[AUCTION] Casascius coin, 1 BTC, loaded AUCTION ENDED

[thoughtfan]

*** AUCTION ENDED ***
Casascius coin, 1 Bitcoin, loaded (brass, Series 2 2013)

(please use the other thread for queries, clarifications etc.)

Clearly this ungraded coin is far from being in mint condition, yet these magnified photos show the blemishes as much more prominent than when holding the coin in person. In your hand, you get a real sense not only of how precious bitcoins themselves are (you're holding 1 / 21 millionth of all that will ever exist) but also how few of these original physical coins were ever minted. See this recent auction where another of these coins I originally purchased directly from Mike Caldwell was sold (by https://twitter.com/bitgeiniog).

• Starting bid: 1.05 BTC.
  
  
• Minimum increments: 0.01BTC
  
  
• End date and time: Saturday 2021-11-27 at 23:00 UTC - see countdown clock below.
  
  
• Sniping: Any bid made within the last 10 minutes of the auction will restart a 10 minute clock for each bid thereafter (countdown clock to be ignored in the event of sniping*).
  
  
• Shipping: Not included. UK buyer: collection in person recommended from a secure facility. Overseas buyer: coin will be professionally packaged and dispatched by bullion dealers, with courier insurance offered for additional cost. Estimated shipping costs: Europe: BTC0.0005, International: BTC0.001.
  
  
• Custody: Coin is in the custody of https://twitter.com/bitgeiniog who will meet winner at secure facility or supervise its shipping by the bullion dealers.
  
  
• Payment: Bitcoin (BTC) to be sent to bc1quv0qwqjzc69vpqdshpz3djyrl8d6347ycx52rn (or to escrow, to be agreed with fees paid by buyer)
  
  
• Payment window: The winning bidder has 24 hours to pay their final bid (to me or, if agreed, to escrow) otherwise, at my discretion, the next highest bidder may be notified and will have a chance to pay their high bid.
  

For anyone not familiar with what this is, from the Encyclopedia of Physical Bitcoins and Crypto-Currencies:



Auction ends in*:
COUNTDOWN CLOCK REMOVED BECAUSE IT IS PLAYING UP. AUCTION ENDS ON THE HOUR.

Note that the countdown clock applies only in the absence of sniping.*

* In the event of sniping, the eligibility of bids will be determined retrospectively in accordance with the timestamp of bids posted, the winner being the highest bid received in accordance with the sniping rule above.

Please note this thread is for bids only. If you have any queries, comments or anything other than bids, please use the other thread.

[1713921225]

1713921225

[1713921225]

1713921225

[minerjones]

1.05BTC

[thoughtfan]

Bump - Last chance to bid in the next hours...

1.05BTC

Hi mj, Clearly this price is waaaay below what I was expecting and hoping for - and it's not over yet...

...But I want to be clear I will honour my commitment here and sell at this price if there's no further action - and happy if it is to go so cheaply, that it goes to you as one of the best respected experts and most trusted in the field.tf

[minerjones]

Says here per your time that auctions ends in 22 minutes, not 1 hr 36 minutes...   looks like timer was reset

https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/timezone/utc

[minerjones]

*** AUCTION LIVE NOW ***
Casascius coin, 1 Bitcoin, loaded (brass, Series 2 2013)

(please use the other thread for queries, clarifications etc.)

Clearly this ungraded coin is far from being in mint condition, yet these magnified photos show the blemishes as much more prominent than when holding the coin in person. In your hand, you get a real sense not only of how precious bitcoins themselves are (you're holding 1 / 21 millionth of all that will ever exist) but also how few of these original physical coins were ever minted. See this recent auction where another of these coins I originally purchased directly from Mike Caldwell was sold (by https://twitter.com/bitgeiniog).

• Starting bid: 1.05 BTC.
  
  
• Minimum increments: 0.01BTC
  
  
• End date and time: Saturday 2021-11-27 at 23:00 UTC - see countdown clock below.
  
  
• Sniping: Any bid made within the last 10 minutes of the auction will restart a 10 minute clock for each bid thereafter (countdown clock to be ignored in the event of sniping*).
  
