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Author Topic: ➡️➡️ [ANN] | [banned mixer] | BITCOIN MIXER ⬅️⬅️  (Read 2292 times)
tumbler.io (OP)
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September 20, 2023, 12:30:00 PM
Last edit: October 24, 2023, 04:04:18 AM by tumbler.io
Merited by Learn Bitcoin (2), Symmetrick (2)
 #1


Just looking to the future. Anonymize your payments and savings!

With the advent of cryptocurrencies, everyone dreamed of decentralization and anonymity, as Nakamoto bequeathed. But in recent years, anonymous currencies have been losing their positions on leading cryptocurrency exchanges, and the volumes of decentralized exchanges have been seriously falling since their appearance. Often pseudo-decentralized projects, when studied in detail, unfortunately, give themselves away as not decentralized. Our project is not decentralized, but it helps to solve one very important issue. It helps you to own your Bitcoin savings anonymously, as well as pay for the services you need and invest anonymously as well.

You should know that it is the best product that looks traditional at first glance, but it has hidden potential, which is successfully realized with your support. It is suitable for a much larger number of people than you might imagine: on the project pages you will learn about fresh ideas for using this mixer, because many do not guess where and under what circumstances you can use such a service.

Why does the next bitcoin mixer appear in 2023? A truly working tool will never interfere with the community in reality, in which there has not yet been support for the anonymity of bitcoin transactions in the bitcoin blockchain itself.

Why do you need to use [banned mixer]? Everyone makes their own choice. [banned mixer] attentively and seriously treats the simplest, at first glance, issues, and works out complex issues, decomposing them into simple ones to solve in detail. Below, in the thread, answers to all your questions about the work of the project will appear.

Advantages of the project:

- support 24x7
- easy to use, familiar and intuitive interface with lots of hints
- a convenient assistant Anonymizing Meter
- support of up to ten receiving addresses
- a calculator that allows you not only to accurately understand the amount of the commission paid, but also to control the amounts sent
- reasonable service fee
- absolute safety and reliability
- zero-logs policy, the service never stores any users personal info
- all sources for mixing are under full control of the service, including premium level funds
- Tumbler code is encrypted and formed a new after each mixing

 Wink Expect Testers Reviews Discussion with interesting conditions for testers.

Be careful with clones and always use only the following addresses:

Clearnet: https://[banned mixer]
Tor Mirror: http://[banned mixer]
tumbler.io (OP)
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September 20, 2023, 12:43:16 PM
 #2

Reserved for updates!
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September 20, 2023, 02:16:34 PM
 #3

Is it a new project? I feel like I heard the name long ago.

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LeGaulois
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September 20, 2023, 03:12:48 PM
 #4

LEGAL STATEMENT OF [banned mixer]
TUMBLERIO Ltd

Show us your are trully a limited company. I can verify that

Is it a new project? I feel like I heard the name long ago.

You're probably thinking about Tumbler.to, a mixer closed ~3 years ago
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2827109.msg55656025#msg55656025

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AB de Royse777
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September 20, 2023, 03:53:02 PM
 #5

You're probably thinking about Tumbler.to, a mixer closed ~3 years ago
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2827109.msg55656025#msg55656025
You are correct.
I could not get my head around with the .io and .to

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September 20, 2023, 08:06:04 PM
 #6

Wink Expect Testers Reviews Discussion with interesting conditions for testers.
I am already doing quick testing myself, and I can say that clearnet address is not working for me after trying with several different browsers.
Onion address works, but I didnt do anything much except browsing the content, checking out fee and faq page.

Quote
After the creation of the order, you will see the minimum and maximum amount for the transaction, which is from 0.001 up to 100 BTC. In case you sent us less than the minimum, that would be concerned that a donation. In case you would like to mix a higher amount, please feel free to contact us through the support form, and we will answer you as soon as possible.
Can you confirm that you actually own 100 BTC by signing an address?


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JeromeTash
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September 20, 2023, 09:07:53 PM
 #7

Something is up with the clearnet version right after solving the captcha. And now every time I visit the link

I get this error
Quote
429 Too Many Requests

Perhaps you should fix it.

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September 20, 2023, 09:38:50 PM
 #8

Clearnet doesn't work for me. Error 429 Too Many Requests from DDos-guard

Is it a new project? I feel like I heard the name long ago.

You're probably thinking about Tumbler.to, a mixer closed ~3 years ago
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2827109.msg55656025#msg55656025

The domain name is one word, very related to the mixing service. It can affect the feeling as if we know about this service from before.

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September 21, 2023, 12:01:29 AM
 #9

I can't open the clearnet browser like post above, say: 429 Too Many Requests. but it's okay on the Onion browser.
So, it says captcha on step 1, but I didn't go through that step but went straight to step 2, Looks like the website isn't ready yet.
the service fee doesn't seem very competitive like another mixer, the minimum is 1%.

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tumbler.io (OP)
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September 21, 2023, 03:59:32 AM
Last edit: September 21, 2023, 06:51:28 AM by tumbler.io
 #10

First of all, I would like to say a big thank you for the stress test!

15836600 requests, it turns out we have competition... at first glance there wasn't any  Wink


Quote
Is it a new project? I feel like I heard the name long ago.

Yes, this is a new project, and it has nothing to do with projects with other domain names, including Tumbler.to.

Quote
Show us your are trully a limited company. I can verify that

I'm afraid this is commercially confidential, you could try asking for this information via the feedback form on the website.

Quote
429 Too Many Requests
Clearnet doesn't work for me. Error 429 Too Many Requests from DDos-guard

Protection from DDOS attack was triggered. Now everything is working normally. Thanks to all testers Wink

Quote
which is from 0.001 up to 100 BTC. In case you sent us less than the minimum

Indeed, incorrect information is stated in the FAQ, at the moment the system limit for mixing is  temporarily reduced up to 10 bitcoins, you could see that when creating a new order, as well as when downloading a letter of guarantee. In the future, the mixing limit will be raised to the figures stated in the FAQ section.

Quote
Can you confirm that you actually own 100 BTC by signing an address?

No, I don't think it's a good idea to show anyone the addresses with the balances of the system, it's not a cryptocurrency exchange.

Quote
Perhaps you should fix it.

Everything has been fixed, thanks for your interest in the project!

Quote
The domain name is one word, very related to the mixing service. It can affect the feeling as if we know about this service from before.

Indeed, you are right! ][banned mixer] is a beautiful domain and very related to the mixing service!
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September 22, 2023, 12:07:01 AM
 #11

15836600 requests, it turns out we have competition... at first glance there wasn't any  Wink
That's something that surprised me, especially since this website is new, So what is your strategy that can be up to 15 million requests?. are you share on social media?

Everything has been fixed, thanks for your interest in the project!
So far the clearnet and onion browsers it's running normally. but the captcha still doesn't work, when I try to mix go straight to step 2

No, I don't think it's a good idea to show anyone the addresses with the balances of the system, it's not a cryptocurrency exchange.
that's a good idea. if you share your 100 btc, it will make people comfortable to use your service and not afraid of the money being taken away

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September 22, 2023, 07:30:15 AM
 #12

Quote
That's something that surprised me, especially since this website is new, So what is your strategy that can be up to 15 million requests?. are you share on social media?

I was surprised too. Immediately after the publication of the first post and 15 views, the project received 15 million requests. Obviously, the traditions of new projects meeting at the forum are as follows. Free stress test. The attack has not stopped. The system holds up, and that's fine.
As for social networks, if I made such a decision, the links will appear on the site.

Quote
So far the clearnet and onion browsers it's running normally. but the captcha still doesn't work, when I try to mix go straight to step 2

The captcha is not always activated and highlighted. The system works correctly. You can continue mixing.

Quote
that's a good idea. if you share your 100 btc, it will make people comfortable to use your service and not afraid of the money being taken away

There is a letter of guarantee for this. Anyone can prove mixing if needed. Never has the confirmation of funds capacity showed the reliability of the project.
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September 23, 2023, 12:38:28 PM
Last edit: September 23, 2023, 01:42:11 PM by tumbler.io
 #13

Thanks to all the customers who have already started using [banned mixer], and, of course, to those who carried out a DDoS attack on the system.
This experience helped to optimize the service and make it more secure. At the moment, the DDoS attack has ended after 3 unsuccessful attempts.
At the moment, the system has extensive functionality and provides reasonable conditions on the market:

- minimum service fee: 0.4% (0.2% in case of max discount)
- network fee: 0.0002 BTC
- minimum amount: 0.001 BTC
- payment delay: from 0 to 72 hours
- up to 10 addresses for payment
- extended discount system
- letter of guarantee

You are welcome to try [banned mixer]!

Clearnet: https://[banned mixer]
Tor Mirror: http://[banned mixer]
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September 25, 2023, 07:07:18 AM
 #14

Hello, I just came from your review campaign and found that you offer LIFETIME DISCOUNT

Since users will review a mixing service which enhances privacy, using LIFETIME DISCOUNT is bad for privacy as it can easily link all your current and future addresses, inputs and outputs, it's just like sharing a master public key.

Therefore, I am asking about the TUMBLER CODE as described on the site:

Quote
After each mixing operation the system generates a new TUMBLER CODE for you. We use a TUMBLER CODE to be sure that you will not get your funds back. The same code is used for the discount system. Please, keep it for your next orders and discounts. Notice that after each mixing, the TUMBLER CODE is new.


You claim to delete logs, but won't this code serve as a tool to track user transactions after deleting logs? and how can you be sure of this without revealing his inputs?

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September 25, 2023, 07:32:55 AM
 #15

Salut!
The [banned mixer] Bitcoin Mixer Review#1 was launched today!
I'm looking forward to reviews and ideas for improving the service from the participants.
At the end of the first round and the elaboration of ideas from the testers, a second round will be held, where new participants will also be able to engage.
Don't miss it! The author of the best review will receive the extra prize of 0.01 BTC from [banned mixer]!
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September 25, 2023, 12:06:41 PM
 #16

Before anything I would say welcome to Bitcointalk, a forum like no other where you can expect scrutiny from users with crypto awareness and always looking out for loopholes to fix/better a service and a whole lot of others that would be out for what they could benefit off these loopholes.

With your announcement came attention and haven’t visited the site, I must say I noted as Hugeblack on the log, code and lifetime reward. Clarifying that would speak loudly as to handling input and output data with respect to code linking, input/output handling and and the reward system.

Also, while this might blend,
Quote
Save your bitcoins from confiscation with the bitcoin tumbler
Bitcoins are mostly seized for fraudulent practices, crimes, and administrative breaches. If your coins are connected to any criminal activities, it’s bye-bye to your all so precious coins. It’s that simple!

I would like to flip the above and put the bottom ahead of the first statement like this;
Quote
Bitcoins are mostly seized for fraudulent practices, crimes, and administrative breaches. If your coins are connected to any criminal activities, it’s bye-bye to your all so precious coins. It’s that simple!

Save your bitcoins from confiscation with the bitcoin tumbler
This is just to paint a picture am getting and in no way to twist things but, a matter of clarification.

This gives the statement at my end, an arms open for transactions that fits into that category.

Am well aware that even without stating, those are some of the transactions that comes seeking mixing services and mixers can’t really differentiate which coins are legitimate or not as is the nature of bitcoin but, claim as in quote seems like such a bold move.
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September 25, 2023, 06:44:03 PM
 #17

Hello, I just came from your review campaign and found that you offer LIFETIME DISCOUNT
You claim to delete logs, but won't this code serve as a tool to track user transactions after deleting logs? and how can you be sure of this without revealing his inputs?
Quote
With your announcement came attention and haven’t visited the site, I must say I noted as Hugeblack on the log, code and lifetime reward. Clarifying that would speak loudly as to handling input and output data with respect to code linking, input/output handling and and the reward system.

Hello, Hugeblack, Mr.right85

the answer to your uneasy question about tumbler code will take some time.
It will appear here the nearest time.
I will try to dispel your doubts.
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September 25, 2023, 06:52:08 PM
 #18

the answer to your uneasy question about tumbler code will take some time.
It will appear here the nearest time.
I will try to dispel your doubts.
Just know that no mixer has ever given a satisfactory answer to this question. The first time I saw it asked, the mixer closed shortly after this question was asked.

LoyceV find the link!

LoyceV on the road Advertise here for LN Don't deal with this account (exception)
Advertise here for LN Tip my kids Exchange LN (20 coins). 1% fee. No KYC <€50/month
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September 25, 2023, 07:19:39 PM
 #19

the answer to your uneasy question about tumbler code will take some time.
It will appear here the nearest time.
I will try to dispel your doubts.
Just know that no mixer has ever given a satisfactory answer to this question. The first time I saw it asked, the mixer closed shortly after this question was asked.
LoyceV find the link!

I will post the answer, anyway. I think it will be useful for many.
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September 26, 2023, 02:59:56 AM
Last edit: September 26, 2023, 04:04:54 AM by tumbler.io
 #20

I apologize for the long replies, my attention was focused on something else.

The children are up to mischief again Smiley

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September 26, 2023, 03:36:06 AM
Last edit: September 26, 2023, 04:05:11 AM by tumbler.io
 #21

Thank you so much for not staying away. It is very important for me to get as many comments as possible from the forum members.

Quote
...
You claim to delete logs, but won't this code serve as a tool to track user transactions after deleting logs? and how can you be sure of this without revealing his inputs?

