Regarding Auroracoin TW exploit (Fix included)

[bigc1984]

Every coin that uses KGW should apply the fix as well asap right?

Yes, I think so.

Any idea if digishield or dgw (version2) are susceptible to the same exploit?

Have not yet dig too deeply on it, but:
Digishield: not the same, but possibly similar. KGW counts a lot of blocks to calculate adjustment, digishield only one, so it quite different. In KGW, attacker can 'jump over' the block in the future, which is not possible with only 1 block. Not yet sure, but there might be another TW exploit: Can you generate 2 blocks with dT less than 2xtarget so difficulty won't rise? If you generate block with dT 0, you get diff +25%, if I calculated correctly. next question: can you generate a block with -25% difficulty with less than 2*timespan? I think you get only -12.5% with 2 blocks time, so this hole is not open :-). But not sure if there are others.
 Edit: this is dogecoin digishiel, don't know others..

DGW: possibly, quick peek reveals no fix, but it might be there, have to make deeper look at it to be sure.

DGW is not exploitable. It is not effected by this exploit, this has been confirmed. Darkcoin > *.

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[lajz99]

DGW is not exploitable. It is not effected by this exploit, this has been confirmed. Darkcoin > *.

Sounds like a challenge if I ever read one...

[andyatcrux]

Wow, BCX has a conscience! I am sure there will be no "I may have been wrong about the devs intentions" or "sorry." This will be touted as an abject lesson. That said, as awkward as this may all be for both parties to come to terms here, it is good to see that BCX is keeping his word. Both the threat of attack and now working on a resolution to mitigate the harm. Well done sir, just wish it could have been directed at more deserving coins. In the end you are making a contribution.

[kalus]

Wow, BCX has a conscience! I am sure there will be no "I may have been wrong about the devs intentions" or "sorry." This will be touted as an abject lesson.

yeah i doubt anybody will apologize to BCX either for all that shittalk, but nbd it's only altcoins.

[andyatcrux]

Please try to keep my post in context. Thanks. I hear what you are saying though. I think BCX is probably not expecting any sorry.

EDIT: I did fail to read this:

Of note also, it appears that Balduro is actually delivering the Air Drop as promised. I cannot 100% verify that yet and the method he used screams scam. However I am not above admitting mistakes and it is certainly appearing that Balduro has made the all time mother of implementing the right idea with the wrong execution!

More to come on this as I dig deeper.


~BCX~

Well I didn't see that one coming.  Kudos to BCX for being the man and admitting his error.

I guess this is fair enough. I do think many were trying to tell him this, some in a not so nice way, but many were trying to use level reasoning. I am gonna chalk it up to the fact that there are many horrible scams out there and there is no doubt that AUR (I believe unintentionally) opened the door to scamcoins to use this model of coin.

[ElMariachi]

The foundation of all cryptocurrencies is an agreement
[...]
So however asshole you are BCX, you are an asshole in a good way, thank you!

First thing is a nice idea but as has become more than obvious again and again basing things solely on trust is usually a very bad idea. You talked about algorithms having to be improved too and that being part of that "agreement" to which I entirely agree.

The last thing however was unneeded imho though, but hey, I doubt BCX will cry about it

[Nite69]

I added the fix to the original post, feel free to update your coins. If someone want to give this a fancy name, just go ahead!

[LTEX]

I added the fix to the original post, feel free to update your coins. If someone want to give this a fancy name, just go ahead!

Great job mate! How about "GoodNite" 

[_noname_]

Good going BCX. This is what I want to see from old/senior members. And apology for calling you a scammer in other threads. I will remove those.

[Nite69]

Every coin that uses KGW should apply the fix as well asap right?

Yes, I think so.

Any idea if digishield or dgw (version2) are susceptible to the same exploit?

Have not yet dig too deeply on it, but:
Digishield: not the same, but possibly similar. KGW counts a lot of blocks to calculate adjustment, digishield only one, so it quite different. In KGW, attacker can 'jump over' the block in the future, which is not possible with only 1 block. Not yet sure, but there might be another TW exploit: Can you generate 2 blocks with dT less than 2xtarget so difficulty won't rise? If you generate block with dT 0, you get diff +25%, if I calculated correctly. next question: can you generate a block with -25% difficulty with less than 2*timespan? I think you get only -12.5% with 2 blocks time, so this hole is not open :-). But not sure if there are others.
 Edit: this is dogecoin digishiel, don't know others..

DGW: possibly, quick peek reveals no fix, but it might be there, have to make deeper look at it to be sure.

