Neo-liberalism and the crisis of Capitalism

[kryptqnick]

Viewing people as members of simple binary divisions is not a very good portrayal, in my opinion. People aren't just owners of production or a part of labour force. Someone can be self-employed, being a means of their own production but also not employing anyone else, for example. Or sometimes people are just self-employed on paper, while really working for companies basically as employees. One can also both have a small business and have a job as an employee to earn money and invest in that business. So even if we split people into many classes, it doesn't cover those in the middle, on intersections, etc.
Capitalism, in its pure form, is a cruel system. But capitalism has many faces, and it can admit a significant part of socialism into it in practice, if we look at how different countries are doing it. So it's not all good or bad because it can be very different.

[WillyAp]

If you look at those undeveloped continent like Africa and most part of Asia, the suffering and poverty that existed within is not mainly cause by capitalism, socialism or any other form of government being practice by the state, The major cause of suffering in those part of the world is mostly cause by the high level of incompetence by our leaders.

As an African you should be aware that Africa is a large continent, And not a country.
Zambia: https://hir.harvard.edu/chinese-investment-in-africa-a-reexamination-of-the-zambian-debt-crisis/  a Harvard view.
Further investment into African countries: https://thediplomat.com/2021/11/the-quiet-china-africa-revolution-chinese-investment/
And the most interesting article: https://www.fpri.org/article/2022/01/chinese-economic-engagement-in-africa/

Don't forget that elections bring forward mostly politicians with little interest into their people.
I bet that some of the past White Governments have been more beneficial to some countries than the black version.
Basically don't trust anyone who promise you equality, 

[topbitcoin]

Viewing people as members of simple binary divisions is not a very good portrayal, in my opinion. People aren't just owners of production or a part of labour force. Someone can be self-employed, being a means of their own production but also not employing anyone else, for example. Or sometimes people are just self-employed on paper, while really working for companies basically as employees. One can also both have a small business and have a job as an employee to earn money and invest in that business. So even if we split people into many classes, it doesn't cover those in the middle, on intersections, etc.
Capitalism, in its pure form, is a cruel system. But capitalism has many faces, and it can admit a significant part of socialism into it in practice, if we look at how different countries are doing it. So it's not all good or bad because it can be very different.

I completely agree. Limiting the view of humans only as a means of production or labor is not a comprehensive view of society. People have their own value in the economy that is more than just being owners or employees. For example, someone may have a small business while working as an employee or entrepreneur. This means that economic classes do not always have clear boundaries and allow for a variety of roles and experiences between them.

It is also worth noting that capitalism manifests itself in various forms, including socialism. This illustrates that no economic system is completely negative or positive, but what matters is how well the system is developed and controlled. Your observations about the ambiguity of capitalism and the permissibility of adopting socialist elements have significant implications and should be seen as an example to highlight how we must consider context and implementation when studying economic systems.

[franky1]

So what keeps poor countries poor is developed countries and they don't want poor countries to get better because it doesn't benefit them.

basically it boils down to the western controls of FOREX

Yes, because the currency is not backed by gold reserves, the value of the currency is dominated by the power of western countries. That is a very detrimental thing. Apart from that, debt is also a problem. When poor countries' exchange rates weaken, their foreign debt will get higher over time.

One of the best solutions is to use fiat currency for local transactions only and use bitcoin and gold which have global prices for cross-border trade. Then the local currency may not be affected by forex. What is your opinion? Do you have a solution for this condition?

imagine this as a way we could counter the wallstreet manoeuvres of forex(much like the activism of gamestop did on wallstreet)

imagine we stopped measuring bitcoin vs USD which then assumes other fiat currencies:BTC via forex... to instead measure bitcoin vs "minimum wage hour units MWHU"
whereby as an example bitcoin was lets say 4660 MWHU

whereby for instance if USD min wage was $15. an american wanting to buy bitcoin would need to pay $~70k
whereby for instance if UK min wage was ~£11.44 a brit wanting to buy bitcoin would need to pay ~£53k
whereby for instance if nigeria min wage was ~N373 a nigerian wanting to buy bitcoin would need to pay ~N1.73m

people would soon work out. they could sell bitcoin for USD.. convert USD to naira buy bitcoin using Naira, repeat and then see how the balance between Naira and USD changes

1btc = $70k = 88,000,000N = 50btc
50btc = $3.8m = 44000000000N = 2500btc

it wouldnt take much for wallstreet to then react to then change the 1:50 peg of $ to N(allow the circuit breaks to not trigger to allow the prices to move more inline)

[WillyAp]

people would soon work out. they could sell bitcoin for USD.. convert USD to naira buy bitcoin using Naira, repeat and then see how the balance between Naira and USD changes

All nice and peachy with Bitcoin at 72.000, Not so nice when it drops to 50.000.
Who thinks in minimal wages deserves to live of one.   

