El Salvador: The Most Profitable Country on Bitcoin Investment

[skarais]

~~~

Bukele is a massive bitcoin investor personally, so he’s deeply into bitcoin before sitting in his current position. That brings me to a certain point that the progress of one’s country relies much on the leader itself. Luckily, Bukele has it all to be a great leader because of his being visionary, strategic and resilience.

El Salvador was once a developing country before, but because they’ve chosen a responsible and a passionate one, most especially when it comes to financial aspects, now this small country becomes the most profitable country when it comes to bitcoin investment.

El Salvador is likely one of the countries that made such a profit from its investment in bitcoin, while some other countries may have earned more even if they did not invest in bitcoin. The imposition of taxes on investment and trade has increased state revenues, in fact I think some countries that facilitate bitcoin mining have also benefited although I don't know exactly how much.

We clearly welcome Bukele's optimistic attitude towards bitcoin which has made bitcoin legal as currency in his country. It is fitting for other countries that are lagging behind to change their minds on bitcoin and start investing and supporting it, even with friendlier regulations.

[buwaytress]

Still waiting on Bukele to provide several things I've brought up in the past, including proof of reserves,...

Does this information suffice for what you are looking for regarding proof of reserves?

https://bitcoin.gob.sv/

This can also be found in this article.
El Salvador launches $360M Bitcoin treasury monitoring website

This was in 2021, but their holdings have now increased to 5,958.77 BTC, equivalent to $589,804,677 at the current price.

Partially, yes! It shows a wallet with a provable balance (nice use of mempool.space btw) but I couldn't locate the signed tx (which is part of the other thing I was wondering about, who holds the access?). Relying on you or someone else to point it out to me so I can reduce my dismissive attitude towards Bukele

Curious what the 200+ BTC was used for.., (the withdrawals start Oct 14 and I couldn't find anything in his Tweets). Might have been more before March when the address was changed. Is there anywhere else providing financial statements (another thing I mentioned)?

[RockBell]

If many countries can copy this from El Salvador government to invest in bitcoin in the bear season and sell in the bull season, I don't think there would have been inflation in the world today, and even though there will be inflation in the world it will not be massive like this current inflation because this huge amount of income they have made from bitcoin in this bull season, it will go a long way to boost their economy for their citizens to experience the surplus of good living in their country, For El Salvador government to make this kind of income from bitcoin, I think it has been long they have be holding the bitcoins till this current bull season before they advice themselves to release the bitcoins  in this highest price of bitcoin to earn this amount of funds from bitcoin.

And people are really appreciating what the El Salvador government did because the step they took other countries should be ashamed because they were busy condemning bitcoin were others were busy using it to boost there economy, the economy of El Salvador was seriously impacted by the step they took to invest in bitcoin and the initiative is seriously yielding, and they are suppose to get a little bit of relief now because of how they have boosted the economy and this should be another example for people to actually follow but you know some country will still not learn.

And since they they have gotten 5k bitcoin thay is actually a lot, and am trying to know which country will take the next step, and USA have, a great influence and that is why I was hoping that if they can make it to be in there reserve then it will also improve there economy and that is exactly what we want because the government is trying to get involve and I see it as a good sign, for bitcoin.

And this are periods that we need to be taking bitcoin seriously because there is a good wave that is coming so this will make bitcoin to get at is peak and then eventually retrace back its step towards another face, so we have to be mindful of this period.

[Princess Leah]

If many countries can copy this from El Salvador government to invest in bitcoin in the bear season and sell in the bull season, I don't think there would have been inflation in the world today, and even though there will be inflation in the world it will not be massive like this current inflation because this huge amount of income they have made from bitcoin in this bull season, it will go a long way to boost their economy for their citizens to experience the surplus of good living in their country, For El Salvador government to make this kind of income from bitcoin, I think it has been long they have be holding the bitcoins till this current bull season before they advice themselves to release the bitcoins  in this highest price of bitcoin to earn this amount of funds from bitcoin.

