Trading has become too much akin to gambling. Let's embrace it

[temple]

~

In theory!
In practice, it never actually happened, and it's pretty hard for it to happen this way.
First, it's hard for the hashrate to drop because of the advancement in chips efficiency, so 3 miners might quit but one might replace his asics and there you go, same hashrate, then there is the delay between the orders and actual receiving the miners, people order when it's profitable, 3 months pass, you get the gear you have nothing to do but mine!

I think I would add that infrastructure besides advancement in chips efficiency is worth mentioning here as it becomes more attainable every day and you can see the industry growing in Africa. As these panels become cheaper and more abundant, the implementation of those channels to fuel regional energy demands becomes more practical and any excess energy can be pointed at BTC mining. The advancements in technology make it more likely that BTC hash rate will be maintained if not increased.

So some traders would feel prompted to exit their positions in exchanges to deter risks of the coins losing value.

Ethereum Classic was successfully 51% attacked more than 4 times, the coin is still alive, so.....traders might not focus on the security aspects of a coin!  

Traders maybe not so much, but I think investors do if they are in it for the long haul aiming for increase and preservation of value. I think an attack on BTC would be perceived differently than an attack on ETC.

Trading cryptos is gambling, it's just the ego of traders that denies it.

Could you atleast make some specificities to this, Stompix?

Simple example:
https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-58707641
When a hamster manages to make money from trading crypto, one can't keep saying it's about knowledge and not luck!

This is a funny piece of info! It's like what was going on in 2017 when everyone thought they are an amazing trader because every single altcoin went up a few thousand percent.

[DaNNy001]

I'll keep on saying this, trading is a skill and gambling is not but most people think they are the same because they always focus on flipping on their trading account. Experienced traders go into the Market with leverage and try to make sure that they make more Profit than losses by following the rule of risk management.. Trading especially in crypto currency can be make you or break you, it takes understanding to understand the market and come up with a strategy that works.. gambling is mostly based on luck and instincts nothing more nothing less.

[mak013]

I'm assuming everyone here already knows how volatile crypto markets are and how much of a risk it is to trade there. I'm not going to delve deep on that topic because I consider it a given already. However I'm getting a sense that in spite of the great demand to make risky trades on crypto, casinos tend to ignore it too much.

I remember a few years ago binary options on BTC/USD were quite popular.
These days billions of USD are put towards leveraged futures, and now with markets opening futures and options on Bitcoin ETFs, institutional investors will also have access to very risky positions on BTC right from their broker.

However, these markets have several restrictions. On most brokers you can't get margined leverage above 5x and/or many territories don't even allow for brokers to offer options to the general public. Let alone the fact that people from many countries aren't even allowed to sign up to crypto exchanges because of arbitrary reasons like for example Israel pressuring Binance to close the accounts of people just for being Arab.

Anyway, I think more casinos should follow the path of what Rollbit has been doing with its virtual futures and offer gambling services based on the BTC price. There could be several advantages. No KYC, no regulatory restrictions as imposed on traditional markers, unlimited leverage... You name it.
Maybe even there could be some algorithmic memecoin releases. Maybe you're one of the lucky ones that get 10x or one of the unlucky ones that get rugged.

Would you gamble on casino games that are based around the real fluctuations of BTC's price?

I don`t think that it would be a good decision. BTC in the casino is just a type of money, like USD. Using it in games like an instrument of the game - is strange enough as for me. It looks like trading and in casino i don`t want to trade, even if i use BTC as money. Cryptocurrency exchanges has their specific instruments for trading, they analyze the price every second. Common casino can`t give all opportunities of the exchange to the gambler. As the result it would be some disappointed gamblers, some problems with gamblers. Let`s use instruments for the purposes they were created for.

