Crypto and energy consumption

[Desscount]

I honestly don't know why crypto and energy is now talk of the town, we all know that mining of coin consumes energy and is not only mining of coin that consumes energy. Now that elon musk is talking about btc consuming alot of energy is like starting a war. We should all know that something like this might come up sometime, we just have to be prepared when next something like this comes up.

Crypto and energy are always discussed because they are related to the future of the earth,
if they can indeed give the earth a longer life, of course blockchain and crypto currency will always be used all over the world,
and when compared to some other assets such as gold, silver etc., currency crypto is really energy efficient, of course this will be an interesting topic

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[SquallLeonhart]

They only look at a certain level and evaluate everything with a one-sided view of Bitcoin. It was the advent of Bitcoin that made international remittance services work better than before, increased sending speeds and launched mobile apps for people to be proactive in their transactions.
It was Bitcoin that changed the face of banking around the world.
As you said, it is absurd when the security level of the banking system is weak. It is that weakness that brings about economic and time loss, which can be said to slow down the history of human development.

But that is natural and normal. Even from the side of crypto,,, we have to admit most crypto people also evaluate things from their single perspective. Fiat and banks are evil and all that and ignore 99% of alt projects are also truly evil and even worse as they scam people left and right.

But yes, it seems this is the neverending debate that never looks at the real answer.

Unfortunately there are tons of projects that were created just to make the creator richer, that is the whole purpose of those projects because creator only wants money. This doesn't exactly mean that they are not focusing on making the project better, if the project doing better means the team profiting more sometimes they do that, but if the whole point is to have a project that will make them money, they will focus on that and the project rarely becomes good.

This is why I feel like there is a good point to be made, if there is a project you research that has stuff in it that helps the team a lot such as premind or whatever, that means it is an evil project and you should stay away from it. However there are zero good banks, all banks are bad from start because of the whole idea, but there are decent crypto currencies.

[bamb]

The issue of green house gas produced by fossil fuel and energy consumption used in industries, homes and modern businesses has greatly caused damage to earth eco system!  I believe bitcoin can use clean energy for it's mining operations. The onus is on us now to find  alternative energy for bitcoin activities in order to make it compliant and acceptable in the future!

[devil2man]

nowadays everything is done with energy consumption and therefore relative pollution but unlike many other things the mining of altcoins is something we do for ourselves and not imposed by others (industries, governments) and then they can be used renewable energies to pollute less

[leea-1334]

Unfortunately there are tons of projects that were created just to make the creator richer, that is the whole purpose of those projects because creator only wants money. This doesn't exactly mean that they are not focusing on making the project better, if the project doing better means the team profiting more sometimes they do that, but if the whole point is to have a project that will make them money, they will focus on that and the project rarely becomes good.

This is why I feel like there is a good point to be made, if there is a project you research that has stuff in it that helps the team a lot such as premind or whatever, that means it is an evil project and you should stay away from it. However there are zero good banks, all banks are bad from start because of the whole idea, but there are decent crypto currencies.

Well,,, actually that definition already fits them as a scam. If the whole purpose of project was never to focus on making it better or development of the product, then it is a scam.

And this is why I wholly believe actually projects who raise funds without doing nothing actually never mean to do anything aka they are doing a scam a long way around.

[imstillthebest]

Shouldn't we concentrate our efforts on using clean renewable energy, rather than restrict our use of it?

who is restricting it . this is a kind of energy that are not harmful in the environment . crypto mining can produced heat and heat is a form of renewabale energy ,they can make use of it instead of restricting crypto mining .

Frankly, if there is a problem with too much energy consumption, we should go back and live in caves, and hunt in groups.

theres no problem if i were to ask as long as your using the energy for a purpose and not wasting it for useless things . its crazy going back in the old age but we need to be inovative as this makes people life easier

[Lantind]

nowadays everything is done with energy consumption and therefore relative pollution but unlike many other things the mining of altcoins is something we do for ourselves and not imposed by others (industries, governments) and then they can be used renewable energies to pollute less

Yes, everyone has a better idea in terms of any mining so that everyone doesn't have to worry about pollution or other things to the environment because nowadays there are many advanced technologies that can be used by everyone.

[Lantind]

If we look closely, the pollution in question today is from the use of consumable fuels such as fossils or petroleum as the main fuel for generating electricity used for crypto mining activities, but if we use power plants by utilizing environmental conditions, we will be able to minimize Due to the existing pollution, there are many alternatives as fuel to generate electricity, whether it is solar, water, or wind power, depending on the environment of each miner.

Yes, and smart people will certainly know which materials are suitable for them to use in mining sites, so that it doesn't need to be a problem for too long because in the past a lot of mining was carried out, but there were never any problems related to the environment or pollution.

[Ucy]

Aside from using clean renewable energy, there should also be efficient use of energy. Little/zero energy should go to waste, in my opinion. I think this was solved by satoshi with him suggesting that heat from miners  be used for other purpose like heating homes/buildings in cold environments.
I think we should be seriously looking for ways to put the heat generated into good use,if it has not been done already.

