"Not your keys, not your coins"

[BlackHatCoiner]

That's you, and not approximately 90%(just a guess, don't quote me on this) of people outside the US without access to (or with great difficulty accessing) the US dollar.

But, they don't access the US dollar; they access a centralized currency that's supposedly pegged to the US dollar. And my question is: Why would someone outside the US want to access the US dollar? If they want to pay a US merchant online, it's better to have an intermediary to convert their EUR, GPB etc., to USD automatically, like PayPal. And that's because fiat currency is centralized by design; such intermediary is required.

On the other hand, with a stable coin, you need A) an intermediary who'll convert USDC to USD and B) an intermediary whose word has to be unquestionably taken that USDC isn't backed by thin air.

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[mk4]

But, they don't access the US dollar; they access a centralized currency that's supposedly pegged to the US dollar. And my question is: Why would someone outside the US want to access the US dollar? If they want to pay a US merchant online, it's better to have an intermediary to convert their EUR, GPB etc., to USD automatically, like PayPal. And that's because fiat currency is centralized by design.

On the other hand, with a stable coin, you need A) an intermediary who'll convert USDC to USD and B) an intermediary whose word has to be taken that USDC isn't backed by thin air.

Though it's backed — USDC might not technically be 'real' USD, but it works. It can be used as a currency and for payments just as how BTC can be used; and a good number of people do not actually convert their USDC to their local currency unless needed because they can use it online. Also the fact that some people feel more comfortable having USD exposure through USDC rather than holding their local currency.

^Not saying that people should or should not trust USDC, but a good number of people do.

[BlackHatCoiner]

Though it's backed

Can you prove it?

'real' USD

I'm not familiar with that term, even in quotation marks. What's a "real" USD after all? Is it cash? Is it credit? Debt? Credit on the credit? Credit on the debt? Bond? An unlicensed IOU, which is essentially a "stable" coin?

It can be used as a currency and for payments just as how BTC can be used

Alas if it couldn't; it's supposed to be a currency.

and a good number of people do not actually convert their USDC to their local currency unless needed because they can use it online.

Definitely, but that doesn't make it any different than just having a central database (AKA, spreadsheet) wherein the users' transactions are saved. It's less useful than PayPal, with extra steps.

[Mpamaegbu]

Some exchanges like Binance are naturally shady and the problems they face are more real than others since they may not even have enough bitcoins to pay everyone which could be the reason why they stopped letting people withdraw bitcoin but they still allow withdrawal of shitcoins on alternative chains (like BTC on Binance chain which is not really BTC).

Honestly, the BTC on Binance chain something is crazy. I don't know how CZ and his team arrived at such a crazy innovation. For whatsoever reason, I don't even go near that. I haven't transacted using such pseudo BTC. Anything that's not the original BTC chain raises my suspicion and that's what happens with me and what Binance is offering in that.

these days a large number of people are buying bitcoin and transferring it to their cold storages taking advantage of the current discount.

Aptly captured. It's discount indeed. This is the type only veterans will understand because newcomers will be scared to go in at a time like this.

[taufik123]

these days a large number of people are buying bitcoin and transferring it to their cold storages taking advantage of the current discount.

Aptly captured. It's discount indeed. This is the type only veterans will understand because newcomers will be scared to go in at a time like this.

Not only are they scared, but they also don't have the money left to buy bitcoin at the current discounted price.
Those new players are busy looking at the chart every day and then choosing Cutloss, because the price of Bitcoin is getting lower.
They are not ready to lose their money. I believe
the veterans will benefit greatly this time.

[Shamim11223]

Most especially these days when even the largest exchanges like Coinbase and Crypto.com are going through hard times, it is really more urgent to not leave funds on exchanges. The risk has gone a lot higher. Even Binance itself had to halt Bitcoin withdrawals due to a large volume of transactions that are stuck. There's an exchange run happening. Things don't look good, now more than ever. Not your keys, not your coins is most relevant today.

[mk4]

Can you prove it?

Nope. Hence why I said in my previous post that it's 'supposedly' backed. Just like the money in your PayPal account. In both cases we're hugely trusting a US-based company.

