Can civilization revert to a barter system

[S A KHAIR]

Central banks have announced CBDCs (central bank issued digital currencies). Some have voiced concerns of CBDCs being tools of surveillance and control. If society experiences CBDCs and decides they do not like them, will it be possible to revert to a barter based system of trade?
A barter based system could be more susceptible to fraud and scams. Yet would allow for financial transaction outside of CBDC regulation. This could become a necessary step if some individuals and businesses are deplatformed by CBDC. Some businesses can only survive by paying workers under the table.
In practice a barter based system could function similar to ebay with an independent and reliable 3rd party form of escrow. (Blockchain based of course, we aren't complete savages and primitives  )
Could a barter system be a worthwhile form of trade past the year 2022. Perhaps the next big leap forward will be a retro move backward into the past.

At one stage of the evolution of civilization, the exchange system was introduced among the people.  Man used to collect from others what he could not produce in exchange for the products he produced. 

This system was called the barter system.  Gradually money infiltrated and transactions started to take place through money. The bank is established to keep money deposits. Money became one of the means of exchange for human beings. Many more problems started with inflation.

 Is it possible to go back to the previous barter system to get rid of it?
 The answer is "no". 

Never possible.  In order to return to the state of exchange, the money and banking system have to be abolished which is by no means possible. The bank is not only a depository but also a financial intermediary whose job is to accept deposits, lend and raise money. 

If we want to go back to the barter system, we have to go back to civilization.  But we do know that "a civilization gradually evolves and becomes more advanced than before never go back.

[dunfida]

I don't really think we can go back to the old barter system in which you would exchange or trade something in return because that was so outdated already and in modern times, you can hardly see the part in which you could try to insert it to be used again. Most especially now that innovation and technology are rapidly spreading and used by almost everyone. Maybe in a little area like in some parts of a country which is rural, it can possibly happen. In the province and in simple communities, this would be probable and doable - to have a barter system that could enable people to live like it was an old century again. However, this won't be possible in the cities as this is more of a task and not everyone has the luxury to trade something for something. This could also bring conflict such as unjust wage counterparts and such to the workers. It's still much better to have it in a money-based system. Because after all, we cannot pay bills with vegies. I doubt the big corporations would even accept that.

Come to think alone that technology advancement do really flies fast and everything is gradually turns out to be digitalized already which means that we cant really turn into those times on where barter system is on the

works because talking about precision and accessibility and time of execution times is much more faster or way more better then it is just dumb that we would go back into a system where it is done manually.

I dont get the point on considering that we would really be going into those old system which most people been thinking off on how to make things way more faster and better.

[TheGreatPython]

I don't really see how a barter system could be working in today's world. The world became so international in the last 50 years. Almost any large company produces in multiple countries and relys on transportation of goods across long distances. The barter systems humans had in the past waa very local restricted. You know the seller or buyer and exchange directly with him. But now electronics buyers from North America or Europe have no real interaction with the sellers from China. It can't really be a direct barter transaction, so we need something in between, which is money right now. There will always be the need of some kind of medium in between.

It can't be, nobody can go back to barter system, there could be some industrial barter systems available for some industries that goes around in a cycle but that is about it, cannot be global.

The whole point of OP even writing this was to test the waters and if we have so many people saying no just here, imagine how many people would say no to anywhere else. This is why I honestly believe that we should not be really shocked that barter systems could be anything but a failed system if it is even tried.

[beezee]

I'm not sure that the barter system in this day and age applies. Maybe if 2 parties agree to barter I think it will go smoothly. but to barter in the state system I'm sure it will be difficult.

[savetheFORUM]

It can't be, nobody can go back to barter system, there could be some industrial barter systems available for some industries that goes around in a cycle but that is about it, cannot be global.

The whole point of OP even writing this was to test the waters and if we have so many people saying no just here, imagine how many people would say no to anywhere else. This is why I honestly believe that we should not be really shocked that barter systems could be anything but a failed system if it is even tried.

Yes, I guess the best way to approach these things is that any new idea should not be shot down right away, discussed and why it can't happen and then we can move on but we can't just ignore them because if people ignored bitcoin as a new idea, we wouldn't be here. Money or some sort of thing that provides value has to exchange hands, used to be gold in ancient times, now fiat, and we have crypto for the past decade or so, but has to be something.

[izsara]

Come to think alone that technology advancement do really flies fast and everything is gradually turns out to be digitalized already which means that we cant really turn into those times on where barter system is on the

works because talking about precision and accessibility and time of execution times is much more faster or way more better then it is just dumb that we would go back into a system where it is done manually.

I dont get the point on considering that we would really be going into those old system which most people been thinking off on how to make things way more faster and better.

The problem is that rapid and even very fast technological advances are not accompanied by the readiness of some people who still want to be in the old system so they don't want to move from their place even though the demands should be seen that they inevitably have to follow civilization in order to not left behind, and this is what causes some people to lack interest in seeing the future because they are comfortable in the past

[paxmao]

The technology has made us advanced and we can make payments at the ease of one click but what's the fun of going back in time for the rebirth of the old payment system known as barter exchange? Suppose you want to buy rice meals but you have wooden plates at your home and you will have to find the person who will have rice meals and want to have wooden plates from you.For these kind of situations you need to fulfill the two conditions and this is not possible in the current scenario.We have more advanced technology like btc where you don't need to worry about double coincidence of wants and whatever you want just pay it with LN within few seconds and no third party involvement.So why think about traditional methods.

