Question for regular casino players. Will you use Lightning if available?

[Tellek Garing]

I made a topic 4 years ago that asked if casino site owners and operators were interested in integrating/implementing the Lightning Network for their service. It had just three replies, and two were mine. Hahaha.

I want to ask again, and this time to the users. Will you use the Lightning Network if available? Or will you continue to use whichever altcoin you're currently using?

Aside from the fact that casinos take fee for withdrawal aside from the blockchain fee which is a means of earning revenue for the casino, most casinos are afraid of the integrating lightening network due to the fact that lightening network is a new development and not still at it testnet so not many business will want to integrate it.

But on a personal note I will use lightening network to make deposits and withdrawals since LN offers relatively low fees.

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[CaVO32]

I made a topic 4 years ago that asked if casino site owners and operators were interested in integrating/implementing the Lightning Network for their service. It had just three replies, and two were mine. Hahaha.

I want to ask again, and this time to the users. Will you use the Lightning Network if available? Or will you continue to use whichever altcoin you're currently using?

Aside from the fact that casinos take fee for withdrawal aside from the blockchain fee which is a means of earning revenue for the casino, most casinos are afraid of the integrating lightening network due to the fact that lightening network is a new development and not still at it testnet so not many business will want to integrate it.

But on a personal note I will use lightening network to make deposits and withdrawals since LN offers relatively low fees.

I think what is holding back for the massive adoption in LN is the availability of trading platforms and other sites that are accepting LN payment. Most players want cheap fees but they don't want to learn on their own how to set-up their own LN wallet. So most are just relying on these exchanges to convert their crypto to other currencies like fiat. But if there will be exchanges which accept LN, I have the feeling that the demand for this payment method will increase. I for one, will use it if I can directly send my funds from the casino to an exchange, to convert it to my fiat.

[RILWAN]

I have been an early adopter of the Bitcoin lightning network and a strong advocate, I will gladly use the service if it is available in any casinos. The mass adoption of lightning networks will be more effective if there is high demand for platforms such as casinos.

[stomachgrowls]

I have been an early adopter of the Bitcoin lightning network and a strong advocate, I will gladly use the service if it is available in any casinos. The mass adoption of lightning networks will be more effective if there is high demand for platforms such as casinos.

There are already some casinos that integrate lightning network which is really good to look at or make use of but the main issue is the trust that do connects with it that's why they aren't really able to get sufficient number of players due into that kind of problem which is something not surprising.

I've seen that this one is done well but not all would really be that confident on using LN yet they do say that it's still on developmental state and they do much prefer those older ways.

[Wind_FURY]

I have been an early adopter of the Bitcoin lightning network and a strong advocate, I will gladly use the service if it is available in any casinos. The mass adoption of lightning networks will be more effective if there is high demand for platforms such as casinos.

There are already some casinos that integrate lightning network which is really good to look at or make use of but the main issue is the trust that do connects with it that's why they aren't really able to get sufficient number of players due into that kind of problem which is something not surprising.

I've seen that this one is done well but not all would really be that confident on using LN yet they do say that it's still on developmental state and they do much prefer those older ways.

I'm starting to see, and recognize that merely "accepting" deposits through the Lightning Network "because cheap/fast Bitcoin transactions" might not be enough to attract users to actually force them to use it. Altcoins have been doing the job good enough for many users for fast/cheap transactions. But shower thought, what if a casino with absolutley NO KYC as a unique selling proposition, and built directly on top of Lightning like the way DirectBet was built on top of the Bitcoin blockchain?

As an example, a casino like this, but with more games, https://lightning-roulette.com/

[LUCKMCFLY]

definitely yes! and for all other people that answer yes I already built something here.

https://t.me/lncoinflipbot
It's a coin flip telegram bot that you can play with lightning. it's provably fair! give it a try/

I think I've seen the same gambling game that's built through telegram's bot.

How long you've been operating with this flip coin game on telegram? So as it accepts LN, it's probably also accepting other cryptos.

Since some players are not using it too even though the fees are cheaper paying $5 is also cheaper  for them too and it is less complicated than LN as many people here are still not understand what LN is , does the LN only uses small amount or it can be used too in bigger transactions?

AFAIK, LN is only ideal for small transfers but there's a development that's going there for larger transfers.

no it only accepts Bitcoin on Lightning. There's no need for other cryptos. All my apps and services are Bitcoin only.
Lightning Network is fast/cheap transfer bitcoin, why use anything else? It's very easy to use.
Just download any wallet and send/receive.