[Noruka]

Aside from using clean renewable energy, there should also be efficient use of energy. Little/zero energy should go to waste, in my opinion. I think this was solved by satoshi with him suggesting that heat from miners  be used for other purpose like heating homes/buildings in cold environments.
I think we should be seriously looking for ways to put the heat generated into good use,if it has not been done already.

That idea is close to impossible if I am not mistaken as Bitcoin is pretty much solely mined by gigantic data centers filled up till under the roof with dedicated mining hardware. They even use systems to reduce the heat in order to increase the hardware's longevity. I don't see a way to canalize the heat in a reasonable manner to homes such that they can use it for heating.

[bison]

nowadays everything is done with energy consumption and therefore relative pollution but unlike many other things the mining of altcoins is something we do for ourselves and not imposed by others (industries, governments) and then they can be used renewable energies to pollute less

Yes, everyone has a better idea in terms of any mining so that everyone doesn't have to worry about pollution or other things to the environment because nowadays there are many advanced technologies that can be used by everyone.

If someone decides to do mining, they will logically determine the resources needed and also think about the long term effects, and as you said that there are now many advanced technologies, if used properly, these technologies are able to minimize the existing pollution even recycle what was originally a pollution into a new resource for use in mining

[Lantind]

If someone decides to do mining, they will logically determine the resources needed and also think about the long term effects, and as you said that there are now many advanced technologies, if used properly, these technologies are able to minimize the existing pollution even recycle what was originally a pollution into a new resource for use in mining

That is clear, so that now there is no longer any reason for pollution or problems with the environment, because those who want to mine in large and large quantities, of course will use a simple and easy way and do not damage the environment, because there are many technologies and tools that can be used.

[Noruka]

Aside from using clean renewable energy, there should also be efficient use of energy. Little/zero energy should go to waste, in my opinion. I think this was solved by satoshi with him suggesting that heat from miners  be used for other purpose like heating homes/buildings in cold environments.
I think we should be seriously looking for ways to put the heat generated into good use,if it has not been done already.

That idea is close to impossible if I am not mistaken as Bitcoin is pretty much solely mined by gigantic data centers filled up till under the roof with dedicated mining hardware. They even use systems to reduce the heat in order to increase the hardware's longevity. I don't see a way to canalize the heat in a reasonable manner to homes such that they can use it for heating.

Why? we can redirect that heat to make energy? Maybe it's not possible now but we all know almost every piece of machinery is run by the power which is directly or indirectly come from heat and it can only produce energy from 30% of its heat and other 70% lost. So In the future, we would be able to make such an engine that's energy efficiency will be much higher.

Did you ever mine anything with a simple GPU? These data centers are running an unbelievable amount of devices, sometimes a good bit away from the next village or town depending on which country we are talking. Generally, yes heat can be used to produce energy, but that is not a simple endeavor. Heating homes probably referred to people mining at home, and I was rather referring to the fact that mining at home simply doesn't take place anymore because the data centers took over.

[ven7net]

Just want to put this out there. What is the problem with crypto mining and energy consumption? Yes, I know you'll raise environment concerns, I get it.

However, consider this: a civilisation is measured by its energy consumption. Before we discovered fire and used any stone tools, the only energy we had was whatever our bodies produced. Then we discovered fire, made tools, invented the wheel, etc. Until now, when we use computers, robots and other machines to help us live. Our life expectancy and quality of life has increased dramatically.

Shouldn't we concentrate our efforts on using clean renewable energy, rather than restrict our use of it?

Frankly, if there is a problem with too much energy consumption, we should go back and live in caves, and hunt in groups.

I don't think we need to go back to live in caves to stop using energy for our own purposes. Why don't you consider the option that we are simply deceived and forced to buy something that is very profitable for someone? I am not saying that green energy is bad, on the contrary it is very good, but getting this energy at this stage of development is an expensive pleasure. Moreover, these technologies existed before, but they were simply not used as large players earned money on other sources of energy. Now, too, nothing has changed much, if it is profitable to make money on coal, then they will extract coal, who does not have coal, oil, gas and even wood, then of course they will try to use alternative sources of energy, while it simply may not be enough for industry and heavy production. Cryptocurrencies also consume energy, but not on the same scale as we can. All this, as I said above, is a game of big players, and everyone tries to defend their interests.

[Nalbo]

Aside from using clean renewable energy, there should also be efficient use of energy. Little/zero energy should go to waste, in my opinion. I think this was solved by satoshi with him suggesting that heat from miners  be used for other purpose like heating homes/buildings in cold environments.
I think we should be seriously looking for ways to put the heat generated into good use,if it has not been done already.

That idea is close to impossible if I am not mistaken as Bitcoin is pretty much solely mined by gigantic data centers filled up till under the roof with dedicated mining hardware. They even use systems to reduce the heat in order to increase the hardware's longevity. I don't see a way to canalize the heat in a reasonable manner to homes such that they can use it for heating.