[Sandra_hakeem]

Simple example:
https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-58707641
When a hamster manages to make money from trading crypto, one can't keep saying it's about knowledge and not luck!

if I were told in my wildest dreams that a hamster would trade on digital currencies, Maybe I'll believe it, but I'll certainly get caught up with the reality when I'm sober. I mean, the closest thing to what you just said was a video I saw on Facebook - a hamster, with the little aid of his master on  things that its hands can't Carry, made a good (so they claim) bowl of dish (I can't remember what that was) but this was all a test to accertain the already pending theory that hamsters are smartest of all rodents.

Well, what really intrigues me all the time is how they got to train him on which lever to pull to either buy or sell...well again, if this a gamble as you claim, what are the odds that this rodent, by their virtue of accurate selection, decide on which lever to pull? I haven't seen a video about it so, the more I try to conform this into reality, the more stupid it looks to me.

[GxSTxV]

Would you gamble on casino games that are based around the real fluctuations of BTC's price?

I also saw many games in casinos trending these days to predict the price of Bitcoin, especially with the hype and bullish market. It's an interesting mixture of trading and gambling and with how volatile crypto markets are it's not surprising that this trend is catching on these days with this market and Bitcoin reaching $100,000.

The way I see it, these new games maybe are good to people who are already into crypto trading but want a more straightforward and fast paced experience like binary options. Instead of going through all the complexities of exchanges leverage restrictions and regulatory that takes time, in the place with casinos offering BTC prediction games fast way straight to the thrill.
Personally the first casino I saw doing that is, RollBit with virtual futures that have definitely tapped into that market before many others following and copying their idea, making it easier for users to take high risk bets without the red tape.

Answering your question; now that I stopped gambling due to an addiction recovery journey, I know how easily these kind of things could make us go out of control but I for me personally I have made a promise to myself., even if these games blur the line between trading and gambling and for some that might make the risk even harder to manage.

[SmartGold01]

I don`t think that it would be a good decision. BTC in the casino is just a type of money, like USD. Using it in games like an instrument of the game - is strange enough as for me. It looks like trading and in casino i don`t want to trade, even if i use BTC as money. Cryptocurrency exchanges has their specific instruments for trading, they analyze the price every second. Common casino can`t give all opportunities of the exchange to the gambler. As the result it would be some disappointed gamblers, some problems with gamblers. Let`s use instruments for the purposes they were created for.

If I could get correctly to what he is trying to suggest or buy is that the risk factors are not considered because if they do the level of loss people are experiencing today in gambling could have been reduced, usually the same terminology are used and are likely the same as ( trade with the amount you can afford to lose, gamble with the amount you can afford to loose, do not allocation all monthly salary to trading, same is also used for gambling) therefore, we can consider both to have same risk level and, infact gambling is much more riskier than trading because gambling is a total lost while trading there is every tendency the coin would dump and later rise again.

[sunsilk]

I'll keep on saying this, trading is a skill and gambling is not but most people think they are the same because they always focus on flipping on their trading account. Experienced traders go into the Market with leverage and try to make sure that they make more Profit than losses by following the rule of risk management.. Trading especially in crypto currency can be make you or break you, it takes understanding to understand the market and come up with a strategy that works.. gambling is mostly based on luck and instincts nothing more nothing less.

While that makes sense there is a form of gambling that's also requiring a skill and that's sports betting. There are similarities between both things and that's why people used to think that there's not a lot of difference from the two.

But you're right. Most of the traders are skilled and they've earned it and to differentiate their skills and luck, the same way as how we do it with the gamblers.

And I think people will agree if someone says that futures trading is certainly a type of gamble.

[Aanuoluwatofunmi]

I still cant phantom the major reason on why this is become possible, that trading is becoming akin on gambling, because they both have different pattern of operation, their differences is more than their similarities, which so tells more about the way we are gambling and how we see them both having relationship to have been compared together, some people can gamble as they want but cant trade the way they like except they follow some principles.

