BANKMAN-FRIED PANIC GAMBLES TO REPAY DEBT

[sunsilk]

especially if you use the user's money (other people) and hope to get the max win so you can pay for the losses of the users in the company.

I think that's too ridiculous for a well-known blockchain project developer, that's how genius SBF's brain is in managing debt payments and solving problems, if so, he will be the butt of ridicule by his friends, and in fact, many do that.

That's the craziest part of it.

SBF ended up thinking that he'll get a lot of money back through gambling. That's why people that have deposited on FTX and have their money there, don't want to gamble because the risk is higher than trading or by just parking it there.

Well, the genius has came out of the cave and started to make freaky things out of people's money. That's what money can do if you don't own it yet you started to lose it with your wrongly deed.

we don't know if he was thinking logically by such move, because it was known that he has some drug issues to treat his depression or ADHD. so for me, it affects his way of thinking and not surprised if he resorted to this move just to recover losses. however, such move was dangerous as he used the billion-dollar money of his clients. good if you are just using thousands of dollars but we are talking billion dollar here at the very least. if you are not living high profile with such amount, i don't know what that is.

He's already out of his mind and that type of thinking while you're owning a business that's related to finance and crypto, you're not really thinking logically with that.

Having some drug issues might probably have released him out of his right mind and that's why he's going with this resort that might get him some bail.

But, wherever you look at it, that's not really a good thinking when you're the owner of a big organization. He probably had accepted it already that he's out of it.

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[Fortify]

Sam Bankman-Fried is alleged to have lost $100M of FTX’s money at online casinos. It is, however, not the first time Bankman-Fried has lost funds either. The collapse of Terra/Luna in May caused massive losses for Sam’s Alameda Research Fund. In hopes of winning back some of the losses, it appears that Sam hit the blackjack floor with FTX money. Unfortunately, he dug the hole deeper. According to Nansen Research, he lost  $100 million in Ethereum and USDT playing at crypto casinos like Stake, Bitcasino, and others. The dots begin to join and Binance’s unveiling of the misappropriation of customer funds now seems to make sense.]Sam Bankman-Fried is alleged to have lost $100M of FTX’s money at online casinos. It is, however, not the first time Bankman-Fried has lost funds either. The collapse of Terra/Luna in May caused massive losses for Sam’s Alameda Research Fund. In hopes of winning back some of the losses, it appears that Sam hit the blackjack floor with FTX money. Unfortunately, he dug the hole deeper. According to Nansen Research, he lost  $100 million in Ethereum and USDT playing at crypto casinos like Stake, Bitcasino, and others. The dots begin to join and Binance’s unveiling of the misappropriation of customer funds now seems to make sense.

How in the world did SBF decide that gambling was the best course of action for recovering the funds? It seems to me that he has terrible friends around him.  Have you ever thought of gambling as way to recover your funds and pay your debts? Does this look like a case of compulsive gambling?

You blame this on "terrible friends around him" yet seem to discount the possibility that this was all his idea and he willfully committed to it? If you're friends with a billionaire and you say "don't do that" then he will probably drop you in order to find another person that does not oppose him, he had all the power in that sort of friendship dynamic. All of the things we're seeing now show that he was a bit naive but is also quite devious in certain aspects. Instead of being happy with a steady income and owning an exchange, he wanted to accrue way more money by engaging in extra trading activity with customer funds, which is what led to his ultimate downfall - he was gambling in many different ways.

[BobK71]

Anyone can behave abnormally if an established business collapses or disappears in a moment. Here SBF is doing the same. But i was skeptical from the start that such news was strictly true or not. Because online portals have been publishing articles without any information or data lately, this kind of news can raise doubts which is very normal. However, the behavior of SBF is somewhat questionable. It is believed that he will take a greater risk in such a decision. It is good if he wins from the gambling but he must know what might happen if he loses.

[aioc]

1.This might be fake news.

No it's not have checked the article attaches to the main post and Tom Dwan a poker player admitted

Tom Dwan has publicly admitted that he knew that FTX was crumbling.

