Prosecution to use Caroline Ellison notes as evidence against SBF

[2stout]

The thing is that pardons and clemency are not one in the same and conflating the 2 is an error.  A pardon is a type of clemency and the most desirable type as it can let you off the hook for restitution and fully restore ones rights.  Commutations of a prison sentence is another type of clemency, which is the most common type of clmency and typically doesn't absolve one of restitution or fully restores ones rights.  So using your source (https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2025/02/07/biden-granted-more-acts-of-clemency-than-any-prior-president/), Biden only granted 80 pardons during his time in office and in a year, trump has granted over 1600 pardons in a little over a year so far in office (https://www.cato.org/blog/embarrassment-riches; ).  Also, trump removed the requirement that they pay restitution and fines, costing their victims an at least estimated $1.3 billion (https://www.cato.org/blog/embarrassment-riches).

This doesn't prove Trump is selling pardons. One view is that the case against Trevor Milton is politically motivated, and Trump intervened.
Trevor Milton is in a very difficult situation; Trump has only waived criminal and state fines, not private corporate debts. Only one particular and controversial case was cited, on the basis of which it is impossible to draw final conclusions.

Where there is smoke, there is fire.  And, the view that the case against Trevor Milton is politically motivated is patently false as he is a proven fraud.  Yeah, but $661 million was wiped away while he still owes nearly $100 million.  So he went from owing around $761 million to only $100 million.  The corporate debt is only 13.14% of the total.  I only cited 1 of many cases and will leave it to you to do some easy research as today's lesson is over.

If you've decided to become a teacher, you're doing a very poor job. You've cited only one case and are drawing conclusions based on that that Trump is selling pardons.
If you're accusing someone, you should provide sufficient evidence and independently study other cases.

What I cited contained more than 1 case and I've also mentioned other cases previously.  My conclusion are drawn not just from 1 case, far from it.  The goal post moving and mental gymnastics from continued schooling are astounding.

[zasad@]

The thing is that pardons and clemency are not one in the same and conflating the 2 is an error.  A pardon is a type of clemency and the most desirable type as it can let you off the hook for restitution and fully restore ones rights.  Commutations of a prison sentence is another type of clemency, which is the most common type of clmency and typically doesn't absolve one of restitution or fully restores ones rights.  So using your source (https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2025/02/07/biden-granted-more-acts-of-clemency-than-any-prior-president/), Biden only granted 80 pardons during his time in office and in a year, trump has granted over 1600 pardons in a little over a year so far in office (https://www.cato.org/blog/embarrassment-riches; ).  Also, trump removed the requirement that they pay restitution and fines, costing their victims an at least estimated $1.3 billion (https://www.cato.org/blog/embarrassment-riches).

This doesn't prove Trump is selling pardons. One view is that the case against Trevor Milton is politically motivated, and Trump intervened.
Trevor Milton is in a very difficult situation; Trump has only waived criminal and state fines, not private corporate debts. Only one particular and controversial case was cited, on the basis of which it is impossible to draw final conclusions.

Where there is smoke, there is fire.  And, the view that the case against Trevor Milton is politically motivated is patently false as he is a proven fraud.  Yeah, but $661 million was wiped away while he still owes nearly $100 million.  So he went from owing around $761 million to only $100 million.  The corporate debt is only 13.14% of the total.  I only cited 1 of many cases and will leave it to you to do some easy research as today's lesson is over.

If you've decided to become a teacher, you're doing a very poor job. You've cited only one case and are drawing conclusions based on that that Trump is selling pardons.
If you're accusing someone, you should provide sufficient evidence and independently study other cases.

What I cited contained more than 1 case and I've also mentioned other cases previously.  My conclusion are drawn not just from 1 case, far from it.  The goal post moving and mental gymnastics from continued schooling are astounding.

I can even help you and give you a link to an article that explains more than the two examples you gave.
https://www.cato.org/blog/embarrassment-riches

Of course, Trump has issued many individual pardons, but that's his right to favor his allies or strike lucrative political deals. I can even agree that his decisions are very expensive for the US budget.

But even if you're logical, that doesn't prove Trump is selling pardons.