[franky1]

people would soon work out. they could sell bitcoin for USD.. convert USD to naira buy bitcoin using Naira, repeat and then see how the balance between Naira and USD changes

All nice and peachy with Bitcoin at 72.000, Not so nice when it drops to 50.000.
Who thinks in minimal wages deserves to live of one.  

by not measuring in USD (the point of my scenario)
if you mean the market would be 3333 MWHU (equating to($15*3333) $50k)

then the nigerian cost of 3333MWHU * N373 = N1.24m
and the game can still be played

[simons_js]

So what keeps poor countries poor is developed countries and they don't want poor countries to get better because it doesn't benefit them.

basically it boils down to the western controls of FOREX

Yes, because the currency is not backed by gold reserves, the value of the currency is dominated by the power of western countries. That is a very detrimental thing. Apart from that, debt is also a problem. When poor countries' exchange rates weaken, their foreign debt will get higher over time.

One of the best solutions is to use fiat currency for local transactions only and use bitcoin and gold which have global prices for cross-border trade. Then the local currency may not be affected by forex. What is your opinion? Do you have a solution for this condition?

imagine this as a way we could counter the wallstreet manoeuvres of forex(much like the activism of gamestop did on wallstreet)

imagine we stopped measuring bitcoin vs USD which then assumes other fiat currencies:BTC via forex... to instead measure bitcoin vs "minimum wage hour units MWHU"
whereby as an example bitcoin was lets say 4660 MWHU

whereby for instance if USD min wage was $15. an american wanting to buy bitcoin would need to pay $~70k
whereby for instance if UK min wage was ~£11.44 a brit wanting to buy bitcoin would need to pay ~£53k
whereby for instance if nigeria min wage was ~N373 a nigerian wanting to buy bitcoin would need to pay ~N1.73m

people would soon work out. they could sell bitcoin for USD.. convert USD to naira buy bitcoin using Naira, repeat and then see how the balance between Naira and USD changes

1btc = $70k = 88,000,000N = 50btc
50btc = $3.8m = 44000000000N = 2500btc

it wouldnt take much for wallstreet to then react to then change the 1:50 peg of $ to N(allow the circuit breaks to not trigger to allow the prices to move more inline)

Your explanation seems good, but the reality will never happen. No company wants to pay its employees with bitcoin, even if there is, the amount is small.

Apart from that, bitcoin is like other forex instruments, most people see bitcoin in USD. Bitcoin is seen because there is USD value in it, if that thinking can be reversed and consider bitcoin to be more valuable than USD then it will be a new era.

[dezoel]

What people who dislike "capitalism", which is simply just liberal laws, is that this is what we have as best solution right now. No other system has worked as well as this one did, look at USA and how miserable and yet improved the lives are at that country. If you do want a better life, then do come up with a better solution.

These days we do not have to look at things as only right or wrong, as only right or left, or liberal vs socialist, or authoritarian vs libertarian etc etc. We can have different views on every single subject, I could support socialist ideas on topic 1, and liberal ideas on topic 2, why would I have to fit myself into a box about every subject? I can just think of it case by case easily.

[peter0425]

Viewing people as members of simple binary divisions is not a very good portrayal, in my opinion.

Well it is not like we have any other choice. Many research needs to have the modt accurate portrayal as possible and even though these intersections would most likely become limitations to fully understanding a population it is still better to just portray it as general groups

Capitalism, in its pure form, is a cruel system. But capitalism has many faces, and it can admit a significant part of socialism into it in practice, if we look at how different countries are doing it. So it's not all good or bad because it can be very different.

Agreed capitalism is a driving force of economic growth so if it is one of the things that can help a country grow out of poverty then I don’t think it should be looked at as a bad thing