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Author Topic: [GLBSE] GEM - Invest in Diamonds!!!  (Read 5114 times)
c0ffer
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December 09, 2011, 01:47:51 AM
 #1

c0ffer Gemstone Sales Announces GLBSE - GEM Listing

GEM GLBSE shares are attached to the value of physical gemstone assets allocated to the shares. Shares can be redeemed for physical inventory. Physical inventory for these shares are diamonds.

Current holdings: Diamonds 1ctw (1 pt. x 100)

(pic only shows some of the entire carat)


Shares Issued: 100 (1 share = 1 diamond)

Shares Available For Sale: 50 (25 SOLD)

Opening bid for shares is 1BTC

This is an experiment in tying BTC to the value of diamonds Grin

I have allocated 100 1pt. diamonds to be held against the shares sold.
If you own a share, you own a diamond.
If you want to cash out your share, you will be sent a diamond (you must pay for shipping).
I have released 25 shares for sale and will release another 25 if the first 25 sell.
If I sell the diamonds for a profit, the proceeds will be reinvested in more diamonds and increase the value of the shares proportionately.

This should be interesting to see how it goes Smiley

Feel free to post questions or PM for more info.





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c0ffer
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December 09, 2011, 06:40:26 PM
 #2

Yes, that is another way of breaking it down. If you were to cash in your share immediately, you would be buying 1pt diamonds for 1BTC each.

Wholesale pricing on 1pt diamonds is roughly $300-$450 depending on quality, etc. These are very nice and can easily fetch that price (I will have stats to accompany the pics) so the potential for turing them over and increasing the value of the fund is not unrealistic. The retail price for them is higher of course.

In the event that diamonds are sold/reinvested or if shareholders redeem their shares, I do have access to additional quantities to continue the offering and support the shares.

Even if the diamonds are strictly held, then the value of the shares in BTC should move based on the value of BTC.

I will also be adding a section to my website that will have all of the info I post here and additional information, stats, pics, etc.


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December 09, 2011, 06:42:02 PM
 #3

Wholesale pricing on 1pt diamonds is roughly $300-$450 depending on quality, etc. These are very nice and can easily fetch that price (I will have stats to accompany the pics) so the potential for turing them over and increasing the value of the fund is not unrealistic. The retail price for them is higher of course.
Wait, do you mean 1 ct of diamond?

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December 09, 2011, 06:53:31 PM
 #4

Yes, that is another way of breaking it down. If you were to cash in your share immediately, you would be buying 1pt diamonds for 1BTC each.

Wholesale pricing on 1pt diamonds is roughly $300-$450 depending on quality, etc. These are very nice and can easily fetch that price (I will have stats to accompany the pics) so the potential for turing them over and increasing the value of the fund is not unrealistic. The retail price for them is higher of course.

In the event that diamonds are sold/reinvested or if shareholders redeem their shares, I do have access to additional quantities to continue the offering and support the shares.

Even if the diamonds are strictly held, then the value of the shares in BTC should move based on the value of BTC.

I will also be adding a section to my website that will have all of the info I post here and additional information, stats, pics, etc.
Wait... so you are selling $300-$450 worth of diamonds for 1BTC each?  I don't mean to be accusatory, but how could this NOT be a scam?  How on earth can you buy them so cheaply that it makes it profitable for you to sell them for 1 BTC each?
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December 09, 2011, 07:03:47 PM
 #5

Yes, that is another way of breaking it down. If you were to cash in your share immediately, you would be buying 1pt diamonds for 1BTC each.

Wholesale pricing on 1pt diamonds is roughly $300-$450 depending on quality, etc. These are very nice and can easily fetch that price (I will have stats to accompany the pics) so the potential for turing them over and increasing the value of the fund is not unrealistic. The retail price for them is higher of course.

In the event that diamonds are sold/reinvested or if shareholders redeem their shares, I do have access to additional quantities to continue the offering and support the shares.

Even if the diamonds are strictly held, then the value of the shares in BTC should move based on the value of BTC.

I will also be adding a section to my website that will have all of the info I post here and additional information, stats, pics, etc.
Wait... so you are selling $300-$450 worth of diamonds for 1BTC each?  I don't mean to be accusatory, but how could this NOT be a scam?  How on earth can you buy them so cheaply that it makes it profitable for you to sell them for 1 BTC each?