And people are really appreciating what the El Salvador government did because the step they took other countries should be ashamed because they were busy condemning bitcoin were others were busy using it to boost there economy, the economy of El Salvador was seriously impacted by the step they took to invest in bitcoin and the initiative is seriously yielding, and they are suppose to get a little bit of relief now because of how they have boosted the economy and this should be another example for people to actually follow but you know some country will still not learn.

And since they they have gotten 5k bitcoin thay is actually a lot, and am trying to know which country will take the next step, and USA have, a great influence and that is why I was hoping that if they can make it to be in there reserve then it will also improve there economy and that is exactly what we want because the government is trying to get involve and I see it as a good sign, for bitcoin.

And this are periods that we need to be taking bitcoin seriously because there is a good wave that is coming so this will make bitcoin to get at is peak and then eventually retrace back its step towards another face, so we have to be mindful of this period.

Sometimes I wish my country could do what El Salvador is doing currently concerning Bitcoin but then they keep implementing regulations that would frustrate Bitcoiners and chase most exchange where people could purchase Bitcoin from away, if only we had leaders that got vision like the president of El Salvador concerning Bitcoin and start buying Bitcoin currently I believe it would help boost our economy and clear some debts we're owing the World Bank, if they could just buy and hold for even a full circle.

 The most annoying part of it all is that they’re seeing the benefits that countries supporting Bitcoin are gaining but then they're keeping blind eyes towards it and keep borrowing more funds without clearing the previous ones. I think the speech Trump made during his campaign concerning Bitcoin and it’s benefits to nation building should be an eyes opener to developing countries but then the leaders in my country are just clueless.

[Zoomic]

El Salvador took a very big risk when they decided to invest in Bitcoin, especially at a time when many never believed in it. I can imagine the kind of pressure the president got then for taking the decision he took then. I am very sure that if this his  decision didn't give any positive results like we are seeing now, many of us would have lots of negative things to say about El Salvador. Ofcourse people only praise good results.

This should be an eye opener to other countries who are still restricting their citizens from using or investing in bitcoin. Now we can tell who is ignorant and wrong here. While other countries are already making money from bitcoin, countries who are still very ignorant should wise up and join the trend before it's becomes kinda late for them.

[dezoel]

Obviously they made a good profit, but what are their budget really? I can see that they invested about 300 and made about 300 profit on top of that, but was that a good chunk of their budget? Feels like 300 million was a small investment, even some companies made bigger investments than that, and El Salvador just got 300 million worth, maybe that's a lot for their budget, I wouldn't know, but even the poorest nations usually could figure out a way to get a billion or so from somewhere.

In any case, they did the right thing and they should do what micro strategy does, just keep on putting some part of tax income into bitcoin and keep doing that for decades, eventually they will have the biggest bitcoin reserve in the world.

[Japinat]

El Salvador took a very big risk when they decided to invest in Bitcoin, especially at a time when many never believed in it. I can imagine the kind of pressure the president got then for taking the decision he took then. I am very sure that if this his  decision didn't give any positive results like we are seeing now, many of us would have lots of negative things to say about El Salvador. Ofcourse people only praise good results.

This should be an eye opener to other countries who are still restricting their citizens from using or investing in bitcoin. Now we can tell who is ignorant and wrong here. While other countries are already making money from bitcoin, countries who are still very ignorant should wise up and join the trend before it's becomes kinda late for them.

Bukele itself is already a huge fan of bitcoin, so we can anticipate that he has already reserved good amount of bitcoin in his portfolio. But taking El Salvador into bitcoin which is still very unfamiliar for its citizens, that’s really a big risk and a big challenge for Bukele. Not all leaders of a country can successfully do that. But at least bitcoin has proven its excellent value now, something that other countries may feel envy on El Salvador.

[X-ray]

although the success of El Salvador is massive in this regard, we need to acknowledge that el salvador is smart enough to buy bitcoin at low and right now reaping the profits.

I doubt any other country can follow the same success if what they do is just getting fomo'd, i still remember back then people were so doubtful saying el salvador was reckless buying BTC when market was in deep red but their persistence paid off.
now despite the fact that there's still many potential left with BTC and its chance of hitting $1 million is there. it'd be better if those countries can start acknowledging crypto or bitcoin in general by giving flexible legal framework first.

