Bisq 1 Vs Bisq 2 help?

[dim_mak5]

Hi,

First of all is Bisq a DEX or P2P?

I understand Bisq 2 is in beta, anyone know when the finished version of Bisq 2 be released? When released, Bisq 1 will be discontinued/no more updates for it?

Any Bisq users here that like to kindly share their reviews experiences of Bisq 1 & Bisq 2 and which one they think is the best overall? Bisq 1 Protocol Multisig still remains the best? Are there any known bugs in Bisq 2?

For newbies to Bisq what advice is best for low fees and quick execution of market orders at privacy & security?

If I sell on Bisq for Stable coins then how do I convert stable coins for fiat & withdraw it to my UK bank account?

If If I sell on Bisq for Fiat then how to do the transaction without meeting the buyer in person face to face for safety reasons?

[bitmover]

Bisq2 is just the beta version of bisq

For newbies to Bisq what advice is best for low fees and quick execution of market orders at privacy & security?

.

Bisq1 is more stable. This is the one you should use if you don't mind the old interface. There are no difference in fees.

https://bisq.network/downloads/

There are more details about bisq 2 here.

https://bisq.network/blog/bisq-2-now-in-beta/

You can run both in the same system.

[dkbit98]

You are asking to many questions in one post and most of them are not serious at all

First of all is Bisq a DEX or P2P?

Both.
Bisq is DEX aka decentralized exchange for P2P peer-to-peer trading.

I understand Bisq 2 is in beta, anyone know when the finished version of Bisq 2 be released? When released, Bisq 1 will be discontinued/no more updates for it?

Ask Bisq developers about that, not random people on bitcointalk forum.
There are several stages in Bisq Roadmap but basic version works even now.

For newbies to Bisq what advice is best for low fees and quick execution of market orders at privacy & security?

I don't recommend Bisq exchange to newbies, and privacy-security has nothing to do with fees and market order execution.
If you want privacy there is Bisq fork on monero chain called Haveno.

If If I sell on Bisq for Fiat then how to do the transaction without meeting the buyer in person face to face for safety reasons?

There are plenty of payment fiat options to choose on Bisq.

[dim_mak5]

Bisq2 is just the beta version of bisq

For newbies to Bisq what advice is best for low fees and quick execution of market orders at privacy & security?

.

Bisq1 is more stable. This is the one you should use if you don't mind the old interface. There are no difference in fees.

https://bisq.network/downloads/

There are more details about bisq 2 here.

https://bisq.network/blog/bisq-2-now-in-beta/

You can run both in the same system.

Like to know if Bisq 2 Beta is Stable too as I seen the video that Bisq 1 will be discontinued next year so best to get use to the Bisq 2 interface right?

You are asking to many questions in one post and most of them are not serious at all

First of all is Bisq a DEX or P2P?

Both.
Bisq is DEX aka decentralized exchange for P2P peer-to-peer trading.

I understand Bisq 2 is in beta, anyone know when the finished version of Bisq 2 be released? When released, Bisq 1 will be discontinued/no more updates for it?

Ask Bisq developers about that, not random people on bitcointalk forum.
There are several stages in Bisq Roadmap but basic version works even now.

For newbies to Bisq what advice is best for low fees and quick execution of market orders at privacy & security?

I don't recommend Bisq exchange to newbies, and privacy-security has nothing to do with fees and market order execution.
If you want privacy there is Bisq fork on monero chain called Haveno.

If If I sell on Bisq for Fiat then how to do the transaction without meeting the buyer in person face to face for safety reasons?

There are plenty of payment fiat options to choose on Bisq.

When I think of DEX I think of an exchange like Binance or Coinbase that does no KYC and has deep liquidity. When I think of P2P I think of meeting the buyer/seller in person, 0 liquidity for instant market orders, take times to buy/sell at the market price.

What's the best alternative to Bisq that requires the user not to download anything to run its service and all is required is a web browser?