+1 what's the deal here?  how can you sell $300 worth of diamonds for $3.  I'll take them all please.. thanks.

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December 09, 2011, 07:04:44 PM
 #6

This is not a scam in any way. I have sold many stones here and am now trying something new with Bitcoin economics Smiley

There are 100 x 1pt diamonds for a total of 1 carat.

There are 100 shares issued with one share equalling 1 x 1 pt. diamond.

BTC is currently at ~$3, so 1BTC for each share x 100 = $300

So if all of the shares were bought and redeemed then there would be 100 x 1pt. diamonds sold at $300 which is in around the wholesale price I originally mentioned.


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December 09, 2011, 07:05:58 PM
 #7

Wholesale pricing on 1pt diamonds is roughly $300-$450 depending on quality, etc. These are very nice and can easily fetch that price (I will have stats to accompany the pics) so the potential for turing them over and increasing the value of the fund is not unrealistic. The retail price for them is higher of course.
Wait, do you mean 1 ct of diamond?

Pretty sure he meant 1ctw for $300-$450.  Otherwise he'd be saying that 1ctw could fetch $30,000-$45,000...

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December 09, 2011, 07:06:34 PM
 #8

Wholesale pricing on 1pt diamonds is roughly $300-$450 depending on quality, etc. These are very nice and can easily fetch that price (I will have stats to accompany the pics) so the potential for turing them over and increasing the value of the fund is not unrealistic. The retail price for them is higher of course.
Wait, do you mean 1 ct of diamond?

Pretty sure he meant 1ctw for $300-$450.  Otherwise he'd be saying that 1ctw could fetch $30,000-$45,000...

Ok that makes more sense.. OP can you confirm?

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December 09, 2011, 07:06:56 PM
 #9

I see where there may have been a misunderstanding after reading my posts...

I meant to post:

...
Wholesale pricing on 1pt diamonds is roughly $300-$450 per carat depending on quality, etc....

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December 09, 2011, 07:08:00 PM
 #10

Pretty sure he meant 1ctw for $300-$450.  Otherwise he'd be saying that 1ctw could fetch $30,000-$45,000...

This is correct Smiley

My apologies for the typo in that response.

The original post had those details:

Current holdings: Diamonds 1ctw (1 pt. x 100)




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December 09, 2011, 07:17:11 PM
 #11

What clarity range are the stones? 

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December 09, 2011, 07:55:59 PM
 #12

Wow, the response to this has been significantly higher than I anticipated. I will have all of the stats and pics up shortly.

So far the first lot of 25 shares has been sold... In less than 24 hours!  Shocked


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December 09, 2011, 07:58:36 PM
 #13

Yes, the second round of 25 will also open at 1BTC.


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December 09, 2011, 08:03:14 PM
 #14

Getting ready to post the next lot Smiley


Keep your eyes on the GLBSE if you want shares, these are going FAST!


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December 09, 2011, 08:04:40 PM
 #15

Sell order posted Grin



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December 10, 2011, 12:40:29 AM
 #16

Will you be putting up a motion for shareholder approval before issuing more shares?

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December 10, 2011, 01:25:18 AM
 #17

Motions will be put forth for actions that directly affect the value of the shares. The best example of this would be selling of the assets for the purposes of reinvesting into more diamonds of a similar nature. If there were to be a decent margin increase then this would directly affect the ultimate value of the shares since the holdings would increase from the original 1pt stone per share.

In a case where the overall holdings were being multiplied then a motion will not be put forth. The example here would be if I added another carat of 1pt diamonds right now, then another 100 shares would be issued. The opening for those shares would be based on the value of BTC at the time and/or market value of the existing shares, but there would be no motion for the addition.





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December 12, 2011, 07:41:45 PM
 #18

I like the idea of purchasing gems with bitcoins. I would not mind to pay 30 and more BTC for a nice stone but for that we need better pics and more information. Something in this direction http://www.gemselect.com/sapphire/sapphire-304593.php

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December 12, 2011, 10:57:33 PM
 #19

I understand completely and I will have some more offers like that very soon.

I have several higher value stones available for sale and am in the process of adding them to my site. Once I have good pics available I will also post some here.

This GLBSE listing is meant more as an experiment in Bitcoin economics and tying BTC value to a physical commodity.