...
Just know that no mixer has ever given a satisfactory answer to this question. The first time I saw it asked, the mixer closed shortly after this question was asked.

As you have noticed, there is a discount system in [banned mixer] bitcoin mixer and at the same time, this mixer does not actually store any information about the amounts of deposits of its customers.

How does it work? Now I will try to explain everything from the beginning and without technical details...

All bitcoin mixers that do not use coinjoin technology use mixer codes. This is a necessary functionality so that their customers do not get their own coins back when they mix again.

When creating a new order, the system generates an address for the deposit and marks this address with a unique key - mixer code.
The client makes a deposit to this address and receives his unique mixer code.
In case of repeated mixing, he applies his mixer code, and the system excludes for payments all addresses that were used for the deposit by this client earlier.

If the bitcoin mixer uses a discount system, then, besides the mixer codes directly, the system must also store the total amount of all deposits for each individual mixer code!

Obviously, this is absolutely unacceptable and impermissible!

Why? Because under some unfortunate circumstances, the mixer database with all its codes created during the entire operation of the system will get into open access. Such a situation will disclose the following information to third parties:

- the total amount of all deposits during the entire operation of the system
- the total amount of all deposits for each mixer code - each client (after all, an ordinary bitcoin mixer needs to know what amount of discount each client should receive)

Therefore, even if the bitcoin mixer declares that its system deletes all logs, critical information about the total amount of deposits in the system for each client will remain.

Not very good... Hmm, but how does it work with [banned mixer]?

Everything is simple. [banned mixer] does not store information about its clients' deposits. All information is stored and encrypted in the tumbler code itself Smiley

simplified form
Tumbler Code = Reverse Encryption Algorithm ( Deposit key + Total amount )

That's why the tumbler code is updated after each mixing: updated information about the client's total deposit is sewn into it and securely encrypted.

After the client enters his tumbler code, [banned mixer] system will decrypt it, extract a tag from it that is associated with the addresses of his past deposits, extract the total amount of deposits and thus be able to use the discount system, risking nothing. Using this method, [banned mixer] system does not need to save any long-term logs, as it presumably happens in most mixing services that use short mixer codes and discount systems (based on logic and mathematics).

As for deposit address tags, in practice, these tags are stored in the system for no more than 7 days, since during this period all deposit addresses will be used by other users and "dust" is moved from the system.

The system deletes all information about orders 24 hours after the successful completion of the task, and all correspondence with the support service after 48 hours. The customers themselves store tumbler codes. Deposit address tags are all that remain in the system. And even this information is automatically deleted after a short time.

I don't seem to have forgotten anything. I will be glad to answer all your questions.
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September 26, 2023, 05:55:20 AM
 #22


Welcome to the forum 🇹‌🇺‌🇲‌🇧‌🇱‌🇪‌🇷‌.🇮‌🇴‌  Cool

Was trying to see what the internet has to say about you guys, and unfortunately, a search on [banned mixer] pings other mixers as can be seen by the screenshot..

If you have time on your hands to work on some SEO optimization  it will be nice to see you rank on the first page of Google with the "[banned mixer]" search  Smiley


 
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September 26, 2023, 06:36:35 AM
 #23

Quote
Welcome to the forum 🇹‌🇺‌🇲‌🇧‌🇱‌🇪‌🇷‌.🇮‌🇴‌  Cool

Thank you!

Quote
If you have time on your hands to work on some SEO optimization  it will be nice to see you rank on the first page of Google with the "[banned mixer]" search  Smiley

SEO optimization takes time. Smiley The work is in progress.
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September 26, 2023, 11:28:53 AM
 #24

Quote
If you have time on your hands to work on some SEO optimization  it will be nice to see you rank on the first page of Google with the "[banned mixer]" search  Smiley
SEO optimization takes time. Smiley The work is in progress.
My search in the browser is also the same as the post above, the name [tumbler io] without typing the [.] sign that I entered is in fourth place. This shows that SEO accuracy is still weak.



Does it take a long time to work on it?
Your answer is too simple. After I visited the tumber.io site, it didn't seem like it would take long because the web display wasn't too heavy.

 
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September 26, 2023, 01:00:05 PM
 #25

Thank you so much for not staying away. It is very important for me to get as many comments as possible from the forum members.
I don't seem to have forgotten anything. I will be glad to answer all your questions.
I have provided a detailed review of this service here ---> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5467984.msg62904448#msg62904448 , including above question and some suggestions.

1)after testing the service, I think you need to review the Tumbler Code. I did not use this code and made two shuffles after about 10 minutes. I got my coins from the same address I deposited to.

1) I did not find on the site what would happen if someone sent to the same old address after more than 24 hours, just a warning not to send.

3) You also need to look at the withdrawal fees as they are high. I do not know if it applies to all cases, but it is the experience of a user who has tried the service three times.

Other than that, everything is great and I enjoyed the experience.

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September 27, 2023, 06:38:46 PM
 #26

The  [banned mixer] Bitcoin Mixer Review#1  that was recently launched shows interesting results!

The testers team gathered by Royce777 is really professional.

There are some ideas that have already been implemented in hot pursuit, there are some shortcomings that have been identified, and they have already been fixed, there are moments where the testers themselves for some reason could not figure out the functionality.
I will wait for all 20 reviews to appear and show in the final post all the suggestions.
There are really interesting ideas, implementing which will take time.
For example, several people mentioned the lack of a night mode and, voila, it has already been implemented. Use it with pleasure!

I will definitely share all my thoughts after appearing of all the reviews!
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October 02, 2023, 09:14:30 AM
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 #27

The first round of the Review contest has almost neared the end - Royce777 is waiting to receive the last review.
Thus, the nearst days I will also choose the best review of the first round, although it will not be easy: many reviews are very cool.
This week it will be interesting for us in this thread to discuss a summary table of your suggestions and planned implementations - it is in motion at the moment.
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October 02, 2023, 07:10:47 PM
 #28

To be honest, user interface looks so good that I don't want to leave your website. Everything looks so nice, well-organized and colors are so well-chosen, it makes me calm when I scroll down and move on different pages. Great job! I hope that's not only me who feels like that but I really am captivated with this.

By the way, why you use mixer codes over coinjoin? What is the advantage/disadvantage? By the way, as I see, you offer so called premium level coins in exchange of higher fees. What if I send coins from wallet X to your mixer, choose Premium Level and deposit mixed coins directly on centralized exchange like Binance and Coinbase and then they mess up with me because their blockchain analyses partner company detected that coins are not clean. Let's imagine this case, what will happen in situation like this? Do you offer guarantee for premium coins on top exchanges like Binance and CB? I'm just curious.

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October 02, 2023, 09:45:39 PM
 #29

The first round of the Review contest has almost neared the end - Royce777 is waiting to receive the last review.
Thus, the nearst days I will also choose the best review of the first round, although it will not be easy: many reviews are very cool.
This week it will be interesting for us in this thread to discuss a summary table of your suggestions and planned implementations - it is in motion at the moment.

If you recognise constructive criticism and suggestions, then the review campaign can be considered effective. I have seen that some suggestions are repeated by several users, which is an obvious sign that it is important.
I forgot to emphasize in the review that you need more activities on other channels. Twitter and Telegram are probably mandatory, you are currently completely inactive there. Given that all your chat logs from support are deleted after 24 hours, then a network like Telegram is really necessary for more efficient support.

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October 03, 2023, 12:10:30 AM
Last edit: October 03, 2023, 01:08:22 AM by xLays
 #30

I just want to ask how a lifetime discount works, including how to redeem it and whether it involves a code. I'm asking because I'm one of the participants in the signature design contest and there are only three people who submitted an entry to the contest. This means that if the reward for the contest doesn't change, I'll be rewarded with a 40% lifetime discount for your service.

Also I see the terms from the contest:

Quote
When you apply you automatically agree that : ..Transferring the discount code that you receive to third parties and their subsequent generations is prohibited...

Does this mean I can't sell the code or give it away too (Just to make it clear)?

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October 03, 2023, 10:35:09 AM
 #31

Quote
By the way, why you use mixer codes over coinjoin? What is the advantage/disadvantage?

If I've understood your question correctly, it seems to be more along the lines of "why opt for the traditional mixing method instead of coinjoin?"
One of the primary reasons is that the coinjoin scheme itself is fairly transparent and tends to attract the attention of systems analyzing transactions, making it challenging to break away from existing patterns. Additionally, coinjoin transactions are quite rare; not every block contains such transactions. This makes it easier for interested companies to extract and analyze these specific transactions.
At the same time, traditional mixers can accommodate almost any type of transaction, such as the most popular and straightforward ones like "One-to-One" and "One-to-Two". In other words, the most frequently occurring combinations in blocks are precisely what traditional bitcoin mixers opt for, because the broader the transaction slice, the more challenging it becomes to analyze.
Another reason for choosing the classic system is that, with the right setup, one can achieve a high "Privacy score result for the transaction." It also allows for the use of a tumbler code to offer a discount to clients, which is a pleasant feature. In a couple of weeks, it is planned to conduct the Review #2 , where one of the focal points for testers will be the "Privacy score result for the transaction."

Quote
Twitter and Telegram are probably mandatory, you are currently completely inactive there. Given that all your chat logs from support are deleted after 24 hours, then a network like Telegram is really necessary for more efficient support.
Thank you immensely for the constructive suggestions and feedback. I truly don't wish to disappoint, but at this time, there are no plans to introduce additional communication channels.

Quote
Does this mean I can't sell the code or give it away too (Just to make it clear)?
Yes, you're absolutely right – the intention is that this code is solely for your use; it shouldn't be sold or passed on to third parties. And yes, it's completely secure: refer to the description on how the tumbler code is structured in the project in the above post.
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October 03, 2023, 03:26:49 PM
Merited by Symmetrick (1)
 #32

The  [banned mixer] Bitcoin Mixer Review#1  that was recently launched shows interesting results!

The testers team gathered by Royce777 is really professional.

There are some ideas that have already been implemented in hot pursuit, there are some shortcomings that have been identified, and they have already been fixed, there are moments where the testers themselves for some reason could not figure out the functionality.
I will wait for all 20 reviews to appear and show in the final post all the suggestions.
There are really interesting ideas, implementing which will take time.
For example, several people mentioned the lack of a night mode and, voila, it has already been implemented. Use it with pleasure!

I will definitely share all my thoughts after appearing of all the reviews!

It's great you already make improvements to your site after only reading a couple of reviews.
I was also lucky enough to be one of the participants and must say some of the reviews are top notch!

For the contest, I think the first review already, by user ratimov was very good. I didn't have the same problems he did, with the language switch, but the whole review was grade A quality.
Another 2 ones I enjoyed reading myself were written by BlackHatCoiner and Gladitorcomeback. They tested stuff I couldn't even think of, very informative.
I don't want to be in your shoes, it's a tough decision to choose a best review out of these.

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October 04, 2023, 01:07:54 AM
 #33

If you have time on your hands to work on some SEO optimization  it will be nice to see you rank on the first page of Google with the "[banned mixer]" search  Smiley
Yes, that is important, let's make it natural as Yomix did. I am not sure they use SEO to optimize it, I am really sure Yomix did it naturally because they are good in marketing. So if [banned mixer] want be o top searching let do the same what yomix did by create the signature campaign and masive marketing on social media. The important thing 1st is to make people believe if [banned mixer] is Trusted. So if people already believe, the ranking will be shifted to the top place naturally.

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October 04, 2023, 09:31:37 AM
 #34

If you have time on your hands to work on some SEO optimization  it will be nice to see you rank on the first page of Google with the "[banned mixer]" search  Smiley
Yes, that is important, let's make it natural as Yomix did. I am not sure they use SEO to optimize it, I am really sure Yomix did it naturally because they are good in marketing.


I would not agree that SEO ranking is such an important thing when we talk about mixer services. It can be useful, of course it's always good, but it's not crucial.
As the most obvious example, I would mention Chipmixer, which for the last few years has only worked with the TOR site without a clearnet site. By directly searching the chipmixer keyword, the original site was not even in the first 5 pages of the Google search engine. And yet they were quite dominant in the mixer industry.

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October 04, 2023, 01:21:59 PM
 #35

If you have time on your hands to work on some SEO optimization  it will be nice to see you rank on the first page of Google with the "[banned mixer]" search  Smiley
Yes, that is important, let's make it natural as Yomix did. I am not sure they use SEO to optimize it, I am really sure Yomix did it naturally because they are good in marketing.


I would not agree that SEO ranking is such an important thing when we talk about mixer services. It can be useful, of course it's always good, but it's not crucial.
As the most obvious example, I would mention Chipmixer, which for the last few years has only worked with the TOR site without a clearnet site. By directly searching the chipmixer keyword, the original site was not even in the first 5 pages of the Google search engine. And yet they were quite dominant in the mixer industry.
It's very hard topic to discuss about because there are solid arguments on both sides. The existence of clearnet site increases the chance of phishing and scamming. If you remove clearnet website and promote only onion link, the number of people falling scams will decrease, that's what chipmixer owner experienced and said at least.
But on another hand, why shouldn't mixer be available on clearnet? If all of your users are for illegal activities, sure, you don't need one but I assume if aim is to truly help  customers to remain anonymous and you care about your average users, then clearnet is necessary. It's especially necessary in the beginning to let your customers visit and see your website, average user is probably lazy enough to download and open Tor for that.