[BlackHatCoiner]

I understand Bisq 2 is in beta, anyone know when the finished version of Bisq 2 be released? When released, Bisq 1 will be discontinued/no more updates for it?

Bisq 1 will probably be discontinued when "Bisq Multisig" is implemented in Bisq 2. That's expected to be ready in Q3 of 2024.

I understand Bisq 2 is in beta, anyone know when the finished version of Bisq 2 be released? When released, Bisq 1 will be discontinued/no more updates for it?

Feature "Bisq Easy" in Bisq 2 is designed for newbies, but I have never used it and cannot therefore recommend. It's less secure than traditional Bisq.

What's the best alternative to Bisq that requires the user not to download anything to run its service and all is required is a web browser?

You won't find a better alternative than that, when it comes to fiat trades. Every centralized, web browser based exchange that includes fiat trades enforces KYC nowadays.

[dim_mak5]

I understand Bisq 2 is in beta, anyone know when the finished version of Bisq 2 be released? When released, Bisq 1 will be discontinued/no more updates for it?

Bisq 1 will probably be discontinued when "Bisq Multisig" is implemented in Bisq 2. That's expected to be ready in Q3 of 2024.

I understand Bisq 2 is in beta, anyone know when the finished version of Bisq 2 be released? When released, Bisq 1 will be discontinued/no more updates for it?

Feature "Bisq Easy" in Bisq 2 is designed for newbies, but I have never used it and cannot therefore recommend. It's less secure than traditional Bisq.

What's the best alternative to Bisq that requires the user not to download anything to run its service and all is required is a web browser?

You won't find a better alternative than that, when it comes to fiat trades. Every centralized, web browser based exchange that includes fiat trades enforces KYC nowadays.

How Bisq 2 is less secure than traditional bisq 1?

[RickDeckard]

How Bisq 2 is less secure than traditional bisq 1?

From my understanding, BHC was refering to the new feature (Bisq Easy) being less secure than the remaining options that Bisq 2 offers (and also Bisq 1). I tend to agree with this considering that "Bisq Easy" doesn't enforce a security deposit within the deal. This means that the buyer/seller can back out of it without any consequences (you should report whenever this happens though) and it translates to being a free card to access your bank account details at no immediate consequences.

It is, however, a good tool for someone who is "tipping" their toes with Bisq but one that you shouldn't perpetually use within the program.

Bisq 1 will probably be discontinued when "Bisq Multisig" is implemented in Bisq 2. That's expected to be ready in Q3 of 2024.

Correct. Plus, per their roadmap[1], Bisq 1 will enter "limited maintenance" somewhere in the beginning of Q4 of 2024 and is estimated to be abandoned on Q1 of 2027 (if everything goes according to plan).
[1]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T583ogprpkM

[dim_mak5]

How Bisq 2 is less secure than traditional bisq 1?

From my understanding, BHC was refering to the new feature (Bisq Easy) being less secure than the remaining options that Bisq 2 offers (and also Bisq 1). I tend to agree with this considering that "Bisq Easy" doesn't enforce a security deposit within the deal. This means that the buyer/seller can back out of it without any consequences (you should report whenever this happens though) and it translates to being a free card to access your bank account details at no immediate consequences.

It is, however, a good tool for someone who is "tipping" their toes with Bisq but one that you shouldn't perpetually use within the program.

Bisq 1 will probably be discontinued when "Bisq Multisig" is implemented in Bisq 2. That's expected to be ready in Q3 of 2024.

Correct. Plus, per their roadmap[1], Bisq 1 will enter "limited maintenance" somewhere in the beginning of Q4 of 2024 and is estimated to be abandoned on Q1 of 2027 (if everything goes according to plan).
[1]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T583ogprpkM

Which mode you recommend then in Bisq2 if easy mode is not secure safe?

[RickDeckard]

Which mode you recommend then in Bisq2 if easy mode is not secure safe?

