UK court rejects bid from James Howells to recover his hard drive from landfill

[Ale88]

7,500 BTC are forever locked with a key that is now unrecoverable in a dumpster in the UK as the judge decided that the hard drive is now property of the city council after it was dumped in the landfill.

Every now and then there is a news about this guy who is trying to sue the city, the municipality, etc etc because of this damn hard disk. I understand him, it sucks, it's life-changing money but how the hell is he thinking he was going to get it back? And the worst thing is that he's spending all his time and energy behind this situation, he's throwing away time that he will never get back and he doesn't understand it.

[Z-tight]

James Howells has been going on about this for a very long time now, i get it that we are talking about life changing money here, but the chances of recovering that funds is slim to none. I don't know if James would take any further action after this verdict, but in my opinion, i don't think he should, this whole case must be taking a toll on his mental health when he thinks about how rich he may have been, but the sooner he lets it rest, the better for him.

[Felicity_Tide]

Honestly, I don't think it would be even possible to recover the keys from that dumpster after all this time.

Another story of someone that has made a big mistake that will forever go down in Bitcoin history.

Case like this, considering the amount involved, he should have been willing to make proper negotiations with everyone that was going to be involved, but as it stands, it seems the authority isn't interested in what he has to say. But 2013 is such a very long time. Digging up dirt of more than a decade, and sorting them out won't be an easy task(if he was given the permit in the first place).

And as things stands, nothing can be done at this point, but considering how masisve the amount is in today's evaluation, he will continue to push the case, in hope that he will get the permit. I will be expecting another news on this case soon.

[AndrewWeb]

James Howells has been going on about this for a very long time now, i get it that we are talking about life changing money here, but the chances of recovering that funds is slim to none. I don't know if James would take any further action after this verdict, but in my opinion, i don't think he should, this whole case must be taking a toll on his mental health when he thinks about how rich he may have been, but the sooner he lets it rest, the better for him.

He's losing his mind

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/man-loses-fight-dig-up-30745248

and here is the judgment

https://www.11kbw.com/content/uploads/Howells-v-Newport.pdf

What can we learn from this? Don't lose your private key ! Make a copy of your private key or private keys. I have mine private keys both on paper and on CD in different locations. In case something happens to the computer that's only used for Bitcoin transactions nothing else.

[coolcoinz]

Yep, agreed.
Probably because the drive would be damaged harshly or filled with god knows what.

Still, it's about being there for the citizen. Isn't that what the government's purpose used to be? At least in theory.

I'm a libertarian and I'd allow him to dig at his own risk. Nowadays governments are always looking up for themselves, not the good of the people. To them if something happened to these guys, if they got sick, or buried under tons of garbage, the politicians would get bad press. That's all that matters to them. So, they'd rather avoid any problems and tell him to fuck off.

James Howells has been going on about this for a very long time now, i get it that we are talking about life changing money here, but the chances of recovering that funds is slim to none. I don't know if James would take any further action after this verdict, but in my opinion, i don't think he should, this whole case must be taking a toll on his mental health when he thinks about how rich he may have been, but the sooner he lets it rest, the better for him.

Maybe if they let him dig and he'd actually spend a few weeks diving in this landfill, he'd get back to reality. It's not about what his chances are, but whether he should be allowed to try. I think that he should, regardless of the outcome.

[Lucius]

With all that money involved, he ought to have done a deal with the council rather than going to court. If he had offered to split the proceeds with the council, I bet they would have taken him up on the offer. He should have done that right at the beginning. I expect the drive has been recycled into a Chinese rocket by now.

We can't say that he didn't try, because a few years ago he offered a significant amount to the city council in case the HDD was found and they managed to save the coins. They refused because they probably believe that the operation itself is dangerous for the environment, and possibly that even if the HDD is found, no data could be saved.

As far as recycling is concerned, nowadays most of the old IT equipment from Europe ends up in countries of the Far East, but it is possible that 10+ years ago this was not the case. The HDD is somewhere deep under the piles of garbage (at least what's left of it).

A man from the Welsh city of Newport has offered his city council a 25% cut of his 7,500 bitcoins if it allows him to excavate the landfill where he threw away a hard drive containing the fortune in 2013.

[headingnorth]

It would create an environmental disaster in the area and set a bad precedent. Then anyone who ever threw something away by mistake would be allowed to dig up the mountain of garbage. He has to be high on something good if he thinks any sane government would ever agree to let him do it.

It would be a very expensive operation especially if the drive and the funds on it are never recovered. It would take an army of paid workers to sift through all that garbage looking for a needle in the haystack. Who the hell would want to perform that nasty work? And they have to be paid even if nothing is ever found. Does he expect the government to pay for it? Does Howell have millions of dollars of his own money to pay their wages, which would have to be very high to get anyone to do it? The whole idea is beyond stupid.