If you are looking for "investment grade" stones, I will be posting some very soon Wink



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December 13, 2011, 11:59:29 AM
 #20

I understand completely and I will have some more offers like that very soon.

I have several higher value stones available for sale and am in the process of adding them to my site. Once I have good pics available I will also post some here.

This GLBSE listing is meant more as an experiment in Bitcoin economics and tying BTC value to a physical commodity.

If you are looking for "investment grade" stones, I will be posting some very soon Wink




Cool thanks for the info.

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December 14, 2011, 12:55:21 AM
 #21

One pic showing some of the diamonds has been added to the original post. More to come Smiley



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December 14, 2011, 08:56:23 AM
 #22

Very very nice stones.  Shocked

Wish I had some extra bitcoins to invest into these. I can't believe how cheap wholesale diamonds are compared to the end market. I feel 'jipped' for the recent engagement ring I bought.

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December 14, 2011, 02:53:48 PM
 #23

This fund has fallen nearly 10% and the current highest bid is a 90% drop. Are you going to provide any price support for this fund? Wouldn't repurchasing shares at a lower cost be a way to meet your goal of adding additional assets per share?

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December 14, 2011, 04:38:50 PM
 #24

This fund has fallen nearly 10% and the current highest bid is a 90% drop. Are you going to provide any price support for this fund? Wouldn't repurchasing shares at a lower cost be a way to meet your goal of adding additional assets per share?

Altough, the USD/btc price rose about 10% the past couple days, so if a diamond is still worth about the same and a dollar is still worth about the same, then the btc/diamond price should go down 10%, right?

That doesn't answer any of my questions.

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December 14, 2011, 05:22:02 PM
 #25

I have noticed activity in the shares even though the volume is quite low.

Although, the USD/btc price rose about 10% the past couple days, so if a diamond is still worth about the same and a dollar is still worth about the same, then the btc/diamond price should go down 10%, right?

Although we are dealing with minimal numbers right now, this makes the most logical sense. The shares were initially released with BTC at about $3. BTC has gone up about 10% but the value of the stones remains the same so it would make sense that shares might trade at the difference.

I am examining options right now for ways to increase the value of the shares.

In the long term it will be interesting to see how this progresses.




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December 14, 2011, 05:59:57 PM
 #26

Very very nice stones.  Shocked

tyvm Grin


... I can't believe how cheap wholesale diamonds are compared to the end market....

I wouldn't feel that way if I were you. In this form they are the elements of what could become jewelry. When you get to the stage of a final piece, there are many other elements that come into play that affect the value. If you were to weigh the gold in that ring you would find the spot value comparison to also be high. How much does silicon cost compared to chips, steel to cars, etc.

Once stones like these have found their way into a fine piece of jewelry the overall value increases and of course, you can't quantify the value of your fiance's appreciation for a nice ring Wink


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December 14, 2011, 06:54:14 PM
 #27

What's the clarity of the diamonds ? Colour ?

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December 14, 2011, 07:39:29 PM
 #28

Anyone wanting to buy in to this fund, please put up a bid offer on the GLBSE.

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December 14, 2011, 09:39:24 PM
 #29

Anyone wanting to buy in to this fund, please put up a bid offer on the GLBSE.

Does this mean you did not like the answer you got, and now you are selling your shares to the highest bidder?

I still did not get an answer. Yes, I am selling sold the rest of my shares. I was anxious to get out of this.  It seems to me that it is nothing more than us paying the OP to expand his inventory.  He will issue shares until infinity and shareholders will never see a profit.

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December 15, 2011, 12:10:15 AM
 #30

There are currently 100 shares. One share is worth one diamond, weighing 1pt. valued at $3 when issued. When the shares were issued, the ask for one share was one BTC, worth approximately the same as one of the diamonds represented in the holding.

The diamonds in the holding are still worth $3. BTC is worth more than $3 right now so if anyone else is selling shares, they are asking for a little less than 1 BTC since the dollar to BTC conversion works that way. The diamonds still weigh 1pt and there are still 100 of them in the holding.


This fund has fallen nearly 10% and the current highest bid is a 90% drop. Are you going to provide any price support for this fund? Wouldn't repurchasing shares at a lower cost be a way to meet your goal of adding additional assets per share?

It fell 10% in BTC while the value of BTC went up. Since this is an experiment in tying the value of the shares/BTC to the value of diamonds, this looks to be correct, even though the volumes are not worth mention.

