Is trading really worth it?

[goaldigger]

It’s worth it but don’t expect too much if you are still not knowledgeable enough to trade on your own. The risk is high and that’s why its rewarding, because the higher the risk the higher the reward and of course it will always depend on how you execute your strategy. Trading is risky, don’t take it for granted because if you do, you can’t expect yourself to earn some profit. Continue to learn, trading is a never ending analysis the market will continue to move and we should adopt on every trend.

[1714668651]

1714668651

[tadamichi]

How do you think that trade is analysed, charted and mapped out?

Im aware people use technical analysis for that, but if you held amazon or apple for 20 years for example, it doesnt matter how much ta you did, because you cant beat this. Time in the market beats trying to time the market, almost always. When the macro/ market situation changes ta wont help you much and you might be slow to realize that a change of strategies is necessary, or that old patterns dont apply anymore. Also im questioning the general effectiveness of ta, especially if it means not looking at other factors anymore.

And how accurate have TA and charts predicted the situation we're now in?

Just an addition: My brother checks no crypto-charts. He prefers Forex and gold. Does the same logic apply there too? I honestly don't know what to say or whom to address to.

What kind of trades is he doing exactly?

[TimeTeller]

It’s worth it but don’t expect too much if you are still not knowledgeable enough to trade on your own. The risk is high and that’s why its rewarding, because the higher the risk the higher the reward and of course it will always depend on how you execute your strategy. Trading is risky, don’t take it for granted because if you do, you can’t expect yourself to earn some profit. Continue to learn, trading is a never ending analysis the market will continue to move and we should adopt on every trend.

Trading requires a lot of your patience and strategies.
Each coin or project will need a different strategy as they have different progress of developments.
So it doesn't mean that you just jump onboard whenever there is hype or fud.
Without making any logical study on the coin, you will lose without a fight.
It is true that everyday you spend on your trading journey, you will acquire new skills or tips or techniques.

[samcrypto]

It takes a lot of sacrifices if you are planning to fully commit in trading and do this for a living, I can say many succeed on this but still many are suffering from a big loss which force them to have a decent job again. Well, trading is risky if you are not confident about your knowledge in trading, don’t do it full time because you can just trade depends on the market trend and your strategy, personally I can say trading is worth it but I can’t afford to lose my job for now because trading is still not for me.

[BlackHatCoiner]

What kind of trades is he doing exactly?

• National currencies. Sells USD for EUR, EUR for YEN etc.
• Plays with spot losses, buy orders, sell orders and the like, with gold.

Whenever he explains what he's doing to me, it feels like a black box. It's like when someone feels he knows what he does, but it is somehow constantly proven that he doesn't. What he wants is to have is a ~3% gain on average, every month. I just don't understand if he deeply knows it's gambling or just thinks there's a "scientific explanation" known as "<whatever> analysis" that can be used to make money.

He likes being on Tradingview and try to explain what's going on, what are all these things etc. But, why do I feel it's just horseshit and there's absolutely nothing essential?

[Oshosondy]

@BlackHatCoiner

Let me be honest with you, I have spent over 2 years in trading, I am not a newbie at all and I know the pros and cons of trading.

Trading is not gambling, but life itself is gambling which can make us consider trading as gambling, but trading is not gambling if relating it to casinos and other gambling means, it is just called trading.

The level of risks in trading is as high as in gambling, within a day, a rich man that has just started to trade can lose almost all his money, he can lose millions or more in just a week. Trading is a pure gambling for beginners and it is addicting just like gambling.

For experts, trading is not gambling, it is far better than gambling, the market can favour, what if the market first not favorable and a professional trader is losing. First of all, he used an amount of money he is able to lose to trade, second is that he used a very minimal leverage like 1x to start. Trading bitcoin, he can increased the leverage to 3x maximum (my own strategy and my max) if the loss has increased, just to make the entry price to become nearer to the unfavoured price so the entry price the trader will start to make profit will become closer to the present price. There are many more to trading like that.

Newbies will always lose, it is normal. That is why it is always advisable for newbies to trade with the amount lesser than the amount of money they can afford to lose, because they will lose. Someone can be a newbie trader or not yet become professional for over 2 years as the trader will lose, making the same and different mistakes and later try to amend. For newbie traders, trading is gambling.

If you see the life experience of some traders, it was bad, they lose a great amount of money in just short period of time, it is very risky like gambling because traders will start from the beginning as a newbie and if they use much money, sorry to tell you that they will lose it. Just as in gambling, as they trade more and used more money, they will lose more.