By the way, we don't actually know how much of a traffic comes from Google, Bing, Yahoo, DuckDuckGo and other search engines. So, it's hard to say, chipmixer existed so long that they were already known for the whole crypto world.


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blue Snow
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October 05, 2023, 12:01:14 AM
 #36

As the most obvious example, I would mention Chipmixer, which for the last few years has only worked with the TOR site without a clearnet site. By directly searching the chipmixer keyword, the original site was not even in the first 5 pages of the Google search engine. And yet they were quite dominant in the mixer industry.
So when we talk about that, Chipmixer was a popular site that has credible uses by people. They don't need that traffic Google search. because people already know that mixer is trust and reliable to use.

If you remove clearnet website and promote only onion link, the number of people falling scams will decrease,
The problem is, not many people can use that onion link, I admit that when try onion links where have a bad connection internet location. I have to back on the Clearnet link to access the mixer.

However, clearnet link is important. They must priority that link beside the onion link. because there are many normal people who only know how to use clearnet link, and never use onion link for his life once.

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October 10, 2023, 10:43:58 AM
 #37

If you have time on your hands to work on some SEO optimization  it will be nice to see you rank on the first page of Google with the "[banned mixer]" search  Smiley
Yes, that is important, let's make it natural as Yomix did. I am not sure they use SEO to optimize it, I am really sure Yomix did it naturally because they are good in marketing. So if [banned mixer] want be o top searching let do the same what yomix did by create the signature campaign and masive marketing on social media. The important thing 1st is to make people believe if [banned mixer] is Trusted. So if people already believe, the ranking will be shifted to the top place naturally.


To everything there is a season, blue Snow
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October 10, 2023, 10:55:18 AM
 #38

To everything there is a season, blue Snow
When will we hear responses to some of the comments made in the campaign review?
What changes may occur, especially to some points that everyone agreed upon, such as the mixing algorithm and withdrawal fees?

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October 18, 2023, 02:51:53 PM
 #39

I'm glad to inform you that the first round of Bitcoin Mixer Review is completed and a great job has been done, in the next message I will provide a complete list of all edits.
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October 18, 2023, 04:11:19 PM
Merited by Symmetrick (5), BlackHatCoiner (4), bitmover (3), AHOYBRAUSE (2), examplens (1), TryNinja (1), Learn Bitcoin (1)
 #40

The questions and suggestions from the testers of the first Review are collected below. I've tried to show most of them.

Ratimov

Quote
"The maximum value within one transaction is 10 BTC, which is not that much; many mixers allow you to exchange 50 BTC. To mix large amounts, you will have to additionally communicate with support."
⌛⌛⌛ After completing all tests, we're ramping up our mixing pool soon – bigger transactions are on the horizon.

Quote
"The mixer offers up to 10 addresses to add, and they support all address formats except Taproot."
✅✅✅ We've added Taproot support now, so you're all set for every address format.

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"The delay is dynamic and varies from 0 to 72 hours, which is not so much, considering that many services offer a delay of much more than 3 days, but I like that there is a breakdown here not only by hours, but also by minutes."
✅✅✅ Honestly, we've found that going beyond 72 hours doesn't make much difference.

Quote
"The weaknesses of this service are the inability to select the distribution of bitcoins by address in percentage terms, and there is also a lack of latency distribution for individual addresses."
✅✅✅ Just to clarify, since the inception of our service, we've actually had the feature to distribute bitcoins by address in percentage terms and to set latency distribution for individual addresses. Perhaps it might've been overlooked? Do check again, and let us know if you need any assistance navigating through it.

Quote
"I would also add an option for a random number of transactions, this will increase anonymity. Or you could choose how many transactions to split the bitcoins into."
✅✅✅ We've already implemented that feature. Now, our system distributes coins using 96 different sending patterns, and yep, that includes sending from various address types. We're all about upping that anonymity game.

Quote
"When you come to the mixer, select a language, then select mixing parameters, click on the Continue button, then the service, when you go to a new screen, resets your language settings and shows English by default. You have to select the language you need again."
✅✅✅ Thanks for pointing that out. We've fixed the issue, so your language preference should stick throughout the process now. Give it another go and let us know if everything's smooth.

Quote
"After creating a second separate transaction, the mixer on my first mixing produced the following error:.... What does it mean? Why did it arise? The service does not explain this in any way on the screen, you can only guess and write to support. Does the service really not like merged transactions, but no one explained this."
✅✅✅ Thanks for bringing this to our attention during the testing phase. We've now updated our platform to display descriptions for all potential errors, so users will have a clearer understanding of what's happening.

Quote
"I didn't actually send money to the deposit address more than twice, I sent it to a different address each time, but within the same transaction"
✅✅✅ Our system was initially set up to flag any non-standard behavior as a potential threat, leading to the transaction being marked as an error. Good news is, we've updated this. You can now send transactions and even increase the fee during the process. Our system won't mistake it for a double-spend, and your transaction will go through smoothly. Plus, if there's a transaction cancellation, your order will revert to its initial state, waiting for a new transaction. Hope this clears things up!

Quote
"Payment of commission to miners by the service is generous"
✅✅✅ We've made adjustments and corrected the overly generous miner fee.

Quote
"Order information expires after 24 hours, and chat history expires after 48 hours, although a feature could be added to force this history to be deleted immediately."
✅✅✅ Just a quick heads-up: we've now added a feature allowing clients to delete order information directly from the order page without waiting for the 24 hours to lapse.

Quote
"Just create a separate email for any questions and complaints, where I won’t need to remember and copy all sorts of links for chat. A separate email address is always more reliable than the internal service page."
❎ Thanks for the suggestion. However, based on the history of ChipMixer, email played a pivotal role in its shutdown. According to regulatory reports, ProtonMail might not be as anonymous and secure as many believe. So, for now, we won't be introducing email support to maintain the highest levels of security and anonymity. Hope you understand.

Quote
"I emphasize, precisely in expanded form, because the internal support chat on the mixer’s website only has a text version of the problem description;"
✅✅✅ We've completely revamped our internal chat. Lots of new features have been added, including automatic updates. We're always striving to make our platform more user-friendly and efficient.

Quote
"you can’t even attach a screenshot there."
❎ For security reasons, we don't plan to add the functionality to attach screenshots. Text-based messages provide a secure means of communicating with our support team, and we believe it's sufficient to convey any necessary information.

Quote
"Get an email account, create a telegram support, create several options for contacting service representatives so that I don’t have to remember these links for chat and at the same time keep the mixer page open to communicate with support and wait for answers."
❎ For the sake of security, we don't plan to support Telegram. Telegram's recent privacy policy changes involve disclosing user information, including IP addresses, upon regulatory request, which raises concerns about user privacy. We aim to prioritize the utmost privacy and security for our users.

Quote
"Next, I would like to note the meager set of external communication sources, which I already talked about in the Support section. There are only Twitter and Bitcointalk to choose from. Add Email, telegram, reddit, discord, anything that could increase the search and support for this service on the Internet."
❎ We currently do not intend to add any additional communication channels beyond our internal chat and Bitcointalk forum. This decision is rooted in our commitment to maintaining complete control over privacy for both us and our users. We believe this approach best aligns with our mission to provide a secure and anonymous service.

Quote
"Also, why is there no PGP fingerprint on the main page of the site?"
❎ There is no option to add the PGP fingerprint on the main page of the site without using Email for support. However, in case we need to sign any messages, we'll use the official Bitcoin address of the project - 1TUMBLRXHDjFZacmFLbuDn2Rw1rcPgacR.

Quote
"There is no referral program, but this is rather not a drawback, but a wish for the further addition of such an opportunity."
⌛⌛⌛ A referral program is on our roadmap for future additions. Your suggestion aligns with our plans for further enhancements.



Charles-Tim

Quote
"I noticed it is hard to slide those percentage to the accurate amount someone desires... ", "If possible the amount in percentage to be mixed into different addresses can be edited, it would be excellent, instead of using only fee slider."
✅✅✅ We've added a feature that allows you to use the left and right arrow keys on your keyboard to make more precise adjustments to the sliders in the mixing form. This should provide a more accurate way to set the desired percentage.

All other issues you've mentioned have already been addressed and resolved as described in the previous responses.



hugeblack

Quote
"Dark mode is not supported."
✅✅✅ We've added a dark mode feature. Now you can enjoy the service with a more comfortable viewing experience in low-light environments.

Quote
"Site does not work when JavaScript is disabled."
❎ We currently do not intend to implement that functionality because JavaScript is essential for the proper operation of the site. Additionally, JavaScript helps resolve various issues related to client anonymity and provides protection against DDoS attacks.

Quote
"Mixer don't have restore your order page based on TX-ID."
✅✅✅ A link to your order has been added to the guarantee letter. You can always revisit your order using this link, even after closing your browser tab.

Quote
"Remove discount system and LIFETIME DISCOUNT"
❎ We won't be removing the discount system and lifetime discount. Our system fully incorporates this functionality without compromising the anonymity of our clients. We've previously explained this feature in detail in our forum thread and discussed how the Tumbler code operates.

Quote
"Use ProtonMail to receive support requests."
❎ We don't plan to use ProtonMail for receiving support requests. Chipmixer previously used ProtonMail, but that project no longer exists.

Quote
"Add a lighter version that does not support JavaScript, such as ---> https://clean.[banned mixer]/"
❎ At the moment, we are not considering adding a lighter version that doesn't support JavaScript.

Quote
"Random service fee: The user usually chooses the lowest fee within Basic, Standard, Premium. Adding a forced random option within these levels will enhance privacy."
❎ Implementing a forced random option for service fees within the existing levels doesn't provide practical benefits, as we see that most users already choose service fees randomly to enhance privacy.

Quote
"You did not mention what will happen if the user deposits after 24 hours."
✅✅✅ A detailed response to this question has been added to the FAQ section on the project's website.

Quote
"Adding support for the Lightning Network"
❎ Support for the Lightning Network is not in our current considerations.

Quote
"Paying to a friend"
❎ We don't intend to include the 'Paying to a friend' feature in our services. This functionality is more similar to a cryptocurrency wallet feature, and our primary focus is on providing a different set of services.

Quote
"I noticed that when I received payments, the mixer was paying a lot of fees."
✅✅✅ We've made adjustments and corrected the overly generous miner fee.

Quote
"Unfortunately, this is very disappointing. I received the same coins that I sent when testing Basic, and this indicates that there is not enough stock of bitcoins or complete reliance on the tumbler code."
❎ Using the Tumbler Code is essential to avoid such issues. You can find information about it in various sections on our website.

All other issues you've mentioned have already been addressed and resolved as described in the previous responses.



AHOYBRAUSE

Quote
"The discount only start from 1 btc so I guess it’s not for the average user."
❎ There are projects with higher requirements for discounts, and we consider our rates to be reasonable.

Quote
"Mandatory transaction fee seems a bit high and could be dynamic."
❎ The minimum fee helps protect our pool from de-anonymization attacks. At the time of withdrawal, the fee is dynamic and is selected based on the Bitcoin network's current load.

Quote
"FAQ, even though explaining everything well, could be written better"
✅✅✅ We've made significant improvements to the FAQ section based on feedback from testers. It now contains a wealth of new information and clarifications to better assist users.

Quote
"It would be nice if the user can choose to change how many % would go to to how many addresses in a different way, by manual input for example."
❎ This feature has actually been available since the project's inception.

All other issues you've mentioned have already been addressed and resolved as described in the previous responses.



Learn Bitcoin

Quote
"The website UI looks good, but I was searching to switch to Night mode as I wouldn't say I like using bright screens."
✅✅✅ We've added a dark mode feature. Now you can enjoy the service with a more comfortable viewing experience in low-light environments.

Quote
"The problem is that users must copy and save their support page link."
✅✅✅ We've taken this into account and made improvements. Now, the link to your ongoing support conversation is duplicated on the chat page, making it easier for you to continue where you left off even if you close your browser tab.

All other issues you've mentioned have already been addressed and resolved as described in the previous responses.



SmartGold01

Quote
"The minimal deposit was little bit huge, I suggest the minimal deposit should be reduced and fit on 0.0005BTC or below..."
❎ The minimum deposit is an important part of our system's security measures, and we believe the current amount is set at an optimal level.

All other issues you've mentioned have already been addressed and resolved as described in the previous responses.



BlackHatCoiner

Quote
"You rely on javascript. I strongly recommend you to either let people audit the code of both your front-end and back-end, or get rid of javascript completely."
❎ JavaScript (JS) plays a crucial role in maintaining the security and anonymity of our project. Without JS, the level of anonymity and functionality we offer could not be fully realized. Perhaps some of the testers who attempted to assess our service, including DDoS testing, have gained a deeper appreciation for this technology. They may have also noticed specific technical aspects while interacting with our website. In a nutshell, JS enables anonymity for both us and our clients.

Quote
"You have not DNSSEC enabled, which can significantly reduce the risk of various DNS-based attacks, such as DNS spoofing, cache poisoning, and man-in-the-middle attacks."
⌛⌛⌛ I'm sorry, but our DNS provider (DDOS-Guard) currently does not support DNSSEC, although they have promised to add this feature in the future. We do not plan to transfer the domain to another DNS provider as we have not found a suitable candidate that meets all our requirements related to anonymity and security.