  
• Shipping: Not included. UK buyer: collection in person recommended from a secure facility. Overseas buyer: coin will be professionally packaged and dispatched by bullion dealers, with courier insurance offered for additional cost. Estimated shipping costs: Europe: BTC0.0005, International: BTC0.001.
  
  
• Custody: Coin is in the custody of https://twitter.com/bitgeiniog who will meet winner at secure facility or supervise its shipping by the bullion dealers.
  
  
• Payment: Bitcoin (BTC) to be sent to bc1quv0qwqjzc69vpqdshpz3djyrl8d6347ycx52rn (or to escrow, to be agreed with fees paid by buyer)
  
  
• Payment window: The winning bidder has 24 hours to pay their final bid (to me or, if agreed, to escrow) otherwise, at my discretion, the next highest bidder may be notified and will have a chance to pay their high bid.
  

For anyone not familiar with what this is, from the Encyclopedia of Physical Bitcoins and Crypto-Currencies:



Auction ends in*:


Note that the countdown clock applies only in the absence of sniping.*

* In the event of sniping, the eligibility of bids will be determined retrospectively in accordance with the timestamp of bids posted, the winner being the highest bid received in accordance with the sniping rule above.

Please note this thread is for bids only. If you have any queries, comments or anything other than bids, please use the other thread.

Quoting for reference

[thoughtfan]

Hi, Please ignore the timer. It has not been reset. It finishes in 14 mins.

I think there's an issue with the timer when the page is revisited. I thought there was an issue before then I was told it was fine so I thought it may just have been me and left it. I have disabled it. The auction end time is on the hour in a few mins (subject to sniping as per above).

[minerjones]

Hi, Please ignore the timer. It has not been reset. It finishes in 14 mins.

I think there's an issue with the timer when the page is revisited. I thought there was an issue before then someone said it was fine so I left it. I'll disable it now.

Ah, ok... all good

[thoughtfan]

1.05BTC

For anyone happening to be looking for the current bid...

[thoughtfan]

Congratulations minerjones, it's yours!

[minerjones]

Congratulations minerjones, it's yours!

Very good sir.
Will contact you via PM.
Thank you.

[thoughtfan]

Retracted - for reference, the comment that was here is quoted by others below.

[minerjones]

...as a trial for this as a marketplace for these, it was a costly lesson but at least I can be fairly confident this board no longer has the reach (in terms of proportion of potential buyers) that it used to and seems to be mainly dealers who pay 'trade' prices.

Had this gone well, the next on the list would have been the first of the Cas silver-gilt tens but I won't risk a repeat of this disappointment x10 and will now need to thoroughly research other options.

It has been funny coming back here after the years away (after Theymos's many shenanigans and the blocksize malarkey) and kind-of apt that it has ended with disillusionment again. Ah well, such is life. Wishing you all the best.tf

For what it's worth, selling here on forum has become a struggle due to the amount of scams and fuckery that go on here..... I can see why people are hesitant to bid.
On the converse, places like Scarce City have been killing it in terms of premium.
Previously a few varied year Cas coins have gone for 1.4BTC and 1.8BTC

[iBitcoinHongKong8]

...as a trial for this as a marketplace for these, it was a costly lesson but at least I can be fairly confident this board no longer has the reach (in terms of proportion of potential buyers) that it used to and seems to be mainly dealers who pay 'trade' prices.

Had this gone well, the next on the list would have been the first of the Cas silver-gilt tens but I won't risk a repeat of this disappointment x10 and will now need to thoroughly research other options.

It has been funny coming back here after the years away (after Theymos's many shenanigans and the blocksize malarkey) and kind-of apt that it has ended with disillusionment again. Ah well, such is life. Wishing you all the best.tf

Bro stop with the games. You've been threatening(lol) to sell coins here for the last several months to a year and you brought out the ugliest Cas coin I've seen in a long time. What did you possibly expect? MJ did you a favor by taking if off your hands. You surely didn't expect some ridiculous premium on this coin did you? Keep your coins next time. Nobody will notice.

iBHK8

[blucepheus]

...as a trial for this as a marketplace for these, it was a costly lesson but at least I can be fairly confident this board no longer has the reach (in terms of proportion of potential buyers) that it used to and seems to be mainly dealers who pay 'trade' prices.