If you want to use Bisq and have never used it before, you will find that Bisq Easy will help you get started in navigating Bisq UI and learn some of the platform mechanisms. If you are new to Bisq and do not have any bitcoin yet, I would recommend you to try the feature.

However, as soon as you understand how Bisq trades and interface work, and considering that, for now, Bisq 2 only supports one trading protocol - Bisq Easy - I would advice you to use Bisq 1 market to get your bitcoins. There's a great guide that you can follow here[1]. Since you will need bitcoin in order to make trades in Bisq 1, you could use Bisq Easy to get them and then just start using Bisq 1 as soon as you are comfortable.
[1]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LyEKA5Iq9I&t=207s

[dim_mak5]

Which mode you recommend then in Bisq2 if easy mode is not secure safe?

If you want to use Bisq and have never used it before, you will find that Bisq Easy will help you get started in navigating Bisq UI and learn some of the platform mechanisms. If you are new to Bisq and do not have any bitcoin yet, I would recommend you to try the feature.

However, as soon as you understand how Bisq trades and interface work, and considering that, for now, Bisq 2 only supports one trading protocol - Bisq Easy - I would advice you to use Bisq 1 market to get your bitcoins. There's a great guide that you can follow here[1]. Since you will need bitcoin in order to make trades in Bisq 1, you could use Bisq Easy to get them and then just start using Bisq 1 as soon as you are comfortable.
[1]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LyEKA5Iq9I&t=207s

Is Bisq 1 & Bisq 2 have cross platform compatibility meaning can for example buyers from bisq1 buy from sellers from bisq2 and vice versa? If no then Bisq1 has more liquidity than bisq2 right?

[Pmalek]

When I think of DEX I think of an exchange like Binance or Coinbase that does no KYC and has deep liquidity.

That's wrong. The mentioned exchanges are centralized. If someone attacks their servers and takes them offline, no user will be able to use the exchanges until they are back up. Bisq is decentralized. Think of it like torrent clients. Each person (peer) has a copy of the software they can run. There isn't a central point of failure and server you can attack or bring down to disrupt the exchange. You only stop that one person from using the platform until they run and synchronize another copy of the software. 

When I think of P2P I think of meeting the buyer/seller in person, 0 liquidity for instant market orders, take times to buy/sell at the market price.

Face-to-face is one way to engage with P2P deals. But it isn't limited only to physical meetings. If you trade your X coins for my Y coins without an intermediary, you executed a P2P trade. Be careful of fake P2P services like Binance that aren't real P2P exchanges. That's because the exchange (not you) has control of the keys where you deposit your coins. 

[dim_mak5]

When I think of DEX I think of an exchange like Binance or Coinbase that does no KYC and has deep liquidity.

That's wrong. The mentioned exchanges are centralized. If someone attacks their servers and takes them offline, no user will be able to use the exchanges until they are back up. Bisq is decentralized. Think of it like torrent clients. Each person (peer) has a copy of the software they can run. There isn't a central point of failure and server you can attack or bring down to disrupt the exchange. You only stop that one person from using the platform until they run and synchronize another copy of the software. 

When I think of P2P I think of meeting the buyer/seller in person, 0 liquidity for instant market orders, take times to buy/sell at the market price.

Face-to-face is one way to engage with P2P deals. But it isn't limited only to physical meetings. If you trade your X coins for my Y coins without an intermediary, you executed a P2P trade. Be careful of fake P2P services like Binance that aren't real P2P exchanges. That's because the exchange (not you) has control of the keys where you deposit your coins. 

Sorry I meant when I think of DEXs I mean Uniswap & Pancakeswap and can these DEXs be bought down like you said above? Or just DEX means No-KYC but centralized which is confusing 

Can a CEX who asks for No-KYC legally be classified as a DEX until they ask for KYC?

[Findingnemo]

Sorry I meant when I think of DEXs I mean Uniswap & Pancakeswap and can these DEXs be bought down like you said above? Or just DEX means No-KYC but centralized which is confusing 

Can a CEX who asks for No-KYC legally be classified as a DEX until they ask for KYC?