Even the hydropower supplied mining farms in deep hills of Sichuan are being shut down by the Chinese government. Though bitcoin has found its way to some European nation with green renewable energy. I don't think it's possible to shift from POW to POS for bitcoin. So, for it to stay, they should promote mining through renewable energy. POW is one of the trusted way of securing the network.

[meanwords]

I don't see the motivation behind why this is an issue, im previously utilizing environmentally friendly power energy in my home throughout recent years and my mining ranch is running on sunlight based boards and reinforcement. In the end it needs impetus and the arrangement is incorporated, leaving a few clients to trust the validators without enough control.

Some people are just ignorant so they always raise this issues or that people who doesn't like Bitcoin or others who want FUD will try to spread this argument as many times as they want in a bias way because a lot of people wouldn't really care much about the details.

[Noruka]

Aside from using clean renewable energy, there should also be efficient use of energy. Little/zero energy should go to waste, in my opinion. I think this was solved by satoshi with him suggesting that heat from miners  be used for other purpose like heating homes/buildings in cold environments.
I think we should be seriously looking for ways to put the heat generated into good use,if it has not been done already.

That idea is close to impossible if I am not mistaken as Bitcoin is pretty much solely mined by gigantic data centers filled up till under the roof with dedicated mining hardware. They even use systems to reduce the heat in order to increase the hardware's longevity. I don't see a way to canalize the heat in a reasonable manner to homes such that they can use it for heating.

Even the hydropower supplied mining farms in deep hills of Sichuan are being shut down by the Chinese government. Though bitcoin has found its way to some European nation with green renewable energy. I don't think it's possible to shift from POW to POS for bitcoin. So, for it to stay, they should promote mining through renewable energy. POW is one of the trusted way of securing the network.

Mining is also not only bad with PoW. There is so much wasted overproduced electricity that could be used to mining. That way the companies wouldn't just let overproduction go to waste but instead use it for mining and increase profitability thereby. Everyone just sees the downsides of mining with electricity, but there is also a lot of potential to proof of work. I won't go into detail, but one idea is to have power plants in rural areas that are a risky investment under normal circumstances because you don't know if you can sell all your energy as a provider. Now if you don't, you could just point that energy towards Bitcoin mining, making it more attractive to take on risk by launching power plants in rural areas.

[Lantind]

Some people are just ignorant so they always raise this issues or that people who doesn't like Bitcoin or others who want FUD will try to spread this argument as many times as they want in a bias way because a lot of people wouldn't really care much about the details.

Yes, but those of us who really care and understand about cryptocurrencies also don't need to pay attention to those who are stupid because arguing with stupid people can also lead us to stupid places like him.

[SirLancelot]

Yesterday there was a topic in my own nations crypto forum that I read and it was an interesting read. This one guy wrote it and he is someone who works for a company that has wind turbines, for some reason they make it work on 98% power and leave the other 2 alone, no idea why but I suppose it was just personal preference at that point.

So, when crypto got big this year they wanted to see if they could buy some equipment and mine it, after all mining machines do work and they do make money as well, with the 2% remaining power they could buy around 1000 S9's to mine, still a ton of money to spend but that would be fine.

They calculated that it would cost 16.5 million dollars to buy 1000 (even if they could find it which they can't for now) and would recoup the investment in 2 years. They decided it was the most idiotic investment because they could just buy 16 more wind turbines which would keep giving you profit for 50 years at least instead of be obsolete when new miners come out. So, they decided not to do that since financially it was a horrible decision. Energy consumption of it is not the problem, miners are getting ripped off unless they make their own equipment that's plain and simple.

[uneng]

Yesterday there was a topic in my own nations crypto forum that I read and it was an interesting read. This one guy wrote it and he is someone who works for a company that has wind turbines, for some reason they make it work on 98% power and leave the other 2 alone, no idea why but I suppose it was just personal preference at that point.

So, when crypto got big this year they wanted to see if they could buy some equipment and mine it, after all mining machines do work and they do make money as well, with the 2% remaining power they could buy around 1000 S9's to mine, still a ton of money to spend but that would be fine.

They calculated that it would cost 16.5 million dollars to buy 1000 (even if they could find it which they can't for now) and would recoup the investment in 2 years. They decided it was the most idiotic investment because they could just buy 16 more wind turbines which would keep giving you profit for 50 years at least instead of be obsolete when new miners come out. So, they decided not to do that since financially it was a horrible decision. Energy consumption of it is not the problem, miners are getting ripped off unless they make their own equipment that's plain and simple.

I believe people who invest in such mining operations expect the price of bitcoin and altcoins is going to increase much more yet, so although the return of investment may take 2 years to be achieved, the final profit can also be much higher than the one they expect at this moment, since they are only considering the currently currencies' prices on their calculations and in 2 years bitcoin can rise 50%, 100%, 150%...
Anyway, it's a very risky investment, because we are talking about millions of dollars and there isn't any guaranteed date to recover this investment. It will depend on the market's fluctuations and if we occasionally hit a long lasting bear season it will take even longer to retrieve the money invested.