If we talk about CDBC then it's again central control and it's nothing else but just digital fiat and even if they use Blockchain technology they will not provide any freedom to you and moreover they are just tools to make government more profits and whenever they want to make changes in it they can.



Government and central banks are trying to make people fool with their CDBC launch while most of them are figuring out how to explore Blockchain technology and make it fully central control and what do you think they will do when they launch it or why do they fear bitcoin? They want only profits and freedom of funds is not a good option for them.You yourself needs to be aware about how to use money with security and safeguard yourself from rising inflation so have btc stacked.

That is quite exact to be honest, the centrally issued coins put together the worst of both worlds and, as a layer of glazed crap on top, it adds a built-in invasion of privacy. I would be very wary of even considering the use of any CDBC launched by a dictatorial or repressive regime such as China or Turkey, but even in the EU or the US I really hope they do not make it mandatory.

[Rengga Jati]

Will the existence of this CBDC eventually erase fiat or paper money that has been used by residents in each country?
Does this CBDC also mean erasing various e-Money that has been official and valid?
If not, why bother going to the barter system? Don't we still have this alternative?
Moreover, every time there will be changes. In the past the barter system worked well, even I still feel how the barter system works.
But as time goes by, people are increasingly allowed to use "fiat money" and eventually we get used to this. And now there is also e-money, then cryptocurrency. Some have used this, but that doesn't mean fiat money is abolished.
And if later CBDC is required and abolishes fiat, then it may only be done by certain countries whose people are already prepared.
But if everything is not ready, I'm not sure that they will force them to only use CBDC or people will choose to barter again.

[Fatunad]

Come to think alone that technology advancement do really flies fast and everything is gradually turns out to be digitalized already which means that we cant really turn into those times on where barter system is on the

works because talking about precision and accessibility and time of execution times is much more faster or way more better then it is just dumb that we would go back into a system where it is done manually.

I dont get the point on considering that we would really be going into those old system which most people been thinking off on how to make things way more faster and better.

The problem is that rapid and even very fast technological advances are not accompanied by the readiness of some people who still want to be in the old system so they don't want to move from their place even though the demands should be seen that they inevitably have to follow civilization in order to not left behind, and this is what causes some people to lack interest in seeing the future because they are comfortable in the past

This is true on which there are still people who are stuck in the past and wont tend to improve out themselves on trying out to adapt on whats the current system the world is in.
They do tend to stick on whats on the past and wont welcome on  any changes or advancement that is really currently happening and thats the hardest part in talks of full adoption
or integration of things and we couldnt  really just let ourselves get stuck with the old system which it is not really that worth nor sensible on continuing if there is
something which is more better and more faster and secure.

[pinggoki]

With all the luxury that we have and all the philosophy and ideas that a work should get paid of something equal, I think that it's a no-brainer to say that we won't be able to go back to that point, at least on a global scale. This capitalistic society has build a strong supply chain that many industries rely on and reverting to that system might be considered catastrophic for theze industries.

[Furious 7]

With all the luxury that we have and all the philosophy and ideas that a work should get paid of something equal, I think that it's a no-brainer to say that we won't be able to go back to that point, at least on a global scale. This capitalistic society has build a strong supply chain that many industries rely on and reverting to that system might be considered catastrophic for theze industries.

Of course, in this case there are some considerations that will not support the barter system like this.
if indeed we look at some of the weaknesses of the barter system, of course there are very many weaknesses there, one of them is like what you said about something that must be paid equally (in price not amount) and this will definitely be very difficult when indeed the development of civilization is getting higher but the system is applied is still the same. Of course, by creating money, it is to create something simpler and even if you look now at paper money in terms of payments, it has been much reduced and many of them have moved to a more modern direction, such as fiat, which is still ranked first in payments or indeed crypto in the world. some countries that have made them as a means of payment

[pawanjain]

Central banks have announced CBDCs (central bank issued digital currencies). Some have voiced concerns of CBDCs being tools of surveillance and control. If society experiences CBDCs and decides they do not like them, will it be possible to revert to a barter based system of trade?

A barter based system could be more susceptible to fraud and scams. Yet would allow for financial transaction outside of CBDC regulation. This could become a necessary step if some individuals and businesses are deplatformed by CBDC. Some businesses can only survive by paying workers under the table.

In practice a barter based system could function similar to ebay with an independent and reliable 3rd party form of escrow. (Blockchain based of course, we aren't complete savages and primitives  )

Could a barter system be a worthwhile form of trade past the year 2022. Perhaps the next big leap forward will be a retro move backward into the past.