Those are decentralized exchanges but BISQ is a decentralized p2p and this can also be classified into the exchange category.

A centralized exchange can still be no KYC and in the past they were but due to the regulatory frameworks they made up mandatory KYC for everyone to register on their platform.

Not every DEX is truly decentralized, so if the government can find the one behind it, they can shut it down or enforce KYC.

[Pmalek]

Sorry I meant when I think of DEXs I mean Uniswap & Pancakeswap and can these DEXs be bought down like you said above?

Both of those should be decentralized P2P exchanges. I have never used them, though. Bisq is a software that you download and run on your computer. I am not sure if those two that you mentioned have standalone applications. The question is, what happens if the official websites of Uniswap or Pancakeswap becomes unavailable?   

Or just DEX means No-KYC but centralized which is confusing

You are now mixing centralized and decentralized again by bringing in another factor, which is KYC. Identity verification has nothing to do with it. The main issue is the distribution. Bisq isn't decentralized because they aren't asking for KYC. It's decentralized because every user runs its own copy of the software, distributing it to hundreds and thousands of computers worldwide. You would have to take offline each copy to kill Bisq. But there is only one Binance and servers connected to the exchange that would need to be shutdown do disrupt Binance. Bisq doesn't have KYC because it's privacy-focused and it's P2P nature doesn't require it. If user A is trading with user B, Bisq doesn't need to know their identities.   

Can a CEX who asks for No-KYC legally be classified as a DEX until they ask for KYC?

No. It will always be a CEX. Many CEXs didn't have KYC in the past, and some still don't require it, but they reserve the right to ask you for KYC if they see fit.

[dim_mak5]

Sorry I meant when I think of DEXs I mean Uniswap & Pancakeswap and can these DEXs be bought down like you said above? Or just DEX means No-KYC but centralized which is confusing 

Can a CEX who asks for No-KYC legally be classified as a DEX until they ask for KYC?

Those are decentralized exchanges but BISQ is a decentralized p2p and this can also be classified into the exchange category.

A centralized exchange can still be no KYC and in the past they were but due to the regulatory frameworks they made up mandatory KYC for everyone to register on their platform.

Not every DEX is truly decentralized, so if the government can find the one behind it, they can shut it down or enforce KYC.

Okay those DEXs that I mentioned like Uniswap & Pancakeswap can be accessed by a web browser, no need to download or install anything on your device. So if a DEX service that can be accessed by a web browser are not truly decentralized because that website is run by 1 or a few web servers and for it to be classed as truly decentralization it needs to be run by 1000+ or more servers that is scattered evenly throughout the globe?

Otherwise please let me know which DEXs are truly decentralized that does not require the end user to download install anything on their device?

[BlackHatCoiner]

Otherwise please let me know which DEXs are truly decentralized that does not require the end user to download install anything on their device?

For an exchange to be decentralized, it actually means to run peer-to-peer. In a truly decentralized exchange, every peer holds equivalent rights with each other. This means that the end user must simultaneously be a server, as other peers will need to establish connection with them. Bisq is an example where the end user runs a server in the back-end while trading.

That's why you need to run a piece of software at least, to be part of a truly decentralized exchange.

[dim_mak5]

Sorry I meant when I think of DEXs I mean Uniswap & Pancakeswap and can these DEXs be bought down like you said above?

Both of those should be decentralized P2P exchanges. I have never used them, though. Bisq is a software that you download and run on your computer. I am not sure if those two that you mentioned have standalone applications. The question is, what happens if the official websites of Uniswap or Pancakeswap becomes unavailable?  