In a tweet he said:

“Sam had used his ftt token raise to plug a hole in Alameda’s balance sheet. I found this out at some point in I think 2021. From a few places. Some were nice people who weren’t involved. I know about a lot of corruption in the world, and sometimes it’s not my business to out.”

It is alleged that Dwan played poker with numerous people connected to FTX in some way or another. Through his interactions with them, he found out about their insolvency and even warned certain people to be careful with FTX, as he realized they were misappropriating funds.

“I basically knew they were insolvent when ftt was still at 22. I hoped it was just in treasuries etc, and a mild misappropriation of funds. And I got a bunch of flack in groups n public for suggesting ppl be careful and withdraw at least some. And so many rushing to defend him.”

The problem is, there are already warnings but supporters and investors and close associates shut the news and prefer to listen to their prodigy, they should have done an investigation to clarify this and advised and guide SBF so he would not indulge the company's money to gambling, the blaming games happens when the worse just happened.

[madnessteat]

1.This might be fake news.
2.If this news is actually true, then SBF is an idiot. So many people in the crypto world praised Bankman-Fried as some kind of genius. It seems like SBF is the complete opposite of a genius.
We can't predict what is happening in a desperate person's mind. Some people start acting totally dumb and irrational, when they lose control over the situation in their lives.
SBF could've pumped &dumped some dead shitcoin in order to recover some of the losses. FTX/Alameda had enough money to do such thing.
The profits would have been way bigger. I know it's unethical and probably illegal, but doing such thing is way smarter than wasting millions of dollars on gambling.

He is facing a huge prison sentence, and even if he knew that before he was arrested, gambling that much money is just crazy. I'm sure he knows how to do the math and knows that the casino has an advantage over the player.

I'm still more inclined that he is not a gambler, but just a man who was lucky enough to be in the right place at the right time, and he lost everything simply because of greed and his not very clever scheme to get unsecured credit.

[uneng]

Like i said before, if indeed he resorted to gambling as a way to try to fix up the mess he got himself and every one into, i think he wouldn't be the first to do this.
Like we all know or some of us know, Fred Smith, the then CEO of FedEx saved his company from bankruptcy through playing blackjack in las Vegas, So i have no doubt that SBF have heard this story and decided to attempt the same thing to see if he could be as lucky as Fred Smith, but unfortunately for him, it seems that luck wasnt just on his side.

https://i.imgur.com/nBD6hzR.png

The FedEx story had a happy ending, but it was a different situation. Fred Smith wasn't running pump and dump schemes or sponsoring political parties and foreign countries with the company's money. Actually, FedEx's money was his, not from customers, as opposite to the case of FTX exchange. Moreover, he gambled only a relatively small amount of 5000$ into 27,000$, and that isn't exactly what saved the company from failure, rather it was his inspiration to not give up FedEx, so from that moment on he didn't keep gambling anymore in order to develop his business, but worked hard to make things work and thankfully he achieved it.

If SBF read that somewhere and thought he could revert the banktuptcy of FTX, I think he didn't understand the morale of the story.

[Fivestar4everMVP]

Like i said before, if indeed he resorted to gambling as a way to try to fix up the mess he got himself and every one into, i think he wouldn't be the first to do this.
Like we all know or some of us know, Fred Smith, the then CEO of FedEx saved his company from bankruptcy through playing blackjack in las Vegas, So i have no doubt that SBF have heard this story and decided to attempt the same thing to see if he could be as lucky as Fred Smith, but unfortunately for him, it seems that luck wasnt just on his side.

https://i.imgur.com/nBD6hzR.png

The FedEx story had a happy ending, but it was a different situation. Fred Smith wasn't running pump and dump schemes or sponsoring political parties and foreign countries with the company's money. Actually, FedEx's money was his, not from customers, as opposite to the case of FTX exchange. Moreover, he gambled only a relatively small amount of 5000$ into 27,000$, and that isn't exactly what saved the company from failure, rather it was his inspiration to not give up FedEx, so from that moment on he didn't keep gambling anymore in order to develop his business, but worked hard to make things work and thankfully he achieved it.