[Ever-young]

I'll keep on saying this, trading is a skill and gambling is not but most people think they are the same because they always focus on flipping on their trading account. Experienced traders go into the Market with leverage and try to make sure that they make more Profit than losses by following the rule of risk management.. Trading especially in crypto currency can be make you or break you, it takes understanding to understand the market and come up with a strategy that works.. gambling is mostly based on luck and instincts nothing more nothing less.

Like I said in a thread where such a topic was also being discussed, it's very difficult for you to understand how both trading and gambling work if you don't do the two. I have been into trading, and I'm also a gambler. No matter how good you think you are, you can never win; the system always has the highest chance of winning over you. 
 
Trading requires the trader to just pay attention; even if you don't win trades all the time, you will always have a higher chance of never running out of the little capital you have left. Those who are into buying all these pump-and-dump tokens are the ones who regard trading and gambling as the same due to the experience they have from it.

[alegotardo]

Anyway, I think more casinos should follow the path of what Rollbit has been doing with its virtual futures and offer gambling services based on the BTC price. There could be several advantages. No KYC, no regulatory restrictions as imposed on traditional markers, unlimited leverage... You name it.
Maybe even there could be some algorithmic memecoin releases. Maybe you're one of the lucky ones that get 10x or one of the unlucky ones that get rugged.

Would you gamble on casino games that are based around the real fluctuations of BTC's price?

In fact, the idea of ​​betting in casinos based on Bitcoin price fluctuations is tempting for anyone seeking strong emotions and not intimidated by risk. It is obvious that casinos saw this opportunity amid the restrictions of traditional markets and since regulations in this sector are very weak or even non-existent depending on the country where they are based, so this became a good option to increase profits.

That said, I would still make the following considerations and risks about this new emerging opportunity:

Extreme Volatility: BTC is known for its dramatic price fluctuations, so just like in an exchange, you need to be prepared for significant losses, especially with high leverage.

Addiction and Risk Management: The addictive nature of gambling combined with the volatility of cryptocurrencies can lead to disastrous situations, so it is essential to manage risk and establish strict limits.

Regulation and Legality: This is an issue that many people overlook, but while cryptocurrency casinos may operate in regulatory grey areas, there are legal risks and KYC procedures that often apply when a player needs to withdraw their winnings.

[Agbamoni]

I'll keep on saying this, trading is a skill and gambling is not but most people think they are the same because they always focus on flipping on their trading account. Experienced traders go into the Market with leverage and try to make sure that they make more Profit than losses by following the rule of risk management.. Trading especially in crypto currency can be make you or break you, it takes understanding to understand the market and come up with a strategy that works.. gambling is mostly based on luck and instincts nothing more nothing less.

No argument here buddy. Trading is indeed a skill, but anyone can get a pattern in gambling and make it in gambling which we can't completely call it a skill. What makes people relate trading to gambling is the similarities in terms of risk and uncertainty. This is based on the ideology that there is no extent we can have knowledge in regard to trading that is backed by certainty which is same with gambling. Two things must not have a complete characteristic with each other before saying they are similar. One or two similarities make them very relatable in terms of that behavior. Perhaps you can agree with me, if not then prove me wrong.

[stompix]

I think I would add that infrastructure besides advancement in chips efficiency is worth mentioning here as it becomes more attainable every day and you can see the industry growing in Africa. As these panels become cheaper and more abundant, the implementation of those channels to fuel regional energy demands becomes more practical and any excess energy can be pointed at BTC mining. The advancements in technology make it more likely that BTC hash rate will be maintained if not increased.

I can't take seriously an article that says stuff like this:

Nigerians are finding a new way to tap into the global digital gold rush: mobile bitcoin mining apps. This surge comes amid a wave of innovation, as startups address the challenge of providing a cheap and reliable energy source for cryptocurrency mining. For many Nigerians, traditional mining rigs are out of reach due to their high cost and energy demands. However, the emergence of mobile apps like Sitefinity, Geomine, Digitrack, Bitmine, Minetracker and Hashflare has opened the door for anyone with a smartphone to participate.

