Loan Defaulted [anog]

[shasan]

What happened:: Scammed 0.21 ETH. I am creating this accusation as the user recently logged in into the account and the user may scam other in another way.

Scammers Profile Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=885776

Reference Link: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5030169.msg54127080#msg54127080
Amount Scammed: 0.21 ETH
Payment Method: Ethereum
Proof of Payment: https://etherscan.io/tx/0x503a0d55d58eb5099ff9361c4b84e810d41179213e4f3a0d5697c60127354127
Falg: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;flag=3015

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[shasan]

Reserve

[Charles-Tim]

I too have tagged the account.

I checked about anog which is the loan defaulter, he registered on this forum in 2016 and was a senior member in 2018 when merit system was introduced. Which means 250 merits was pregenerated for his account.

Anog only earned 1 merit since 2018

This kind of user will not be in a signature campaign and having only just 1 merit that he received. I am surprised, thinking of the reason you loaned him the money he requested for.

[examplens]

I would not be surprised if that account has changed owners, sold, or hacked.
OP, why did you wait so long to tag him? obviously, that account is no longer critical to the owner, therefore negative feedback does not have much impact.

I tagged them also and supported the flag by my side.

[Jawhead999]

I am surprised, thinking of the reason you loaned him the money he requested for.

At that time the loan only worth $30 since Ethereum is worth for $200, so he might think it just a small amount money and not a big deal for him. Though the account isn't active posting in this forum and don't have any reputation, personally I wouldn't lend any money for such account.

OP, why did you wait so long to tag him?

I'm curious too, he already wait for 2 years and there's no reason to believe he will pay the loan if there's no private communication.

[notblox1]

anog didn't post for more than two years but he is still in control of this account because he was last active on July 19 of this year.
I don't understand people who are doing things like this and pretending like it never happened.

[hugeblack]

Regardless of the above-mentioned case, but if a similar situation occurred where the user disappeared for any circumstance (may have been exposed to an accident or any compelling reason) and reappeared after several months/years, will the value of loan be calculated in the same currency (for example, if he borrowed half Bitcoin now and it became worth Bitcoin is more than $100,000) or will it be worth 12k by then?


Meaning that you will now ask him to return 0.21 ETH or its equivalent on the date of the loan?

[NeuroticFish]

Meaning that you will now ask him to return 0.21 ETH or its equivalent on the date of the loan?

I guess that the first step would be a - any - communication get (re) established between the two parties.
Until then, this doesn't matter, sorry.

[JeromeTash]

Meaning that you will now ask him to return 0.21 ETH or its equivalent on the date of the loan?

0.21 ETH still remains 0.21 ETH.  In fact, in the reference link, he is the one who promised to pay 0.21 ETH, not an equivalent of that value in USD at the time


The user in question even had some untrusted feedback regarding his behavior and it makes sense now. I think he was only in the forum to default a loan

onnz423

2017-08-29

Reference

Keeps spamming the forum with loan requests, and changes the amount requested. I would be extra careful while trading with this user.

onnz423

2017-08-29

Reference

Keeps spamming the forum with loan requests, and changes the amount requested. I would be extra careful while trading with this user.

[khaled0111]

Flag supported. I believe this is the right thing to do till he repays the 0.21 eth you owe him and give a valid excuse why he didn't repay in time.
The good thing here is that you noticed his account became active again and tagged him before he make another loan request and scam another lender. I believe this is shasan's main goal from creating this thread, otherwise he'd has done it way earlier.

[Charles-Tim]

At that time the loan only worth $30 since Ethereum is worth for $200, so he might think it just a small amount money and not a big deal for him. Though the account isn't active posting in this forum and don't have any reputation, personally I wouldn't lend any money for such account.

I thought shasan would have a better criteria before accepting to loan anyone, but this seem of a surprise to me.

Regardless of the above-mentioned case, but if a similar situation occurred where the user disappeared for any circumstance (may have been exposed to an accident or any compelling reason) and reappeared after several months/years, will the value of loan be calculated in the same currency (for example, if he borrowed half Bitcoin now and it became worth Bitcoin is more than $100,000) or will it be worth 12k by then?


Meaning that you will now ask him to return 0.21 ETH or its equivalent on the date of the loan?

Yes.

People can as well go for stable coins like USDT, there are loaners on this forum that can lend Bitcointalk qualified users stable coins like USDT. I remember when I needed money in the past, I borrowed in USDT. Loaners even on bitcoin lending board do give option of stable coin, or the borrower can dialogue with the loaner.

[yahoo62278]

According to etherscan the loan was granted on march 11th 2020. I don't think anyone is doubting the loan was defaulted, but I'm with a few others in this thread wondering why you took until july 31st 2022 to make the scam thread?

I see the account logged in on july 19th, hasn't posted since a month after taking the loan, safe to assume the account is under new ownership?

[shasan]

I am surprised, thinking of the reason you loaned him the money he requested for.

He was a sr member and asked loan for about 30$ and I don't think 30$ is valuable then the account.

OP, why did you wait so long to tag him? obviously

I'm curious too, he already wait for 2 years and there's no reason to believe he will pay the loan if there's no private communication.