[adultcrypto]

El Salvador took a very big risk when they decided to invest in Bitcoin, especially at a time when many never believed in it. I can imagine the kind of pressure the president got then for taking the decision he took then. I am very sure that if this his  decision didn't give any positive results like we are seeing now, many of us would have lots of negative things to say about El Salvador. Ofcourse people only praise good results.

I don't understand what you refer to as big risk when it comes to bitcoin investment. Could it be that you still consider buying bitcoin a big risk? No doubt there is risk in everything even life itself but classifying investment in bitcoin as a big risk is totally out of place. The only time I will consider buying bitcoin a big risk is if the investment is made with money meant for other basic things that cannot be delayed and the intention of targeting quick profits. In this instance, the chances of not succeeding is very high because there is still something called correction in price movement and when it happens, you might not be able to recoup your investment immediately unless you wait longer. However, when investment is made with long term target, like El Salvador did, the risk is highly minimized and cannot be classified as a big risk.

[stadus]

This country has a huge debt- "$24 billion, which is over 80% of its GDP". The profit they’ve gained from their Bitcoin investment could already help alleviate this to some extent.
~snip~

What is $300 million compared to a debt of $24 billion? Even if the price of BTC rises x10 tomorrow, it still wouldn't help them get out of the abyss they've been in for several decades. What would have helped them is if they had a much more aggressive investment policy in BTC a few years ago when BTC was much cheaper - but instead the president decided to buy 1 BTC every day, which doesn't seem like a wise move today.

For that country, BTC is just one of a series of experiments they resort to in order to find a solution, but BTC is not a solution for the failed economy in a country destroyed by bribery, corruption and gang violence.

They’re not completely relying on Bitcoin as their main income stream, but earning from Bitcoin investments is already a great addition. Whatever happens, they’re unlikely to become too aggressive by putting more than 50% of their resources into Bitcoin—it’s just too risky.

What this country is doing by exposing itself to Bitcoin is attracting pro-Bitcoin investors through its Bitcoin-friendly policies. It’s more about building a long-term positive impact rather than short-term gains.

And yes, they have a huge debt—but what country doesn’t? Especially among developing nations, debt is common because good debt helps improve the country’s economy over time.

Since we’ve been focusing on their debt, let’s also look at their revenue streams. Check out how progressive their yearly revenue growth has been. . + projection.
Take note ; the "$24 billion?" is a long term debt, it will be amortized over the years, which I believe they could pay based on their yearly income.

The general government revenue in El Salvador was forecast to continuously increase between 2024 and 2029 by in total 2.6 billion U.S. dollars (+27.37 percent). After the ninth consecutive increasing year, the revenue is estimated to reach 12.13 billion U.S. dollars and therefore a new peak in 2029.

[Ziskinberg]

Partially, yes! It shows a wallet with a provable balance (nice use of mempool.space btw) but I couldn't locate the signed tx (which is part of the other thing I was wondering about, who holds the access?). Relying on you or someone else to point it out to me so I can reduce my dismissive attitude towards Bukele

Curious what the 200+ BTC was used for.., (the withdrawals start Oct 14 and I couldn't find anything in his Tweets). Might have been more before March when the address was changed. Is there anywhere else providing financial statements (another thing I mentioned)?

I can only go by the information shared, but I’m sorry as I can’t answer your question fully as my technical knowledge on this is quite limited. However, using simple logic, he’s the president of a country, so making false claims about a country owning Bitcoin would put his country at risk of criticism and harm investor confidence.

I’m curious, though, since you asked this question, are there any other groups or individuals who have also questioned the legitimacy of El Salvador’s Bitcoin ownership?

[buwaytress]

However, using simple logic, he’s the president of a country, so making false claims about a country owning Bitcoin would put his country at risk of criticism and harm investor confidence.

That is the fallacy that far bigger people have banked on to take people's trust and money. The biggest crypto exchange in the world had almost no systems of check and balance -- their CEO, his girlfriend, his crew were encouraged to make false claims and they were only found out when markets crashed and customers panicked.

Look at all the biggest crypto lawsuits ongoing this year alone. They involve crypto far, far more than the ones Bukele claims to control for the interest of his country. Their shared attribute? Lack of transparency, and single points of failure (usually, one guy or a few guys who decide everything without accountability).