Definitely, but that doesn't make it any different than just having a central database (AKA, spreadsheet) wherein the users' transactions are saved. It's less useful than PayPal, with extra steps.

Yes. But that's besides the topic. It's pretty much the crypto-version of PayPal. But in the end — my main point is that people find it useful, so people that doesn't have access to USD through banks use it. Sure people could use PayPal, but the likeliness of getting de-platformed is far higher with PayPal than being address-locked with USDC (at least for now).

[teosanru]

Obviously it's a good practice to have it always and forever people having their own keys while holding Cryptos are much more safer compared to those having stored their coins on exchange but eventually I sometimes feel if the project is a scam in itself there isn't a lot of things that anyone can do about it. Luna for example no matter where you had it stored it's still going to go to zero. I feel it's equally important to keep money in good projects and also diversify the same into different projects in order to be safe at all times.

[xSkylarx]

If you have huge amount of assets in crypto, never store it on centralized exchanges or lending platforms. Your assets are in danger on those platforms if you plan to hold them for long term. Only put there are the amount that you will use on a daily basis.

Sometimes using a decentralized wallet isn't enough if your holdings are like 6 digits or above so using a hardware wallet is also a good option to help secure your cryptocurrencies.

[Kakmakr]

The thing is.... people are so used to the convenience of centralized services, because they used centralized services in the Fiat system (Banks) and they trust these services, because it is backed by governments. (Governments give bailouts when they fail)

They think large (regulated) Crypto exchanges give them the same security that Banks and other regulated financial institutions give them, but they are wrong. These centralized services are the main focus point for hackers and also for corrupt governments... and they can lose access to their coins at any given moment.  

[Mpamaegbu]

~snipped~

Not only are they scared, but they also don't have the money left to buy bitcoin at the current discounted price.

That's sadly true; at least for those who've been doing the DCA thing since Bitcoin started dipping till now.

The thing is.... people are so used to the convenience of centralized services, because they used centralized services in the Fiat system (Banks) and they trust these services, because it is backed by governments. (Governments give bailouts when they fail)

You know, I've tried to rationalize how someone who lives on trading won't get to rely or keep their cryptos on centralized exchange(s) and still trade comfortably. Decentralized exchanges don't hodl enough cryptos to enable traders alternate easily and do their trades. I might understand the warning of people not leaving their coins on centralized exchanges if they only intend to hodl them but for a trader I don't think that's feasible.

[laurenB7742]

They think large (regulated) Crypto exchanges give them the same security that Banks and other regulated financial institutions give them, but they are wrong. These centralized services are the main focus point for hackers and also for corrupt governments... and they can lose access to their coins at any given moment.  

This is not the actual reason why many people use the crypto exchange. Personally, I use crypto exchange and prefer to hold my coins to exchange when the amount is below 500 USD.

I know 500 USD is huge for newcomers but I'm telling you about my personal matter. When I know I may need to sell that coins at any time and the amount is really affordable I prefer to hold that in an exchange account thus I can sell them instantly.

But, at the time I invested a decent amount of money to buy Bitcoin for long-term holding I never take the risk to hold it on an exchange account, I always prefer to gather all my coins in a hardware wallet to secure that for the long term.

So, we need to use both of them in our daily life, and yes it is risky and they can lock your funds at any time without giving any reason that's why you should have to avoid exchanges if you plane for long term holding.

[DoublerHunter]

If you have huge amount of assets in crypto, never store it on centralized exchanges or lending platforms. Your assets are in danger on those platforms if you plan to hold them for long term. Only put there are the amount that you will use on a daily basis.

Sometimes using a decentralized wallet isn't enough if your holdings are like 6 digits or above so using a hardware wallet is also a good option to help secure your cryptocurrencies.

^I think staking your assets also considering at risk too, how you can entrust your fund on the platform that we dont know what will happen in the future. We should always remember this rule, not your keys, not your coins.
Even though gambling platform will considering on centralized exchange, dont store on their wallet if you want to have a full control on it. Always pull out your fund after sessions will end.

[taufik123]

That's sadly true; at least for those who've been doing the DCA thing since Bitcoin started dipping till now.