If SBF read that somewhere and thought he could revert the banktuptcy of FTX, I think he didn't understand the morale of the story.

You make sense for sure, but even as right as you are, I still think situations doesn't have to always be the same to have happy endings or end at the same results like the other, and yes, Fred smith gambled with his money(his company's company actually) which was said to be the last $5000 he had left, in as much as i want to agree with you that the $27,000 he won isn't what saved his company but he's determination not to give give up on FedEx, i still believe that that same determination is to save his company is what drove him into gambling, and clearly, that was his last option, and if he had lost that $5000, i can tell you for sure that the courier company called FedEx would have been long dead except someone else bought it over back then.

One fact i will leave you with is that when it comes to achieving or reaching great heights in business, determination alone doesn't really do much, you need money , and without the money, your determination will die with you, and be buried with you as well, several companies fold up and die not because the CEO was not determined to keep the company running, but they simply lacked the funds to make that happen.

[Sithara007]

With every passing day, I am getting really fed up with the sort of sob stories the mainstream media is dishing out about Bankman Fraud and the other FTX criminals. For heaven's sake, these are the people who stole $10 billion from ordinary hard working people. Bankman Fraud wasted $100 in gambling because he was a gambling addict. Look how the media spun that story. They painted it as if Fraud was trying to help the victims by doing gambling. It is really getting nauseating, the level of support these criminals get from the media. And here is the latest piece (offered without any further comments):

https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2023/01/02/caroline-ellison-ftx/

Like Bankman-Fried, Ellison was a proponent of effective altruism, a philanthropic philosophy that encourages young people to take high-paying jobs, amass wealth and donate it.

[nullama]

~snip~
This guy was put where he was by someone else, because he definitely couldn't make his way through by himself. It's really not surprising he was gambling with customers' funds, as that is the smartest idea that could come from his mind in order to fix the mess he put everyone into. I think the most shocking part of the whole story is that the media gave him the status of phenomenon and prodigy boy. It would be funny if it wasn't tragic...

Those photos reminded me of this:



Basically the whole mainstream media was saying that it's all fine, the agencies that were supposed to evaluate the risk of those instrument said they were the best ever, until everything collapsed.

Here's more information about that, for younger bitcoiners: The Indisputable Role of Credit Ratings Agencies in the 2008 Collapse, and Why Nothing Has Changed

Things continue the same today, mainstream media supporting people like Bankman-Fried. He's even going to plead not guilty:

Bankman-Fried set to enter not guilty plea in FTX fraud case

[Sithara007]

Bankman-Fraud is a product of the bankers and their mainstream media cronies. Satoshi designed Bitcoin back in 2008, in order to end the dominance of big bankers. 15 years later, now the entire cryptocurrency sector is under the threat of takeover by these same people. Those who stood against this takeover have been sidelined or imprisoned. Exchanges such as BTC-e, who stood up against the authorities were destroyed without any trace. At the same time, the left-wing mafia hyped up criminals such as Bankman-Fraud and allowed exchanges like FTX to encroach the space left by platforms such as BTC-e. Compare the media portrayal of Bankman Fraud and Alexander Vinnik, and you will see what I am saying. 

When I joined this forum 9 years ago, most of the users here were libertarian, and stood for anonymity and freedom of speech. Almost all the users were against government dictatorship. Most important part is that honesty was valued. Users trying to cheat others were looked down upon.

After almost a decade, the scene has completely changed. Most of the users are left-wing, and they want taxes up to 90% as well as increased regulations. It is perfectly OK to steal billions of USD from other people, if the criminal apologizes in the end and say "sorry". There are no morals and ethics. Now Bitcoin sector has become the same as fiat sector.