I must make a re-estimate on digishield. It does allow back to median 11 blocks, ie one can go back in time.
1 Go to the future 12:00:00 -> get diff -50%
2 Go back 11:59:30 -> get diff +25%

Yes, there is attack vector.

[ghostlander]

This bug is possible due to no hard limiter at all for difficulty adjustments as well as a large allowance for the future time stamps. EventHorizonDeviation is an averaging factor and doesn't work as a limiting factor. It isn't really supposed to. A retarget code which allows difficulty abuse of such extreme magnitude like with AUR recently isn't a good one. By the way, how many coin developers have copied KGW to their coins without having a good understanding of the internals just because it's a popular trend? That's a rhetorical question.

[ZeroBarrier]

I have looked over Dogecoin's implementation, and it is more than likely vulnerable as well.  It is hard to say however, because Dogecoin has a significantly higher hash rate than most other coins and has included a dampening on the adjustment.

Correct me if I am wrong, but I don't think DOGE uses KGW.

Edit: NVM, just read the dev blog and saw they implemented DigiShield in the last update, v1.6.

[Dabs]

So however asshole you are BCX, you are an asshole in a good way, thank you!

Please I work hard to be a regular asshole, don't paint me in a good light.


~BCX~

I confirm that BCX is an asshole.

[MegaHertz]

So however asshole you are BCX, you are an asshole in a good way, thank you!

Please I work hard to be a regular asshole, don't paint me in a good light.


~BCX~

I confirm that BCX is an asshole.

one that i find very interesting though. 

though, i have only joined since Auroracoin....  ( hold the tomato's please ) 

but programming since 83, so lets just say its been quite a ride.   very impressed with the "new" generation.

MHz

[markm]

By the way, how many coin developers have copied KGW to their coins without having a good understanding of the internals just because it's a popular trend? That's a rhetorical question.

Billions and billions.

That's a rhetorical answer.

-MarkM-

[illodin]

By the way, how many coin developers have copied KGW to their coins without having a good understanding of the internals just because it's a popular trend? That's a rhetorical question.

Billions and billions.

That's a rhetorical answer.

-MarkM-

And how many of those coins have insanely insecure hashrates?  

-illodin-

[MegaHertz]

Yes per our agreement I will pull back the exploit and allow a fix.

As explained by Nite69 I am gaining on the chain with a current running KGW TW.

If the TW exploit isn't pulled back before the hard fork, it will instantly catch up at the next hard fork due to diff swings and be in full full implementation. So either way I win, fix it or don't fix it.

So after month of  posting we end up seeing absolut nothing from you?

Don't get me wrong.. I don't judge what you planed to do.. I don't care... ( although I am  a BIG AUR bag holder since 1 or 2 days: I mined 0.5 AUR hurray!! )

No..but I would like to see a proof of your chain or something in any way or form because I want to know if it was indeed technical possible and not theoretical nature only and I want to see if you had the skills to do so. You talked a bit too selfconfident toward the end to really still believe it's more than just you talking.

Did you read the post by Balduro, the founder and Nite69, the developer brought on by the Auroracoin Team? The exploit is live and is working or else I can assure you an agreement would not have been reached. I am satisfied with the agreement and you as an investor should be satisfied with that.

Of note also, it appears that Balduro is actually delivering the Air Drop as promised. I cannot 100% verify that yet and the method he used screams scam. However I am not above admitting mistakes and it is certainly appearing that Balduro has made the all time mother of implementing the right idea with the wrong execution!

More to come on this as I dig deeper.


~BCX~

I can state honestly, so help me God, that what I have seen here in Reykjavik is fair distribution of the coins.  

Of course, there were some who had difficulties.   That "resolved itself" a few days ago.  Actually, I am sure Baldur and crew made some changes to improve claim rates.

Also, of course, there have been who have claiming for many relatives, however that is up to the family and relatives in question.

Have there been some "thefts" ?  I honestly don't know, I'm sure some small percentage.   Just like there was a small percentage who may have lost their coins due to Server Overload and unsuccessful transactions from the pre-mined mint -> verification -> blockchain -> wallet.   There were even people who just clicked ahead, past the page that said to print out their wallet... so...

my thoughts (continued) are that as we are creeping towards 10 percent claimed, in as many days, I sense a general feeling of fairness from the hundreds ( okay, five dozen or so ) of Icelanders I have questioned.  ( friends, taxi drivers, store owners, restaurant owners )

So, yes, BCX, Baldur does seem to be delivering.    AND perhaps his strategy (Facebook and SMS) had flaws.     But when I came to think about it (that night when the details became obvious)    it actually made ALOT of sense to use FB as there are many checks available, cross references, and what? about 95% Facebook usage in Iceland ?  

