Stacks Bowers Again - Summer auction

[Steeley]

This is a great discussion. Microsoul coins are important to the hobby and should be traded freely, but the issues exist and the hobby is still in early adoption with many unaware would be buyers.

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[SatsLife]

I agree with Chi. I'd even go as far to say that no coin makers that ever had issues redeeming their coins should be offered. Is Stacks and Bowers aware of the potential issues?

Not making people aware of the potential issues does a huge disservice to the likes of casascius premiums and other high quality coins and makers, not to mention the winning bidders of these microsoul coins.

[thoughtfan]

...Microsoul effectively "recalled" coins in late 2017, asking people to peel the coins and offering DIY sticker replacements...

This sets off alarm bells for me if Microsoul was sending out sticker replacements. Is there a link to that please? I'd like to know if those labels were clearly marked as 'DIY' and that it is not possible to confuse them with the stickers concealing Gravitate-generated private keys.

[owlcatz]

This sets off alarm bells for me if Microsoul was sending out sticker replacements. Is there a link to that please? I'd like to know if those labels were clearly marked as 'DIY' and that it is not possible to confuse them with the stickers concealing Gravitate-generated private keys.

I think it kind of started here - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2055992.0

& here's where Matthew went bonkers and off the deep end before disappearing.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2136007.msg21360387#msg21360387

It's worth noting - I actually met Matthew/Gravitate at Coinfest UK 2018 - Once introduced to him as being "owlcatz", He then asked me if I was going to bash him in the head with my pint of beer LOL... (Half-seriously even)!  

He was also sort of "in disguise", meaning he was using a walker and pretending to be ill, he also looked quite different than the pics floating around of him on the internet - Anyways, He was there promoting some other scam coin I forgot the name of, presenting it under the just the billed name "Matthew", (most others there were using full names ofc) and we happened to figure it out it was him once we got there... I was with Lesbian Cow, Zepher and I Think BG4 at the time, so they can also attest to this funny interaction... I wish I had recorded it now it was fuckin hilarious...

The histories of some of these coin makers is quite surprising once you dig deeper... Even CI had scam accusations against him after being caught using an alt to bid/win his own auctions...

Edit - I do trust CI's coins for the most part, I don't think Pedro is a scammer, people know his full name etc etc.. And also no issues with his coins whatsoever, so I think he just learned a tough lesson in the long run... IDK...

Edit 2 - I had completely forgot about this scam rating I left Gravitate ... Jesus... What a nut-job...  https://archive.ph/LUz5E

[thoughtfan]

This sets off alarm bells for me if Microsoul was sending out sticker replacements. Is there a link to that please? I'd like to know if those labels were clearly marked as 'DIY' and that it is not possible to confuse them with the stickers concealing Gravitate-generated private keys.

I think it kind of started here - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2055992.0

& here's where Matthew went bonkers and off the deep end before disappearing.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2136007.msg21360387#msg21360387

It's worth noting - I actually met Matthew/Gravitate at Coinfest UK 2018 - Once introduced to him as being "owlcatz", He then asked me if I was going to bash him in the head with my pint of beer LOL... (Half-seriously even)!  

He was also sort of "in disguise", meaning he was using a walker and pretending to be ill, he also looked quite different than the pics floating around of him on the internet - Anyways, He was there promoting some other scam coin I forgot the name of, presenting it under the just the billed name "Matthew", (most others there were using full names ofc) and we happened to figure it out it was him once we got there... I was with Lesbian Cow, Zepher and I Think BG4 at the time, so they can also attest to this funny interaction... I wish I had recorded it now it was fuckin hilarious...

The histories of some of these coin makers is quite surprising once you dig deeper... Even CI had scam accusations against him after being caught using an alt to bid/win his own auctions...

Edit - I do trust CI's coins for the most part, I don't think Pedro is a scammer, people know his full name etc etc.. And also no issues with his coins whatsoever, so I think he just learned a tough lesson in the long run... IDK...

Thanks owlcatz, the context helps a lot. So the guy declares a 'legal contract' that recommends everyone redeem their coins immediately and claims that this 'contract' absolves him of any responsibility as to whether or not his coins are funded! In that mindset, I can't see it would have been a high priority for him consider the security implications of ensuring the stickers he was offering to give away would be clearly distinguishable from the stickers he himself used to protect the private keys on the coins he issued. So unless anyone can confirm otherwise, I guess the safest assumption to make is that some Microsoul coins out there may have been funded by any randomers with coins and stickers and who may have retained the private keys?

[thoughtfan]

Stacks Bowers Microsoul coins listings update

I am pleased to report Stacks withdrew the three Microsoul coins from the November auction. They are no longer on the website auction listing 

I do acknowledge and understand that there are some who were pleased to see them included. However, as I will explain in a thread of its own, the matter of the mixed response to these coins within the community is of concern to me and I think it is in everyone's interest that the market for compromised-brand coins be as limited and minimal as possible. Personally, I am in no doubt that their exclusion is good for physical crypto in the longer term.

[SatsLife]

Stacks Bowers Microsoul coins listings update

I am pleased to report Stacks withdrew the three Microsoul coins from the November auction. They are no longer on the website auction listing 

I do acknowledge and understand that there are some who were pleased to see them included. However, as I will explain in a thread of its own, the matter of the mixed response to these coins within the community is of concern to me and I think it is in everyone's interest that the market for compromised-brand coins be as limited and minimal as possible. Personally, I am in no doubt that their exclusion is good for physical crypto in the longer term.

This is great news! Thanks for the update

[Steeley]

Thoughtfan,

Very wise move. I think in the future, with a sophisticated collecting base outside of the forum, there will be an understanding of the history for these coins. In that context they are coins well worth selling and collecting. However, the potential damage to the hobby from newbies buying a compromised collectible is risky now, especially as Stacks Bowers establishes their offerings of physical bitcoins. I applaud your decision and am a little sad these great Microsoul coins have this stink on them, they are all great collectibles.

[thoughtfan]

Thoughtfan,

Very wise move. I think in the future, with a sophisticated collecting base outside of the forum, there will be an understanding of the history for these coins. In that context they are coins well worth selling and collecting. However, the potential damage to the hobby from newbies buying a compromised collectible is risky now, especially as Stacks Bowers establishes their offerings of physical bitcoins. I applaud your decision and am a little sad these great Microsoul coins have this stink on them, they are all great collectibles.

Hi Steely, Satslife and those who gave me merit.

Just to be clear, whilst I appreciate your expressions of thanks, I am am not, neither do I represent Stacks Bowers. I was the messenger and don't deserve the praise as I wouldn't deserve to be shot if it were bad news I were delivering! Not that I'm throwing it back into your face - I'll take it anyway with thanks

[henkcryptotank]

Seems like the best move to me. Better safe then sorry especially during this stage of BTC collectibles becoming more mainstream.

Greets Hank

[Lesbian Cow]

Stacks Bowers did the right thing here, top job!