I’m curious, though, since you asked this question, are there any other groups or individuals who have also questioned the legitimacy of El Salvador’s Bitcoin ownership?

I'm sure they are. I'm also sure they're more difficult to hear or find because they are the minority and social media amplifies what the majority say. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for El Salvador going full Bitcoin. But that same spirit has to show in accountability and transparency, and it must still be, in the end, the will of the people. I'm not convinced there is any real ambition toward this.

[dzungmobile]

That is the fallacy that far bigger people have banked on to take people's trust and money. The biggest crypto exchange in the world had almost no systems of check and balance -- their CEO, his girlfriend, his crew were encouraged to make false claims and they were only found out when markets crashed and customers panicked.

Look at all the biggest crypto lawsuits ongoing this year alone. They involve crypto far, far more than the ones Bukele claims to control for the interest of his country. Their shared attribute? Lack of transparency, and single points of failure (usually, one guy or a few guys who decide everything without accountability).

After that FTX collapse, there is pressure request on cryptocurrency centralized exchanges to be more transparent about their exchange treasuries, it's good movement after an accident.

The same for national treasury in bitcoin, I agree with you that transparency and accountability need to be improved and provided publicly to their citizens. They use national budget to buy bitcoin, as part of their national treasury and citizens as tax payers to governments, have all rights to know about it.

It's better than nothing but risk exists. Transparency, accountability won't 100% prevent fraud if they want to do this. We can not be actively all time and be too quickly responsive against their fraud actions.

[Ziskinberg]

However, using simple logic, he’s the president of a country, so making false claims about a country owning Bitcoin would put his country at risk of criticism and harm investor confidence.

That is the fallacy that far bigger people have banked on to take people's trust and money. The biggest crypto exchange in the world had almost no systems of check and balance -- their CEO, his girlfriend, his crew were encouraged to make false claims and they were only found out when markets crashed and customers panicked.

Look at all the biggest crypto lawsuits ongoing this year alone. They involve crypto far, far more than the ones Bukele claims to control for the interest of his country. Their shared attribute? Lack of transparency, and single points of failure (usually, one guy or a few guys who decide everything without accountability).

Although this happens with some exchanges, it’s nowhere comparable to a country or a leader managing a nation, as every action, especially involving money, is always under scrutiny. When Bukele tweets that they’re buying Bitcoin, it's not automatic that they'll buy right away as the funds used have already passed through various processes in different departments, with multiple people verifying the transactions before finalizing them.

He’s essentially just the messenger, while his team handles the actual buying, and with such a significant value of Bitcoin involved, it’s necessary to have a separation of duties, requiring many people to ensure the security of the Bitcoin they’re holding. All of this follows a process, and some information cannot be divulged for security reasons.

I believe this might address your question about why they didn’t sign a message. From my research, even exchanges typically don’t sign messages for the same security concerns.

I’m curious, though, since you asked this question, are there any other groups or individuals who have also questioned the legitimacy of El Salvador’s Bitcoin ownership?

I'm sure they are. I'm also sure they're more difficult to hear or find because they are the minority and social media amplifies what the majority say. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for El Salvador going full Bitcoin. But that same spirit has to show in accountability and transparency, and it must still be, in the end, the will of the people. I'm not convinced there is any real ambition toward this.

This is the best information they can provide to demonstrate transparency (accountability is another matter, though).

Now, I’m convinced that they actually hold that Bitcoin, even without seeing any reports of signed messages - thanks to this one single tweet.

https://x.com/nayibbukele/status/1593113857261965312


As you can see in the tweet from November 17, 2022, after that, we can observe that 1 Bitcoin entered the address they claimed to own daily.

https://bitcoin.gob.sv/address/32ixEdVJWo3kmvJGMTZq5jAQVZZeuwnqzo

[BALIK]

El Salvador took a very big risk when they decided to invest in Bitcoin, especially at a time when many never believed in it. I can imagine the kind of pressure the president got then for taking the decision he took then. I am very sure that if this his  decision didn't give any positive results like we are seeing now, many of us would have lots of negative things to say about El Salvador. Ofcourse people only praise good results.