But unlike gambling, no profession in gambling but that may be a debate for some people, but the obvious truth, the more someone gambles, the more the losses. But in trading, traders can still professionally know that they should enter the market at a particular price and also leave the market at a particular price (easy said than done for newbies). Gambling is all-or-none, either you lose all or win all, cashout is not just an advantage, unlike trading that a trader can still believe in his analyses, the trade may not first favour, the market may correct itself and the trader may later make profit. But not just that the trader will just make profit, there are many discipline that he must abide to, he should not be greedy, he should use the amount of money he is able to lose, using low leverage like 1x and he should be able to make use of indicators and sentiments appropriately.

[dunfida]

It’s worth it but don’t expect too much if you are still not knowledgeable enough to trade on your own. The risk is high and that’s why its rewarding, because the higher the risk the higher the reward and of course it will always depend on how you execute your strategy. Trading is risky, don’t take it for granted because if you do, you can’t expect yourself to earn some profit. Continue to learn, trading is a never ending analysis the market will continue to move and we should adopt on every trend.

Trading requires a lot of your patience and strategies.
Each coin or project will need a different strategy as they have different progress of developments.
So it doesn't mean that you just jump onboard whenever there is hype or fud.
Without making any logical study on the coin, you will lose without a fight.
It is true that everyday you spend on your trading journey, you will acquire new skills or tips or techniques.

Getting a good grasp of it would really require time and effort which doesnt talk about short span of time and this do involves very long period for you to get engage or to deal with.You cant just learn in a matter of days
or months but rather it would really be a couple of years or something and once you do learnt up yourself then find out that you do able to make or snip out some profits in the market then you can consider yourself to be a good trader but of course this one isnt for everybody yet there are people who do still keep struggling despite of the long time that they've been doing trading.So its up to someone whether they would sustain and persevere with this career.I could really say that it is really worth and could really give out that chance on making it as a living if you could really able to sustain.

[tadamichi]

What kind of trades is he doing exactly?

• National currencies. Sells USD for EUR, EUR for YEN etc.
• Plays with spot losses, buy orders, sell orders and the like, with gold.

Whenever he explains what he's doing to me, it feels like a black box. It's like when someone feels he knows what he does, but it is somehow constantly proven that he doesn't. What he wants is to have is a ~3% gain on average, every month. I just don't understand if he deeply knows it's gambling or just thinks there's a "scientific explanation" known as "<whatever> analysis" that can be used to make money.

Honestly trading gold on a short time horizon seems weird to me, there isnt much scientific about it. No matter how someone tries to rationalize it. Thats why im meant with putting too much emphasis on TA, because it can give oneself the impression that there is something predictable to discover, when its completely unpredictable in reality. Theres big institutions that can use a lot of volume to move markets. But for a regular person: trying to predict tiny changes in gold solely based on ta seems like astrology to me personally, especially if his strategies dont seem to be working.

Im not a expert on forex, but its definitely not something i would advice a beginner to start in. And especially if no long term strategy portfolio is even being built. I think the basics are missing here and this whole approach seems to be built on weak ground. Basics first, and then a beginner can start going into more challenging trading. Just keep him out of leverage please, so he doesnt run the risk to get into debt for nothing.

He likes being on Tradingview and try to explain what's going on, what are all these things etc. But, why do I feel it's just horseshit and there's absolutely nothing essential?

Because thats what it is, its just a waste of time trying to predict ultra short term changes in prices better than everyone else, instead of spending time on actually evaluting economics/ ideas/ businesses. Time can be spent more productively with greater returns, both financially and mentally. Sure a lot of money could be made with leverage(less with spot), but lets not act like this is the norm, the same money can be lost quickly again with this approach.

[Desmong]

And how accurate have TA and charts predicted the situation we're now in?

Just an addition: My brother checks no crypto-charts. He prefers Forex and gold. Does the same logic apply there too? I honestly don't know what to say or whom to address to.

Yes it can be applied to crypto too but it depends because of the nature of the crypto market. The market is very flexible and volatility and most time irregular things could make the crypto market falls overnight. Many things are happening in the market which are not supposed to be so. The forex market is very understandable there are things we need to look at to predict the next possible movement of the market.

[gunhell16]

Can I have a precise and constructive answer on whether trading is really worth spending time on? My brother wants to do this job for a living, and I'm just curious if it's a dignified, worth-spending occupation. I don't know where to ask, I don't understand technical analysis; when he explains it to me I feel it's some sort of gambling strategy.

I've used to read experts' discussions, papers, books and the like, but I find no such stuff on trading. It's a very vague term anyway. Are there really people who just "buy low and sell high", making a living by just doing that? I can't comprehend how can a person seriously make a living by something that looks complete gambling, instead of providing goods, services, work etc.