Quote
"You have not set the Content-Security-Policy header (which protects from cross-site scripting)."
✅✅✅ This conclusion is incorrect. We have implemented all the necessary security headers, including the Content-Security-Policy header, since the launch of our project. You can verify this here https://securityheaders.com/

Quote
"Was this written on the go? Looks sketchy."
✅✅✅ We've made significant improvements to our FAQ section, addressing any previous issues and adding new content. Additionally, we've corrected typos on the website to enhance user experience.

Quote
"A little while later, after waiting for confirmation, I got this:"
✅✅✅ Our system was initially set up to flag any non-standard behavior as a potential threat, leading to the transaction being marked as an error. Good news is, we've updated this. You can now send transactions and even increase the fee during the process. Our system won't mistake it for a double-spend, and your transaction will go through smoothly. Plus, if there's a transaction cancellation, your order will revert to its initial state, waiting for a new transaction.

Quote
Actual mixing. When the user receives mixed coins, they have to look mixed. That's the point of the mixer; to improve fungibility and privacy, and the manner to accomplish it is to make it difficult for outsiders to de-anonymize known-mixer outputs. However, there needs to be a discernible indicator that these coins indeed originated from a mixer, so that anyone attempting to trace them can give up.
✅✅✅ Our system distributes coins using 96 different sending patterns, and yep, that includes sending from various address types. We're all about upping that anonymity game.

Quote
"Security levels". The user has no manner to verify whatsoever how their "Premium" coins are more private; which is a lie in the first place as I demonstrated. Premium coins which I expected to withdraw on different addresses, were withdrawn with direct blockchain connection. Minimum privacy there."
✅ Please note that the funds you received were from an address with a much larger sum than you requested for withdrawal. By structuring our pool into levels and using various sources of coins, we aim to protect our pool from de-anonymization, making it more costly to attack. This approach enhances the overall security and privacy of our service.

Quote
"Pricing. Please explain me why each receiving address costs an additional 20,000 sat. Your fee range of 0.4% to 3.60% is quite reasonable. However, as you've acknowledged, I didn't receive an equally good product for the price I paid when comparing the "Basic" and "Premium" options."
✅ The minimum receiving address fee is "one of the methods" to protect our pools from de-anonymization, the primary function of which is to make such an attack as expensive as possible.

All other issues you've mentioned have already been addressed and resolved as described in the previous responses.



dkbit98

Quote
"Website design is ok, it's clean, and I didn't notice any big spelling mistakes, but first thing that caught my eye was Absolutely Reliable claim on main page. Either Tumbler has hired gipsy fortune teller or they have top secret time traveling machine when they are already claiming to have many positive customer reviews on forums, and they just recently started this service."
✅ It's a part of our SEO strategy! But believe us, in the future, it will be true.

Quote
"Note that after finishing my mixing I was presented with a button to write a review, and it was redirecting only to their bitcointalk forum topic."
✅ In addition to that, this button does not pass a referer, so your data remains secure (blocked at the security headers level and in the HTML code). Smiley

Quote
Fees page is saying that fees are smaller when larger amount of Bitcoin is sent for mixing, and they still boldly claim that for 100 or more BTC there is 50% discount and 0.20% service fee. I will have to say that I really suspect they have 100 or more Bitcoin, unless they are using other centralized services, but I will talk more about that later. When they first appeared in bitcointalk I asked them this question and I think they rchanged 100 btc claim to 10 btc in FAQ page, but it's still there in Fees page.
✅✅✅ A detailed response to this question has been added to the FAQ section on the project's website.

Quote
"This is where I received my first error or bug while I was testing Tumbler, and I was asked to refresh browser and continue."
✅ It's possible there was a connection interruption between your browser and our system's backend, and refreshing the page was a troubleshooting step to address this.

Quote
"I also want to use manual delete option for Support chat."
✅✅✅ We've added the option for manual deletion in the support chat.

All other issues you've mentioned have already been addressed and resolved as described in the previous responses.



stompix

Quote
"Checking the first tx I was so glad they overpaid 3x times, I looked at the topic, so what the first two members had to say and...I knew it. It had to be, I knew it was coming! The other tx had the exact fee, weight, virtual size!"
✅✅✅ The problem has been resolved.

Quote
"A bit inconvenient to recreate the order page, but a good thing to put it in the letter"
✅✅✅ A link to your order has been added to the guarantee letter. You can always revisit your order using this link, even after closing your browser tab.

Quote
"...issues with replaced transactions, needs to be fixed"
✅✅✅ The problem has been resolved.

Quote
"I'm a bit concerned about those tumblers codes, how does it track the amount mixed?"
✅ We have provided a detailed explanation of how it works and why it is secure in our forum post.

All other issues you've mentioned have already been addressed and resolved as described in the previous responses.



TryNinja

Quote
"Many positive customer reviews on forums speak about [banned mixer]'s reliability and solid reputation." -> maybe link some of them, otherwise it doesn't matter what you say."
✅ It's a part of our SEO strategy! But believe us, in the future, it will be true.

Quote
"what about warning people about the risk of using a third party proxy middleman and maybe recommend users to use the Tor mirror?"
⌛⌛⌛ We'll consider adding a convenient notification, but at the moment, we don't see a way to do it without compromising the usability of the site.

Quote
"A question about the tumbler code: How do you keep track of which coins are related to that user? For example, I send from my address X to your mixer address A. Then I come back later and mix again with my code. How do I *NOT* get the coins from mixer address A? If you're saving that information on your database, isn't this a privacy issue?"
✅ The Tumbler code is stored with the user themselves. The code = Reverse Encryption Algorithm ( Deposit key + Total amount ). We do not store deposit amount data and can determine a customer's discount based on the information they provide to us. We have provided a detailed explanation of how it works and why it is secure in our forum post.

Quote
"I believe coins should move around a little bit more before they are sent straight to a new customer."
✅✅✅ We have added protection, which means that for a certain period, the user will not receive their coins back, even without using the Tumbler code.

Quote
"All transactions had their change address identified by Blockchair, maybe because a 3-type address sent to a 1-type address and the change was also a 3-type address?"
✅✅✅ We've already implemented that feature! Now, our system distributes coins using 96 different sending patterns, and yep, that includes sending from various address types.

Quote
"For a third mix, I tried sending coins and then cancelling my tx though RBF. It was detected after some time and a message showed up: "An error occurred during order processing. Please "contact support (what if I resend it? Nothing showed up, so I cancelled it again)."
✅✅✅ We've now updated our platform to display descriptions for all potential errors, so users will have a clearer understanding of what's happening. Plus, if there's a transaction cancellation, your order will revert to its initial state, waiting for a new transaction.

Quote
"I wanted to try something different, so after noticing that there was no captcha required on the order page, I wrote a script that brute forces sessions as an attempt to find someone else’s randomly. Assuming a order id format "XXXXXXXX-XXXXXX" and 36 characters (A-Z/0-9), there was 36^14 possible ids. Maybe too much? Still, I wanted to try. Grin"

👓 The ORDER-ID is generated independently of any database connection, allowing for the creation of at least 1.000.000.000 unique IDs without impacting the system's performance. It simply generates a valid ID with a signature for your 'future' session using an algorithm-based approach without database involvement. We closely monitored your attempted attack. In the event of a CSRF breach and the initiation of a mass order creation, our protection mechanisms would have been activated, resulting in a denial of service. Additionally, an automatic captcha would have been triggered. Nevertheless, we appreciate your stress test, which has led to many optimizations.

Furthermore, IP blocking based on excessive requests is inherently present but currently disabled. We were curious to see where you would end up Smiley

Currently, the system is equipped to handle high loads with cluster support and includes features to protect against and filter out malicious traffic. Therefore, there is a possibility that we may no longer need the services of DDOS-Guard in the future.

Quote
"You're new, of course, but put an avatar and card on your twitter account so you don't look inactive and careless (Grin): https://twitter.com/tumbler_io"
⌛ According to our task queue, in the future, we plan to add an avatar to the Twitter/X account.

Quote
"Extra suggestion: let people deposit multiple times before they receive their coins. For example, I can send 0.001 BTC from my address A to your deposit address X + send 0.003 BTC from my address B to your deposit address Y. My output will be 0.001 + 0.003 = 0.004 BTC. This makes it so the output can also be higher than a single input transaction (A alone, or B alone)."
✅✅✅ We have created over 90 transaction sending patterns, each of which operates based on various mixing conditions.

Quote
What happens if the transaction takes longer than that to confirm?
✅✅✅ We have added extensive clarifications to the FAQ section regarding your inquiries related to order timing

All other issues you've mentioned have already been addressed and resolved as described in the previous responses.



Gladitorcomeback

Quote
"A good mixer/tumbler didn't keep any type of history for long time to secure whole process. [banned mixer] keeping transaction history for 24 hours support history for 48 hours which is not good where as other competitors/mixers not keeping any log. The good thing is that we can delete this history anytime we want but automatic delete should ne reduce to atleast 24 hours."
✅✅✅ We have added the option for users to delete their tickets and information about their orders themselves.

Quote
"Review: [banned mixer] customer support is not good enough while some other mixers have very fast support services which also provide telegram support , fast enough and available 24/7."
✅ We have a system for evaluating the performance of our support team, and we will strive to improve our support system over time to provide better service.

Quote
"Only using 3 address which is easy to track which mixers used."
✅✅✅ We have created over 90 transaction sending patterns, each of which operates based on various mixing conditions.

Quote
"Over all fee is much high"
✅✅✅ The problem has been resolved.

Quote
"Sending btc after 24 would be considered loan, why not refund?"
✅✅✅ After 24 hours, if we haven't received deposit information, the order is deleted, including the deposit address and its private key. In other words, a refund becomes impossible. Added to FAQ.

Quote
"No captcha at the start which could lead to DDOS attack."
✅ The protection will only be activated in the event of an attack, we do not disrupt the use of the service unnecessarily.

All other issues you've mentioned have already been addressed and resolved as described in the previous responses.



bitmover

Quote
"As you might know, when chipmixer was seized they also got their hard drives with lots of information.  I am curious about what information do you keep associated with Tumbler Code. It could be nice to share what kind of information is stored."
✅ We have provided a detailed explanation of how it works and why it is secure in our forum post.

Quote
"I suggest to upgrade all deposit addresses to native segwit format, bech32 (starting with bc1..) so everyone save money in fees."
✅✅✅ We have changed the deposit address to bech32 format, and payments may also come from other types of addresses.

Quote
"Blockchair identified the change address and classified the transaction privacy as Critical."
✅✅✅ We have analyzed all Blockchair patterns and made the necessary adjustments.

All other issues you've mentioned have already been addressed and resolved as described in the previous responses.



examplens

Quote
"If we talk about dark mode, I think that black (HEX #000000) is not an ideal solution, or at least it should have one more shade."
✅ This is sepia color, we simply "inverted" the original colors.

Quote
"I believe you already know about the negative impact of anonymity when there is an intermediary between your service and the user. However, why choose DDoS-Guard, when they have a rather bad reputation?"
✅ We believe it's an excellent service operating in the "right" jurisdiction.

Quote
"When you say that you delete all logs within 24 hours at the latest, can you be sure that DDoS-Guard also not collecting any data?"
✅😁✅ By choosing DDOS-Guard, we are absolutely sure it's not CloudFlare Smiley

Quote
"AML Bot recognized the address from which I received Bitcoin as a low-risk score. Well, even though I chose almost the lowest level of anonymization, it seems satisfactory. Again, I leave open the question of how adequate AMLBot is."
✅ Our platform is not designed for satisfactory results in systems like AMLBot.
Conduct an experiment, connect 10 different addresses of yours with another 10 new addresses in your wallet in one transaction, after which each address in your wallet will have a 97% risk according to AMLBot's assessment. In this case, the AMLBot system will think that you were trying to use CoinJoin technology. Do you think this is a fair risk assessment?

All other issues you've mentioned have already been addressed and resolved as described in the previous responses.



Bitcoin_Arena

Quote
"In fact, such details should put somewhere more visible and not hidden at the bottom where one has to scroll a whooping 14 pages down in order to see the bottom. It should be around 2 pages maximum."
😳😷😊 - SEO part.

Quote
"DDoS protection service. The service uses DDoS Guard to protect itself against DDoS attacks, which can turn out to be a loophole in the future for a service that promises its customers ultimate privacy. With the dangers DDoS Guard could pose, I think you should look for alternative ways. Better safe than sorry."
✅ We consider DDOS-Guard to be a very good service. It is better than its competitors that are located in questionable jurisdictions.

Quote
"The support for other available languages is pretty good, except for the Terms and Privacy."
❎ We do not plan to translate the Terms and Privacy (at least for now).

Quote
"Once the 24 hours have passed, this order page should expire or the deposit address should be hidden if it has not received any deposit with instructions to the user to start the mixing process afresh. Refreshing it bring this error message, which is persistent. Please fix"
✅ It's possible there was a connection interruption between your browser and our system's backend, and refreshing the page was a troubleshooting step to address this. In the future, there are improvements intended for the part that manages this connection.

Quote
"I am not really satisfied with how the coins are mixed and can easily help the Chainalysis experts or services connect the dots without much effort."
✅✊✅ We disagree with you. Currently, our mixing algorithms and payout patterns are the most advanced in the market. In the event of an order, with the recommended mixing settings, you would encounter significant difficulties with de-anonymizing your new addresses as an analyzer.

All other issues you've mentioned have already been addressed and resolved as described in the previous responses.