I don't understand what you refer to as big risk when it comes to bitcoin investment. Could it be that you still consider buying bitcoin a big risk? No doubt there is risk in everything even life itself but classifying investment in bitcoin as a big risk is totally out of place. The only time I will consider buying bitcoin a big risk is if the investment is made with money meant for other basic things that cannot be delayed and the intention of targeting quick profits. In this instance, the chances of not succeeding is very high because there is still something called correction in price movement and when it happens, you might not be able to recoup your investment immediately unless you wait longer. However, when investment is made with long term target, like El Salvador did, the risk is highly minimized and cannot be classified as a big risk.

They use the national budget (people's money) to invest in bitcoin, while their country is heavily in debt, people's lives are extremely difficult and the economy is almost on the brink of bankruptcy. I don't think they invested bitcoin with idle money, so their decision to invest in bitcoin was really a very risky gamble at that time.

Although they have made significant profits, this is not a worthy example for other economically struggling countries to follow. Because we are talking about the economy of a country with hundreds of millions of people, not just an individual or an organization. There are too many risks they face if things don't go as expected.

[buwaytress]

Although this happens with some exchanges, it’s nowhere comparable to a country or a leader managing a nation, as every action, especially involving money, is always under scrutiny. When Bukele tweets that they’re buying Bitcoin, it's not automatic that they'll buy right away as the funds used have already passed through various processes in different departments, with multiple people verifying the transactions before finalizing them.

He’s essentially just the messenger, while his team handles the actual buying, and with such a significant value of Bitcoin involved, it’s necessary to have a separation of duties, requiring many people to ensure the security of the Bitcoin they’re holding. All of this follows a process, and some information cannot be divulged for security reasons.

I believe this might address your question about why they didn’t sign a message. From my research, even exchanges typically don’t sign messages for the same security concerns.

That... is actually the point. A country's leader has a bigger burden of accountability, because it's public money (or we assume). It may not be "automatic" but he actually passed the Bitcoin laws quite swiftly, and if you recall the demonstrations in the same year, people were angry they weren't consulted. An exchange should be signing messages... never mind Bukele or his "Team". Signing messages does not compromise security. It's a feature of Bitcoin

You describe a process of authorisation and verification, and a process of delegation of roles and assumption of responsibility, but I'm asking for the details of that -- who is this team? Who is responsible for what? Who arranged the deals? There is a duty to the people (whose money it is being used to buy the Bitcoin, presumably) to show this.

The same for national treasury in bitcoin, I agree with you that transparency and accountability need to be improved and provided publicly to their citizens. They use national budget to buy bitcoin, as part of their national treasury and citizens as tax payers to governments, have all rights to know about it.

Yes...

This is the best information they can provide to demonstrate transparency (accountability is another matter, though).

I already accepted that in my earlier post as proof of reserve, but I can also post an address claiming it to be mine. Until I sign the address, I have no proof I own it. It shows the inflows and outflows, so I did ask where is the 200+ BTC that went out going to?

[2Pizza410000BTC]

I'm sure Central African Republic would be regretting their decision to abandon Bitcoin now because back when they followed El Salvador to adopt it as their legal tender in 2022, they had high hopes of it helping their very struggling economy but with so much internal and external pressures, had to drop the plan to make it work.
Nayib Bukele was hit with so much backlash when he did the same thing back in 2021 and now who's smiling? Imagine the same people who criticized his actions are now calling him smart.

When you take the initiative to do something, many people will criticize and laugh at you, this is the law of the world. Notice for yourself that when you take the initiative to do something good, you will definitely receive criticism and laughter from your loved ones or people around you or in your village. If you continue your initiative ignoring their criticism and laughter and if you succeed in that initiative, you will see that those close to you will praise you a lot. In fact, this is what happened in the case of the government of El Salvador. When he took the initiative to invest in Bitcoin, the people of his country criticized and laughed at him a lot, but Nayib Bukele ignored their criticism and laughter and continued to invest in Bitcoin. Those who criticized and laughed at him are today praising him a lot and calling him smart. This is the law of the world.