[nullama]

Bankman-Fraud is a product of the bankers and their mainstream media cronies. Satoshi designed Bitcoin back in 2008, in order to end the dominance of big bankers. 15 years later, now the entire cryptocurrency sector is under the threat of takeover by these same people. Those who stood against this takeover have been sidelined or imprisoned. Exchanges such as BTC-e, who stood up against the authorities were destroyed without any trace. At the same time, the left-wing mafia hyped up criminals such as Bankman-Fraud and allowed exchanges like FTX to encroach the space left by platforms such as BTC-e. Compare the media portrayal of Bankman Fraud and Alexander Vinnik, and you will see what I am saying. 

When I joined this forum 9 years ago, most of the users here were libertarian, and stood for anonymity and freedom of speech. Almost all the users were against government dictatorship. Most important part is that honesty was valued. Users trying to cheat others were looked down upon.

After almost a decade, the scene has completely changed. Most of the users are left-wing, and they want taxes up to 90% as well as increased regulations. It is perfectly OK to steal billions of USD from other people, if the criminal apologizes in the end and say "sorry". There are no morals and ethics. Now Bitcoin sector has become the same as fiat sector.

Didn't know the story of Alexander Vinnik, thanks for sharing the name.

What I find curious is that any casino worldwide accepts cash without ID, in the same way that BTC-e accepted Bitcoin, yet nothing happens to the people running casinos worldwide.

[wxa7115]

What I find curious is that any casino worldwide accepts cash without ID, in the same way that BTC-e accepted Bitcoin, yet nothing happens to the people running casinos worldwide.

It should not surprise us, how do you think politicians, some of the richest people around the world and even drug lords can move their money all over the world without any problem?

They can do that because banks allows them to do it, for all the noise governments create about bitcoin being used by criminals, the banking system allows criminals to do whatever they want despite the regulations currently in place, and when they are caught they receive a fine and nothing more, a fine they can easily pay with all the money they helped move around the world.

[Sithara007]

Didn't know the story of Alexander Vinnik, thanks for sharing the name.

What I find curious is that any casino worldwide accepts cash without ID, in the same way that BTC-e accepted Bitcoin, yet nothing happens to the people running casinos worldwide.

BTC-e was targeted by the FBI because they refused unfair demands from the latter. FBI wanted the user data and transaction details, which the platform refused to provide (since they valued the privacy and anonymity of their customers). Their servers were targeted and some of the reserves were stolen. Even after this, BTC-e reimbursed the losses and tried to carry on as usual. However the FBI targeted them for a second time in 2017 and after that it became impossible for them to continue with their operations. I had an account with them, and the BTC-e guys were very honest and straight forward. Never had a problem with them. Their downfall provided opportunity to criminals such as Sam Bankman Fraud to come up with their own platforms and loot the customers.

[BobK71]

Like i said before, if indeed he resorted to gambling as a way to try to fix up the mess he got himself and every one into, i think he wouldn't be the first to do this.
Like we all know or some of us know, Fred Smith, the then CEO of FedEx saved his company from bankruptcy through playing blackjack in las Vegas, So i have no doubt that SBF have heard this story and decided to attempt the same thing to see if he could be as lucky as Fred Smith, but unfortunately for him, it seems that luck wasnt just on his side.

When the CEO of FedEx Fred Smith is about to fail his business, he worried how to managed that money what was need for the company. He failed everywhere to collect. Finally he entered Las Vegas with depression just to change his state of mind. But that was not his pre-planned. He never expected that he could win at that moment. It can be said that luck was good and when he got $5000 to $27000 he thought of expanding his business with that money. But the situation is completely different for SBF.

[piebeyb]

Didn't know the story of Alexander Vinnik, thanks for sharing the name.

What I find curious is that any casino worldwide accepts cash without ID, in the same way that BTC-e accepted Bitcoin, yet nothing happens to the people running casinos worldwide.