For price support, the market seems to be working fine based on the initial stated objectives of tying shares/BTC to 1pt diamonds.

I have pulled my initial 1BTC ask and may list a lower offering. I may also list a higher one if the BTC/dollar conversion drops again. I may add another carat and add another 100 shares. I may be successful in turning over enough carats to switch the holdings to 2pt diamonds or better making the shares worth significantly more. There are many variables in play and that is the excitement and fun of this experiment.

Growth of the fund can also come from profitable turnover of the holding and the value of shares adjusted accordingly. I am actively pursuing this route to grow the value of the shares and the overall holdings which is to my benefit and that of shareholders. This is all a learning process and will happen over time, it is not for everyone, but clearly a winner in a lot of ways. Also, the likelihood of the holdings depreciating in dollar value is almost non-existant.

I will eventually post more details at my site on the specific status of shares, holdings, valuations, etc.

The market will also drive the price I would hope Wink


What's the clarity of the diamonds ? Colour ?

Clarity is VS to SI 1. I am waiting to hear back on the exact colour range for the lot. Obviously VS stones are more valuable than SI and colour is a factor too. The wholesale value price quoted is an average based on the high to low of the lot. One carat of the best quality diamonds in the lot would cost more than $300, where the same weight of the lower quality ones would cost less. More details will be coming on the website soon.



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December 15, 2011, 04:27:04 AM
 #31

This fund has fallen nearly 10% and the current highest bid is a 90% drop. Are you going to provide any price support for this fund? Wouldn't repurchasing shares at a lower cost be a way to meet your goal of adding additional assets per share?

If I understand the way things work, I don't want c0ffer buying shares back to keep the price at 1 BTC.  I want him buying more diamonds when the price of BTC (hopefully) hits 6.
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December 15, 2011, 04:38:50 AM
 #32

Very very nice stones.  Shocked

Wish I had some extra bitcoins to invest into these. I can't believe how cheap wholesale diamonds are compared to the end market. I feel 'jipped' for the recent engagement ring I bought.

FWIW, the price of gemstones scales exponentially size.  A 1 carat diamond costs more than 100 1-pt diamonds even though the total weight is the same.  It's not like precious metals where 2 half-ounce coins are basically worth as much as a single one once coin.  You can't melt down and combine gems.
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December 15, 2011, 05:42:55 AM
 #33

If I understand the way things work, I don't want c0ffer buying shares back to keep the price at 1 BTC.  I want him buying more diamonds when the price of BTC (hopefully) hits 6.

...

FWIW, the price of gemstones scales exponentially size.  A 1 carat diamond costs more than 100 1-pt diamonds even though the total weight is the same.  It's not like precious metals where 2 half-ounce coins are basically worth as much as a single one once coin.  You can't melt down and combine gems.


Very well said on both accounts.

The point of the shares is not to keep them at 1BTC but to increase the overall value of the holdings that the shares are tied to. The value of BTC is what makes things additionally interesting. If shares are at 1BTC, but BTC are worth $6, I would say we are all doing well Wink

And you are correct on the exponential value side. A one carat diamond is worth significantly more than 1 carat total weight of 1pt diamonds. That was why I mentioned aiming for 2pt stones. 1ctw of 2pt stones is worth more than 1ctw of 1pt stones.


The colour range on this lot is G-H.


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December 15, 2011, 05:50:56 PM
 #34

 Wink how much more do u have to pay for IF or VVS diamonds ? Since the stones are very small, the clarity won't be a big problem. Colour seems to be fine.


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December 17, 2011, 03:51:51 AM
 #35

I had not looked into pricing for clarity higher than these for this holding of stones. Additions to the holding will be of a similar nature in order to keep the the shares easier to manage.

Since the value of the shares is directly tied to the actual stones, it is important to be able to keep them in an exchangeable form. This is why there is an equal number of stones for an equal number of shares. Increasing the physical holdings affects the value of the shares from both the BTC side and the potential for redeeming shares for physical goods.

Of course, any way I can find to increase the value of the holding will be explored. Smiley




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December 18, 2011, 08:17:33 PM
 #36

how exactly would I go about buying a share from https://glbse.com ?

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March 08, 2012, 08:41:01 PM
 #37

how exactly would I go about buying a share from https://glbse.com ?