Second, when I see here:
https://www.gama.africa/
Trojan mining being listed, the same as in my topic Rate the safety of this mining setup
I am sure this is a joke!

Well, what really intrigues me all the time is how they got to train him on which lever to pull to either buy or sell...well again, if this a gamble as you claim, what are the odds that this rodent, by their virtue of accurate selection, decide on which lever to pull? I haven't seen a video about it so, the more I try to conform this into reality, the more stupid it looks to me.

It wasn't trained!
Every time that he would play with his wheel a coin would be selected, and then they would wait till he passed through two small tunnels in his playroom, one with sell and one with buy, that was all, pure randomness, but the thing is that during a bull run he outperformed every stock, just as traders brag now about making gains, well everyone is making gains when all coins are up 100%, that doesn't make trading anything other than gambling!
Here is a video of the hamster:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i5scs_NWTSg

[mak013]

I don`t think that it would be a good decision. BTC in the casino is just a type of money, like USD. Using it in games like an instrument of the game - is strange enough as for me. It looks like trading and in casino i don`t want to trade, even if i use BTC as money. Cryptocurrency exchanges has their specific instruments for trading, they analyze the price every second. Common casino can`t give all opportunities of the exchange to the gambler. As the result it would be some disappointed gamblers, some problems with gamblers. Let`s use instruments for the purposes they were created for.

If I could get correctly to what he is trying to suggest or buy is that the risk factors are not considered because if they do the level of loss people are experiencing today in gambling could have been reduced, usually the same terminology are used and are likely the same as ( trade with the amount you can afford to lose, gamble with the amount you can afford to loose, do not allocation all monthly salary to trading, same is also used for gambling) therefore, we can consider both to have same risk level and, infact gambling is much more riskier than trading because gambling is a total lost while trading there is every tendency the coin would dump and later rise again.

If i understand correctly, the idea is to get some exhange functions with additional opportunities, that exhange can`t suppose due to their restrictions. But i don`t think that it would be good for a common gambler. It depends risks, thats why common trader can`t use  "leverage above 5x". I don`t sure that common gambler more qualified than common trader and that casino has better instruments for trading than exchange has.

[Dr.Bitcoin_Strange]

I'll keep on saying this, trading is a skill and gambling is not but most people think they are the same because they always focus on flipping on their trading account. Experienced traders go into the Market with leverage and try to make sure that they make more Profit than losses by following the rule of risk management.. Trading especially in crypto currency can be make you or break you, it takes understanding to understand the market and come up with a strategy that works.. gambling is mostly based on luck and instincts nothing more nothing less.

You are absolutely right mate, I always try to differentiate between trading and gambling and am not among the league of people who doesn't agree that gambling is the same thing as gambling. Although, a gambling can actually take trading as gambling and rely on luck to win a trade but it will only take them a short time to blow their account but those that are skillful traders are making money consistently every day despite that they can also experience losses at time, they do make up with it when they are winning in other trades.

[STT]

Trading is often gambling, its become increasingly like that because of the instability to mainstream currencies.  Maybe it shouldnt be that way but it is right now.

Long ago banking was boring, mortgages were boring and interest rates was a slow moving market.  Now the finance market anything can happen including the downfall of some of the worlds largest economies, currencies and debt markets.   Anything can happen, which is why finance got so close to gambling.

[AliMan]

That is dependent on the value of a crypto pairs that's being traded through btc, because as popularity increases the value also rises. Gambling would also tend to become more in demand as well as trading would also become much concerned. Every individuals should take it seriously, since wasting money despite of its value is alarming but kept ignoring every single advices that came from different concerned citizens.

[Mpamaegbu]

No, I would not. When Bitcoin was closed to $100k the people between on the price then to reach it in some hours, or a day would have lost money. One guy said he wasn't going to come back to X until Bitcoin hits $100k, that was totally unnecessary. Personally I know Bitcoin is going to surpassed $100k but when this would happen, that I don't know and I am not willing to make any bets on that. I'd rather bet on sports events which I am sure about or still bet on slot games which is another ofy personal favourites.