For players of your style, the fact that the casinos have the LN functionality is highly valued and accepted among all its members, in addition to the fact that, like you, there are many players who only have BTC and only want to play with BTC, sometimes it can be Annoying that some fees are that bottleneck, but it's as simple as you say, it's like downloading the wallet, making deposits and withdrawing.

I am very sure that the number of traders in the world that exist, many do not play in casinos because of the fees, and because of what it takes to change BTC for alts, I really support your motion.

[delfastTions]

By the way, a couple of days ago, the LN network set another record for bitcoins blocked in channels.  I would like LN itself to develop faster, but development is still taking place. 
Definitely, for many people who have bitcoin, it is absolutely superfluous to exchange it for other altcoins.  Extra operations on exchanges and, by the way, paying extra commissions for the exchange.  Most casino players do not need this at all. 
So LN definitely has a huge potential for use in the gambling industry. 
Let's hope that the casinos themselves will be active in implementing LN.

[pakhitheboss]

I have been an early adopter of the Bitcoin lightning network and a strong advocate, I will gladly use the service if it is available in any casinos. The mass adoption of lightning networks will be more effective if there is high demand for platforms such as casinos.

There are already some casinos that integrate lightning network which is really good to look at or make use of but the main issue is the trust that do connects with it that's why they aren't really able to get sufficient number of players due into that kind of problem which is something not surprising.

I've seen that this one is done well but not all would really be that confident on using LN yet they do say that it's still on developmental state and they do much prefer those older ways.

It would be very interested to know which online casinos are now allowing LN fir gambling. A list of the same can encourage a lot of people replying on this topic to use those casinos. LN us the fastest and cheapest way to use Bitcoin but there not much information available about vendors accepting it.

[slaman29]

I'm starting to see, and recognize that merely "accepting" deposits through the Lightning Network "because cheap/fast Bitcoin transactions" might not be enough to attract users to actually force them to use it. Altcoins have been doing the job good enough for many users for fast/cheap transactions. But shower thought, what if a casino with absolutley NO KYC as a unique selling proposition, and built directly on top of Lightning like the way DirectBet was built on top of the Bitcoin blockchain?

As an example, a casino like this, but with more games, https://lightning-roulette.com/

I've seen one site put in Lightning and then after a while remove it anyway despite most people there using BTC to play. Especially the past few years fees have really been cheap enough to send normally, I guess the demand isn't as much as we would have thought.

And yes, maybe I feel more secure paying $1 to ensure I get it there than $0.01 to wonder if I'm doing it right.

[carlfebz2]

I'm starting to see, and recognize that merely "accepting" deposits through the Lightning Network "because cheap/fast Bitcoin transactions" might not be enough to attract users to actually force them to use it. Altcoins have been doing the job good enough for many users for fast/cheap transactions. But shower thought, what if a casino with absolutley NO KYC as a unique selling proposition, and built directly on top of Lightning like the way DirectBet was built on top of the Bitcoin blockchain?

As an example, a casino like this, but with more games, https://lightning-roulette.com/

I've seen one site put in Lightning and then after a while remove it anyway despite most people there using BTC to play. Especially the past few years fees have really been cheap enough to send normally, I guess the demand isn't as much as we would have thought.

And yes, maybe I feel more secure paying $1 to ensure I get it there than $0.01 to wonder if I'm doing it right.

Some do say say it was still experimental thats why they do still prefer the old way instead of LN but eventually i dont see anything wrong on making use of LN but it wasnt really that developed well

on which it could really be that just right for it to be in used on this kind of aspect but it wont really be that bad on making use as long it do serve out its purpose but for now its still experimental?

It doesnt really get that much attention but one day when its really that being developed then there's some chance.

[Wind_FURY]

I'm starting to see, and recognize that merely "accepting" deposits through the Lightning Network "because cheap/fast Bitcoin transactions" might not be enough to attract users to actually force them to use it. Altcoins have been doing the job good enough for many users for fast/cheap transactions. But shower thought, what if a casino with absolutley NO KYC as a unique selling proposition, and built directly on top of Lightning like the way DirectBet was built on top of the Bitcoin blockchain?