Or just DEX means No-KYC but centralized which is confusing

You are now mixing centralized and decentralized again by bringing in another factor, which is KYC. Identity verification has nothing to do with it. The main issue is the distribution. Bisq isn't decentralized because they aren't asking for KYC. It's decentralized because every user runs its own copy of the software, distributing it to hundreds and thousands of computers worldwide. You would have to take offline each copy to kill Bisq. But there is only one Binance and servers connected to the exchange that would need to be shutdown do disrupt Binance. Bisq doesn't have KYC because it's privacy-focused and it's P2P nature doesn't require it. If user A is trading with user B, Bisq doesn't need to know their identities.  

Can a CEX who asks for No-KYC legally be classified as a DEX until they ask for KYC?

No. It will always be a CEX. Many CEXs didn't have KYC in the past, and some still don't require it, but they reserve the right to ask you for KYC if they see fit.

Okay so to get the True Decentralization Status it has to be?:

- Exchange cannot be accessible through a website address. The end user must download/install on their device to use the exchange service.

- The exchange cannot be run by 1 or even a few servers. Must be 1000+ servers scattered evenly throughout the globe because only 1 or a few servers can be targeted easily.

Does services like RoboSats, PeachBitcoin & Vexl fit the above criteria? Or is Bisq the only exchange that fits this criteria?

Basically I am looking for a DEX which has deep liquidity, doesn't take long for orders to be filled which cheap fees/low premiums.

[Pmalek]

Okay so to get the True Decentralization Status it has to be?:

- Exchange cannot be accessible through a website address. The end user must download/install on their device to use the exchange service.

It shouldn't only be accessible over a website because if that website goes down or is taken over by malicious actors, everything falls apart. It's not a problem if one of the ways that you engage with the platform is via a browser.

- The exchange cannot be run by 1 or even a few servers. Must be 1000+ servers scattered evenly throughout the globe because only 1 or a few servers can be targeted easily.

The more peers act as servers and run a copy of the software the better and more decentralized it is. Compare it to Bitcoin and Bitcoin nodes. If you only had one central Bitcoin node that all users had to connect to and rely on, it wouldn't be a decentralized currency. That node would hold absolute power. But that's not the case, and we have thousands of nodes spread all over the place. 

Does services like RoboSats, PeachBitcoin & Vexl fit the above criteria?

I don't know what Vexl is. PeachBitcoin isn't decentralized. It's a no-KYC exchange up to around €1000 a day, but it's not decentralized. People say that RoboSats is decentralized but I am not sure it is. I haven't used it, but I know it runs over the TOR browser. It's privacy focused and non-KYC, but it can't be decentralized if the only way to access it is through an onion address and traders aren't running their own copies. If you have to connect through a RoboSats point and that's the only way, it isn't decentralized.   

Basically I am looking for a DEX which has deep liquidity, doesn't take long for orders to be filled which cheap fees/low premiums.

We all are, but the world isn't perfect. DEXs aren't nearly as popular as CEXs so the liquidity is incomparable. If the main features you are looking for are decentralization and anonymity, you will have to forget about some other points. In case of DEXs, those are liquidity, ease of use compared to CEXs, and the quickness in completing trades. Don't forget, the P2P nature requires the other party to find your orders and accept them. It's not an automatic and quick process and is done manually.   

[dim_mak5]

Okay so to get the True Decentralization Status it has to be?:

- Exchange cannot be accessible through a website address. The end user must download/install on their device to use the exchange service.

It shouldn't only be accessible over a website because if that website goes down or is taken over by malicious actors, everything falls apart. It's not a problem if one of the ways that you engage with the platform is via a browser.

- The exchange cannot be run by 1 or even a few servers. Must be 1000+ servers scattered evenly throughout the globe because only 1 or a few servers can be targeted easily.

The more peers act as servers and run a copy of the software the better and more decentralized it is. Compare it to Bitcoin and Bitcoin nodes. If you only had one central Bitcoin node that all users had to connect to and rely on, it wouldn't be a decentralized currency. That node would hold absolute power. But that's not the case, and we have thousands of nodes spread all over the place.  

Does services like RoboSats, PeachBitcoin & Vexl fit the above criteria?