Crypto trading here in this industry is really tested for us to make money, you always have to have an idea or knowledge and you know you have to analyze when the possible decrease and increase in the price of the token you have, so you know when you should buy and sell so you can make a profit. Then buying at a low price and selling at a high price is also very proven and many people make money with this method. Just let me repeat you know you should analyze the price movement on the chart graph on an exchange site platform.

[xSkylarx]

Can I have a precise and constructive answer on whether trading is really worth spending time on? My brother wants to do this job for a living, and I'm just curious if it's a dignified, worth-spending occupation.

Trading can really be a profitable career but never consider quitting your job. Just make it as a side hustle of yours whenever possible. Trading is more like a business for me as it needs a huge capital when the market doesn't go your way. You need to have a deep pocket to still trade if the market continues dumping and stay at a lower price for some time.

Are there really people who just "buy low and sell high", making a living by just doing that? I can't comprehend how can a person seriously make a living by something that looks complete gambling, instead of providing goods, services, work etc.

I don't think there is someone that does trading profitably just by doing that. Market is very unstable and global factors also affects the movement of it.

I can't comprehend how can a person seriously make a living by something that looks complete gambling, instead of providing goods, services, work etc.

Trading is very different from gambling. You can calculate your risks in trading by using different strategies, indicators, and charts that will help you decide your plan. Unlike in gambling, you mostly depend on your luck to win.

[BlackHatCoiner]

Gambling is all-or-none

Gambling is, though, completely transparent. You know the rules, you know your chances. Trading is an entirely different thing, completely opaque. You only know the price history, and can only make some arbitrary assumptions.

Both gambling and trading have some very important in common: The whales beat you. You can't win poker if you're playing with a billionaire, it's a matter of chances. And I presume it's the same in trading; it's a matter of time until you lose that money, because an institution knows more than you do.

Honestly trading gold on a short time horizon seems weird to me, there isnt much scientific about it. No matter how someone tries to rationalize it.

It's more rational than trading cryptos, but yeah, it still doesn't make much sense to try to live off gold trades. Does it?

[tadamichi]

Honestly trading gold on a short time horizon seems weird to me, there isnt much scientific about it. No matter how someone tries to rationalize it.

It's more rational than trading cryptos, but yeah, it still doesn't make much sense to try to live off gold trades. Does it?

There’s just too many factors in the short term: worldwide market with millions of participants, different volumes based on exchanges,  so many different financial instruments(etfs, cfd, futures options, spot), considering inflation, interest rates, conversion rates between different currencies, it wont go up as high as other investments when the economy recovers, gold mining, commodity demand, huge influence from big institutions, short term news, gold discoveries, politics, custodian risk.

Somehow you need to translate all of this information into how the price will rise or fall in the next minutes/ hours/ days. If this task is impossible to solve in code, where you can express math freely, so how should technical analysis solve it?

And then the question is, can all this effort beat the market, where you just need to save into an index or something that gives you like 7-8% on average in the long term? If not, its not rational and you did worse, even tho a lot of time was spent.

And the other question is, can it outperform Bitcoin? And even if you don’t trust Bitcoin, there’s ways to diversify investments, Stocks pay yearly dividends etc. There’s so many strategies that can be built, that can outperform the short term approach, with much less risk and work required.

Only a minority will succeed in the short term, so I’ll never recommend it, if there’s not already a strong long term strategy in place, and short term trading is done with a few % of his overall investment portfolio as an addition. Idk any successful trader that just had a short term strategy and not both.

[ChrisPop]

Only a minority will succeed in the short term, so I’ll never recommend it, if there’s not already a strong long term strategy in place, and short term trading is done with a few % of his overall investment portfolio as an addition. Idk any successful trader that just had a short term strategy and not both.

Well if short-term trading was not profitable why would traders still do it? The truth is there are a gazillion strategies to "play" the market. It all comes down to the personality and temperament of the trader. For example if you are high in negative emotion sensitivity you might want to play the short-term - as seeing a position being on a significant drawdown for a lot of time might take a toll on your quality of life and trading.

Moreover your trading style needs to suit your lifestyle. Not everybody finds trading to be fulfiling, nor everyone likes to spend most of their awake time watching charts move on a monitor (although with today's technology you can get yourself an impressive setup with led lights, curved uhd monitors and all that good stuff )

[tadamichi]

Only a minority will succeed in the short term, so I’ll never recommend it, if there’s not already a strong long term strategy in place, and short term trading is done with a few % of his overall investment portfolio as an addition. Idk any successful trader that just had a short term strategy and not both.

Well if short-term trading was not profitable why would traders still do it? The truth is there are a gazillion strategies to "play" the market. It all comes down to the personality and temperament of the trader. For example if you are high in negative emotion sensitivity you might want to play the short-term - as seeing a position being on a significant drawdown for a lot of time might take a toll on your quality of life and trading.