As an example, a casino like this, but with more games, https://lightning-roulette.com/

I've seen one site put in Lightning and then after a while remove it anyway despite most people there using BTC to play. Especially the past few years fees have really been cheap enough to send normally, I guess the demand isn't as much as we would have thought.

It's more complicated than "demand for Lightning isn't high". It's also because, as I said in my post that you quoted, a lack of unique selling proposition for the casino/lack of unique value proposition for the user to use the Lightning Network. It's not only happening in casinos, but also in exchanges as well. As debated, what if a casino, or an exchange was built on top of Lightning and offered NO KYC as a unique selling proposition? I believe it might be something many people in the community would like.

[slaman29]

As debated, what if a casino, or an exchange was built on top of Lightning and offered NO KYC as a unique selling proposition? I believe it might be something many people in the community would like.

I get what you're saying but why is No KYC the proposition for Lightning and not for on-chain? If an exchange or casino is regulated, it won't matter if they're using Layer 1/2/3 or whatever, they can't promise no KYC.

Maybe I'm not understanding why this also helps sell L2 though. When L1 already by default doesn't need KYC, that's been the entire USP of using on-chain non custodial services...

[shasan]

Aside from the fact that casinos take fee for withdrawal aside from the blockchain fee which is a means of earning revenue for the casino

Almost all the casino as well as exchange site take fees base on their own fixed withdrawal fees from where they get commission. If  we use lightning network they will still take the commission though that commission might be lower than the commission which they are receiving right now.

[CaVO32]

Aside from the fact that casinos take fee for withdrawal aside from the blockchain fee which is a means of earning revenue for the casino

Almost all the casino as well as exchange site take fees base on their own fixed withdrawal fees from where they get commission. If  we use lightning network they will still take the commission though that commission might be lower than the commission which they are receiving right now.

I don't know the reason why exchanges and gambling platforms are not integrating LN, but maybe it is due to the small fees that they can get. Because if exchanges are offering LN, and there is LN also in a casino, I will probably use LN. But if it is only in casino, where I saw one here accepting LN, and no exchanges to transfer to, I won't use it. So it is the availability of this network to trading platforms, I think is one reason why people are not using this network. Most people are just lazy to install a wallet having LN. Actually, electrum has LN but you need to be careful in setting this up to avoid mistakes.

[Wind_FURY]

As debated, what if a casino, or an exchange was built on top of Lightning and offered NO KYC as a unique selling proposition? I believe it might be something many people in the community would like.

I get what you're saying but why is No KYC the proposition for Lightning and not for on-chain? If an exchange or casino is regulated, it won't matter if they're using Layer 1/2/3 or whatever, they can't promise no KYC.

Maybe I'm not understanding why this also helps sell L2 though. When L1 already by default doesn't need KYC, that's been the entire USP of using on-chain non custodial services...

You didn't understand, or didn't get neither the context nor the point. Are you familiar with the TRUE ON-CHAIN casino called DirectBet?

“DirectBet revolutionized the way sports betting is done with crypto currencies. We came out with a unique approach where you don’t need to create an account and deposit to place a bet. Instead, winnings are sent back directly to your wallet, instantly and within minutes of the result. At DirectBet, your coins are kept safe in your wallet under your control while they are not in a wager.

https://www.bitcoincasinopro.com/reviews/directbet/

But because as the network became more congested, blocks full, fees high, it became impractical to use DirectBet. BUT, what if a casino like DirectBet was built on top of the Lightning Network? I believe it might also attract, and give users an incentive to use Lightning.

[slaman29]

You didn't understand, or didn't get neither the context nor the point. Are you familiar with the TRUE ON-CHAIN casino called DirectBet?

But because as the network became more congested, blocks full, fees high, it became impractical to use DirectBet. BUT, what if a casino like DirectBet was built on top of the Lightning Network? I believe it might also attract, and give users an incentive to use Lightning.

I don't think there is any true gambler who was around the forum in the past 4 years who doesn't know directbet, but I guess I didn't get what you meant from before because I thought you were talking about Lightning as an enabler for no-KYC. But you're actually saying no-KYC as the gateway to Lightning adoption (then I agree, but no-KYC is the gateway for BTC adoption and people still end up using KYC custodials because of convenience and ease of use).

But now you made it clear although in my mind it makes it harder for a casino to use Lightning  AND offer no KYC cause I always thought opening channels makes you more identifiable. Bear in mind I know very little about it as never used it.