[Popkon6]

El Salvador took a very big risk when they decided to invest in Bitcoin, especially at a time when many never believed in it. I can imagine the kind of pressure the president got then for taking the decision he took then. I am very sure that if this his  decision didn't give any positive results like we are seeing now, many of us would have lots of negative things to say about El Salvador. Ofcourse people only praise good results.

In 2021, the government of El Salvador under Nayib Bukele accepted Bitcoin as legal tender, and from there the journey of investing in Bitcoin began. And they decided to deposit one Bitcoin per day on average and have been depositing Bitcoin continuously. In the end, they deposited about 6000 plus Bitcoins from which they are now earning huge benefits from each Bitcoin.
All of these things can be achieved by taking risks, but Bitcoin has played a huge role in El Salvador becoming largely self-sufficient in half of its territory.

This should be an eye opener to other countries who are still restricting their citizens from using or investing in bitcoin. Now we can tell who is ignorant and wrong here. While other countries are already making money from bitcoin, countries who are still very ignorant should wise up and join the trend before it's becomes kinda late for them.

In the case of Bitcoin investment, no matter who the person or investor is, success will only be possible by investing in Bitcoin if he has invested in Bitcoin for a long time. You will notice that all investors or institutions have been successful through Bitcoin investment, such as the government of El Salvador, Nayib Bukele, and in terms of companies, MicroStrategy has also become largely self-sufficient by accumulating Bitcoin under the leadership of Michael Saylor and they are taking steps to invest in more Bitcoin. So you only have to take the risk of investing in Bitcoin and it is easier to achieve success if you invest for a long time

[Ziskinberg]

That... is actually the point. A country's leader has a bigger burden of accountability, because it's public money (or we assume). It may not be "automatic" but he actually passed the Bitcoin laws quite swiftly, and if you recall the demonstrations in the same year, people were angry they weren't consulted. An exchange should be signing messages... never mind Bukele or his "Team". Signing messages does not compromise security. It's a feature of Bitcoin

You describe a process of authorisation and verification, and a process of delegation of roles and assumption of responsibility, but I'm asking for the details of that -- who is this team? Who is responsible for what? Who arranged the deals? There is a duty to the people (whose money it is being used to buy the Bitcoin, presumably) to show this.

Yeah, that’s it. They’re supposed to sign a message, just like you said, and exchanges should sign messages too. But in reality, they don’t. This could be due to regulatory factors we’re not fully aware of since we’re not working within the government.

The same goes for El Salvador, they may not satisfy the request of some skeptics, which casts doubt on them. However, overall, it’s widely believed that they own the Bitcoins they claim to hold, as I’ve explained in my previous post.

Now, let’s talk about MicroStrategy. They hold more Bitcoins than El Salvador. Do they sign messages for their holdings? If they don’t, would you also doubt their claims about the number of Bitcoins they hold? It’s the same situation with El Salvador. Honestly, I haven’t seen any big firms holding millions of dollars worth of Bitcoin signing messages from their wallets. This ties back to my earlier explanation about security and the standard practices followed by institutions.

[laijsica]

With the current bull run, one country has benefited significantly - El Salvador. They started accumulating Bitcoin well before this bull run, and as recently reported, they’ve already gained more than 100% on their investment.

Just imagine what that kind of profit could do to improve their country. I think other nations, especially developing ones, should start considering following El Salvador’s lead when it comes to Bitcoin investment. It could improve their economies, it should be a game- changer.

Look at the numbers.

Among those celebrating bitcoin’s ascendance past $100,000 is the country of El Salvador.

President Nayib Bukele on Thursday posted a screenshot of the country’s portfolio on X that showed a current year-to-date balance of $603,340,991, a gain of 117%, or $326,245,977.98, thanks to a bitcoin investment that began in 2021.

The President of El Salvador is considering Bitcoin as one of the means for the economic development of his country and he is also getting success in it. He is holding Bitcoin regularly and is moving forward with the determination to continue in stages. El Salvador has already found another 3 trillion dollars worth of gold unmined, which is going to be important for their economy.
The qualities of a country's leadership can lead to progress in every sector, the best example of which is Nayib Bukele, who has legalized Bitcoin through legal tender and is trying to integrate Bitcoin with the conventional financial system.