Trofo

Quote
"Why is there a need for captcha? Never seen that on mixer before. Are there bots using mixing services and even if there are why would that be a problem if they are paying same fees."
✅ Captcha is automatically enabled in case of an abnormal number of new orders.

Quote
"Backend needs a lot of work to reach the level of best mixers out there. First there is a feeling like there should be much more funds available."
⌛⌛⌛ Once we're done with all the testing, we'll be boosting our mixing pool.

Quote
"Would also like to read much more about how actual mixing works (what is happening with our BTC on Tumbler wallets)."
⌛⌛ In future updates, we will add more technical information to our website about how mixing works.

All other issues you've mentioned have already been addressed and resolved as described in the previous responses.



Hamza2424

Quote
"While Reviewing the Mixed coins privacy I would like to add that the privacy level of the mixed coins on the Basic standard is average, it made a score of 60 points and easily got tracked, and immediately Blockchain linked both my receiving addresses I think it could have been more efficient if we had increased the transaction delay."
✅✅✅ We have analyzed all Blockchair patterns and made the necessary adjustments.

Quote
"First of I would like to mention that there's a bug in the support chat."
✅✅✅ The problem has been resolved. The chat has been completely redesigned.

All other issues you've mentioned have already been addressed and resolved as described in the previous responses.



Wind_FURY

All other issues you've mentioned have already been addressed and resolved as described in the previous responses.



GeorgeJohn

All other issues you've mentioned have already been addressed and resolved as described in the previous responses.



Potato Chips

Quote
"I guess there is no video."
⌛⌛⌛ Video is in development. Deadline is by the end of the year.

Quote
"Another thing I noticed is the big/inflated claims which I’m not a fan of."
✅✅✅ We have corrected many texts.

Quote
"To improve this, I would suggest showing an “invalid address” error next time so it’s more clear for the end user."
✅✅✅ We've now updated our platform to display descriptions for all potential errors, so users will have a clearer understanding of what's happening.

Quote
"Furthermore, the change address from my first mix was used for my second mix."
✅✅✅ The sending system has been revamped.



Faisal2202

Quote
"You guys should add the total receiving amount too when we increase the number of receiving addresses. You can add that section right there where I marked red. It will come more handy while keeping track of how much we are paying on fee and how much we are going to receive in total. I had to use a calculator. I know none of the other Mixers I have experienced, have this feature besides just a simple fee calculator, but it will be super comfy and UI will become more user-friendly."
✅✅✅ We have added the feature you recommended. Now, you can see the total receiving amount when you increase the number of receiving addresses. We hope this makes tracking your payments and fees more convenient.

Quote
"It would be great if we would manually write the percentage to allocate to each address (when we add more then one receiving addresses). But most of the mixer don't have this feature too, I think its on purpose. And just to add, I really liked the strategy of not allowing users to divide the amount into equal parts like in 50% 50% parts. No matter how much I tried but we can't divide them in equal parts. First I thought that's due to the slider but later I came to remember that they have already wrote on their website that..."
✅✅✅ We've added a feature that allows you to use the left and right arrow keys on your keyboard to make more precise adjustments to the sliders in the mixing form. This should provide a more accurate way to set the desired percentage.

Quote
"Whenever I write something and want to send it I have to click on the send button, while it should also be done by clicking enter key on the keyboard, it also did not work with shift+Enter. Which means, we have to click via mouse on the send option."
⌛⌛⌛ We appreciate your suggestion, and we plan to add the functionality to send messages by pressing the Enter key on the keyboard in the future. Your input helps us improve the user experience.

Quote
"We all know that, Twitter has rebranded to "X" even though the domain is not changed yet, but the Logo is changed in all over the world. So, you should also use the up-to-date logo of Twitter (opps), of "X" in the bottom. Acceptance of new changes increase impression."
✅✅✅ We have updated the logo for "X", to ensure it is current and accurate, as you suggested.

Quote
"A link can be given for users to direct go to the page you are referring to, Because it will be hard for newbies to search about Tumbler on BTT. More ease for the users will show more devotion and users will feel comfy with you."
✅✅✅ We have added links to the service thread on the BitcoinTalk forum for easier access and convenience for our users.

Quote
"I think you guys are trying to say --> Send the BTC to the address while you wrote "Send the transfer to the address." It is really very confusing while reading the website content, please correct it."
✅✅✅ The sentence has been corrected.

Quote
"Your website name is [banned mixer] <-- last io are in small letters, but in your website content, you wrote io as IO (in capital letters) which seems to be unprofessional and not really good too. I suggest you guys to use the io everywhere. It would also help to rank your main keyword."
✅✅✅ We have corrected these details in the website text.





Thanks to all the testers, we've tried to resolve all possible issues, and a tremendous amount of work has been done.
We look forward to the second round of testing!
Thank you all!
Faisal2202
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October 18, 2023, 05:06:07 PM
 #41

Thanks to all the testers, we've tried to resolve all possible issues, and a tremendous amount of work has been done.
We look forward to the second round of testing!
Thank you all!
I am amazed to see the work you guys have put and I can see the devotion, I am excited to use this mixer again, with all new improvements. I am very happy to hear that, my suggestions were of great help. Your feedback meant a lot, I don't think I see something like this before. You guys did great work. And keep the spirits up  Wink

..cryptomus..   
  
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lllllllllllllllllll CRYPTO
PAYMENT GATEWAY
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ACCEPT
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PAYMENTS
..GET STARTED..
AHOYBRAUSE
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Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform


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October 18, 2023, 05:55:37 PM
 #42

The site definitely shows a lot of improvement now, great work.

It is also nice to see that you took all the suggestions and tried to implement them as best as possible. We also appreciate the update here.
As Faisal stated, I have also never seen so much work put into something after asking for some reviews here. That really shows your devotion.


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..PLAY NOW..
tumbler.io (OP)
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October 19, 2023, 07:09:52 PM
 #43


[banned mixer] launches the [banned mixer] Mixer Review#2!
Leave your applications and take part.
We are looking forward to confirming the list of members.
Good luck to all the applicants!
BlackHatCoiner
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October 19, 2023, 07:35:13 PM
 #44

JavaScript (JS) plays a crucial role in maintaining the security and anonymity of our project. Without JS, the level of anonymity and functionality we offer could not be fully realized.
Could you please explain how front-end Javascript enhances user's anonymity? As far as I know, it can only hurt it: https://tor.stackexchange.com/a/21987. And if you don't mind, how it protects the server's anonymity?

This conclusion is incorrect. We have implemented all the necessary security headers, including the Content-Security-Policy header, since the launch of our project. You can verify this here https://securityheaders.com/
Apologies. You have indeed implemented Content Security Policy:
Quote from: Firefox developer tools, from the onion site
content-security-policy
default-src 'self'; script-src 'self' 'unsafe-inline' 'unsafe-eval'; style-src 'self' 'unsafe-inline'; object-src 'none'; media-src 'self'; img-src 'self' data: 'unsafe-inline'; frame-src 'none'; font-src 'self'; connect-src 'self'

Please note that the funds you received were from an address with a much larger sum than you requested for withdrawal. By structuring our pool into levels and using various sources of coins, we aim to protect our pool from de-anonymization, making it more costly to attack. This approach enhances the overall security and privacy of our service.
The funds I received in the second mixing were literally taken by the change of the first mixing. That is absolutely unacceptable if I'm requesting from your service to have my coins received in multiple addresses. The whole point of using multiple addresses (AKA, split mixing), is to not reveal common ownership.

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dkbit98
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October 20, 2023, 06:00:12 PM
 #45

[banned mixer] launches the [banned mixer] Mixer Review#2!
Leave your applications and take part.
We are looking forward to confirming the list of members.
Good luck to all the applicants!
Are there any significantly big changes and improvements with your service from last time you organized review campaign?
First review campaign was only few months ago if I remember correctly.

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October 20, 2023, 07:20:38 PM
 #46

❎ Using the Tumbler Code is essential to avoid such issues. You can find information about it in various sections on our website.
Since it will not be removed, is there a guarantee that the lifetime discount does not affect privacy.

The problem was that I did the mixing process twice, two minutes apart. I completed the first, and after two minutes, a new mixing process began with the same value as the previous one. The problem was that I got my coins from the address of the previous mixing process. In other words, you either have a software problem or you have a problem with the reserves.



I have visited the site and there are updates, will try to test it again and I wish you success.

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AHOYBRAUSE
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October 21, 2023, 02:07:11 AM
 #47

[banned mixer] launches the [banned mixer] Mixer Review#2!
Leave your applications and take part.
We are looking forward to confirming the list of members.
Good luck to all the applicants!
Are there any significantly big changes and improvements with your service from last time you organized review campaign?
First review campaign was only few months ago if I remember correctly.

Actually the first review campaign was exactly 3 weeks ago, not a few months.
And yes, they made a lot of changes already, I had a quick look some days ago and many addressed problems have been given improvements.

I also applied for the 2nd review campaign, maybe I can test it again but if not that's fine.


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October 21, 2023, 03:30:50 AM
Last edit: October 21, 2023, 05:37:25 AM by tumbler.io
 #48

I apologize for the delays in responses; to be honest, project tasks take precedence at the moment.



Quote
BlackHatCoiner,
Could you please explain how front-end Javascript enhances user's anonymity? As far as I know, it can only hurt it: https://tor.stackexchange.com/a/21987. And if you don't mind, how it protects the server's anonymity?

JavaScript plays a crucial role in the operation of our service. Apart from handling backend security against DDoS attacks, complicating the creation of phishing sites, and enhancing usability, the use of JavaScript allows us to maintain a "competitive advantage in terms of security and anonymity" for both us and our clients. Security experts, upon a thorough "review" of the project, will understand the specifics of what is being discussed. It doesn't make sense to publicly disclose all the security methods of our project.

Quote
BlackHatCoiner,
The funds I received in the second mixing were literally taken by the change of the first mixing. That is absolutely unacceptable if I'm requesting from your service to have my coins received in multiple addresses. The whole point of using multiple addresses (AKA, split mixing), is to not reveal common ownership.

As mentioned earlier in the report, we have made changes to this section. Now, for a specified period, deposit funds are temporarily held for all clients.

Quote
dkbit98,
Are there any significantly big changes and improvements with your service from last time you organized review campaign?
First review campaign was only few months ago if I remember correctly.

@icopress ...

Quote
hugeblack,
Since it will not be removed, is there a guarantee that the lifetime discount does not affect privacy.

We have provided a detailed explanation of how the Tumbler code operates in previous messages. Unlike the "conventional" approach, our method is secure.

Quote
hugeblack,
The problem was that I did the mixing process twice, two minutes apart. I completed the first, and after two minutes, a new mixing process began with the same value as the previous one. The problem was that I got my coins from the address of the previous mixing process. In other words, you either have a software problem or you have a problem with the reserves.

As mentioned in the report earlier, we have made changes to this section. Now, for a specified period, your deposit funds are temporarily locked for all clients.

Before, if you didn't use the tumbler code and sent coins in a similar amount to a prior deposit, your coins could be selected for payment to another client, possibly you.
and this is perfectly reasonable, logical, and correct...

Quote
AHOYBRAUSE,
I also applied for the 2nd review campaign, maybe I can test it again but if not that's fine.

Thank you for your previous review. Like all our other contributors, you've played a part in improving our project Smiley
Now, we'd like to hear feedback from new testers.
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October 22, 2023, 05:58:24 AM
Last edit: October 22, 2023, 06:11:50 AM by tumbler.io
Merited by mikeywith (2)
 #49

The questions and suggestions from the testers of the first and second Review are collected below.



Faisal2202

Quote
"Whenever I write something and want to send it I have to click on the send button, while it should also be done by clicking enter key on the keyboard, it also did not work with shift+Enter. Which means, we have to click via mouse on the send option."

✅✅✅ Added this feature.



mikeywith

Quote
Leave us a message
An error has occurred. Please refresh the page and try again.

✅✅✅ This error might occur if you try to leave a page while a form is still loading. We've added a warning to address this situation.

Quote
The (Please, download the letter of guarantee before a transfer) is hardly noticeable, it must be more visible than the deposit information.

✅✅✅ We added an icon to highlight this text Smiley

Quote
- The tumbler code is somewhere at the bottom of this page, very easy to miss if you don't scroll down and honestly I almost forgot about it since my attention was on the deposit process, the page has a ton of blank space at the top, alongside the logo and steps icons at the top, all of which are taking a lot of "wasted" space

-I think this page should be squeezed to fit a single screen without having to scroll down, where everything needed (Letter of Guarantee + Deposit status + tumbler code appears in the same height level without needing to scroll)

✅❎ We use adaptive web design to ensure pages look consistent in modern browsers our clients use. Usability tests guided information block placement. We'll keep testing new layouts, potentially modifying some blocks in the future.

Quote
No easy way of entering the order number should one close the page by mistake, if someone doesn't pay enough attention to the URL which contains the order number /order#JTPFXE5B-ABCDE then it will be hard for them to go back to the same order without contacting the support team.

✅✅✅ The full page address is repeated in the letter of guarantee. A separate page for entering the order ID seems unnecessary to us.

Quote
1. Despite receiving the transaction the timer is still running on the order page as if it's still yet to come.
2. However, the timer on the website is showing 1h.17mins (not sure why)

❎ ! Unable to reproduce this error. There may have been connection interruptions between your browser and our website.