It's crazy when people take speculations to mean certainty. Maybe, out of excitement, we all do that. Many people (including me) were so sure Bitcoin was going to hit $100k as soon as Trump was declared president-elect just as many also know that there was going to be a correction after it hit that level. The sole reason being that $100k is a psychological level and price takes a bounce off every psychological level. It's the same stuff we're going to witness when price gets to $150k. However, it's so much risk timing the market and assuming a deadline for it. It's never going to work that way. The market doesn't respect anyone to dictate for it. For instance, I'm sure Bitcoin will hit $150k and even surpass it this bull season but I will be stretching my luck too far if I place a timeline to it, like saying before end of this month or in January. Doing that is pure gambling.

[Onyeeze]

The thing is that there is no difference between gambling and the trading the only thing is that they have two different names but similar meanings so many people would not gamble which is the increase in Bitcoin price but you can trade with the increase of Bitcoin but for the Aspect you are saying concerning threading and gambling I believe that gambling different thing that I have to do with lock while trading is something you practice and no it very well because when you fail to know try the very well on the process of trading you consider trading as Same as gambling

[ginsan]

Actually although in the end this can be considered the same but in the end the essence is different for some cases because for some traders especially beginners maybe this will be used as a gambling arena because they will assume that there is no need for some techniques and strategies in making purchases because they trust more in instinct which is a form of their inability to be in trading but forcing the will to jump into trading which makes conditions more difficult than thought so that they prioritize instinct to buy or sell when trading.

But on the other hand we certainly realize that not everyone does this because after all there are still many traders out there who even do their analysis techniques before opening positions so in the end I don't feel that this can be generalized for every trader because in the end traders and gamblers are two different things.

[Mahanton]

Would you gamble on casino games that are based around the real fluctuations of BTC's price?

I also saw many games in casinos trending these days to predict the price of Bitcoin, especially with the hype and bullish market. It's an interesting mixture of trading and gambling and with how volatile crypto markets are it's not surprising that this trend is catching on these days with this market and Bitcoin reaching $100,000.

The way I see it, these new games maybe are good to people who are already into crypto trading but want a more straightforward and fast paced experience like binary options. Instead of going through all the complexities of exchanges leverage restrictions and regulatory that takes time, in the place with casinos offering BTC prediction games fast way straight to the thrill.
Personally the first casino I saw doing that is, RollBit with virtual futures that have definitely tapped into that market before many others following and copying their idea, making it easier for users to take high risk bets without the red tape.

Answering your question; now that I stopped gambling due to an addiction recovery journey, I know how easily these kind of things could make us go out of control but I for me personally I have made a promise to myself., even if these games blur the line between trading and gambling and for some that might make the risk even harder to manage.

Actually its been already a while with these kind of games that you are trying out to predict the price of Bitcoin and other coins in the market, just like on what im wearing on my signature on which Rollbit does already have that kind of option on which you can be able to make up some bets on where price will really be ending up on a specific time duration on which simply shows or means that you can either win or lose basing up into your choice. It will really be just that too hard on applying some trading skills on this one because of short time period and which is why it is really that considered to be pure gambling on this aspect because it will really be just that too hard to predict on where it will really be doing. Some people do really find this to be that entertaining or something that could bring out that kind of leisure and thrill and thats why you do able to saw that there are still people who are really that liking to get involved with these kind of gambling specially on crypto price movement. Its been here for a while now, it is really just that its not really something that getting up too much attention or interest because only gamblers with having that kind of trading kind behavior are the ones who do get interested with these stuffs but actually it is really that quite entertaining on trying out to guess and predict on where prices will go, but for me on which i cant be able to bare up the risks because volatility is really that too much on very short time frame on which i cant handle it out.