[2stout]

The thing is that pardons and clemency are not one in the same and conflating the 2 is an error.  A pardon is a type of clemency and the most desirable type as it can let you off the hook for restitution and fully restore ones rights.  Commutations of a prison sentence is another type of clemency, which is the most common type of clmency and typically doesn't absolve one of restitution or fully restores ones rights.  So using your source (https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2025/02/07/biden-granted-more-acts-of-clemency-than-any-prior-president/), Biden only granted 80 pardons during his time in office and in a year, trump has granted over 1600 pardons in a little over a year so far in office (https://www.cato.org/blog/embarrassment-riches; ).  Also, trump removed the requirement that they pay restitution and fines, costing their victims an at least estimated $1.3 billion (https://www.cato.org/blog/embarrassment-riches).

This doesn't prove Trump is selling pardons. One view is that the case against Trevor Milton is politically motivated, and Trump intervened.
Trevor Milton is in a very difficult situation; Trump has only waived criminal and state fines, not private corporate debts. Only one particular and controversial case was cited, on the basis of which it is impossible to draw final conclusions.

Where there is smoke, there is fire.  And, the view that the case against Trevor Milton is politically motivated is patently false as he is a proven fraud.  Yeah, but $661 million was wiped away while he still owes nearly $100 million.  So he went from owing around $761 million to only $100 million.  The corporate debt is only 13.14% of the total.  I only cited 1 of many cases and will leave it to you to do some easy research as today's lesson is over.

If you've decided to become a teacher, you're doing a very poor job. You've cited only one case and are drawing conclusions based on that that Trump is selling pardons.
If you're accusing someone, you should provide sufficient evidence and independently study other cases.

What I cited contained more than 1 case and I've also mentioned other cases previously.  My conclusion are drawn not just from 1 case, far from it.  The goal post moving and mental gymnastics from continued schooling are astounding.

I can even help you and give you a link to an article that explains more than the two examples you gave.
https://www.cato.org/blog/embarrassment-riches

Of course, Trump has issued many individual pardons, but that's his right to favor his allies or strike lucrative political deals. I can even agree that his decisions are very expensive for the US budget.

But even if you're logical, that doesn't prove Trump is selling pardons.

I thought you were going to provide a new link, but I see you used the one I previously provided, so moot point.  More food for thought, hopefully these things will be investigated one day, hopefully sooner than later:  https://www.cbsnews.com/news/trump-linked-firm-pardon-lobbying/

[zasad@]

The thing is that pardons and clemency are not one in the same and conflating the 2 is an error.  A pardon is a type of clemency and the most desirable type as it can let you off the hook for restitution and fully restore ones rights.  Commutations of a prison sentence is another type of clemency, which is the most common type of clmency and typically doesn't absolve one of restitution or fully restores ones rights.  So using your source (https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2025/02/07/biden-granted-more-acts-of-clemency-than-any-prior-president/), Biden only granted 80 pardons during his time in office and in a year, trump has granted over 1600 pardons in a little over a year so far in office (https://www.cato.org/blog/embarrassment-riches; ).  Also, trump removed the requirement that they pay restitution and fines, costing their victims an at least estimated $1.3 billion (https://www.cato.org/blog/embarrassment-riches).

This doesn't prove Trump is selling pardons. One view is that the case against Trevor Milton is politically motivated, and Trump intervened.
Trevor Milton is in a very difficult situation; Trump has only waived criminal and state fines, not private corporate debts. Only one particular and controversial case was cited, on the basis of which it is impossible to draw final conclusions.

Where there is smoke, there is fire.  And, the view that the case against Trevor Milton is politically motivated is patently false as he is a proven fraud.  Yeah, but $661 million was wiped away while he still owes nearly $100 million.  So he went from owing around $761 million to only $100 million.  The corporate debt is only 13.14% of the total.  I only cited 1 of many cases and will leave it to you to do some easy research as today's lesson is over.

If you've decided to become a teacher, you're doing a very poor job. You've cited only one case and are drawing conclusions based on that that Trump is selling pardons.
If you're accusing someone, you should provide sufficient evidence and independently study other cases.

What I cited contained more than 1 case and I've also mentioned other cases previously.  My conclusion are drawn not just from 1 case, far from it.  The goal post moving and mental gymnastics from continued schooling are astounding.

I can even help you and give you a link to an article that explains more than the two examples you gave.
https://www.cato.org/blog/embarrassment-riches

Of course, Trump has issued many individual pardons, but that's his right to favor his allies or strike lucrative political deals. I can even agree that his decisions are very expensive for the US budget.

But even if you're logical, that doesn't prove Trump is selling pardons.