Quote
The warning that says after the deposit is made:
If one of the outputs has a round value (like exactly 0.1 BTC) — this output can be considered as the recipient. Instead of sending 0.1 BTC, send for example 0.100124.

Is pretty useless at this point, it should show on the first page, and then again on the top of the deposit page not at the bottom, now since you can't control what the user sends, you could at least control what you send by slightly modifying your 0.0002 BTC fee to make it in a dynamic range of say 0.000015 - 0.0002

✅✅✅  We cannot and should not alter the final incoming amount.
If a user wishes to receive exactly 0.001, it is their choice. We merely provide a warning about how such a transfer will be treated.
For instance, if they need to pay for a service that requires an exact amount, altering it would cause problems.

! Additionally, the calculator is available at every mixing stage, providing a warning about the recommended transfer amount just before the transfer.

Quote
1- You consolidated 3 smaller outputs that were not needed

✅✅✅ I don't find anything suspicious. In fact:

1. I can't identify the recipient here (similar to Blockchair).
2. This isn't the usual mixer behavior; typically, it follows a 1-2 pattern.

Excellent work! Smiley

Quote
This input > bc1qkpgugjv55lp0my23m0txn0azww5rvxwyf8qh5p of 0.00022350 is clearly the change address of this transaction
https://blockchair.com/bitcoin/transaction/29cecb7abf2b2455ac842f0f2ca20bc64eeafa650244f100dc2ec248549de845
Which came from this address bc1qmtxzrvnzr3ryak5jeprz3eqqsgpq9t4hzvd2g5

✅✅✅ You know that you used a mixer, so it's likely to assume that the addresses from which the funds were received also belong to the mixer and could have been used for payouts before, possibly including you.
Still, it's very suspicious, possibly a negative experience. Noted. Wink  Grin

Quote
I don't like the security level options, it's complicated for the average user, and there should be only one type of mixing, a mixing that works, and the fees to be different only in regards to the outgoing transaction network fee, not that actually privacy result.
✅✅✅ We believe it's a great feature. More details are available in the FAQ section.

Quote
The website should be translated into more languages, personally, I'd like to see it support Arabic.
⌛⌛⌛ Added to the task list.
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October 24, 2023, 01:06:55 AM
 #50

1. I can't identify the recipient here (similar to Blockchair).

You certainly can for the transactions that had these 3 small inputs, in other words, you revealed the recipient address of my first mix.

more details:

This was my first mix

https://blockchair.com/bitcoin/transaction/29cecb7abf2b2455ac842f0f2ca20bc64eeafa650244f100dc2ec248549de845

this was my address

Code:
bc1qpshee3qva79zxqllgm8z7lxtk556793c4crhkj

and this was the change address owned by you

Code:
bc1qkpgugjv55lp0my23m0txn0azww5rvxwyf8qh5p

up to this point, it's very difficult to tell which address was the change address.


And then there is this mix (not mine)

https://blockchair.com/bitcoin/transaction/6d08da9665e39843ffd02d67d544e030f8ca3e4f82910a74299debbe13bab0ae

and this (not mine)

https://blockchair.com/bitcoin/transaction/4b376658c9932523c06055facd620cfe243042bfc51e6697249467fbaf194f9f


All the way before the last transaction, we had no way of telling what the change address was for all of these 3 mixes, but now after this transaction

https://blockchair.com/bitcoin/transaction/c9a3b09f602b02c433f11fed1e5cc5c1e1207c8c71b34539b0e01445eb04f2db

We know that these 3 inputs belong to the same person, and thus in all of the 3 previous transactions the other 3 addresses were not the change addresses.

So now I know this address

bc1qpweug4vt3pqxfyrl48huppeuhy0xl59c235jxh

and this address

bc1qscpqkpclc6vrucwfmznfzpak4r8942xhvcc2w4

were the recipients of those two transactions, you revealed this piece of info to me for no apparent good reason (or at least one which I don't see).

had you not consolidate those 3 inputs in a mixed transaction that I received, I wouldn't be able to tell the change address of the other 2 addresses (which I don't own)

Obviously, I don't know of other ways to consolidate those small inputs on-chain without revealing the same thing, eventually, when they are consolidated you would reveal the change address of all the other transactions in the same manner, it would just be harder to analyze this information had you waited a little longer before consolidating.

Furthermore, the transaction behavior itself looks suspicious, a normal transaction from a normal wallet would have only included the large input which was larger than the desired output, and the 3 smaller outputs were not even enough to match that anyway.

I do understand that most mixing isn't done so that nobody can tell it's a mixer transaction, the goal is to break the connection between the coins you send and the coins you receive, which you did manage to achieve based on my analysis, I just think that if someone is digging deeper to find out all of this info, it would be wiser to make things more difficult for them even by a small degree.

 



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October 24, 2023, 02:26:54 AM
 #51

Quote
BlackHatCoiner,
Again, not strong anonymity.

First off, we're not a CoinJoin mixer.
We operate on a client-to-client basis.
When a user opts for the "premium" level, investor coins are added to the pool.
Let's make a note of that!

Next, I'm not quite following your suggestions regarding improving anonymity.

Our current mixer setup completely severs the connection between your coins.
You might see past transactions from the payout address, but those aren't your coins, right?

Let me let you in on a "secret": when using the Tumbler code, you're guaranteed not to receive your own coins back, even after a thousand "payout-change" iterations.
Even if your coins were partially transferred to another client, using the Tumbler code ensures you'll never get back the coins that remained in the service as change. To me, that sounds pretty fantastic, not "not strong anonymity".

You're deeply mistaken if you think you can achieve the same level of anonymity just using your own wallet. Mathematically, it's just not possible.

First off, our current mixer pool already contains hundreds of addresses with various balances. After testing, that number will soar into the thousands. Try mixing any amount different from your last transaction, and you'll see entirely different addresses. Of course, when testing with amounts like 0.001 BTC, the service won't pay you from an address with a 1 BTC balance. It adjusts according to your amount. In this context, it's plausible that without using the Tumbler code, you might come across your old address someday.

The solution is in place; for maximum anonymity, use the Tumbler code.

THE ESSENCE OF A GOOD MIXER IS TO HAVE A LARGE COIN POOL AND A SYSTEM THAT PROPERLY DISTRIBUTES COINS AMONG CLIENTS.

At present, we only use 10 BTC, but after testing, we'll SIGNIFICANTLY expand the pool. As for the system, it's fully implemented.

From what I gather, you suggest a "payout -> coinjoin -> payout" scheme? That's a pretty bad idea. Not a single verified exchange will accept your coins. The UniJoin mixer already operates on this scheme: after mixing with them, your coins will instantly be flagged with a 97% risk on the AML bot and similar systems, marked as "COINJOIN". CoinJoin schemes are easily detected, and such coins will attract undue attention. Tx.

You've got the MixTum mixer in your signature. I assume nobody forced you to promote that particular mixer, so it's a conscious choice, right? Did you test it before showcasing it in your signature? That mixer sources its payouts from the Huobi exchange, and what's more, all client payouts come from a single address with a "large balance", until it's depleted. Test it for yourself – due to the significant initial balance, you can track their payout history for several weeks! Is that what you call anonymity?

And with that, I'm directly addressing your question about the 0.0002 BTC fee for each receiving address.

In our case, to get a list of all our current addresses (to stage an attack on our pool), one would need to make hundreds of orders with different amounts, paying roughly $5+ for each payout, plus the service fee (and that wouldn't even scratch a tenth of our pool post-testing). Given that different security levels have separate coin pools, such an attack becomes extremely costly. No analytics-type organization will bother with that.
Using your mixer as an example: to de-anonymize all its users in recent weeks, it would take $10-20, right?

Trust us, we've explored all possible operational methods, scrutinized "every competitor" out there.
Our current system is the only one that truly works without any harmful side effects, and most importantly,
it's a real thorn in the side for analytic companies.
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October 24, 2023, 03:07:38 AM
Last edit: October 24, 2023, 03:57:29 AM by tumbler.io
 #52

Quote
I do understand that most mixing isn't done so that nobody can tell it's a mixer transaction, the goal is to break the connection between the coins you send and the coins you receive, which you did manage to achieve based on my analysis, I just think that if someone is digging deeper to find out all of this info, it would be wiser to make things more difficult for them even by a small degree.

Analyzing blockchain transactions becomes significantly easier once it's known that you've used a mixer Smiley. Naturally, this grants access to scrutinize past transactions. However, in most cases, after just the second iteration, it becomes challenging to distinguish between the recipient and the change.

Purely mathematically, for a more paranoid approach, using CoinJoin after each payout is tempting to ensure there's no chance of reviewing clients' past transactions.

But here, two immediate issues arise:

1. In this operation, you're immediately exposing not one client of the mixer but hundreds (Example Tx).
2. Your coins will receive a 100% risk rating in AML bots and similar systems, making them unacceptable to any verified exchange or trading platform.

An effective mixer's goal is to disconnect your old and new coins, and we achieve this fully.
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October 24, 2023, 04:54:21 AM
Last edit: October 24, 2023, 05:14:37 AM by tumbler.io
 #53


🔥👍 We've finished a significant update.
Our system now considers all the heuristics listed on the Blockchair website (100+ indicators).
This means that Blockchair (or anyone else) can no longer determine the recipient's address or where the change went when analyzing our transactions.
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October 24, 2023, 05:24:25 AM
Merited by LoyceV (4)
 #54

it's a real thorn in the side for analytic companies
We're having a disagreement in a fundamental level; you're buying the notion that coins are tainted. Every action of your service is done under the premise that the mixed coins must be treated as "non-tainted" by blockchain analysis companies. I don't buy that notion, and don't interact with services that will deem my coins as that. Usually, they're just centralized exchanges, which I avoid as I trade decentrally.

To me, the point of a mixer is to make it as hard as possible for a third party to tell which outputs correspond to which inputs. Period. "AML scores", "tainted coins" and the like, are all inaccurate, made-up nonsense that undermine Bitcoin as currency and attack our privacy.

Using your mixer as an example: to de-anonymize all its users in recent weeks, it would take $10-20, right?
Revealing which addresses belong to a mixer doesn't hurt its clients anonymization, just as revealing which inputs are coinjoined doesn't make the outputs de-anonymized. It's just making it apparent that the clients used a mixer / coinjoined, which in the eyes of chain analysis that is deemed as "tainting". Otherwise, I strongly recommend you to get rid of a competitor with just $20 in expenses.

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October 24, 2023, 06:19:25 AM
Last edit: October 24, 2023, 06:41:00 AM by tumbler.io
 #55

Quote
To me, the point of a mixer is to make it as hard as possible for a third party to tell which outputs correspond to which inputs.

In the current reality, it's no longer easy to just rely on CoinJoin. You use decentralized exchanges without KYC, which makes CoinJoin a suitable option for you. But how many share your situation? Maybe just 0.01%?

Quote
"AML scores", "tainted coins" and the like, are all inaccurate, made-up nonsense that undermine Bitcoin as currency and attack our privacy.

I agree, but that's the situation right now. Sadly, we might eventually see miners being mandated to include transactions only from verified sources in blocks Smiley

CoinJoin doesn't sever the link between your old and new coins.

For example, you have 1 BTC, and it's publicly known to belong to you. I also have 1 BTC, publicly known to be mine. After a CoinJoin transaction to 10 addresses (0.2 coins each), all 10 addresses receive the marker "Yours and Mine" (50/50), but this doesn't mean the marker disappears.
This is why CoinJoin services function without a hitch; it's just too easy to monitor them.

In our case, the connection is entirely severed.
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October 24, 2023, 06:49:56 AM
Merited by LoyceV (4)
 #56

You use decentralized exchanges without KYC, which makes CoinJoin a suitable option for you. But how many share your situation? Maybe just 0.01%?
I don't know the number. What I do know is that it's our responsibility to educate newbies about these solutions, and to not give up everything on their naivety. We should not be endorsing the usage of a service which is treating the currency as non-fungible with evidently inaccurate data.

I agree
You don't agree when you're running a business which is based under the premise that taint exists. You're supporting it.

I won't derail this further. It's just sad how some people don't appreciate the censorship resistance this network provides in such efficient and effective manner.

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October 24, 2023, 06:56:50 AM
Last edit: October 24, 2023, 07:10:48 AM by tumbler.io
 #57

Quote
It's just sad how some people don't appreciate the censorship resistance this network provides in such efficient and effective manner.

To some extent, we've implemented what you need. In reality, please test our service in one month, and you'll see that previous transactions will no longer have the same obvious 1-2 pattern. It takes time to create pools and make transactions less conspicuous. Notice that in your review, you mentioned transactions that occurred before the update. We cannot modify the blockchain.
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October 24, 2023, 08:12:14 AM
 #58

To me, the point of a mixer is to make it as hard as possible for a third party to tell which outputs correspond to which inputs. Period. "AML scores", "tainted coins" and the like, are all inaccurate, made-up nonsense that undermine Bitcoin as currency and attack our privacy.
It's clear that AML scores are made up bullshit but that is how it is. When you play their game, you have to follow their rules. I think there are too many people that use centralized exchanges because they are fast, easy to use and offer many services that you can't find on DEX.
So, in the end, many people prefer their coins to be clean without tag that it was mixed, because, mixing sounds bad.