Had this gone well, the next on the list would have been the first of the Cas silver-gilt tens but I won't risk a repeat of this disappointment x10 and will now need to thoroughly research other options.

It has been funny coming back here after the years away (after Theymos's many shenanigans and the blocksize malarkey) and kind-of apt that it has ended with disillusionment again. Ah well, such is life. Wishing you all the best.tf

Bro stop with the games. You've been threatening(lol) to sell coins here for the last several months to a year and you brought out the ugliest Cas coin I've seen in a long time. What did you possibly expect? MJ did you a favor by taking if off your hands. You surely didn't expect some ridiculous premium on this coin did you? Keep your coins next time. Nobody will notice.

iBHK8

Well-said. The Cas is literally the worst I've seen. Looks like it sat in a sewer for a while before someone fished it out. I'm surprised you got a bid at all.

[thoughtfan]

First, I owe you in the bitcointalk community three apologies:

i) for my last message above that I retracted earlier. Looking at it this morning and at the responses to it, I can see that I had let my disappointment at the result combined with tiredness bring out a cynicism (including raising old stuff that has nothing to do with this auction) that was not justified and in the process, insulting those who identify with this community. Sorry for that.

ii) for having starting a thread and then gone on and on about selling Cas coins here (including dangling the silver-gilt 10s carrot) for almost a year, talking as though auctions were forthcoming then disappearing for many months on end.

iii) for, when I eventually did put something on offer, that it was a coin that was far from being in the best condition.

On the first, I've nothing further to say.

On the second and third, to a certain extent this dragging on without delivering anything then my first offering being of such comparative low quality has been out of my hands because though it was I who initially purchased these coins, they are all in the hands of others unless and until I've re-acquired them. And it happened to be that the first I got back was of fairly low quality. Having said that, if you look at the photos of the one that went on Scarce City for BTC1.4, you'll see that it is of similar condition. Those are two of four which have been together (in a 'sewer', damp cellar or wherever it was they were stored). I re-acquired yesterday's one and bitgeiniog (the Scarce City seller) acquired the other.

For what it's worth, selling here on forum has become a struggle due to the amount of scams and fuckery that go on here..... I can see why people are hesitant to bid.
On the converse, places like Scarce City have been killing it in terms of premium.
Previously a few varied year Cas coins have gone for 1.4BTC and 1.8BTC

I am sorry to hear, but it's also somewhat reassuring to hear from mj that it is his experience too that selling here 'has become a struggle'. So I can be reasonably confident that it is highly likely that it was not only the article itself nor my reputation or lack thereof (including both my thread of last year and my older post history) that was the cause of that coin going for a song.

As for 'MJ [doing me] a favor', he's no charity and I'm sure he wouldn't have bid if he didn't think it was a fair (or better) price for him. As I said above, if it was going to go to anyone at that price, I'm glad it was to him.

I will also ask my critics here to remember the goading I got on the other thread, being challenged to 'grow a pair' and put a Cas ten on auction with no reserve and just accept whatever the outcome. I'm pleased I didn't raise to the bait and instead did a test run (even if it was for an item far from being in best condition) before committing to auctioning a ten piece here. With the direct experience I now have, backed up by mj's comment, it seems clear I need to go elsewhere to reach good numbers of lively and enthused bidders. Basically, I need to find the people who are more excited and attracted by the prospect of holding in their hand 1/21-millionth or 1/2.1 millionth of all the BTC that will ever exist in an even more limited form (Casascius coins i.e. coins from the first person who thought up how an internet-native currency could work as physical coins and then produced them) than they are put off by whatever blemishes there may be on the physical coin itself.