[LUCKMCFLY]

I have been an early adopter of the Bitcoin lightning network and a strong advocate, I will gladly use the service if it is available in any casinos. The mass adoption of lightning networks will be more effective if there is high demand for platforms such as casinos.

There are already some casinos that integrate lightning network which is really good to look at or make use of but the main issue is the trust that do connects with it that's why they aren't really able to get sufficient number of players due into that kind of problem which is something not surprising.

I've seen that this one is done well but not all would really be that confident on using LN yet they do say that it's still on developmental state and they do much prefer those older ways.

I'm starting to see, and recognize that merely "accepting" deposits through the Lightning Network "because cheap/fast Bitcoin transactions" might not be enough to attract users to actually force them to use it. Altcoins have been doing the job good enough for many users for fast/cheap transactions. But shower thought, what if a casino with absolutley NO KYC as a unique selling proposition, and built directly on top of Lightning like the way DirectBet was built on top of the Bitcoin blockchain?

As an example, a casino like this, but with more games, https://lightning-roulette.com/

That casino is in DEMO mode and I think it's very good, I'm really not much of a Roulette player, but they have a good concept, besides the fact that the game is fast, and it has a particularity that I don't know if it's currently lost, when I was a few years ago in a traditional physical casino, the roulette had the cer(0) and the double zero(00) in this one has only one zero(0), for me that way it has more chances of winning more when they have so many options, and particularly if it is that fast and each deposit through LN one can play like this, at least I would be hooked to play slots, because with little you can enjoy a lot, and this in some sites is limited to a certain amount, but as it is in LN it would be a low minimum amount to attract both big and small players.

[delfastTions]

I'm starting to see, and recognize that merely "accepting" deposits through the Lightning Network "because cheap/fast Bitcoin transactions" might not be enough to attract users to actually force them to use it. Altcoins have been doing the job good enough for many users for fast/cheap transactions. But shower thought, what if a casino with absolutley NO KYC as a unique selling proposition, and built directly on top of Lightning like the way DirectBet was built on top of the Bitcoin blockchain?

As an example, a casino like this, but with more games, https://lightning-roulette.com/

I've seen one site put in Lightning and then after a while remove it anyway despite most people there using BTC to play. Especially the past few years fees have really been cheap enough to send normally, I guess the demand isn't as much as we would have thought.

And yes, maybe I feel more secure paying $1 to ensure I get it there than $0.01 to wonder if I'm doing it right.

This is the main problem with using the LN network in everyday payments. I also noticed that when the main bitcoin blockchain is in a calm state, then the commissions become very small, sometimes they are measured in a few cents on the slow transaction option. In such periods, the relevance of LN is indeed reduced. And the number of LN users is also decreasing.
So devs casinos are thinking - is it worth it to provide LN, or this payment option will remain unclaimed and even unnecessary.
Therefore, I think that the introduction of LN in general in the crypto-currency market is going on so slowly, and in particular, the use of LN in crypto-casinos too.

[smartaction]

The only reason to use lighting network is to make quick transactions.  Because Bitcoin's block takes a long time to be confirmed.  Which is often the cause of annoyance among gamblers. I use the lighting network for deposits and withdrawals.  Because it charges less gas fees.  And completes transactions quickly.

[slaman29]

I've seen one site put in Lightning and then after a while remove it anyway despite most people there using BTC to play. Especially the past few years fees have really been cheap enough to send normally, I guess the demand isn't as much as we would have thought.

And yes, maybe I feel more secure paying $1 to ensure I get it there than $0.01 to wonder if I'm doing it right.

This is the main problem with using the LN network in everyday payments. I also noticed that when the main bitcoin blockchain is in a calm state, then the commissions become very small, sometimes they are measured in a few cents on the slow transaction option. In such periods, the relevance of LN is indeed reduced. And the number of LN users is also decreasing.
So devs casinos are thinking - is it worth it to provide LN, or this payment option will remain unclaimed and even unnecessary.
Therefore, I think that the introduction of LN in general in the crypto-currency market is going on so slowly, and in particular, the use of LN in crypto-casinos too.

Hope you don't get me wrong that I don't like Lightning, I actually do, I just feel like it's not as easy to use as Bitcoin itself (which according to a lot of newbies already is quite difficult, hence why they stick to easy wallets instead of a real client).

So yes I said more secure but the real reason for most people could simply be that it's not as easy to use.

I didn't know LN users decreasing, thought it was always on the up?