I'm curious about this as well.
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March 08, 2012, 09:44:15 PM
 #38

how exactly would I go about buying a share from https://glbse.com ?

I'm curious about this as well.

This is how you buy shares in companies on the GLBSE.  That being said, GEM hasn't had a single trade in well over a month and I would caution investors to review the facts and think hard before investing in it.

How to Buy Shares:
1.) Sign Up and Create an Account

  • open browser to https://glbse.com/client/glbse/index.html, enter a password to encrypt locally stored data, click "Go"
  • You should now be in "Account Managment", click "Register New Account"
  • You should now be in "Create New Account", click button "Generate new KeyPair" and enter an account name (any name will do) in "Enter a name for this account", click "Register"
  • You should be back in "Account Managment" and see the newly created account. Click the "Use" button next to the account name you entered before.

2.) Deposit funds

  • On the "Account Page" (It says "Global Bitcoin Stock Exchange" as title and there's a menu on the left), you can see your bitcoin balance on the top left below the title. Lets deposit some bitcoins by choosing "Deposit Funds" from the menu.
  • You're now on sub-page "Deposit Funds", click button "Get Deposit Address". You will see a bitcoin address in the text field below the button you just clicked.
  • Send some bitcoins to that address and wait for (I think) 7 confirmations. Click the "refresh"-icon to the right of your balance to see if the funds have arrived. (I sometimes get an error "verification failed due to incorrect signature", also when using other menu items. Dont worry too early, it seems to reliably work on second try)
  • You should now see your funds in the balance (top left)

3.) Buy shares

  • Choose "buy" from the menu.
  • Enter "MergedMining" into field "Enter the asset id"
  • Enter "5" (for example) into field "Enter the quantity you want to buy"
  • Enter "1" into field "Enter the price you are willing to pay"
  • Click button "Buy"
  • To verify you have bought the shares, you can choose "Portfolio" from the menu. You should also see the transaction in "Bitcoin History" and "Assets History".
  • To see the status of the Asset, choose "Asset" from the menu, enter "MergedMining" into field "Enter the Asset id" and click button "Get Details"

4.) Backup the keys

The keys for an account are stored as local data somehow in your browser. Maybe not a safe enough place... to make a backup, do the following:

  • go back to the "Account Managment" page by clicking button "Accounts List"
  • click button "Export Accounts"
  • click mouse in the big text area that appears and hit Ctrl-A or otherwise select all the text
  • paste that text into a new text file and store safely somewhere

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March 08, 2012, 10:57:32 PM
 #39

I would imagine there have been no trades because there are no shares available for trading.

There were 50 shares issued initially and only 35 were purchased, with some people buying more than one share, the number of owners is low.

The shares are directly tied to the value of a 1 point diamond with Bitcoin and when the shares came out BTC was at about $3.50. With BTC higher now the shares would be less than 1BTC (the initial offering ask) so I would guess people are just sitting on their shares and waiting.

I am investigating ways to spur some trading activity, but in the meantime I am also waiting (like many others) to see the results of GLBSE 2.0.

Of course at any time shareholders can redeem their shares for the actual diamonds themselves.


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March 09, 2012, 12:32:49 AM
 #40

I would imagine there have been no trades because there are no shares available for trading.

I see that there are plenty of shares for sale.  No buy orders at any price though.  That is why I urged caution.

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March 09, 2012, 04:55:12 PM
 #41


The asset contract for GEM is broken

https://glbse.com/asset/8f7a9a130675f873c83fec38e11af3ffde4e77c70930db94a5ce86039a6fe71a

Quote
This page contains the following errors:

error on line 50 at column 21: xmlParseEntityRef: no name
Below is a rendering of the page up to the first error.

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March 10, 2012, 02:10:45 AM
 #42

I would guess that the error on the contract would be a potential deterrent for some would-be buyers. I have not been able to make changes to the contract, but I think that is the way the site works (so people don't change the agreement). So that error is beyond my control or capabilities to repair. I am hoping new usability in the 2.0 version will be helpful in making the shares more accessible all around.

I also know there were several shares purchased in a fund that was to be liquidated, but I lost track of what was going on there.

From what I can see in that page, there are some bargains to be had for shares and if it were easier for people to use GLBSE, I would guess there would be more activity. At the same time, this was done as an experiment in tying BTC value to 1 point diamonds so I am not sure how trading activity is to be expected.