I don't know what Vexl is. PeachBitcoin isn't decentralized. It's a no-KYC exchange up to around €1000 a day, but it's not decentralized. People say that RoboSats is decentralized but I am not sure it is. I haven't used it, but I know it runs over the TOR browser. It's privacy focused and non-KYC, but it can't be decentralized if the only way to access it is through an onion address and traders aren't running their own copies. If you have to connect through a RoboSats point and that's the only way, it isn't decentralized.  

Basically I am looking for a DEX which has deep liquidity, doesn't take long for orders to be filled which cheap fees/low premiums.

We all are, but the world isn't perfect. DEXs aren't nearly as popular as CEXs so the liquidity is incomparable. If the main features you are looking for are decentralization and anonymity, you will have to forget about some other points. In case of DEXs, those are liquidity, ease of use compared to CEXs, and the quickness in completing trades. Don't forget, the P2P nature requires the other party to find your orders and accept them. It's not an automatic and quick process and is done manually.  

Thanks for your helpful reply. Okay from my understanding correct me if I am wrong...

- It truly has Decentralization status if you can only access the exchange service via a App/Software that you downloaded/installed on your device. If the exchange service can be accessed via a web browser then it loses its decentralization status even though the exchange service has a App available to download too?

- Decentralization status means more than minimum 1000 servers/nodes across the globe not just 1 or a few servers?

- How many servers/nodes run Robosats?

- Tor Onion addresses are not decentralized? Can onion addresses be replaced with new onion addresses? Onion addresses/servers cannot be located and targeted because onion addresses have good privacy & anonymity?

[Pmalek]

Thanks for your helpful reply. Okay from my understanding correct me if I am wrong...

- It truly has Decentralization status if you can only access the exchange service via a App/Software that you downloaded/installed on your device. If the exchange service can be accessed via a web browser then it loses its decentralization status even though the exchange service has a App available to download too?

An exchange is decentralized if it doesn't have one central (main) point of failure. If every user of the exchange acts as a node in an interconnected P2P way and you make connections directly with different peers, that's decentralized. If one of those peers goes offline, it doesn't disrupt the entire operation of the exchange. It only affects that user, their active trades, and others interested in trading with the peer that went offline. Everything else runs normally.

- Decentralization status means more than minimum 1000 servers/nodes across the globe not just 1 or a few servers?

There is no rule that says how many servers are needed. Like I said before, the more there are, the more decentralized a system is. 1 server equals to centralization. 2 is better, but still not good enough. 10 means more decentralization than with one or two, and so on. Obviously, you can't have 1000s of running instances (servers) of a DEX if that platform only has 200 users. 

- How many servers/nodes run Robosats?

Can't help you there. I don't know. I am questioning its decentralized nature because I think you must connect to one central point to be able to use Robosats, but I could be wrong. Let's see if someone else drops by who knows how Robosats actually runs. 

- Tor Onion addresses are not decentralized? Can onion addresses be replaced with new onion addresses? Onion addresses/servers cannot be located and targeted because onion addresses have good privacy & anonymity?

TOR, the network is decentralized. But we are not talking about the TOR network, but the services that run on top of it. TOR is decentralized because your connection goes through different hops or nodes before you connect to the target server. These nodes can't connect who you are as a person to what you are doing. That's how you get anonymity with TOR. Because the connection hops between different servers, it's impossible to know who connected to what and what they are doing, unless all the TOR nodes that relay your connection are compromised.

But don't confuse the way TOR (the network) works with an exchange available over TOR. That exchange can still be centralized if the only way to use it is to connect to the main server of that exchange. eXch, which we discussed in a different topic, is a good example. It runs over TOR but is centralized. The coins you trade there belong to eXch, not individual users. eXch isn't a P2P exchange where individuals connect with one another. No, you are dealing with the liquidity that eXch provides.

It's worth pointing out that just because something is centralized, it doesn't equal to not trusted and unsafe.