Moreover your trading style needs to suit your lifestyle. Not everybody finds trading to be fulfiling, nor everyone likes to spend most of their awake time watching charts move on a monitor (although with today's technology you can get yourself an impressive setup with led lights, curved uhd monitors and all that good stuff )

I agree with what you’re saying, but if we had 2 groups of average people, one group just does short term trading, and the other group does a little short term trading with a focus on long term strategy, which group would perform better trough out changing scenarios? That’s why i think the second approach is better, no matter how good of a trader you are. No human can consistently perform at the highest level, so it’s important to create some securities that are independent of your own individual performance. This doesn’t mean people can’t trade in the short term anymore, but making things more reliable. The rational approach would be to choose both, or just the long term approach for people who are not into trading.

[cryptosize]

95% of traders lose money, so no. There are tons of things you cannot predict (apart from BTC halvings).

100% of hodlers gain money, provided they have a long-term timeframe.

[harapan]

Yeah it is really is trading is good but one must have a good understanding of the market and the chart both  up moving and downing.
I don't think they are the same as gambling. They might have similarities but they don't really do same thing, but in the end all leads to making additional funds and Profits.
Trading is not for the weak as you need daily routine so as to cash out funds. The market is indeed volatile and lots of things happening.

[0verseer]

Gambling is all-or-none

Gambling is, though, completely transparent. You know the rules, you know your chances. Trading is an entirely different thing, completely opaque. You only know the price history, and can only make some arbitrary assumptions.

Both gambling and trading have some very important in common: The whales beat you. You can't win poker if you're playing with a billionaire, it's a matter of chances. And I presume it's the same in trading; it's a matter of time until you lose that money, because an institution knows more than you do.

Honestly trading gold on a short time horizon seems weird to me, there isnt much scientific about it. No matter how someone tries to rationalize it.

It's more rational than trading cryptos, but yeah, it still doesn't make much sense to try to live off gold trades. Does it?

It can make sense depending on what kind of person your brother is. Does he watch world news and seem to be well-versed in the thing around the world/world trade? Try to engage you in any topic related to politics, wars and history? Cause if he checks most of those, he's likely just want to get a few % gains from his interest/knowledge about the things.
Say, Russia amassed their army along the Ukraine border a few months ago, if he watch the news and was confident about intel there might be a war break out soon. That he knew about Ukraine is a major exporter of wheat. That Russia's oil and natural gas sanctions for the invasion might drive the price higher. Those kind of things aren't wild guesses, trading without any directions or gambling like someone in here said.

It was like crypto where we, holders and investors try to anticipate an upcoming update or having and speculate better sell now or holding it. Sort of like that but his market is more real, more related to world events and the volatility isn't high like the crypto market.

[virasisog]

Can I have a precise and constructive answer on whether trading is really worth spending time on? My brother wants to do this job for a living, and I'm just curious if it's a dignified, worth-spending occupation. I don't know where to ask, I don't understand technical analysis; when he explains it to me I feel it's some sort of gambling strategy.

I've used to read experts' discussions, papers, books and the like, but I find no such stuff on trading. It's a very vague term anyway. Are there really people who just "buy low and sell high", making a living by just doing that? I can't comprehend how can a person seriously make a living by something that looks complete gambling, instead of providing goods, services, work etc.

A beginner can't have crypto trading as a full-time job. Trading needs broad understanding because it's a long process of learning. You can rely on it when you already know the basics plus the technical analysis and strategies that you can apply. It needs time and courage for you to understand everything. It has huge risks and might lead you to losses if you'll enter it without enough knowledge.

[wxa7115]

Can I have a precise and constructive answer on whether trading is really worth spending time on? My brother wants to do this job for a living, and I'm just curious if it's a dignified, worth-spending occupation. I don't know where to ask, I don't understand technical analysis; when he explains it to me I feel it's some sort of gambling strategy.

I've used to read experts' discussions, papers, books and the like, but I find no such stuff on trading. It's a very vague term anyway. Are there really people who just "buy low and sell high", making a living by just doing that? I can't comprehend how can a person seriously make a living by something that looks complete gambling, instead of providing goods, services, work etc.

It is not as weird as it may seem at first sight, lets take a look at supermarkets, super markets do not really produce any of the products they sell and instead they just offer them to the public at a convenient place and they earn a profits from it, so while they are not providing products they are providing a service.

But what service traders provide? They provide liquidity to the markets and make the process of price discovery, the process in which we determine the price of everything, more smooth, some can earn money from the activity but they are a minority as the majority are not good enough to do this and lose their money to those which have a higher skill level.