[PrivacyG]

although the guy did do research years ago to narrow down a section of the landfill that the truck dumped his trash that day, over time there have been excavators pushing trash around as they turn mounds of trash into spread out thin layers over a wider space, so the hard drive can be anywhere by now

and ofcourse time.. could cause damage, erosion and rust to the hard drive, and with lots of nasty grimy fluid and weather the condition of the hard drive data may not be recoverable

also the workers at the landfill may have done a independent search internally. however no movement of the coins shows its unlikely anyone found the hard drive

so overall its a project to give up on/end attempts.. even though the guy might still think he has a right to fight the court and the dream/delusion of there being a chance of recover

The way he publicized all the information and the story all over the Internet does not help him either.  It looks like either he wants to be the main character of a heroic story or he is so delusional he does not realize how things might have changed against his favors.

Just like I said in a post before yours, if somebody did an independent search, it does not guarantee a success in the recovery of the funds!  In fact, if they did this and found the drive but had no idea how to recover the information off of it, what do you do?  Hire an expert and tell them the drive has been in the middle of a pile of garbage for years and should have Bitcoin on it?  Somebody who knows enough about Security and data recovery to get that Wallet out of it will likely also find out about the story this guy published every where.

But the condition of that drive is probably so low you will have to work with the same guys Government Agencies are working with, I imagine it is a highly complex operation the more damaged the drive is.  Then the chances you become the suspect of a Billion Dollar Crime become high!

So imagine this guy gets to even own the entire landfill and hire 1000 people to sort BY HAND every single thing that sits in that pile.  And they never find the drive.  It is completely useless effort for absolutely nothing!

[m2017]

The way he publicized all the information and the story all over the Internet does not help him either.  It looks like either he wants to be the main character of a heroic story or he is so delusional he does not realize how things might have changed against his favors.

He has a compelling goal to find the lost bitcoins. While this is virtually impossible. This has become the meaning of life for Howells, in pursuit of which he has spent a lot of his time and resources. And what is the result? Nothing. It was possible to use his time differently and more productively, admitting defeat and the loss of these bitcoins.

Sometimes should let go of the past in order to move into the future.

So imagine this guy gets to even own the entire landfill and hire 1000 people to sort BY HAND every single thing that sits in that pile.  And they never find the drive.  It is completely useless effort for absolutely nothing!

1st, still need to be able to find it, which is practically impossible. 2nd, need to be able to extract information from a damaged disk. These factors make the effort incomparably high, and the chances, negligible.

It seems to me that this story will become (has already become) one of the urban legends about early BTC-investors, which will continue to excite the minds of newbies about the fact that there is a bitcoins "treasure buried" in the dump, like the legendary buried treasures of pirates of old times.

[hyudien]

the court's decision to reject his bid to retrieve his hard drive from the landfill was correct, because this case itself started from his own mistake of throwing his hard drive in the dumpster and he should have been held responsible for that, instead of filing a lawsuit in the hope that he could get his hard drive back. and it's been 12 years since he threw his hard drive in the landfill, i don't think his hard drive would survive in a place like that. so what he said about him wanting to share 25% of his bitcoins if he managed to get them is just wishful thinking, because the chances are very very small, even nonexistent.

In general his phenomenon for years has been very futile, he has not been able to accept the bitter reality of losing a hard drive containing important keys that he previously considered unimportant. Who knows how long he will let go of bitcoins that can no longer be recovered, James Howells is one of the unlucky people and he should realize that rather than wasting time.

[aoluain]

It seems like he didnt place enough importance on his hard drives back in 2013
when the contents were not that valuable, now when they are worth so much he
regrets what happened.

At this stage it is not worth such an effort and disturbance of the site releasing
more toxins for something that may or may not be intact or achievable.

It really is unfortunate and from Howells point of view he can see his fortune under
waste but cannot retrieve it - it really is ^{or could be} "Buried treasure"

[AprilioMP]

So what can the lesson be taken behind all this according to OP?
From the response of the people here, I think the decision is not willing or rejecting a request to take back from a pile of garbage is not something that might be done because the hard drive is a physical that can be damaged if buried in garbage. Over time it will become land. Logically, the item will not stand due to rainwater and due to hot weather.

Even if the results of the verdict ask related parties to look for it and be found, I am sure that the hard drive cannot be used anymore.

[JaanusRaim]

It would create an environmental disaster in the area and set a bad precedent. Then anyone who ever threw something away by mistake would be allowed to dig up the mountain of garbage. He has to be high on something good if he thinks any sane government would ever agree to let him do it.

It would be a very expensive operation especially if the drive and the funds on it are never recovered. It would take an army of paid workers to sift through all that garbage looking for a needle in the haystack. Who the hell would want to perform that nasty work? And they have to be paid even if nothing is ever found. Does he expect the government to pay for it? Does Howell have millions of dollars of his own money to pay their wages, which would have to be very high to get anyone to do it? The whole idea is beyond stupid.