So, for getting out 10% of 330,000 people, and 10,500,000 coins  ( 31.   I would say it is as open as possible.

And then of course we have round 2 and round 3 and round 4 of the airdrop still to come..... Which I am quite sure will even be an improvement over previous rounds.....    

Anyway, that is my 1 AUR worth.       Thank you for contributing to the strength of Auroracoin.   I can promise you that when all of the dust settles the Icelandic people will be much more informed about all the developments and responsibilities of this coin.  

takk takk frá Íslandi.... come to visit some day, we welcome you as a friend.

MHz

[ZeroBarrier]

I can state honestly, so help me God, that what I have seen here in Reykjavik is fair distribution of the coins.  

Of course, there were some who had difficulties.   That "resolved itself" a few days ago.  Actually, I am sure Baldur and crew made some changes to improve claim rates.

Also, of course, there have been who have claiming for many relatives, however that is up to the family and relatives in question.

Have there been some "thefts" ?  I honestly don't know, I'm sure some small percentage.   Just like there was a small percentage who may have lost their coins due to Server Overload and unsuccessful transactions from the pre-mined mint -> verification -> blockchain -> wallet.   There were even people who just clicked ahead, past the page that said to print out their wallet... so...

my thoughts (continued) are that as we are creeping towards 10 percent claimed, in as many days, I sense a general feeling of fairness from the hundreds ( okay, five dozen or so ) of Icelanders I have questioned.  ( friends, taxi drivers, store owners, restaurant owners )

So, yes, BCX, Baldur does seem to be delivering.    AND perhaps his strategy (Facebook and SMS) had flaws.     But when I came to think about it (that night when the details became obvious)    it actually made ALOT of sense to use FB as there are many checks available, cross references, and what? about 95% Facebook usage in Iceland ?  

So, for getting out 10% of 330,000 people, and 10,500,000 coins  ( 31.   I would say it is as open as possible.

And then of course we have round 2 and round 3 and round 4 of the airdrop still to come..... Which I am quite sure will even be an improvement over previous rounds.....    

Anyway, that is my 1 AUR worth.       Thank you for contributing to the strength of Auroracoin.   I can promise you that when all of the dust settles the Icelandic people will be much more informed about all the developments and responsibilities of this coin.  

takk takk frá Íslandi.... come to visit some day, we welcome you as a friend.

MHz

The unfortunate fact remains that unless Iceland does some sort of official AUR census and asks every single household whether they claimed and received their 31.8 AUR, we might never know if the dev has been laundering and siphoning AUR from the premine into random undisclosed wallets that he and his team hold to dump at a slow and controlled rate to keep the market from crashing and thus maximize profits because of the extreme lack of liquidity of AUR. There is still a huge potential for scam surrounding AUR because of the lack of transparency; and I don't think that will ever really change.

[Bimmerhead]

The unfortunate fact remains that unless Iceland does some sort of official AUR census and asks every single household whether they claimed and received their 31.8 AUR, we might never know if the dev has been laundering and siphoning AUR from the premine into random undisclosed wallets that he and his team hold to dump at a slow and controlled rate to keep the market from crashing and thus maximize profits because of the extreme lack of liquidity of AUR. There is still a huge potential for scam surrounding AUR because of the lack of transparency; and I don't think that will ever really change.

Potential for scam and actual scam are two entirely different things.  We have to work with the world we live in.

No one has yet offered one iota of evidence that a scam is being perpetrated here yet, but evidence does exist that the airdrop is proceeding as advertised.  If you're looking for guarantees you'll have to call the FDIC.

[pepo]

The unfortunate fact remains that unless Iceland does some sort of official AUR census and asks every single household whether they claimed and received their 31.8 AUR, we might never know if the dev has been laundering and siphoning AUR from the premine into random undisclosed wallets that he and his team hold to dump at a slow and controlled rate to keep the market from crashing and thus maximize profits because of the extreme lack of liquidity of AUR. There is still a huge potential for scam surrounding AUR because of the lack of transparency; and I don't think that will ever really change.

Potential for scam and actual scam are two entirely different things.  We have to work with the world we live in.

No one has yet offered one iota of evidence that a scam is being perpetrated here yet, but evidence does exist that the airdrop is proceeding as advertised.  If you're looking for guarantees you'll have to call the FDIC.

I dont think that aurora is a scam , you have to give time , it took bitcoin 4 years to get some value. 1 aurora in a few years could cost 500 USd.