I tagged after 3 months of the loan. As I have created scam accusation deleted previous tag and added new tag as well as added flag so that any user can know about the scammer.

Meaning that you will now ask him to return 0.21 ETH or its equivalent on the date of the loan?

If I have lost 0.21 eth means I have lost that. That doesn't mean I have lost around 30$. Anyway, the loan defaulter defaulted the loan when the price was low and was inactive on the forum and never contacted with me. The intention was to scam from that time. But recently woke up and there might have any reason behind it.

I guess that the first step would be

There is no communication. The users intention was to scam the loan amount.

0.21 ETH still remains 0.21 ETH.  In fact, in the reference link, he is the one who promised to pay 0.21 ETH, not an equivalent of that value in USD at the time

You are right, though I may re-consider if he contacted with me regarding the repayment.

until july 31st 2022 to make the scam thread?

I have several defaulter whom I have tagged only. I have not created any scam accusation as well as flag as the are inactive. If anyone stay active on the forum then the user may do any other scam. And only for that reason I created scam accusation. Creating scam accusation means I do not take the money but I want to safe the community from being scammed by the scammer.

[Poker Player]

He was a sr member and asked loan for about 30$ and I don't think 30$ is valuable then the account.
...
If I have lost 0.21 eth means I have lost that. That doesn't mean I have lost around 30$. Anyway, the loan defaulter defaulted the loan when the price was low and was inactive on the forum and never contacted with me. The intention was to scam from that time. But recently woke up and there might have any reason behind it.

I had to read a couple of times until I understood it. The loan at the time was $30 in fiat equivalent, but today it's like 10 times as much.

Flag supported. The bad thing about this is that I think it's not going to do any good as I've commented in another thread. That account was useless anyway, with only 1 merit earned and was not generating income from signature campaigns. The only thing is that he won't be able to scam anyone on the forum, that's for sure.

[Mahdirakib]

I have found his telegram account username by checking his post history through Ninjastic.space

Bitcointalk username: anog
Telegram username: @Strike57

Then I searched the username on telegram and found his account there. The display name of the account is “Sigla57”. His account active status was showing “last seen recently”. I had sent a message to him and he replied to me within a few minutes. At first I asked him whether he has an account on bitcointalk or not. He replied that he isn't interested in Bitcoins. I have asked the same question again, but he has cleared the chat history and blocked me on telegram.



The user ‘anog’ has used the same ETH address in the authentication post which he has used in the loan application. Perhaps, the telegram account still belongs to him. @shasan, try to reach him on telegram. Perhaps, he will block you too if you message him on telegram.

[Pmalek]

@shasan, try to reach him on telegram. Perhaps, he will block you too if you message him on telegram.

I think the user in question had plenty of time to return the amount he borrowed if he really wanted to. Two years have passed and ether has gone up quite a bit since then. If that is the reason he can't return the coins, the appropriate course of action would be to contact shasan and perhaps find a solution that satisfies both parties. By staying quiet, I am certain anog doesn't intend to return anything.

[noorman0]

-snip-
I see the account logged in on july 19th, hasn't posted since a month after taking the loan, safe to assume the account is under new ownership?

Probably, need to see this account on the next login whether to notice and care about the flag. If the account changes hands, the new owner is expected to say something to this thread (following the flag reference) and may be able to help shasan contact the previous owner.

[JollyGood]

I have left negative trust and have also supported the flag.

Why on earth would someone vanish for that length of time without repaying such a tiny amount of $30 (0.21 ETH). Granted, the amount might have increased to around £300 today but he still could offered to pay back the $USD equivalent at the time of the loan.

I hope "anog" will post here stating why they defaulted.

[Little Mouse]

Meaning that you will now ask him to return 0.21 ETH or its equivalent on the date of the loan?

0.21 ETH still remains 0.21 ETH.  In fact, in the reference link, he is the one who promised to pay 0.21 ETH, not an equivalent of that value in USD at the time

True. Even if ETH price would decrease, I doubt any borrower would adjust the repayment.
But, in such case, if I were lender/borrower, I would definitely try to have a discussion and would look for flexible amount (in case, I wouldn’t be able to repay this amount, since the loan amount was small).

Just imagine, you have borrowed 1 BTC when BTC price was $10k. You earn $500/week and planned to repay the loan within 20 weeks. But when BTC increases to $60k+, it's not anymore possible for you to repay the loan within 20 weeks, nor even within a few years. Just sharing possible reason of the default.

[examplens]

Meaning that you will now ask him to return 0.21 ETH or its equivalent on the date of the loan?

0.21 ETH still remains 0.21 ETH.  In fact, in the reference link, he is the one who promised to pay 0.21 ETH, not an equivalent of that value in USD at the time

True. Even if ETH price would decrease, I doubt any borrower would adjust the repayment.
But, in such case, if I were lender/borrower, I would definitely try to have a discussion and would look for flexible amount (in case, I wouldn’t be able to repay this amount, since the loan amount was small).

taking or giving a loan in crypto it's always a risk, for both sides of course. if the lender agrees to the current value when the loan is granted he can consider it a bad trade and pure loss. in his place, it would mean nothing to me to get the dollar value now $30 instead of $300 (even if this is below the value that eth had). So there is no space for anything flexible, even the debtor should compensate the interest for the entire period.
this just confirms my rule, that the loan must be taken in the currency in which you receive your earnings.

however, it is clear to everyone, there will not be any re-payment.