Information about the GEM listing can be found at my website:

http://c0ffer.com/?page=gem

If there are any potential buyers here who are still having difficulties, I would encourage getting involved with the GLBSE 2.0 project in whatever capacity is available, wait for the update, or PM me.

And if there are any shareholders out there who are concerned about their shares, feel free to additionally PM me or contact me through my website with any inquiries (or post here of course Wink).

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March 10, 2012, 09:39:08 AM
 #43

I would guess that the error on the contract would be a potential deterrent for some would-be buyers.

I went through some of the contracts tied to the other assets I had and had similar error message for another asset (MergedMining), so you aren't the only one. I was able to download and view the contract(s) directly in Notepad. I was using Chrome, so don't know if any other browsers would also have the same problem.

Currently can't look at it as the site appears to be down (09:40UTC).

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March 14, 2012, 12:38:24 PM
 #44

Attention all GEM shareholders:


I will be placing a buy order very soon for the number of shares I know to be circulating.


Updates to come.



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April 12, 2012, 11:51:23 AM
 #45

I will be placing a buy order very soon for the number of shares I know to be circulating.

Have you moved over to 2.0 yet. All the orders seem to have vanished though.

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April 13, 2012, 12:00:44 PM
 #46

I have not migrated yet, was waiting for it to be finalized.

Now that things are looking more solid, I will be looking at making the move.


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June 11, 2012, 01:09:26 PM
 #47

how is it going? Smiley

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June 19, 2012, 04:18:44 AM
 #48

I have 5 shares of GEM under the old GLBSE system.  Can I sell those back to you or receive those stones?  Somehow get the BTC back I have in the company.

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June 20, 2012, 12:14:49 PM
 #49

You can do either Smiley

If you would like to have the stones sent to you please PM me and I can send you additional information.

If you are interested in selling the shares back, also let me know and I will expedite the transition to the new system since it looks like things are fairly stable now.

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June 25, 2012, 06:32:41 PM
 #50

You can do either Smiley

If you would like to have the stones sent to you please PM me and I can send you additional information.

If you are interested in selling the shares back, also let me know and I will expedite the transition to the new system since it looks like things are fairly stable now.


I am looking forward for this transition to happen Smiley

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June 25, 2012, 08:06:14 PM
 #51

I would like to see the direction of the company but as the stock has not been listed on glbse 2 and grown stagnant I was concerned for my investment.  I would not really favor receiving stones of that size but if that is the payout then stones it is.

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c0ffer
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July 02, 2012, 01:21:47 PM
 #52

Here's the latest update:

I have attempted to transfer the assets from GLBSE 1.0 to the new system.

According to the new system the code I was provided with contained no assets. I contacted support and was told that if the code said there were no assets then I had none. I responded explaining how this could not be true and have not heard back yet.

I would like to continue this listing and see how it performs with the way BTC has been moving, but I am limited by the functionality of the GLBSE.

I will contact them again and let everyone know the status.

Additionally, if there are any shareholders out there who would like to try contacting GLBSE support to let them know that you own shares in an asset that they say doesn't exist, that may be helpful.

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July 22, 2012, 11:45:29 PM
 #53

Here's the latest update:

I have attempted to transfer the assets from GLBSE 1.0 to the new system.

According to the new system the code I was provided with contained no assets. I contacted support and was told that if the code said there were no assets then I had none. I responded explaining how this could not be true and have not heard back yet.

I would like to continue this listing and see how it performs with the way BTC has been moving, but I am limited by the functionality of the GLBSE.

I will contact them again and let everyone know the status.

Additionally, if there are any shareholders out there who would like to try contacting GLBSE support to let them know that you own shares in an asset that they say doesn't exist, that may be helpful.


Couple weeks ago I received response from GLBSE that they had some support tickets for migration from GLBSE1. So how is the progress, did you contact them again?

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July 31, 2012, 07:33:02 PM
 #54

I did contact them again and received absolutely no response from them.

I will try one more time. If anyone has suggestions for beyond that I am open to hearing them Smiley



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August 02, 2012, 05:17:10 AM
 #55

I did contact them again and received absolutely no response from them.

I will try one more time. If anyone has suggestions for beyond that I am open to hearing them Smiley


How do you contact them?

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August 02, 2012, 04:28:05 PM
 #56

support@glbse.com



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