BTC-e was targeted by the FBI because they refused unfair demands from the latter. FBI wanted the user data and transaction details, which the platform refused to provide (since they valued the privacy and anonymity of their customers). Their servers were targeted and some of the reserves were stolen. Even after this, BTC-e reimbursed the losses and tried to carry on as usual. However the FBI targeted them for a second time in 2017 and after that it became impossible for them to continue with their operations. I had an account with them, and the BTC-e guys were very honest and straight forward. Never had a problem with them. Their downfall provided opportunity to criminals such as Sam Bankman Fraud to come up with their own platforms and loot the customers.

remember my btc-e remember trading there, as you said they are a very safe and honest site, that's why when I heard that mtgox had a problem I was really happy at that time I had transferred my money from mtgox to btc-e before there was a closure of their site, right now I'm more interested in keeping my money in my wallet because it's much safer considering the many cases that have happened on exchanges like this FTX, but I still have a little trust in binance and still keep 10% of my funds there to trade

[Sithara007]

remember my btc-e remember trading there, as you said they are a very safe and honest site, that's why when I heard that mtgox had a problem I was really happy at that time I had transferred my money from mtgox to btc-e before there was a closure of their site, right now I'm more interested in keeping my money in my wallet because it's much safer considering the many cases that have happened on exchanges like this FTX, but I still have a little trust in binance and still keep 10% of my funds there to trade

I don't know how many of the users know what happened with BTC-e and MtGox. I was an active user back then and had accounts with both the platforms. Back in 2013, these two were the top Bitcoin/Cryptocurrency exchanges. Both of these platforms had their own dedicated user groups. MtGox was very vocal in enforcing KYC and Mark Karpelès used to showoff his influence. On the other hand, BTC-e never undertook KYC as they valued the anonymity and privacy of their users. The BTC-e owners also refused to reveal themselves.

If you could browse through the posts from 2013, you will find that a lot of users accused BTC-e of being a fraud exchange and were warning users that it will go down sometime soon. But it was MtGox which went down in 2014. BTC-e stayed alive until 2017, when the FBI seized their servers and shut the platform down. And it was the death of BTC-e which eventually allowed criminals such as SBF to come up with their own platforms and loot the users.

Now I can connect the dots. FBI and the banking mafia destroyed proper exchanges and then allowed fraudsters such as SBF to encroach the vacant space left by these exchanges. In the end, the reputation of cryptocurrency is tarnished and FBI achieves its target.

[Quidat]

Didn't know the story of Alexander Vinnik, thanks for sharing the name.

What I find curious is that any casino worldwide accepts cash without ID, in the same way that BTC-e accepted Bitcoin, yet nothing happens to the people running casinos worldwide.

BTC-e was targeted by the FBI because they refused unfair demands from the latter. FBI wanted the user data and transaction details, which the platform refused to provide (since they valued the privacy and anonymity of their customers). Their servers were targeted and some of the reserves were stolen. Even after this, BTC-e reimbursed the losses and tried to carry on as usual. However the FBI targeted them for a second time in 2017 and after that it became impossible for them to continue with their operations. I had an account with them, and the BTC-e guys were very honest and straight forward. Never had a problem with them. Their downfall provided opportunity to criminals such as Sam Bankman Fraud to come up with their own platforms and loot the customers.

remember my btc-e remember trading there, as you said they are a very safe and honest site, that's why when I heard that mtgox had a problem I was really happy at that time I had transferred my money from mtgox to btc-e before there was a closure of their site, right now I'm more interested in keeping my money in my wallet because it's much safer considering the many cases that have happened on exchanges like this FTX, but I still have a little trust in binance and still keep 10% of my funds there to trade

People should do this way on where they should really be that mindful on keeping off their coins on any centralized services or platforms.They might be that popular
or known but we arent that blind not to see into those past events or situations on where it does involve these kind of issues like hacking,bankruptcy so called
or whatsoever the reason they would really be calling out which would result on running all the money that someone uses up with that platform.
As for SBF then it isnt really that different into those past owners of exchange platforms the thing here is that he had just been caught.