But for those who don't do DCA, of course it will be a regret not being able to buy cheap.
Of course they have to sell some other assets such as their spare vehicle or property, if they want to join this bitcoin deep euphoria. But the risk of loss is their own responsibility.

^I think staking your assets also considering at risk too, how you can entrust your fund on the platform that we dont know what will happen in the future. We should always remember this rule, not your keys, not your coins.
Even though gambling platform will considering on centralized exchange, dont store on their wallet if you want to have a full control on it. Always pull out your fund after sessions will end.

Centralized exchange is only a temporary trading place and cannot be used as a main asset repository, it is indeed more risky, because there is no complete control. Some risks such as hacking and asset freezing will become a problem that will suddenly occur.

[EdenHazard]

The thing is.... people are so used to the convenience of centralized services, because they used centralized services in the Fiat system (Banks) and they trust these services, because it is backed by governments. (Governments give bailouts when they fail)

They think large (regulated) Crypto exchanges give them the same security that Banks and other regulated financial institutions give them, but they are wrong. These centralized services are the main focus point for hackers and also for corrupt governments... and they can lose access to their coins at any given moment.  

True ...

But there is another problem beside all of those reasons above , the complexity to have our own keys make the most of crypto userr especially a newcomer and non tech savvy will sure prefer to choose the centralized exchange over the decentralized wallet like trezor to store our own crypto.
As time goes by things gonna be alright and just become a usual thing to have a hardware wallet but for now people still thinks it's complicated .. just like the otherday where website & internet being underestimated plus complicated but now look at us , internet become the primary need everywhere

[pooya87]

That's you, and not approximately 90%(just a guess, don't quote me on this) of people outside the US without access to (or with great difficulty accessing) the US dollar.

People who want security and want to exit cryptocurrencies should use fiat, no matter what fiat it is instead of centralized shitcoins that could disappear at any moment or freeze their accounts (like USDT, USDC, etc.) and people outside US use their own fiat currencies, they don't need a US bank account.

[odolvlobo]

It's bad idea to send your coins to centralized lending platforms (like Celcius, 3 Arrows Capital ie.). You don't own key and they can disable withdrawal, apply for bankruptcy anytime.

I disagree. Investing your coins is not bad if you understand the risks.

You are basically saying that everyone should keep all of their money under their mattresses and never invest in anything. That is bad advice.

The basis for "not your keys, not your coins" is that you gain very little by letting somebody else hold your coins. The tradeoff is not positive. On the other hand, if you invest your money, the tradeoff is positive as long as the return makes up for any risks.

[ImThour]

Always take out your funds from exchanges when Bitcoin drops below 30%. Then is the time when Exchanges starts acting weird and may disable your withdrawals on some non-sense reasons.
I prefer to buy a Ledger or Trezor and keep your funds SAFU in that.

[barbara44]

People don't realize that the fact of sending their bitcoins to a centralized service represents a risk. If we make a deposit on an exchange or a casino, at that moment the coins don't belong to us anymore. And if the service decides to lock your balance and keep the money they can do it without problems.

On the technical side, it would be easy for the exchanges to provide a deposit address and give to the customer the private keys, but if they do this then they would lose control of the coins, and we know they don't want that.

Some people knows this already but they still insist to use centralized exchanges like binance and centralized gambling sites (there are lots of them right now) I think that is because they are on the mainstream.

There are decentralized platforms but they are usually not popular as the centralized ones, I think this can be the reason why many people are discouraged on using them because they think it wasn't trusted or there are not enough feedback from those platforms. In my opinion, it is not bad to use a centralized platform as long as you are not storing your money on them for a long period of time and you're not deposing bigger amounts.

[Minecache]

Sometimes using a decentralized wallet isn't enough if your holdings are like 6 digits or above so using a hardware wallet is also a good option to help secure your cryptocurrencies.

Your assets do not have to be 6 digits or more, you need to think of a hardware wallet to store it. For me, investing in crypto is a long term investment whether you own 10 bitcoins or you only own 0.1bitcoins it is still our property. To be on the safe side, let's protect it with a hardware wallet now. Right now, 0.1 bitcoin is worth $2k, but if you hold it long enough, it may be worth $20k, $200k in the future. Who knows? As a crypto investor, we should invest in a hardware wallet to safeguard our assets.