I may find call to return again and will at least do you the courtesy of alerting you of sales / auctions of these coins elsewhere even if only to observe, assuming the likelihood of their being deemed to be overpriced by the OGs here. In the meantime, again but absent the 'sour-grapes-ness' of my message of last night, I'll wish everyone here the best for your endeavours and speculations

[OgNasty]

I may find call to return again and will at least do you the courtesy of alerting you of sales / auctions of these coins elsewhere even if only to observe, assuming the likelihood of their being deemed to be overpriced by the OGs here. In the meantime, again but absent the 'sour-grapes-ness' of my message of last night, I'll wish everyone here the best for your endeavours and speculations

I wouldn't worry too much about it.  When people are overly negative for seemingly curious reasons it typically says more about them then you.  Obviously sales on this forum have slowed down a great deal, and the reasoning is extremely obvious although most people are in extreme denial over it...

These coins were once sold for less than $20.  Obviously they would change hands quite easily at those prices.  Now they're changing hands around $60,000.  It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that something selling for $20 is going to move more units than something selling for $60,000.  I understand a lot of people here are in absolute and complete total denial about the fact that 1 BTC does not equal 1 BTC over time and everything that has ever traded hands here has been done with respect to the dollar value, but it doesn't change the fact that it is absolutely true.  When it comes down to it, a lot more people have $20 to spend on a speculative coin then have $60,000 to spend on one. 

That being said, this coin is one I wouldn't put in my collection.  It appears to have some mold growth on it or something.  It would never come anywhere near any of my other collectibles, so perhaps you further limited your pool of available buyers with that... 

My advice, instead of being upset that you only got 1.05 BTC for this coin, be extremely happy that you just got $55,000 for a coin you probably paid a couple hundred bucks for if you've owned it as long as it appears.  Tell anyone outside of this community that story and they probably wouldn't even believe you it's such an amazing return.

[klondike_bar]

I may find call to return again and will at least do you the courtesy of alerting you of sales / auctions of these coins elsewhere even if only to observe, assuming the likelihood of their being deemed to be overpriced by the OGs here. In the meantime, again but absent the 'sour-grapes-ness' of my message of last night, I'll wish everyone here the best for your endeavours and speculations

I wouldn't worry too much about it.  When people are overly negative for seemingly curious reasons it typically says more about them then you.  Obviously sales on this forum have slowed down a great deal, and the reasoning is extremely obvious although most people are in extreme denial over it...

These coins were once sold for less than $20.  Obviously they would change hands quite easily at those prices.  Now they're changing hands around $60,000.  It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that something selling for $20 is going to move more units than something selling for $60,000.  I understand a lot of people here are in absolute and complete total denial about the fact that 1 BTC does not equal 1 BTC over time and everything that has ever traded hands here has been done with respect to the dollar value, but it doesn't change the fact that it is absolutely true.  When it comes down to it, a lot more people have $20 to spend on a speculative coin then have $60,000 to spend on one. 

That being said, this coin is one I wouldn't put in my collection.  It appears to have some mold growth on it or something.  It would never come anywhere near any of my other collectibles, so perhaps you further limited your pool of available buyers with that... 

My advice, instead of being upset that you only got 1.05 BTC for this coin, be extremely happy that you just got $55,000 for a coin you probably paid a couple hundred bucks for if you've owned it as long as it appears.  Tell anyone outside of this community that story and they probably wouldn't even believe you it's such an amazing return.

Good way to put it - but still sucks when viewed in BTC:BTC terms and not fiat:BTC.  Ive watched the silver Cas coins go from 3+BTC to barely getting 1.3BTC and while the $$$ premium is great (and was often a rationale for the buyers of the precious metal coins) its hard not to be dissapointed when the BTC price barely exceeds the value of the coin and its various sidechains

sadly with the brass coins it seems like selling a peeled coin is the least risk and still pretty close to the same profit.

[Steeley]

I bought some Casascius coins on forums for fiat and feel great about those coins as assets that appreciate. When I buy coins in BTC it is a different calculation; It's probably a store of value at best, but the premium is not likely to keep up with the opportunity cost of the BTC appreciation. We'll see, but the demand for physicals has to grow a lot to keep up. The upside maybe is that the physical coin is a hedge against BTC not performing (which we all think is unlikely).

