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Author Topic: The first rule of investing is saving  (Read 1782 times)
paxmao (OP)
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July 08, 2021, 09:53:19 AM
Merited by vapourminer (2), Vatimins (1)
 #1

It is fairly obvious, but there are people out there that have written 200 pages self-help books and made a fortune out of them by simply stating this simple fact of life: "you can invest your savings. If you ain´t got any, you ain´t gonna invest". (I admit you could argue that you can borrow but still nobody ain´t lending ya if you ain´t gonna givvet baksh).

The basic concepts that will save you a 15 bucks book:

- you invest so that your money works for you. Even if you cannot drop your job, you can still live a bit better with extra income.
- Investing is sacrificing something today to get something tomorrow. This is just a definition. You save x today because you want 2x tomorrow or in year or whenever.
- The first step to invest is saving part of your income. No savings, no future.
- If you have credits unpaid (other than mortgages or other asset backed credits), you pay those first because they charge you a lot.

And from here we could start speaking on how are you going to save regularly, if it is going to be 10% of your income, or 5% or 50%, how are you going to learn about investing, etc...

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July 08, 2021, 10:26:25 AM
 #2

I agree with you 👍 In addition, one should save up to 3 -5 months expenses before investing any money.

Furthermore, I try as much as possible follow Dave Ramsey principles of investing:

1) Get out of debt and save up a fully funded emergency fund.

2)Invest 15% of your income in tax-favored retirement accounts.

3)Invest in good growth stock mutual funds. Personally, I add digital currency to it.

4) Keep a long-term perspective.

5) Know your fees.

6) Work with a financial advisor.

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July 08, 2021, 10:35:34 AM
 #3

"you can invest your savings. If you ain´t got any, you ain´t gonna invest". (I admit you could argue that you can borrow but still nobody ain´t lending ya if you ain´t gonna givvet baksh).

Borrowing for investing is usually a bad decision. One must invest only money he affords to lose. The only "good" way to borrow for investing is if you have plenty of wealth, but it's already locked (properties, companies) and borrowing will provide liquidity.

Also for normal people, I'd suggest to invest only part of the savings, not all. Some should stay for unexpected problems.

However, these are (small) details. The initial rule stands.

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July 08, 2021, 10:49:34 AM
 #4

And it's such a simple rule and yet, some people still can't understand it. Yes, investment is something that could really help you in the future, but it's not really something that you'd want if your current situation is stable enough. Yes, it's unfair, but that's how the world works. At the very least, you should prioritize stabilizing your own financial situation, instead of adding another burden to it. Investing is simply a burden if you're killing yourself while doing it.

It'd also make a life a lot easier if you only bought stuff with your savings, and not money obtained from debt. Debt is a sort of last straw thing that you would only get if you're really stuck in a hard place, starting out investments isn't one of them.

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July 08, 2021, 10:54:50 AM
 #5

"you can invest your savings. If you ain´t got any, you ain´t gonna invest". (I admit you could argue that you can borrow but still nobody ain´t lending ya if you ain´t gonna givvet baksh).

Borrowing for investing is usually a bad decision.

Normally yes! But not in times where you hardly have to pay interest for borrowing money. Suppose you borrow money for less than 1% per year. The stock market has brought an average return of 7-8% in the last years (blue chips). After taxes and interest, that would be about 5% profit. Of course you have a certain risk, but you always have that when investing, even with equity.
But I would not invest borrowed money in crypto as the risk is much much higher.

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July 08, 2021, 11:44:20 AM
 #6

This doesn't apply to other people in different countries though especially for people like me who is from a third-world country which was taught no concept about financial health, everything I knew about finances are all self-taught and discussed with my peers. I think saving is difficult for me because the money from work is just enough to survive alone but not with a family, investing is much more difficult because no one taught us to invest in my country.

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July 08, 2021, 11:46:20 AM
Merited by vapourminer (2)
 #7

I totally agree. Saving must be the first thing to do before investing in any investment vehicle. You must have enough money stored in case of emergency before diving and risking into any investment platforms. Emergency fund is a must before looking into diverisification of investment fund. Because if ever you'll prioritize your investment without back up savings, you'll end up having nothing when your investment fails. So it is really much better to have a savings first, then after fulfilling your savings fund, go and invest in your trusted platform.