It is just a matter of taste. There are many people for them sorting garbage is not nasty work but interesting experience.
I would do such work for free, if I will get 0.1% of the treasure value (in case, it will be found and recovered).

[AndrewWeb]

James Howells wants to buy landfill where he lost Bitcoin fortune

https://www.yahoo.com/news/man-wants-buy-tip-where-215819412.html

[Lucius]

It's just an idea, because he would have to find investors who are willing to buy a pile of waste, and then invest a bunch of money in searching for something that might not be in that place or has been destroyed to the point that nothing can be saved. Still, it seems like there are a lot of people/companies willing to enter into this venture - if for nothing else, then to gain public attention as modern treasure hunters.

However, the more time passes, the less likely it is that the data on the HDD will be usable - or we are all living in a delusion about that.

"I would be potentially interested in purchasing the landfill site," he said."I have discussed this option recently with investment partners and it is very much on the table."

[Doan9269]

7,500 BTC are forever locked with a key that is now unrecoverable in a dumpster in the UK as the judge decided that the hard drive is now property of the city council after it was dumped in the landfill.

Honestly am more skeptical about if he is going to find it there if granted access or not, we are going to consider a lot of factors involved in this, was it ascertained that the recovery phrase or hard drive being located there, this is not what is going to be under an assumption, but needs a clarity on it certainty, because the more we see the value of the bitcoin asset in question there also is the risk of the efforts needed to go through the search over the dump site because lots of resources are going to be put all together for the search, how i just wish the court could just grant the access to give a try and see if it could be seen or not, just to clear their doubt.

[ultrloa]

7,500 BTC are forever locked with a key that is now unrecoverable in a dumpster in the UK as the judge decided that the hard drive is now property of the city council after it was dumped in the landfill.

Honestly am more skeptical about if he is going to find it there if granted access or not, we are going to consider a lot of factors involved in this, was it ascertained that the recovery phrase or hard drive being located there, this is not what is going to be under an assumption, but needs a clarity on it certainty, because the more we see the value of the bitcoin asset in question there also is the risk of the efforts needed to go through the search over the dump site because lots of resources are going to be put all together for the search, how i just wish the court could just grant the access to give a try and see if it could be seen or not, just to clear their doubt.

There's low chance for him to recover that and he's not sure if his drive still fine if he could able to get it that's why I understand the government decision not to grant his request since they will just waste their time finding those device that they don't even know if its really there. maybe James Howell need to move on and he just forget about lose balance since he cannot really do anything with it now. Although that's one big lose of opportunity to get rich but he cannot do anything now since everything is seems impossible especially for recovering it.

Maybe the court didn't find any weights of his claims regarding on his request to find his hard drive that's why they reject his request.

[nullama]

James Howells wants to buy landfill where he lost Bitcoin fortune

https://www.yahoo.com/news/man-wants-buy-tip-where-215819412.html

It is quite crazy that literally a pile of rubbish would be so sought after.

It's also interesting that now the council is in fact planning to close the tip in a few months to put a solar farm...

Would it be that the council wants to "find" the Bitcoin?, interesting development.

[headingnorth]

It would create an environmental disaster in the area and set a bad precedent. Then anyone who ever threw something away by mistake would be allowed to dig up the mountain of garbage. He has to be high on something good if he thinks any sane government would ever agree to let him do it.

It would be a very expensive operation especially if the drive and the funds on it are never recovered. It would take an army of paid workers to sift through all that garbage looking for a needle in the haystack. Who the hell would want to perform that nasty work? And they have to be paid even if nothing is ever found. Does he expect the government to pay for it? Does Howell have millions of dollars of his own money to pay their wages, which would have to be very high to get anyone to do it? The whole idea is beyond stupid.

It is just a matter of taste. There are many people for them sorting garbage is not nasty work but interesting experience.
I would do such work for free, if I will get 0.1% of the treasure value (in case, it will be found and recovered).

A matter of taste? And you would do it for free? LOL.

I hope you enjoy the smell and taste of many years old rotting garbage because that is what you would be smelling and tasting digging through the mountain of garbage for months on end for something with zero chance of being found, and useless even if it was. I hope you don't live with anyone because they would kick you out of the house with the unimaginable stench you would be bringing home every night, the kind of smell that is impossible to wash off. If the smell doesn't kill you the inherently dangerous work of manually sorting through a mountain of trash in an extremely toxic environment probably will.

[fikrett]

James Howells wants to buy landfill where he lost Bitcoin fortune

https://www.yahoo.com/news/man-wants-buy-tip-where-215819412.html

It is quite crazy that literally a pile of rubbish would be so sought after.

It's also interesting that now the council is in fact planning to close the tip in a few months to put a solar farm...

Would it be that the council wants to "find" the Bitcoin?, interesting development.

Maybe, or maybe he just wants to put an end to this whole story with building something on top of it