I thought you were going to provide a new link, but I see you used the one I previously provided, so moot point.  More food for thought, hopefully these things will be investigated one day, hopefully sooner than later:  https://www.cbsnews.com/news/trump-linked-firm-pardon-lobbying/

I'm not a Trump fan, but I think these cases won't be investigated and everyone will forget about it after Trump leaves the White House in a little over two years. There was a lot of dirt on the previous president, too, but everyone forgot about it after the election.
Lobbying isn't illegal in the US, so I don't understand why this angers you so much.

[2stout]

The thing is that pardons and clemency are not one in the same and conflating the 2 is an error.  A pardon is a type of clemency and the most desirable type as it can let you off the hook for restitution and fully restore ones rights.  Commutations of a prison sentence is another type of clemency, which is the most common type of clmency and typically doesn't absolve one of restitution or fully restores ones rights.  So using your source (https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2025/02/07/biden-granted-more-acts-of-clemency-than-any-prior-president/), Biden only granted 80 pardons during his time in office and in a year, trump has granted over 1600 pardons in a little over a year so far in office (https://www.cato.org/blog/embarrassment-riches; ).  Also, trump removed the requirement that they pay restitution and fines, costing their victims an at least estimated $1.3 billion (https://www.cato.org/blog/embarrassment-riches).

This doesn't prove Trump is selling pardons. One view is that the case against Trevor Milton is politically motivated, and Trump intervened.
Trevor Milton is in a very difficult situation; Trump has only waived criminal and state fines, not private corporate debts. Only one particular and controversial case was cited, on the basis of which it is impossible to draw final conclusions.

Where there is smoke, there is fire.  And, the view that the case against Trevor Milton is politically motivated is patently false as he is a proven fraud.  Yeah, but $661 million was wiped away while he still owes nearly $100 million.  So he went from owing around $761 million to only $100 million.  The corporate debt is only 13.14% of the total.  I only cited 1 of many cases and will leave it to you to do some easy research as today's lesson is over.

If you've decided to become a teacher, you're doing a very poor job. You've cited only one case and are drawing conclusions based on that that Trump is selling pardons.
If you're accusing someone, you should provide sufficient evidence and independently study other cases.

What I cited contained more than 1 case and I've also mentioned other cases previously.  My conclusion are drawn not just from 1 case, far from it.  The goal post moving and mental gymnastics from continued schooling are astounding.

I can even help you and give you a link to an article that explains more than the two examples you gave.
https://www.cato.org/blog/embarrassment-riches

Of course, Trump has issued many individual pardons, but that's his right to favor his allies or strike lucrative political deals. I can even agree that his decisions are very expensive for the US budget.

But even if you're logical, that doesn't prove Trump is selling pardons.

I thought you were going to provide a new link, but I see you used the one I previously provided, so moot point.  More food for thought, hopefully these things will be investigated one day, hopefully sooner than later:  https://www.cbsnews.com/news/trump-linked-firm-pardon-lobbying/

I'm not a Trump fan, but I think these cases won't be investigated and everyone will forget about it after Trump leaves the White House in a little over two years. There was a lot of dirt on the previous president, too, but everyone forgot about it after the election.
Lobbying isn't illegal in the US, so I don't understand why this angers you so much.

The comparison of dirt between the current and previous president is like comparing apples to oranges.  Lobbying doesn't anger me so much as you say, and by saying this you missed the plot.  The main anger is for the victims who had their day in court and won restitution only to have it wiped out to the tune of over a billon USD by the current president issuing a full pardon, when he could have taken other measures to leave restitution in place.

[zasad@]

The comparison of dirt between the current and previous president is like comparing apples to oranges.  Lobbying doesn't anger me so much as you say, and by saying this you missed the plot.  The main anger is for the victims who had their day in court and won restitution only to have it wiped out to the tune of over a billon USD by the current president issuing a full pardon, when he could have taken other measures to leave restitution in place.

If you're talking about compensation, Trump's pardon doesn't relieve Trevor Milton of civil liability to private individuals. A pardon doesn't erase the fraud, and all criminal case materials can be used in civil court. Trevor Milton will face very lengthy legal proceedings in the coming years.

Nevertheless, Trevor Milton has started a new startup, and I don't feel sorry for the idiots who will lose money there. If investors themselves are giving money to a fraudster, then there's no need to blame others.