I found physical bitcoins after years of collecting US numismatics. The amount of people that buy USA coins over $1500 in value is very low and that is a market of millions of people. Selling a US coin is a pain in the ass sometime. Selling an item any time you want for $55,000 with immediate transaction possibiliies and with escrow is pretty freaking remarkable. This forum should be lauded and not be judged as bad because there are smart collectors on it that understand the BTC economics of this trade and the quality of the coin. It is truly amazing it sold as it did. You could have made another $1000 or two somewhere else but add the additional hassle and even after that it may not go well the week you pick to sell it.

If you bring your $300 coins to auction you'll get a pretty good premium these days. The problem isn't the forum.

[slimzak]

2500$ premium for a coin degraded to this extent is a win in my book. Congratulations.

[iBitcoinHongKong8]

First, I owe you in the bitcointalk community three apologies:

i) for my last message above that I retracted earlier. Looking at it this morning and at the responses to it, I can see that I had let my disappointment at the result combined with tiredness bring out a cynicism (including raising old stuff that has nothing to do with this auction) that was not justified and in the process, insulting those who identify with this community. Sorry for that.

ii) for having starting a thread and then gone on and on about selling Cas coins here (including dangling the silver-gilt 10s carrot) for almost a year, talking as though auctions were forthcoming then disappearing for many months on end.

iii) for, when I eventually did put something on offer, that it was a coin that was far from being in the best condition.

On the first, I've nothing further to say.

On the second and third, to a certain extent this dragging on without delivering anything then my first offering being of such comparative low quality has been out of my hands because though it was I who initially purchased these coins, they are all in the hands of others unless and until I've re-acquired them. And it happened to be that the first I got back was of fairly low quality. Having said that, if you look at the photos of the one that went on Scarce City for BTC1.4, you'll see that it is of similar condition. Those are two of four which have been together (in a 'sewer', damp cellar or wherever it was they were stored). I re-acquired yesterday's one and bitgeiniog (the Scarce City seller) acquired the other.

For what it's worth, selling here on forum has become a struggle due to the amount of scams and fuckery that go on here..... I can see why people are hesitant to bid.
On the converse, places like Scarce City have been killing it in terms of premium.
Previously a few varied year Cas coins have gone for 1.4BTC and 1.8BTC

I am sorry to hear, but it's also somewhat reassuring to hear from mj that it is his experience too that selling here 'has become a struggle'. So I can be reasonably confident that it is highly likely that it was not only the article itself nor my reputation or lack thereof (including both my thread of last year and my older post history) that was the cause of that coin going for a song.

As for 'MJ [doing me] a favor', he's no charity and I'm sure he wouldn't have bid if he didn't think it was a fair (or better) price for him. As I said above, if it was going to go to anyone at that price, I'm glad it was to him.

I will also ask my critics here to remember the goading I got on the other thread, being challenged to 'grow a pair' and put a Cas ten on auction with no reserve and just accept whatever the outcome. I'm pleased I didn't raise to the bait and instead did a test run (even if it was for an item far from being in best condition) before committing to auctioning a ten piece here. With the direct experience I now have, backed up by mj's comment, it seems clear I need to go elsewhere to reach good numbers of lively and enthused bidders. Basically, I need to find the people who are more excited and attracted by the prospect of holding in their hand 1/21-millionth or 1/2.1 millionth of all the BTC that will ever exist in an even more limited form (Casascius coins i.e. coins from the first person who thought up how an internet-native currency could work as physical coins and then produced them) than they are put off by whatever blemishes there may be on the physical coin itself.

I may find call to return again and will at least do you the courtesy of alerting you of sales / auctions of these coins elsewhere even if only to observe, assuming the likelihood of their being deemed to be overpriced by the OGs here. In the meantime, again but absent the 'sour-grapes-ness' of my message of last night, I'll wish everyone here the best for your endeavours and speculations

While you certainly don't owe me an apology I can respect and appreciate this post from you. It's a very classy and respectful post which is always nice to see. Cheers and good luck with your future sales.

iBHK8