The major reason why the barter system was demolished is because the lack of value for a particular item in exchange for the other.
It would be very difficult to calculate the value of a particular product without a proper scale of price.
Also, if people think governments will be able to track the money and have control over it then it also becomes a disadvantage for themselves.
At any point of audit they could themself be tracked by higher authorities and get blamed for a fraud or corruption.

[Minor Miner]

Will the existence of this CBDC eventually erase fiat or paper money that has been used by residents in each country?
Does this CBDC also mean erasing various e-Money that has been official and valid?
If not, why bother going to the barter system? Don't we still have this alternative?
Moreover, every time there will be changes. In the past the barter system worked well, even I still feel how the barter system works.
But as time goes by, people are increasingly allowed to use "fiat money" and eventually we get used to this. And now there is also e-money, then cryptocurrency. Some have used this, but that doesn't mean fiat money is abolished.
And if later CBDC is required and abolishes fiat, then it may only be done by certain countries whose people are already prepared.
But if everything is not ready, I'm not sure that they will force them to only use CBDC or people will choose to barter again.

Right,  it is never possible for a civilization to go back to the system of exchange because you know, civilization is never backward.
Look, the practice of exchange was introduced only when money was not invented. At that time people used to exchange their necessities with each other and thus meet the demand for all commodities.

But now it is traded for money. Money is now the main medium of exchange. Banking system has been established. Civilization has also come a long way, much more advanced than ever before from which it is never possible to return to the system of exchange by the extinction of money.

[nakamura12]

I don't think that the civilization will revert back to barter but there are some people who still barter. For government or banks, barter won't happen. If reverting back to barter system then will it benefit us all or not?. As of now, we have a medium when you exchange or trade an item or product online or physical. The game I played didn't even have the barter system and it used a medium which is the game currency so when trading, selling use money instead of using another product to exchange.

[izsara]

The problem is that rapid and even very fast technological advances are not accompanied by the readiness of some people who still want to be in the old system so they don't want to move from their place even though the demands should be seen that they inevitably have to follow civilization in order to not left behind, and this is what causes some people to lack interest in seeing the future because they are comfortable in the past

This is true on which there are still people who are stuck in the past and wont tend to improve out themselves on trying out to adapt on whats the current system the world is in.
They do tend to stick on whats on the past and wont welcome on  any changes or advancement that is really currently happening and thats the hardest part in talks of full adoption
or integration of things and we couldnt  really just let ourselves get stuck with the old system which it is not really that worth nor sensible on continuing if there is
something which is more better and more faster and secure.

Actually, things like this are very natural for them because they are already comfortable where they were in the past and now, with all the advancements in technology today, they must inevitably change their comfort and get out of that comfort zone.
but they refuse and still maintain it even though things like this make them even more left behind.

[fullhdpixel]

This is true on which there are still people who are stuck in the past and wont tend to improve out themselves on trying out to adapt on whats the current system the world is in.
They do tend to stick on whats on the past and wont welcome on  any changes or advancement that is really currently happening and thats the hardest part in talks of full adoption or integration of things and we couldnt  really just let ourselves get stuck with the old system which it is not really that worth nor sensible on continuing if there is something which is more better and more faster and secure.

Unfortunately that is mainly because it usually works at first, then starts not working. You have to understand that if there is a "way" that people could make money, then people will make money with it, and other people will realize, or someone will tell everyone and then suddenly everyone starts to make money that way and it will always end up with something like very little or no profit making since everyone is doing the same thing.

This is why I honestly believe that there is a big problem in the world of finances, same method can't make you rich over and over again, you have to realize that you need to keep researching new methods and adapt.

[STT]

Barter is inefficient overall in an economy so it is unlikely to be any improvement.    Its not like its ever gone away completely, deals are done all the time in some areas of the economy but overall it would reduce liquidity and monetary velocity by reducing pricing accuracy and ease of exchange.

[bhooscream]

Ima thinking about how high CBDCs will have the powers actually? I know that it is backed up by the government, but I don't think it will be a must done by their citizens to use CBDC.
Barter is actually complicated if used right now. The era has been different from the past.
It may work, but not sure if that will be effective and efficient, moreover f this is about long-distance trading and business.
On the other hand, the government will also not force to only use Cbdc. It only becomes one of the alternatives offered officially by the government, doesn't it? Not becomes the one that must be used.

[Argoo]

Ima thinking about how high CBDCs will have the powers actually? I know that it is backed up by the government, but I don't think it will be a must done by their citizens to use CBDC.
Barter is actually complicated if used right now. The era has been different from the past.
It may work, but not sure if that will be effective and efficient, moreover f this is about long-distance trading and business.
On the other hand, the government will also not force to only use Cbdc. It only becomes one of the alternatives offered officially by the government, doesn't it? Not becomes the one that must be used.

From a legal point of view, barter transactions are actually an exchange agreement, that is, a type of civil law agreement in which one party undertakes to transfer some property to the other party against the obligation of the other party to transfer property of equal value to the first (from the point of view of the parties to the agreement). With barter, you still need to evaluate the value of the goods on both sides, and the currency of states does this well. That is, all the same, we turn to fiat in a barter transaction. At the level of a decent business, this is a very risky deal. In general, a return to barter is a return to the Stone Age.