[shasan]

Just imagine, you have borrowed 1 BTC when BTC price was $10k. You earn $500/week and planned to repay the loan within 20 weeks. But when BTC increases to $60k+, it's not anymore possible for you to repay the loan within 20 weeks, nor even within a few years. Just sharing possible reason of the default.

When it was scheduled/rescheduled for the repayment the price wasn't high. It becomes high long after the repayment date have passed I mean after the loan defaulted. If the borrower had any intention then s/he could repay and/or atleast could contact with me. But s/he had never did that. The intention of defaulting from the beginning.

[BitcoinGirl.Club]

taking or giving a loan in crypto it's always a risk, for both sides of course.

All business has its own risks. In loan business it's safe to practice collateral but I understand for a small amount OP did not care. It's safer for lenders to give in crypto because price against USD does not effect him when price suddenly bulls which happened in this case. But unfortunately downside happened is since the price against USD was 10x it became huge amount for the borrower resulting not returning the loan at all. 

[JollyGood]

If his intention was to default from the beginning then why would he ask for $30 instead of $100 or $500?

It is possible he sold his account or had other motives, we do not know because he has not posted here. Even now his profile shows as him waking up after a long period activity, he last posted over two years ago in April 2020.

Anyway, his account now has many red trust therefore nobody will trust him again.

When it was scheduled/rescheduled for the repayment the price wasn't high. It becomes high long after the repayment date have passed I mean after the loan defaulted. If the borrower had any intention then s/he could repay and/or atleast could contact with me. But s/he had never did that. The intention of defaulting from the beginning.

[Little Mouse]

If his intention was to default from the beginning then why would he ask for $30 instead of $100 or $500?

Because you will not bigger amount of loan with such an account. That's how lenders think too. Maybe his intention wasn’t to default but he wasn’t in contact with shasan. This is stupid. He could have continue communication with shasan.

[Taskford]

If his intention was to default from the beginning then why would he ask for $30 instead of $100 or $500?

Because you will not bigger amount of loan with such an account. That's how lenders think too. Maybe his intention wasn’t to default but he wasn’t in contact with shasan. This is stupid. He could have continue communication with shasan.

Also that's how those people trying to take the trust of the lender since they want to make them believe that they will pay on time so that they can get bigger loans for second or third time and then they default to their loans. This happen for so many times that's why its good for lenders not to give a huge amount above to the value of their accounts since this is expected to happen to those kind of people.

[shasan]

the price against USD was 10x it became huge amount for the borrower resulting not returning the loan at all. 

That is not the case. The borrower defaulted the loan when it was around 30$. I have created the scam accusation now that doesn't mean it has been defaulted now. I have created now as the borrower has become active on the forum recently which may results loss of the community if I do not make aware about the scam/default.

[PX-Z]

True. Even if ETH price would decrease, I doubt any borrower would adjust the repayment.
But, in such case, if I were lender/borrower, I would definitely try to have a discussion and would look for flexible amount (in case, I wouldn’t be able to repay this amount, since the loan amount was small).

Just imagine, you have borrowed 1 BTC when BTC price was $10k. You earn $500/week and planned to repay the loan within 20 weeks. But when BTC increases to $60k+, it's not anymore possible for you to repay the loan within 20 weeks, nor even within a few years. Just sharing possible reason of the default.

Lenders and lendee probably knew the risks already that's why they still lend and borrow. These people are the one who believe 1 BTC = 1 BTC and you won't gain loss if you don't sell, although some offer USD rates which is more understandable although offer higher interest rate since this will always be a disadvantage to the lendee.

In anyway, this is not the first time OP experience their lenders defaults, so i guess their decisions will probably still the same.

[shasan]

True. Even if ETH price would decrease, I doubt any borrower would adjust the repayment.
But, in such case, if I were lender/borrower, I would definitely try to have a discussion and would look for flexible amount (in case, I wouldn’t be able to repay this amount, since the loan amount was small).

Just imagine, you have borrowed 1 BTC when BTC price was $10k. You earn $500/week and planned to repay the loan within 20 weeks. But when BTC increases to $60k+, it's not anymore possible for you to repay the loan within 20 weeks, nor even within a few years. Just sharing possible reason of the default.

Lenders and lendee probably knew the risks already that's why they still lend and borrow. These people are the one who believe 1 BTC = 1 BTC and you won't gain loss if you don't sell, although some offer USD rates which is more understandable although offer higher interest rate since this will always be a disadvantage to the lendee.

In anyway, this is not the first time OP experience their lenders defaults, so i guess their decisions will probably still the same.

You are right that who are investors for long time 1 BTC is 1 BTC but when the price is too up and borrower  are unable to repay then there might have some discount to the borrower. I cant remember now but I gave discount 80% to one of my borrower.