Revealing which addresses belong to a mixer doesn't hurt its clients anonymization, just as revealing which inputs are coinjoined doesn't make the outputs de-anonymized. It's just making it apparent that the clients used a mixer / coinjoined, which in the eyes of chain analysis that is deemed as "tainting".
It doesn't hurt your anonymity but it hurts you when you want to use centralized exchange. I know, solution is to use DEX but here we talk about people, tons of people who use CEX. You can't force people to use DEX, right? So you have to adapt your service.

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October 24, 2023, 01:00:42 PM
 #59

Notice that in your review, you mentioned transactions that occurred before the update.
To which update are you referring to?

I know, solution is to use DEX but here we talk about people, tons of people who use CEX. You can't force people to use DEX, right? So you have to adapt your service.
Let's ignore for a moment that buying "taint" is harmful for Bitcoin, and that we should opt out using services which treat the currency in such an unfair manner. How do you adapt into something completely non-transparent?

That is a question for [banned mixer]. How do you make sure that your "AML scoring" is acceptable? From the link I mentioned above, the chairmen of chain analysis companies have clarified they won't let anyone audit their software code. You practically have no manner to confirm that they won't be flagged by the chain analysis software, as you don't even know which software is used in the first place. Binance might be using software X, Huobi software Y, Kraken Z etc. We frequently notice coins being deemed as "tainted" from one exchange, and at the same time "clean" by another.

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October 24, 2023, 02:23:43 PM
 #60

Quote
To which update are you referring to?

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5467457.msg63044753#msg63044753

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That is a question for [banned mixer]. How do you make sure that your "AML scoring" is acceptable?

We have already answered this question above.

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✅ Our platform is not designed for satisfactory results in systems like AMLBot.
Conduct an experiment, connect 10 different addresses of yours with another 10 new addresses in your wallet in one transaction, after which each address in your wallet will have a 97% risk according to AMLBot's assessment. In this case, the AMLBot system will think that you were trying to use CoinJoin technology. Do you think this is a fair risk assessment?

We are sure (through testing) that using CoinJoin "completely" is not possible because it becomes a 100% pattern in systems like AML bot and Chainalysis. After today's update, our system uses a hybrid approach, but it will take time for you to notice the difference as new transaction chains are formed.

We're not trying to achieve a favorable AML score by giving up full CoinJoin. We're adapting to the current situation. Everyone has learned to detect it and label those transactions negatively. Why bother with that? We can take a different approach.
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October 25, 2023, 09:17:30 AM
 #61

We are sure (through testing) that using CoinJoin "completely" is not possible because it becomes a 100% pattern in systems like AML bot and Chainalysis.
I know, because the point of coinjoin is to create fungible coins which follow the exact same pattern. X inputs which are owned by several entities are consolidated, creating Y outputs. This process provably obfuscates the ownership. The fact that AML bots treat these as "100% tainted" tells a lot about the mixing effectiveness. They cannot tell who's who, and thus, treat the entire set of outputs as "tainted", which is beyond insane.

We're not trying to achieve a favorable AML score by giving up full CoinJoin. We're adapting to the current situation. Everyone has learned to detect it and label those transactions negatively. Why bother with that? We can take a different approach.
Until when is the question. You're a privacy-focused service which tries to adapt with anti-privacy organization that rely on utter guesswork, which I find fundamentally erroneous. You say that you want to adapt, I'm genuinely curious with what estimations you base your work since anything can be treated as "tainted" by these people with no justification given.

To me, it seems that you've observed which techniques are considered "red flags" by their software, and you try to mitigate to alternative privacy methods. Is that it?

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October 25, 2023, 09:53:49 AM
 #62

@BlackHatCoiner
What you say is true, I understand this, the whole purpose of bitcoin mixer is to make your coins untraceable. You, the person who uses decentralized exchanges, has nothing to worry about but there are people who use centralized exchanges because of many reasons, some of them I already listed in my previous post.
Let's say that despite the fact that I use centralized exchange, I don't want to be totally tracked and want to have my private space. So, I have a bitcoin wallet that is not associated with me and I protect my privacy there but now I need to cash some of my coins and I have to deposit them on Coinbase but I don't want to reveal myself. What do I do in this case? I mix coins on a mixer that offers me coins that will pass AML bots, that's all. When I withdraw from Coinbase, I don't care about that problem, that only arises when I have to deposit on Coinbase. Coinbase is just an example in this case and nothing more or less.

Man, there is a huge problem in crypto world right now. I respect the fundamentals of bitcoin and use it to gain its advantage but centralized entities are taking it over and people prefer easy and comfortable service instead of slightly more complex one. Bitcoin, that was decentralized, is getting centralized. Mining is already centralized, you can't mine it at home, only huge corporations can mine bitcoin. Exchanges are getting regulated, casinos ask your for KYC documents, Ledger implements paid backup subscription for self-custody wallets. You see, this is not decentralization, this is taking over. It looks like centralized entity controlling decentralized coin, totally has it in its territory. So, at this time, demand and supply changes and now, like you said, privacy-focused service tries to adapt with anti-privacy organizations because of high demand, that's all.

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October 25, 2023, 10:44:15 AM
 #63

So, I have a bitcoin wallet that is not associated with me and I protect my privacy there but now I need to cash some of my coins and I have to deposit them on Coinbase but I don't want to reveal myself.
You cannot simultaneously protect your privacy and use Coinbase. You have to pick either your privacy or Coinbase.

What do I do in this case?
We've talked about this in another thread. You cannot hide the fact that you protect your privacy, and nor should you. Coinbase has made it abundantly clear that mixed coins are unacceptable, because they treat every coin they cannot track as morally incorrect. Why are you trying to deceive Coinbase into thinking your coins are not mixed, and not skip it altogether and move to an environment that respects your privacy?

centralized entities are taking it over and people prefer easy and comfortable service instead of slightly more complex one.
Centralized entities are not so powerful anymore, because we have developed decentralized solutions that work.

If you find it so difficult to use Bisq, then just select an exchange which doesn't treat its users as shit. There's a variety of non-KYC: https://kycnot.me/. As I've said before, the only excuse to using a popular, regulated CEX over non-KYC, is shitcoins.

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October 25, 2023, 11:30:05 AM
 #64

I apologize for the delays in responses; to be honest, project tasks take precedence at the moment.
No problem.
I would like to give another try in testing Tumbler with a second review, and I hope to see some improvements this time.

We're not trying to achieve a favorable AML score by giving up full CoinJoin. We're adapting to the current situation. Everyone has learned to detect it and label those transactions negatively. Why bother with that? We can take a different approach.
Because some people coins gets confiscated on centralized exchange that is related with this bad score.

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October 25, 2023, 02:19:34 PM
 #65

Quote
I know, because the point of coinjoin is to create fungible coins which follow the exact same pattern. X inputs which are owned by several entities are consolidated, creating Y outputs. This process provably obfuscates the ownership. The fact that AML bots treat these as "100% tainted" tells a lot about the mixing effectiveness. They cannot tell who's who, and thus, treat the entire set of outputs as "tainted", which is beyond insane.

And, to my great regret, there's nothing that can be done about it. Such systems will continue to operate, and over time, their numbers will grow. I'm afraid to predict, but it seems to me that the next step is mandatory verification of transactions by miners before adding them to blocks Smiley

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Until when is the question. You're a privacy-focused service which tries to adapt with anti-privacy organization that rely on utter guesswork, which I find fundamentally erroneous. You say that you want to adapt, I'm genuinely curious with what estimations you base your work since anything can be treated as "tainted" by these people with no justification given.
To me, it seems that you've observed which techniques are considered "red flags" by their software, and you try to mitigate to alternative privacy methods. Is that it?

We tested a vast number of transactions in the AML bot. In reality, their system is quite simple. It's all based on the concept of good and bad. For instance, if you have 1 BTC with a 100% risk after CoinJoin, it's enough to mix this address with another 1 BTC from a verified exchange to reduce the risk to 50%.

In our system, we eliminated the most obvious patterns for identifying bad coins and configured payout logic based on Blockchair patterns. The result is a very effective system that, with a large pool of coins and a growing customer base, will become the best of its kind.
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October 25, 2023, 04:35:05 PM
Merited by LoyceV (4), Synchronice (1)
 #66

And, to my great regret, there's nothing that can be done about it.
Yes, there is. Don't use services which discriminate their clients if they use privacy protecting tools.

We tested a vast number of transactions in the AML bot. In reality, their system is quite simple. It's all based on the concept of good and bad. For instance, if you have 1 BTC with a 100% risk after CoinJoin, it's enough to mix this address with another 1 BTC from a verified exchange to reduce the risk to 50%
Shouldn't you clarify in your main page which exchanges are tested? As I already told you, we frequently notice coins being treated as tainted by one exchange while being acceptable by another. For example, your mixed coins might be acceptable by Binance, but not by Coinbase.

In our system, we eliminated the most obvious patterns for identifying bad coins and configured payout logic based on Blockchair patterns.
You should also clarify that; "Our anonymizing meter is based on Blockchair's software".

If you're going to follow that route, you need to be transparent with your clients. "We base our work on this", "We have tested this", etc. Otherwise once a client gets their coins rejected sometime (i.e., because of an AML bot update), you will be called a bad service.

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October 30, 2023, 07:21:42 PM
 #67

I was doing a review for the current campaign, and I was almost sure that I had forgotten to write something. This KingsDen's case reminded me of one thing and I will write it here, rather than edit my review.
Your website lacks some kind of notification, where you would emphasize which are the only official channels of communication with support. I think that in your case it is certainly important because you do not have an official Telegram channel, which is quite unusual. Ideal for impersonators to trick new users who won't recognize the fake channel.

  • At the footer of the homepage, I saw the "X" icon, I didn't know what is was doing there until I clicked it and discovered it is a close icon. It will be fine that you use the word "CLOSE" in red colour as the icon doesn't sooth there. It looks like a social media handle icon.
This "X" is a new Twitter logo, and here on the Tumbler site, it does not have the function of closing the page.
Yea, it is redirecting to twitter now. As at when I was reviewing the site, it gave a warning to close all sessions when I clicked it.
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November 01, 2023, 03:56:36 PM
 #68


We have implemented protection against Man-in-the-Middle (MITM) attacks.
All critical data on the website is encrypted using the RSA asymmetric cryptography algorithm.

Now, DDOS-Guard or any other service providing DDoS protection won't be able to intercept our clients' data.

Here's how it works:

- When placing an order in the browser environment, a pair of 2048-bit RSA keys is generated (ClientPublicKey and ClientPrivateKey).
- Inside our JavaScript, there is our system's public key (SystemPublicKey).
- When placing an order, the client's browser encrypts the transmitted data using our public key (SystemPublicKey). Only we can decrypt this data because only we have the private key (SystemPrivateKey).
- In response from the server, the client also receives encrypted data, which was encrypted using the client's public key (ClientPublicKey). Only the client can decrypt the received data because only they have the private key (ClientPrivateKey).
- In addition, it is impossible to intercept order addresses by inspecting HTTP requests. OrderID is simply absent in the requests.

Encryption has been implemented for all critical parts of the project, namely:

- Order creation
- Order page
- Downloading a Letter of Guarantee
- Using the tumbler code
- Support

We would appreciate any feedback related to this update (primarily of a technical nature).
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November 07, 2023, 09:34:51 PM
 #69

After reading some observations, I had a doubt:
If the user chooses the Security level Premium option, does this mean that all their coins come from an exchange? If yes, which one?

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November 09, 2023, 12:43:08 PM
 #70

After reading some observations, I had a doubt:
If the user chooses the Security level Premium option, does this mean that all their coins come from an exchange? If yes, which one?
As it was mentioned before in this thread, "When a user opts for the "premium" level, investor coins are added to the pool". The premium pool contains the system's private resources and investor's bitcoins.
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November 09, 2023, 12:53:48 PM
 #71

Hello everyone,

A detailed roundup of the enhancements made, all inspired by your feedback to [banned mixer] Bitcoin Mixer Review#2 is postponed to next week.
It will take a little bit more time to bring your proposed ideas to perfection.

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November 10, 2023, 02:33:41 PM
Merited by joker_josue (1)
 #72

Hello everyone,

A detailed roundup of the enhancements made, all inspired by your feedback to [banned mixer] Bitcoin Mixer Review#2 is postponed to next week.
It will take a little bit more time to bring your proposed ideas to perfection.



I recently made a review for Tumbler and at that time the fee for every receiving address was 0.0002 BTC but today when I checked it again it is increased to 0.0003 BTC.



https://[banned mixer]/fee

I wonder if you announced this change and what could be the reason for increasing this fee  Huh

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November 10, 2023, 11:07:30 PM
 #73

Quote
I recently made a review for Tumbler and at that time the fee for every receiving address was 0.0002 BTC but today when I checked it again it is increased to 0.0003 BTC.

As you may have noticed, over the past week, transaction fees in the Bitcoin network have increased approximately tenfold.
On average, the recommended fee in recent days has been over 200 satoshis per byte.

https://mempool.space/block/00000000000000000003d77c88d89022c1a4be6271cef2511883228277bcaa14

Considering the size of our average transaction at 250-300 bytes, we find that we occasionally pay over 0.0006 BTC for a transfer, while charging the user 0.0003 BTC.