Anyone must always be prepared of the inevitable and unexpected events. It is suggested to have a savings that's good for 6 months worth of your expenses to cover unfortunate events. One must have enough money to fund several weeks or months being jobless and having no any other source of income. Investment provides higher opportunity to earn compared to saving alone, but also remember that surviving is essential; if your investment go downhill, you will have no other option to sustain your needs unless you have a savings account.
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July 08, 2021, 12:24:13 PM
 #8

     Makes absolute sense, some people don't even bother to save because of those motivational things they read or see either online or from peers. While these "motivational stuff" do not make things bad for a person, the way it is being understood or taken in is what makes it poisonous for that person. Investing without any back up plans, no savings etc., because of "no pain no gain" or "you first have to jump before you can fly(take the risk)" crap is just so wrong in so many levels. I don't know why some don't even understand this. Yes, some people have been successful with this but those people are just pure lucky or can take so much suffering without giving up. But let's face it, not everyone can be like such. Which results in a lot of people failing in life.

     I wish people would understand that keeping old knowledge is as important as absorbing new knowledge, even more so to be able to fuse old knowledge with the new ones in a way that suites one's needs. While Bruce Lee sums it up nicely: “Empty your cup so that it may be filled; become devoid to gain totality.” it does not mean that you have to get rid of all the old but to instead get rid of the useless ones so you can add new knowledge and be open for new point of views.

-Saving and investing go hand in hand. Nothing lasts forever so never let yourself be unprepared for anything.

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July 08, 2021, 12:32:29 PM
 #9

This doesn't apply to other people in different countries though especially for people like me who is from a third-world country which was taught no concept about financial health, everything I knew about finances are all self-taught and discussed with my peers. I think saving is difficult for me because the money from work is just enough to survive alone but not with a family, investing is much more difficult because no one taught us to invest in my country.

It is all about mindset, I am in a third-world country too and my salary is just enough to handle my responsibilities but I am still able to save some amount every end of the month even if it is really small. If your mindset is for the long term that you know that you can't just work forever, you will start to save for something to invest in the future. It's difficult to teach financial literacy in a third-world country because most often people here are not yet open-minded for other opportunities. They are still stuck with the tradition of you study, graduate, then work until your age of retirement.
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July 08, 2021, 12:53:02 PM
 #10

This doesn't apply to other people in different countries though especially for people like me who is from a third-world country which was taught no concept about financial health, everything I knew about finances are all self-taught and discussed with my peers. I think saving is difficult for me because the money from work is just enough to survive alone but not with a family, investing is much more difficult because no one taught us to invest in my country.

It is all about mindset, I am in a third-world country too and my salary is just enough to handle my responsibilities but I am still able to save some amount every end of the month even if it is really small. If your mindset is for the long term that you know that you can't just work forever, you will start to save for something to invest in the future. It's difficult to teach financial literacy in a third-world country because most often people here are not yet open-minded for other opportunities. They are still stuck with the tradition of you study, graduate, then work until your age of retirement.
I have seen the same thing happen in my country too, where people are more relaxed in dealing with life, especially financially. they tend to prefer to be employees, and eventually retire, as if not thinking about financial freedom. in the end they do not think about investing for better welfare. On the other hand, it seems that many are satisfied with their way of life and have no long term thoughts

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July 08, 2021, 01:00:33 PM
 #11

And to save money, first you need a job.

To have a job, first you need skills.

To have skills, you need education.

You have education, you need time (and money).

To have time (and money), you need to be young (and have rich parents).

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July 08, 2021, 01:01:28 PM
 #12

Saving is the hardest part of our life, especially when we just only get enough for our necessities. I couldn't say that they don't have a better future but something they miss the best opportunity of their life.

Maybe we are so thankful that we have been given a chance to invest in crypto as not all have the capabilities to do this. If I would like to save, I certainly have to invest this rather than keeping on my wallet or deposited it in the bank. It doesn't matter if I don't have real money in my pocket but al least I have some investment that could save me and give me profit in the future.

Because for me, Invest now, save later.
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July 08, 2021, 01:10:01 PM
 #13

   Yeah it's true saving is the most important thing to invest cause the more you save the more value you will received at the end. I related this when I was young in our Small town I sell candies and cegarette  every day I save  1coin  when the time goes by I have enough money to invest and now I'm a investor.

