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December 19, 2011, 02:57:57 AM
 #57

In the US all a minor can do is drive a car and buy guns. Strange country they have there...

Minors can buy guns? I wish I would have known that when I was a minor.

PatrickHarnett
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December 21, 2011, 09:55:07 PM
 #58

FWIW, you can search for the corporate status of Xwaylab here:

https://delecorp.delaware.gov/tin/GINameSearch.jsp

It looks like the registration was done via this online corporation factory:

http://www.incorporate.com/business_structures.html

The paperwork is up to date.  With no offense intended to zhaotong, if this corp was just formed by a minor who (as I understand it) is a foreign national on some $99 website, I'd question the actual validity of the corporation itself.  A minor can basically disaffirm any contract, saying they didn't know what they were signing.

MtGox's legal concerns are legitimate.

In Delaware, any corporation must have a registered agent. You simply can't incorporate elsewhere other than "a $99 website". Also, all the personal information is held by the registered agent instead of the state office. It's the partner's responsibility to ensure my eligibility to commit and enforce a contract, not the state's.



In most common business law around the world, the company is the legal entity, not the person setting it up.  Zhoutong might be under 18, but that doesn't stop the company having directors and shareholders who are over 18.  Also, as an employee (as distinct from the company), they are an agent of the company.  (I am a qualified Chartered Corporate Secretary among other things and deal with this stuff reasonably regularly.)
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December 27, 2011, 05:44:20 PM
 #59

In the US all a minor can do is drive a car and buy guns. Strange country they have there...

Minors can buy guns? I wish I would have known that when I was a minor.
As Holliday mentioned, it depends on the state.  The only federal laws are minimum age or 18 and 21 for *purchase* of a  long gun or handgun respectively *from an FFL*.  There are different (state) laws regarding private sales, gifts and possesion/owning firearms.

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