[nullama]

~snip~
People should do this way on where they should really be that mindful on keeping off their coins on any centralized services or platforms.They might be that popular
or known but we arent that blind not to see into those past events or situations on where it does involve these kind of issues like hacking,bankruptcy so called
or whatsoever the reason they would really be calling out which would result on running all the money that someone uses up with that platform.
As for SBF then it isnt really that different into those past owners of exchange platforms the thing here is that he had just been caught.

It's pretty clear now as we have multiple examples over the years.

If you don't have the keys to the coins, they're not your coins, and that's it.

You need to withdraw your coins from whatever company or service you're using to have full 100% self custody of your funds.

You cannot really trust anyone with your coins, the moment it hits their wallet, it's theirs.

Nothing has changed really, and these kind of things will continue to happen because people continue to trust on third parties.

[Sithara007]

People should do this way on where they should really be that mindful on keeping off their coins on any centralized services or platforms.They might be that popular
or known but we arent that blind not to see into those past events or situations on where it does involve these kind of issues like hacking,bankruptcy so called
or whatsoever the reason they would really be calling out which would result on running all the money that someone uses up with that platform.
As for SBF then it isnt really that different into those past owners of exchange platforms the thing here is that he had just been caught.

Ideally no one should be keeping their coins in exchange wallets. But a distinction should be made between trustworthy exchanges and those that can't be trusted. I used BTC-e for more than 3 years without any issue, until the FBI destroyed them. I had similar good experience with Bitstamp as well. Binance is another exchange that can be trusted. Now FTX is different. It was more like an inside job by the Wall Street to destroy the cryptocurrency industry. The promoters like Bankman Fraud and Ellison had no interest as such in cryptocurrency. Their political views are diametrically opposite of those held by Satoshi Nakamoto.

Detractors of Bitcoin realized that the best way to destroy cryptocurrency is through inside jobs and that is what resulted in the meteoric and sudden rise of FTX. And that explains why Bankman Fraud is enjoying his vacation at his Palo Alto home even after stealing $10 billion, while genuine cryptocurrency proponents such as Alexander Vinnik and Ross Ulbricht are locked up behind bars without any possibility of parole.

[piebeyb]

remember my btc-e remember trading there, as you said they are a very safe and honest site, that's why when I heard that mtgox had a problem I was really happy at that time I had transferred my money from mtgox to btc-e before there was a closure of their site, right now I'm more interested in keeping my money in my wallet because it's much safer considering the many cases that have happened on exchanges like this FTX, but I still have a little trust in binance and still keep 10% of my funds there to trade

I don't know how many of the users know what happened with BTC-e and MtGox. I was an active user back then and had accounts with both the platforms. Back in 2013, these two were the top Bitcoin/Cryptocurrency exchanges. Both of these platforms had their own dedicated user groups. MtGox was very vocal in enforcing KYC and Mark Karpelès used to showoff his influence. On the other hand, BTC-e never undertook KYC as they valued the anonymity and privacy of their users. The BTC-e owners also refused to reveal themselves.

If you could browse through the posts from 2013, you will find that a lot of users accused BTC-e of being a fraud exchange and were warning users that it will go down sometime soon. But it was MtGox which went down in 2014. BTC-e stayed alive until 2017, when the FBI seized their servers and shut the platform down. And it was the death of BTC-e which eventually allowed criminals such as SBF to come up with their own platforms and loot the users.

Now I can connect the dots. FBI and the banking mafia destroyed proper exchanges and then allowed fraudsters such as SBF to encroach the vacant space left by these exchanges. In the end, the reputation of cryptocurrency is tarnished and FBI achieves its target.

that's why I didn't really like mtgox since then actually I'm not interested in exchanges that require KYC, I think it's stupid and doesn't even guarantee their site is completely secure, most exchange sites are anonymous on the contrary much more secure, to be honest at the moment i don't keep much of my crypto money on exchange sites now its better to keep it in crypto wallets, currently haven't found any exchange like btc-e