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July 08, 2021, 01:29:33 PM
 #14

~

It is all about mindset, I am in a third-world country too and my salary is just enough to handle my responsibilities but I am still able to save some amount every end of the month even if it is really small. If your mindset is for the long term that you know that you can't just work forever, you will start to save for something to invest in the future. It's difficult to teach financial literacy in a third-world country because most often people here are not yet open-minded for other opportunities. They are still stuck with the tradition of you study, graduate, then work until your age of retirement.
You should also know this that when you are from a third-world country, pretty sure that your family is your responsibility too meaning that you will be needing to supplement their needs to because they think that you are their insurance. That's the sad reality in my country and your country, we are cultivated on a mindset that we should get a job and work ourselves while our jobs slowly kill us and take away our soul.

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July 08, 2021, 02:24:45 PM
 #15

Define saving.

Take one of the largest currencies out there, USD, if you "saved" USD over the last 20 years (using 20 years as an extreme example, it can be much shorter than that depending on monthly inflation rates), the same USD in 2001 would have been worth 50 percent more than it would have been worth now. So merely by saving, you lost over 50 percent of the value in your savings over 2 decades. Take this to a smaller scale - every day, you are technically loosing money by holding on to an inflating currency. Not advocating for everyone to throw away any income in currency they get obviously, but saving has its limitations.
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July 08, 2021, 03:39:21 PM
 #16

Saving is the hardest part of our life, especially when we just only get enough for our necessities. I couldn't say that they don't have a better future but something they miss the best opportunity of their life.

Maybe we are so thankful that we have been given a chance to invest in crypto as not all have the capabilities to do this. If I would like to save, I certainly have to invest this rather than keeping on my wallet or deposited it in the bank. It doesn't matter if I don't have real money in my pocket but al least I have some investment that could save me and give me profit in the future.

Because for me, Invest now, save later.
I get your idea, and I also think the same. Instead of saving, which could mean that it will be just be how it was when you saved it, then investing it is much better because it can produce profit. And when profits are gained, then saving it would be good. Although it is true that saving is needed before a person could even make an investment.

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July 08, 2021, 03:44:56 PM
 #17

I may take a different opinion about what you talking about investment and savings. I believe they are mutually inexclusive to each other, that means one does not give rise to the other. Like it doesn't mean that if you save money, then you have automatically invested it because investment is different from saving. If you invest, you have expectation(s) of having or adding additional money, income or profit to it but in saving, you are not necessarily expecting income, profit automatically to it.

Investment is a process to make more profit but savings may be money kept away for future (IMO is not Investment).
Example here with the definition of investment



- you invest so that your money works for you.

Yes the above on quote is investment because it is a process to accumulate more profit but by keeping money as savings is not Investment. Although, you can keep money in the bank but you still don't usually have interest on it.

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July 08, 2021, 05:12:46 PM
 #18

...

Borrowing for investing is usually a bad decision. One must invest only money he affords to lose. The only "good" way to borrow for investing is if you have plenty of wealth, but it's already locked (properties, companies) and borrowing will provide liquidity.

Also for normal people, I'd suggest to invest only part of the savings, not all. Some should stay for unexpected problems.

However, these are (small) details. The initial rule stands.
don't really agree with you because there is still the possibility of a bank borrower making a profit if he/she invests his/her loan in the long term...

if have low interest rates and can pay in installments over several years then why not borrow money from a bank for crypto investments because not everyone has cash or large assets for them to buy into Bitcoin for example. even though it is risky and too wild, but if you are right in choosing the coins you want to invest, then you will definitely make big profits.
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July 08, 2021, 05:17:11 PM
 #19

don't really agree with you because there is still the possibility of a bank borrower making a profit if he/she invests his/her loan in the long term...

if have low interest rates and can pay in installments over several years then why not borrow money from a bank for crypto investments because not everyone has cash or large assets for them to buy into Bitcoin for example. even though it is risky and too wild, but if you are right in choosing the coins you want to invest, then you will definitely make big profits.

If you invest borrowed money, you invest money you don't afford to lose. And then you've already lost.
Crypto price is fluctuating a lot. And since your strategy contains only the parts where you profit, in the moments the price goes down you'll panic and probably sell at a loss.


So again: if you break the "don't invest money you don't afford to lose" rule, you'll lose. And if you invest borrowed money, you do break that rule.
But no worries, you don't have to go by what I'm saying, you're free to make your own mistakes.

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July 08, 2021, 06:34:22 PM
 #20

Quote
you can borrow but still nobody ain´t lending ya if you ain´t gonna givvet baksh
No one's gonna lend you if you are famous for not paying back the loan .
you can borrow on the people that didn't recognise you but they will first ask for collateral to make sure that they can get something in case you ran away .
 Savings has its own use and I won't touch it but I can only invest if I have extra amount of cash that I haven't put yet on my savings  .
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