Once transaction fees normalize, we will reduce the fee in our system.
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November 11, 2023, 01:08:22 AM
 #74

As you may have noticed, over the past week, transaction fees in the Bitcoin network have increased approximately tenfold.
On average, the recommended fee in recent days has been over 200 satoshis per byte.

https://mempool.space/block/00000000000000000003d77c88d89022c1a4be6271cef2511883228277bcaa14

Considering the size of our average transaction at 250-300 bytes, we find that we occasionally pay over 0.0006 BTC for a transfer, while charging the user 0.0003 BTC.


First of all, if you did put a change in the fee, it would have been good if you tell us here also on the ANN thread so we know about it.

Secondly, you are also charging 0.4% the minimum fee, meaning the fee is being charged in percentage so doesn't that compensate for the higher tx fee too ?
It was already highlighed by many reviewers that as they add the addresses to mix, this 0.002 BTC 0.0003 BTC, amounts too much higher and it discourages users who want to mix small amount of Bitcoins.


Once transaction fees normalize, we will reduce the fee in our system.

From 200+ tx fee, we are now back to around 25-26 bytes,

https://mempool.space/block/00000000000000000003b38d5b19bc529acf344e2447b81c2e2f9263be5ff896

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November 11, 2023, 03:07:52 AM
 #75

Smiley

Quote
Secondly, you are also charging 0.4% the minimum fee, meaning the fee is being charged in percentage so doesn't that compensate for the higher tx fee too ?

Firstly, we don't always make a profit.

Let's do some basic math. You deposit the minimum amount of 0.001, and our profit is 0.4%, which is 0.00000400 BTC. We spend 0.0006 on the transaction, while charging the user 0.0003. We end up with a loss of -0.000296.

Of course, there are orders for larger amounts. It's for this reason that we don't set the commission at 0.0006; in other words, 0.0003 a reasonable compensation takes place.

Quote
First of all, if you did put a change in the fee, it would have been good if you tell us here also on the ANN thread so we know about it.

Your advice has been noted.

Quote
It was already highlighed by many reviewers that as they add the addresses to mix, this 0.002 BTC 0.0003 BTC, amounts too much higher and it discourages users who want to mix small amount of Bitcoins.

Firstly, if you had actually used similar services, you would know that this fee is one of the lowest in the market.
Secondly, the vast majority of those who suggested reducing the commission from testers, claiming that they are large, also did not use similar services before because there was no elementary comparison of the service parameters with competitors.

In other words, unfortunately, some testers did not perform well in the testing task, and not everything that testers write should be taken into account.

Quote
From 200+ tx fee, we are now back to around 25-26 bytes

Our system does not rely on https://mempool.space. I was just trying to point out the weekly trend, which was hard to ignore if you use cryptocurrencies.
For obtaining the recommended fee, we use other, more reliable methods. At the moment, we do not observe a significant decrease under conditions of guaranteed confirmation in 2 blocks.

It might happen in the next 5 minutes, but not yet Wink  The adjustment of the fee in our system will occur automatically.

---

We are very busy and working hard to improve the system. Sorry. It's not always possible to respond promptly to forum questions.
In the coming week (hopefully), we will prepare a detailed report.
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November 11, 2023, 09:27:16 AM
 #76

It might happen in the next 5 minutes, but not yet Wink  The adjustment of the fee in our system will occur automatically.

In this sense, I would like to make a suggestion:
Next to this fee field, place a small message like: "fee automatically adjustable, according to measured sat/byte costs of transactions"

Something like this, just for the user to be aware that this value can change, and choose to do the mix at that moment (because they think it will go up) or wait a while (because they think it will go down).

Either way, thanks for the explanation. Continuation of a good work.

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November 26, 2023, 12:21:48 AM
 #77

There was some kind of silence at the [banned mixer] mixer. They promised a report on the work done, but many weeks have passed, and they are still silent. I go to their website and see that they have added a lot of solutions, including those that I suggested, which is extremely nice. Mixer has grown a lot in terms of user-friendliness and the quality of the site itself. I hope they will return soon and still present their report on the work done.

In general, a large number of constructive suggestions were accepted and implemented in part or in full. It seems that the review campaign gave quite a good result. At least as far as I noticed.
As far as I know, a signature campaign is also being prepared, so I believe that we can expect a more significant update by then.

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November 26, 2023, 12:35:57 AM
 #78

I think it's been more than a month since they ran a contest for avatar and signature design here in BitcoinTalk. Until now they still haven't started the signature campaign. It seems they changed their mind about running a marketing campaign here in BitcoinTalk. Good thing OP is still active; they just haven't posted updates or bumped the thread daily.

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November 26, 2023, 12:59:21 AM
 #79

I think it's been more than a month since they ran a contest for avatar and signature design here in BitcoinTalk. Until now they still haven't started the signature campaign. It seems they changed their mind about running a marketing campaign here in BitcoinTalk. Good thing OP is still active; they just haven't posted updates or bumped the thread daily.

At the closing of the second round of the review campaign, the launch of the signature advertising program was announced. That was about 10 days ago. I think it is too early to write off such a possibility.
This campaign is officially close now.
Thank you everyone for participating on the both review campaign.
We are planning to launch the signature campaign soon.
Looking forward to work together with some of you.

Thank you [banned mixer] team.

Cheers.

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November 26, 2023, 03:30:00 AM
Last edit: November 26, 2023, 02:05:30 PM by tumbler.io
Merited by Symmetrick (24), BenCodie (2), notblox1 (1), joker_josue (1), paid2 (1)
 #80

Hello everyone!

A huge shoutout to everyone who sent us questions and feedback – you've really helped us improve! Over the past few months, we've been hard at work making numerous enhancements to our service. While there have been many changes, today we're excited to share with you some of the highlights that have come out of your valuable input. We've selected a handful of improvements to discuss, but rest assured, there's much more in the pipeline. Stay tuned for some enlightening information, and feel free to join in the discussion!



mikeywith

Quote
I started with using the Clearnet version on Chrome, unfortunately, regardless of testing different browsers (Brave, Tor, and even Edge) I kept getting this error on the Captcha step.

✅ We've fixed the issue. Now, you should be able to complete the captcha step without any errors, regardless of the browser you're using.

Quote
The (Please, download the letter of guarantee before a transfer) is hardly noticeable, it must be more visible than the deposit information.

✅ We've made changes and added an icon to make it more visible. Now, the prompt to download the Letter of guarantee before a transfer should be noticeably clearer than the deposit information.

Quote
The tumbler code is somewhere at the bottom of this page, very easy to miss if you don't scroll down and honestly I almost forgot about it since my attention was on the deposit process, the page has a ton of blank space at the top, alongside the logo and steps icons at the top, all of which are taking a lot of "wasted" space
I think this page should be squeezed to fit a single screen without having to scroll down, where everything needed (Letter of Guarantee + Deposit status + tumbler code appears in the same height level without needing to scroll)

✅ Our usability tests have shown that there are no issues with focusing attention on this particular section at any resolution. We have designed the layout to ensure that all important elements are easily accessible and visible to our users.

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No easy way of entering the order number should one close the page by mistake, if someone doesn't pay enough attention to the URL which contains the order number /order#... then it will be hard for them to go back to the same order without contacting the support team.

✅ Your link is duplicated on the mixing page as well as in the Letter of guarantee. This ensures that even if you close the page by mistake, you can easily find your way back to your order without needing to contact the support team.

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Despite receiving the transaction the timer is still running on the order page as if it's still yet to come.

✅ We've fixed the issue. Now, the timer on the order page will correctly reflect the transaction status, stopping once the transaction is received.

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Is pretty useless at this point, it should show on the first page, and then again on the top of the deposit page not at the bottom, now since you can't control what the user sends, you could at least control what you send by slightly modifying your 0.0002 BTC fee to make it in a dynamic range of say 0.000015 - 0.0002

✅ This information is available at every stage of mixing. We ensure that all necessary details are prominently displayed throughout the process, providing our users with clear guidance at each step.

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You consolidated 3 smaller outputs that were not needed

✅ We have over 90 patterns for processing transactions. Sometimes, it happens that three smaller outputs are consolidated, which is a part of our sophisticated transaction processing system. This approach helps us achieve the highest level of privacy for our users.

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The website should be translated into more languages, personally, I'd like to see it support Arabic.

✅ We have plans to add three more languages to the website.



Ratimov / Symmetrick

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Let's start directly with the main function, namely Bitcoin mixing. I see that the service has implemented a captcha before mixing, and I have a question that dates back to the first review, namely the behavior of the site when changing the language. The mixing process itself consists of several screens: Captcha - Order details - Terms - In progress - Finish. I again observe that if you change the language during mixing, everything is reset and you have to start over, but this does not happen in all screens:

That is, if, after passing the captcha, I go to the order details screen, fill in all the data and try to change the language, I am again transferred to the very beginning. If I continue mixing without changing the language and go to screen 3, where I need to familiarize myself with the conditions, then the problem is the same:

✅ Thank you for such a clear explanation of the issue. There are no errors in these particular places; it's the website's protection against spam attacks that is activating. After successfully completing the captcha, your session is assigned a one-time unique key used for form submission. Changing the language (essentially refreshing the page) resets your current session and deletes all keys. As you've noticed, all the mixing stages are dynamically loaded (using Asynchronous JavaScript and XML (AJAX)), and with the current project architecture, it's impossible to implement language change while preserving the entire progress of form filling. In other words, it's impossible to restore form-filling progress at stages that don't require refreshing the browser page and are loaded dynamically.

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I didn't notice it at all the first time because it almost blends into the main background, make it clearer so that it is visible.

✅ This block was intentionally hidden, as it does not carry any functional load and does not require the client's focused attention. We have removed the transparency, but the size has not been changed. Smiley

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Next, I would suggest that you add information about supported addresses on the deposit screen. Here, on this screen, this information is more useful than in the FAQ section, for example, like this:

✅ Until the introduction of Taproot support, this might have been relevant, but at the moment our system supports all possible types of addresses. Adding this information now would be redundant.

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I would also like to suggest reconsidering the tooltip functions that you have indicated by the ? logo. This is a useful feature, but why did you make them visible all the time? In the web version, some windows overlap each other and become unreadable:

✅ We thought it would be more convenient this way, but judging by customer feedback, it didn't work out. We have removed them. Smiley

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If you leave any number of pop-ups open, they will remain on the screen after moving to screen 3, but when moving to screen 4, they will disappear.

✅ That's funny, we've fixed it. We've disabled the ability to pin windows.

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When you click on Start new mixing ⇆ your tumbler code will already be entered in the corresponding field, but as soon as you change the language, all these settings will disappear and you will have to enter everything manually. This is what it looks like:

✅ We have already described this issue above. It's due to the dynamic nature of our system.

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What happens when I first want to delete the order information and then start a new mix with a new tumbler code:

✅ The tumbler code is not connected to your current order. After deleting your order, your code will still work.
We are planning to release two important articles with illustrations soon:

1. How the Bitcoin mixer [banned mixer] works.
2. What is a Tumbler code and how does it work.

We will try to explain in detail how our project works as a whole and its individual modules.

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Why can’t first delete information about the previous order, and then start a new mixing with the new tumbler code already inserted? This is convenient, but the site is imperfect and allows you to select one thing, and then immediately transfers you to another screen.

✅ We've made a change. Information about your order will be deleted, but there will no longer be an automatic redirect to the homepage.

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Another bug. I previously talked about the problem of changing the language on the title screen and I see that this problem has been fixed... but not completely. The top logo works correctly, but the bottom one also resets the language settings:

✅ We've fixed the issue you mentioned. The language change functionality now works correctly across all elements of the homepage, including the top logo and other sections.

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Next, let's look at your list of links at the bottom of the page, I suggest you add an address verification function there:
So why not add it to the main page? This is much more convenient than placing a mention of this service in the depths of the FAQ, and even in the form of text rather than a hyperlink.

✅ To make address verification more accessible, we have now introduced an "offline" version of this feature
/verify]https://[banned mixer]/verify

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I also recommend that you create a separate page with a brief description of all your advantages that clearly distinguish you from other mixers, for example, the Benefits page:

✅ Added to the home page

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I also want to draw attention to additional social networks. There is nothing else besides bitcointalk and twitter.

✅ We've heard your feedback and have decided to temporarily remove the Twitter icon. Currently, we are focusing our resources on other aspects of our service, but we do plan to revisit and expand our presence on additional social networks in the future. Thank you for bringing this to our attention, and we appreciate your understanding as we work to enhance our user experience.

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I would like to have links to these forums and reviews so that you can check this information in order to familiarize yourself.
Knowing how paranoid crypto users can sometimes be, I can tell you that some, at the first glance at your mixer, may have a strong feeling that you are some kind of scam or have been abandoned for a long time. There are no methods of communication, Twitter is abandoned, there are no other social networks, there are only 4 pages with posts on the forum, no other forums are indicated. Distribution in the crypto community is currently about zero, I hope you will correct this situation.

✅ We've added links to the forum and reviews directly within the text that you mentioned. You can now verify our service and interact with the community through these links. The text that you referred to has been created as an SEO block with the relevant tasks in mind.

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I understand why this happens and it throws me to the bottom of the screen, because your previous open tab closes immediately after the next one opens. Since you have them of different sizes, this effect occurs. I'll come back to this in another chapter of this review and show you the real scale of the problem associated with this way of presenting information to users.

I would like to pay special attention to this section of the site, because there is something to improve and finalize. As I wrote above, this section has problems both in